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k.e Posts: 1948 Joined: Mar. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,09:34    Quote Wooo Hooo Heddle's up for beers! OK, I'm jealous OK! -------------- The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

k.e Posts: 1948 Joined: Mar. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,09:39    Thx Bill, notice the date everyone. Yes, a full 2 and a bit weeks B4 HRH WAD deemed to stoop. Why oh father have you deserted me ? YOU ARE AN ARSEHOLE BILL, SORRY. -------------- The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

dheddle Posts: 545 Joined: Sep. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,09:42    Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 03 2007,09:29) Quote (dheddle @ Oct. 03 2007,09:26) Sleeveless pullovers are not cool. However, apropos nothing, El Camino SS's rock. OT: Any AtBCers in the Hampton Roads area of VA, where I'll be a livin' as of next week? Wooo Hooo Heddle's up for beers! I'll be at a wedding in DC, trying to give a best man speech that frames the to-be-married-miscreant in a good light. Is that close? Richard, It's about 3 hours, unless you get stuck in DC beltway traffic, in which case it can take as long as forty years. -------------- Mysticism is a rational enterprise. Religion is not. The mystic has recognized something about the nature of consciousness prior to thought, and this recognition is susceptible to rational discussion. The mystic has reason for what he believes, and these reasons are empirical. --Sam Harris

Zachriel Posts: 2723 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,09:45    Quote bornagain77: It is precisely because the mutations which give rise to resistance are in some form or another defects, that so-called supergerms are not really ‘super’ at all—they are actually rather ‘wimpy’ compared to their close cousins. Yes, wimpy enough to kill thousands of people every year. -------------- You never step on the same tard twice—for it's not the same tard and you're not the same person.

k.e Posts: 1948 Joined: Mar. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,09:45    .....thats 40 days, prat! -------------- The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

Kristine Posts: 3061 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,09:54    Quote (k.e @ Oct. 03 2007,08:34) Quote Wooo Hooo Heddle's up for beers! OK, I'm jealous OK! Friggin' darn, I was just in DC. Where I got a kiss on the cheek from Richard D. again. In front of my boyfriend! Whoo-hoo! P.S. Hitchie seems to spill drinks on himself with remarkable aplomb. (He's very funny, too.) Question for Bill D: What good is half an apology? You're not saying Baylor faculty = flatulence, are you? (Both were removed.) -------------- Which came first: the shimmy, or the hip? AtBC Poet Laureate "I happen to think that this prerequisite criterion of empirical evidence is itself not empirical." - Clive "Damn you. This means a trip to the library. Again." -- fnxtr

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,09:55    Quote (dheddle @ Oct. 03 2007,09:42) Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 03 2007,09:29)   Quote (dheddle @ Oct. 03 2007,09:26) Sleeveless pullovers are not cool. However, apropos nothing, El Camino SS's rock. OT: Any AtBCers in the Hampton Roads area of VA, where I'll be a livin' as of next week? Wooo Hooo Heddle's up for beers! I'll be at a wedding in DC, trying to give a best man speech that frames the to-be-married-miscreant in a good light. Is that close? Richard, It's about 3 hours, unless you get stuck in DC beltway traffic, in which case it can take as long as forty years. No worries - I'll catch up with later you big hunk of Fundie, you.   -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:09    OI STERNBERGER STORY. ITS ABOUT TIME I GOT RICH FROM THIS ID THING. Would you please pull out all the best bits from this thread (Tarden and Carlsonjok both get '86ed) and put them in a book type format. Get it published, and then send me the royalties. I'm thinking we can have a Dembski / DaveTard type relationship. *runs off and hides* -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

stevestory Posts: 13407 Joined: Oct. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:12    Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 03 2007,11:09) I'm thinking we can have a Dembski / DaveTard type relationship. I'll bring the sweater. You bring the Cheetos.

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:14    Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 03 2007,10:12) I'll bring the sweater. You bring the Cheetos. But..but I have a quadruple PHD in Jebus, Bibul, Writin' books gud and Notpologetics!   -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

k.e Posts: 1948 Joined: Mar. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:15    Quote (Kristine @ Oct. 03 2007,17:54) Quote (k.e @ Oct. 03 2007,08:34) Quote Wooo Hooo Heddle's up for beers! OK, I'm jealous OK! Friggin' darn, I was just in DC. Where I got a kiss on the cheek from Richard D. again. In front of my boyfriend! Whoo-hoo! :p P.S. Hitchie seems to spill drinks on himself with remarkable aplomb. :) (He's very funny, too.) Question for Bill D: What good is half an apology? You're not saying Baylor faculty = flatulence, are you? (Both were removed.) pfftghtsrrffteghdnbdn1kjfkdkajgnkjwngwrekjngsssssst*choke* OK OK OK OK I'll try to take this down under..hrrrrm. Hinchie? Oh sorry .......Hitchie? .... Und kvist by der wunderkind himself? (In front of somone important?). Wash out your undies NOW!!!! *sniff* missed beers with two to the power of 150 heddle humbert*GRRR )$$#@^%%&* plus  Hitchie? I hope u di! I'll have to seriously reconsider my future love life in light of all this. -------------- The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:16    ReligionProf: http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-139989 Quote 18 ReligionProf 10/02/2007 9:21 pm Showing that we do not have the explanation for something just shows that we do not have the explanation (yet). What troubles me most about ID is its message that it is appropriate to stop looking for explanations at that point. I also find the focus on notions like ‘complex specified information’ troubling not so much in and of themselves, but because those who actually study the CONTENT of the information found in DNA agree that it contains a wealth of information about the history of humankind, our relatedness to other species, and the way our organism functions. There are plenty of unanswered questions about the early history of the language and its natural or supernatural origins. But we have the book in front of us, and what it says when we read it seems pretty clear to most scientists. -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:24    Oooooh yes: http://scienceblogs.com/pharyng....ief.php -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

