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  Topic: Discovery Institute Panty Bunch, DI shoots remaining foot?< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Doc Bill



Posts: 1005
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 10 2009,13:55   

Robert Crowther has his panties in a bunch because the California Science Center cancelled a showing of the DI's latest bucket of propaganda bilge, "Darwin's Dilemma."  Oh, I'm sorry, it's not the DI's bucket of bilge, it's Illustra Media's bucket of bilge.

Boo hoo.

Crowther is outraged, OUTRAGED that the CSC, a "department of the state of California" not only cancelled the showing, but furthermore refuses to tell the Disco Tute why.

Let's do a little investigating, science if you will, of our own and see what we can find.

Well, for a start the contract to show the film was not between the CSC and the DI, but rather between the CSC and an organization called the American Freedom Alliance.  Seems to me that the CSC is well within it's bounds not to discuss a contract with a party that's not party to the contract.  You'd think with all the lawyers crawling around the DI they'd have someone who would understand that, but maybe they asked Luskin.

The DI even tried to be SUPER HELPFUL (loading the gun) by issuing a Press Release on their own (ready, aim ...) about the event and how it stars fellows from the DI (FIRE!!).  

An independent press release.

All by themselves.  Not in association with the AFA or the CSC.

Now, cast your minds back to those balmy days at Baylor when Dembski ascended to the throneship of the newly formed Polanyi Institute for Witches and Warlocks.  President Sloan stood up for Dembski and the controversial institute and that was that.

Until Dembski issued the famous un-collegiate email which said basically "Nanny nanny boo boo, it's Waterloo for you!" and got himself removed from the position and the Institute closed.  Nice job, Mr. Smooth.  Shoot feet much?

According to Bobby-C the contract was cancelled due to "issues related to the contract."  What "issues?"

OK, check this out from the CSC website on How To Host An Event At the CSC Good:

Quote
PROMOTIONAL MATERIALS:

It is required that the Event Services Office approve, for technical and factual accuracy, all promotional materials mentioning the California Science Center produced for your event (including invitations, programs, press releases, etc.) prior to printing or broadcast. Please allow sufficient time for this approval.


My bold, DI's bad.

Seems to me that the DI failed to follow procedures and issued a press release mentioning the CSC without their approval.  At the very least the DI should have coordinated their press release with their partner, the AFA.   Could be that the DI was well within its rights to issue any kind of press release they like.  After all the contract was with the AFA who was merely hosting the DI's film which is not the DI's film.  Could be that the AFA said, "The DI did it, not us!"  Could be that the CSC told the AFA, "Next time keep your mutt on a leash."

Could be, could be.  Who knows?  Well, the CSC and the AFA know, and the CSC isn't talking.

That leaves one source of information, the AFA, and one source of speculation, the DI.

Hey, Bobby, why don't you call up the AFA and ask them why the contract was cancelled rather than running around with your hair on fire?  Then let us know the whole story.  Wouldn't that be better than all your speculating?  Or mine?

  
ERV



Posts: 329
Joined: Sep. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 10 2009,15:04   

*high-five*

Mystery solved by Doc Bill!  Thank you!

  
keiths



Posts: 2041
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 10 2009,20:52   

Crowther concludes his whinefest thus:
Quote
Rather than debate the science, Darwinists try to suppress it. They simply can't stand to let people know the truth about the shoddy case for Darwinian evolution.

Yeah, Rob, Darwinists are embarrassed by the shoddy case for evolution.  That's why Donald Prothero (Evolution: What the Fossils Say and Why It Matters), Jerry Coyne (Why Evolution Is True), and Richard Dawkins (The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution) all wrote books laying it out in great detail.  Imagine the terror they must feel at the prospect that someone might actually read their books.

--------------
And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number.  -- Joe G

Please stop putting words into my mouth that don't belong there and thoughts into my mind that don't belong there. -- KF

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 1964
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 11 2009,06:49   

I'm sceptical this is the reason.  The contract wasn't with the Disco Institute, so I'm not sure how their actions could be used to argue for breach of contract (note: IANAL).  The information was in the public domain (the AFA had details up on the 2nd of October, 3 days before the fateful press release).  My google foo isn't good enough to determine when the AFA first announced the show.

It's possible, therefore, that the DI were being opportunist: obviously they knew about the screening, but only put out their own press release once it had been publically announced elsewhere.  I think it would be difficult to use this as a way of cancelling the contract: one would have to show collusion between the AFA and DI in releasing the press release.

--------------
ID theorists don’t postulate a designer for their arguments. - Crandaddy
There is no connection between a peppered moth, natural selection, and religion that I can see. - FtK

   
J-Dog



Posts: 4361
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 14 2009,20:22   

An early puppet remains on teh DI's email list and received this :D.I.'s Back To School Guide

Read it and enjoy!

Kidz - It's Overwhelming Evidence that not all adults have your best interests at heart... and the sooner you understand that, the better off you'll be.

--------------
Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
afarensis



Posts: 1003
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 14 2009,20:47   

Quote (J-Dog @ Oct. 14 2009,20:22)
An early puppet remains on teh DI's email list and received this :D.I.'s Back To School Guide

Read it and enjoy!

Kidz - It's Overwhelming Evidence that not all adults have your best interests at heart... and the sooner you understand that, the better off you'll be.

Quote
Paleontology, where ID encourages scientists to understand how the irreducibly complex nature of biological systems can predict punctuated change and stasis throughout the history of life.


Holy crap! Stephen J. Gould was an IDist!  :p

--------------
Church burning ebola boy

FTK: I Didn't answer your questions because it beats the hell out of me.

PaV: I suppose for me to be pried away from what I do to focus long and hard on that particular problem would take, quite honestly, hundreds of thousands of dollars to begin to pique my interest.

   
Quack



Posts: 1751
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2009,06:18   

Quote
Read it and enjoy!

Now if I could only get rid of that foul taste in my mouth...

--------------
YEC creationists denigrate science without an inkling of what their lives would be without it. YEC creationism is an enrageous, abominable insult to the the human intellect.
                                                         Me.

  
slpage



Posts: 349
Joined: June 2004

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2009,07:16   

Crowther:
"Rather than debate the science, Darwinists try to suppress it. They simply can't stand to let people know the truth about the shoddy case for Darwinian evolution."

This from a guy who sees no problem with Jonny Wells REFUSING to test his claims re: molecular phylogenetics with real data.

The hypocrisy just oozes from these creeps.

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2009,08:40   

Quote (J-Dog @ Oct. 14 2009,20:22)
An early puppet remains on teh DI's email list and received this :D.I.'s Back To School Guide

Read it and enjoy!

Kidz - It's Overwhelming Evidence that not all adults have your best interests at heart... and the sooner you understand that, the better off you'll be.

Casey's back-to-school guide is amusing. But I think that they still have some work to do vis-a-vis educating the masses about the differences (not) between ID and creationism.

I've taught a section of our intro bio course for the last two fall semesters, and we put the scientific method and evolution in the very first module. Both semesters I've also started a discussion about ID on the threaded message board for my section. I simply post the question - "Based on what you have learned about the scientific method, is Intelligent Design a scientific enterprise?", and then let the students discuss it.

None of the students focus on ID very long; it rapidly becomes a discussion about creationism, the bible, saving souls, etc. Lots of cites from AIG material, and no cites from Disco Tute material.

Their message simply isn't getting across, it seems.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Doc Bill



Posts: 1005
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 02 2009,18:17   

The plot thickens!

DI sues California Science Center

Why?

For withholding documents the DI "knows are there," that's why.

Yep, the DI is suing the CSC for document withholding.  DasTARDly documents that would demonstrate that the CSC is in cahoots with the Smithsonian in an active campaign of

**echo chamber on**

Viewpoint Discrimination

*echo chamber off**

Yes, the CSC is like a haystack of information and the DI knows there's a haystack in there somewhere, by cracky.

What, oh what, will happen next???

  
carlsonjok



Posts: 3324
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 02 2009,18:46   

Quote (Doc Bill @ Dec. 02 2009,18:17)
The plot thickens!

DI sues California Science Center

Why?

For withholding documents the DI "knows are there," that's why.

Yep, the DI is suing the CSC for document withholding.  DasTARDly documents that would demonstrate that the CSC is in cahoots with the Smithsonian in an active campaign of

**echo chamber on**

Viewpoint Discrimination

*echo chamber off**

Yes, the CSC is like a haystack of information and the DI knows there's a haystack in there somewhere, by cracky.

What, oh what, will happen next???

The DI has a link to their complaint over at evolutionnews.org. Exhibit 3 is awesome!

Added in Edit:  I only scanned the complaint, but their argument seems to boil down to the fact that CSC didn't produce documents that the DI and AFA know exist, namely the documents that they (DI / AFA) already possess.  Not being a lawyer, I don't know if this is sufficient to substantiate the DI's claim.  Anyone seen Steviepinhead lately?  I think he is a lawyer.

--------------
It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 10094
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 02 2009,21:50   

OH NOES! they'll lose focus just as their research program was getting off the ground. Waterloo, etc.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Robert Byers



Posts: 160
Joined: Nov. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 03 2009,01:54   

EXPELLED once more. this makes the case that freedom of discussion and contention on origin subjects is not for public institutions and venues because the establishment side can't take the criticism.
Faith in censorship and bannings will not stop the creationist drumbeat and marching. It just makes one more determined then ever and progress more delicious.

Creationism wants as many people as possible to weigh the merits of our side and then  our opponents side and we will are confident we sgall overcome.
This is not the 19th century where these things only belong to small circles.
If your ideas can't take scrunity then they don't deserve hugh positiob .

  
Badger3k



Posts: 861
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 03 2009,02:22   

Quote (Robert Byers @ Dec. 03 2009,01:54)
If your ideas can't take scrunity then they don't deserve hugh positiob .

Oh Noes!!!

Who's "Hugh Positiob?"  Is he that deposed Nigerian prince I keep getting emails about, or is he the one who'll make my woody become a Manly Beam!  (not that it needs that...)

Bobby, please edit before you hit the post button.  Try the "preview post" and reread it, and take your meds if you have to.

--------------
"Just think if every species had a different genetic code We would have to eat other humans to survive.." : Joe G

  
Badger3k



Posts: 861
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 03 2009,02:24   

Quote (Badger3k @ Dec. 03 2009,02:22)
Quote (Robert Byers @ Dec. 03 2009,01:54)
If your ideas can't take scrunity then they don't deserve hugh positiob .

Oh Noes!!!

Who's "Hugh Positiob?"  Is he that deposed Nigerian prince I keep getting emails about, or is he the one who'll make my woody become a Manly Beam!  (not that it needs that...)

Bobby, please edit before you hit the post button.  Try the "preview post" and reread it, and take your meds if you have to.

Even "hugh position" makes no sense, and "if your ideas can't take scrutiny then they don't deserve high position" doesn't make much sense, and is grammatically incorrect.  

Hugs position?

--------------
"Just think if every species had a different genetic code We would have to eat other humans to survive.." : Joe G

  
Amadan



Posts: 1244
Joined: Jan. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 03 2009,03:15   

Quote (Robert Byers @ Dec. 03 2009,01:54)
If your ideas can't take scrunity then they don't deserve hugh positiob .

... they'll just have to make to with his friend, Mr Jass.

(Thanks, J-Dog)

--------------
"People are always looking for natural selection to generate random mutations" - Densye  4-4-2011
JoeG BTW dumbass- some variations help ensure reproductive fitness so they cannot be random wrt it.

   
Doc Bill



Posts: 1005
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 03 2009,11:44   

Hey, we were having a nice bash fest here.

Who invited the nut-job?

Funny thing about the Disco Tute.  They desperately want to be recognized and legitimized but they don't want any accountability.

So, the film isn't THEIR film.  Nope, it was made by someone else.  The event isn't THEIR event.  Nope, the We're Right You're Wrong Federation booked the CSC.

But, somehow the DI is right in the middle of things dropping turds into the punchbowl.

It wasn't the AFA's press release that caused the problem.  No, it was Anika "the Tank" Smith's 'poorly worded' horn-tooting, DI-promoting, Smithsonian fame-whoring, ID-vertisement that screwed the pooch.

It's the AFA that should be steamed.  After all, they were doing the DI a big favor by hosting the event and the DI screwed them.  So much theater, I can hardly wait for the next act!


(actually, the pr has Crowther written all over it:  sloppy and sneaky.)

  
MichaelJ



Posts: 455
Joined: June 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 03 2009,14:37   

Maybe Robert means that we are hiding all of that evidence. Like we stopped Robert showing his detailed studies on how marsupials are the same as wolves.

  
Advocatus Diaboli



Posts: 197
Joined: Nov. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 29 2009,17:32   

The story unfolds. IDeists are up for a fight, for freedom!

--------------
I once thought that I made a mistake, but I was wrong.

"I freely admit I’m a sociopath" - DaveScot

"Most importanly, the facts are on the side of ID." - scordova

"UD is the greatest website of all time." stevestory

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 29 2009,17:56   

Quote (Advocatus Diaboli @ Dec. 29 2009,17:32)
The story unfolds. IDeists are up for a fight, for freedom!

Gotta love the fact that the LATimes put that story in the "Entertainment" section!

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Doc Bill



Posts: 1005
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 29 2009,20:02   

If the LA Times don't know Entertainment, ain't nobody knows Entertainment!

So, that's it, Crowther?  Viewpoint discrimination? Are you fucking kidding me, Crowther?

The Mighty Discovery Institute, champions of Intelligent Design, overthrowers of Evolution, Thetans of Theocracy, reduced to squeaking "viewpoint" discrimination?

Puh-theh-TIC, Crowther, puh-theh-TIC!  What's next, Crowther, telling your mother the big, bad Smithsonian was mean to you?

  
fnxtr



Posts: 2110
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 29 2009,20:06   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Dec. 29 2009,15:56)
Quote (Advocatus Diaboli @ Dec. 29 2009,17:32)
The story unfolds. IDeists are up for a fight, for freedom!

Gotta love the fact that the LATimes put that story in the "Entertainment" section!

Quote
Intelligent design is the theory that an intelligent being, rather than impersonal forces such as Darwinian natural selection, is responsible for shaping life on Earth.


Somebody's going to educate Mike Boehm, right? Right?

--------------
"But it's disturbing to think someone actually thinks creationism -- having put it's hand on the hot stove every day for the last 400 years -- will get a different result tomorrow." -- midwifetoad

  
RDK



Posts: 229
Joined: Aug. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 30 2009,00:50   

Quote (fnxtr @ Dec. 29 2009,20:06)
   
Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Dec. 29 2009,15:56)
     
Quote (Advocatus Diaboli @ Dec. 29 2009,17:32)
The story unfolds. IDeists are up for a fight, for freedom!

Gotta love the fact that the LATimes put that story in the "Entertainment" section!

     
Quote
Intelligent design is the theory that an intelligent being, rather than impersonal forces such as Darwinian natural selection, is responsible for shaping life on Earth.


Somebody's going to educate Mike Boehm, right? Right?

Unfortunately it's a little late for that.  We should adopt the Disco Tute's strategy and get them when they're young and impressionable.  You know; train a child in the way he should go, yadda yadda yadda, all that good bullshit.

Ninja edit:

 
Quote
The AFA had planned an Oct. 25 screening of two films at the Exposition Park museum -- one a short Imax movie called "We are Born of Stars," which favors Darwin's theory


The fuck is this?  Seriously, Mike?

The next time Dennis O'Leary starts BAAWWWing about how the media and press are biased towards "Darwinism" I'm going to switch her arthritis pills with high-strength laxatives.

I quickly Googled "We Are Born of Stars" and this came up as the synopsis:

 
Quote
WE ARE BORN OF STARS is the first Anaglyph single projector 3D film created for IMAX/IMAX Dome projection. Using computer graphics, the film traces the development of life from the formation of atomic nuclei in stars to the molecular structure of water and DNA, zooming the audience through the five-billion-year evolution of our solar system.


I'm pretty sure Jebus will actually come back before the laymen get it into their heads that the origin of life has nothing to do with Charles Darwin.

--------------
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‘‘I was like ‘Oh my God! It’s Jesus on a banana!’’  - Lisa Swinton, Jesus-eating pagan

  
Quack



Posts: 1751
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 30 2009,03:20   

Quote
The AFA's Davis said his group has no position on Darwinism and intelligent design but is concerned that debate is being stifled by the scientific establishment.

Stifled? Dembski, Behe, Meyer, O'Leary? Seems to me the 'scientific establishment' is all ears and the answer is  written on the wall Can't they read?

--------------
YEC creationists denigrate science without an inkling of what their lives would be without it. YEC creationism is an enrageous, abominable insult to the the human intellect.
                                                         Me.

  
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