k.e Posts: 1948 Joined: Mar. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:28    Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 03 2007,18:16) ReligionProf: http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-139989 Quote 18 ReligionProf 10/02/2007 9:21 pm Showing that we do not have the explanation for something just shows that we do not have the explanation (yet). What troubles me most about ID is its message that it is appropriate to stop looking for explanations at that point. I also find the focus on notions like ‘complex specified information’ troubling not so much in and of themselves, but because those who actually study the CONTENT of the information found in DNA agree that it contains a wealth of information about the history of humankind, our relatedness to other species, and the way our organism functions. There are plenty of unanswered questions about the early history of the language and its natural or supernatural origins. But we have the book in front of us, and what it says when we read it seems pretty clear to most scientists. OK I'll see that bid and raise you a Quote However, these same proponents always fail to mention the lack of evidence that should be there. It is the classic “dog barking in the night” scenario. Why didn’t the dog bark; why aren’t the expected transitions there? There are no transitions barking at us anywhere. So they wave it away. We are waving  \\\\   ///// (in a scotish accent). -------------- The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

carlsonjok Posts: 3326 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:35    Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 03 2007,10:09) Would you please pull out all the best bits from this thread (Tarden and Carlsonjok both get '86ed) and put them in a book type format. Get it published, and then send me the royalties. HAR HAR HAR. THIS IS YOU. THIS EVERYONE ELSE -------------- It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

Rob Posts: 154 Joined: July 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:38    Sladjo: Quote As we all know, there is nowhere in this Universe a source of information that is purely materialistic. An information source is ALWAYS a mind. Tip for Sladjo:  Try cracking a textbook on information theory instead of trusting the Isaac Newton thereof. -------------- -- Rob, the fartist formerly known as 2ndclass

slpage Posts: 349 Joined: June 2004 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:40    Quote (olegt @ Oct. 02 2007,13:32) Meantime, Dembski is back on the EIL list:   http://cayman.globat.com/~trademarksnet.com/Research/EILab/People.html I liked the Grasse quote on their.. quote page... The only other person I have seen quote from Grasse's 1977 book is John A. 'I love it so' Davison.

k.e Posts: 1948 Joined: Mar. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:45    Quote (Rob @ Oct. 03 2007,18:38) Sladjo:   Quote As we all know, there is nowhere in this Universe a source of information that is purely materialistic. An information source is ALWAYS a mind. Tip for Sladjo:  Try cracking a textbook on information theory instead of trusting the Isaac Newton thereof. No no no u dongetit .......THE MIND see? OK OK OK lets go bak. I hav a thaut...right? (You don't have 2 hav one). Now time goes forward and that thooght is still there ...right? IPSOFACTO thaut comes B4 evryfink.....EVRYFINK!!!..SEEE? -------------- The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

slpage Posts: 349 Joined: June 2004 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,10:48    Quote (Tom Ames @ Oct. 02 2007,15:57) Quote (olegt @ Oct. 02 2007,11:32) Meantime, Dembski is back on the EIL list:   http://cayman.globat.com/~trademarksnet.com/Research/EILab/People.html Anyone look at the CV of Dembski's colleague Thomas English? It's on what looks like the website for his apartment (which he's given the grandiose title 'Bounded Theoretics'), and shows that Dr. English has spent 8 of the last 10 years as a "Researcher" for "The Tom English Project". Not even a Senior or Staff Scientist--just a "researcher"! Reminds me of that "Smartest Guy in the World" character who was on ARN for awhile, and who wrote a chapter for Dembski's book on ever-so-smart people who agree with him. (Langdon was his name, I think.) Yeah - the guy that took the MENSA exam first with a fake name, then re-took it under his own name so he could get a higher score...

Rob Posts: 154 Joined: July 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,11:02    BarryA:   Quote Darwinists attempt to explain this complex information by resorting to the “numerous monkeys typing” randomness. In other words, the theory goes, if you have enough monkeys pounding on enough typewriters, sooner or later they will pound out the works of Shakespeare. We now know, thanks largely to the work of scholars like William Dembski, that appeals to randomness of this sort are mathematically unsound given the limits on probabilistic resources set by the apparent age of the universe. Um, yeah.  Until Dembski came along, we all expected randomly typing monkeys to produce Shakespeare, and randomly combining molecules to produce homo sapiens.  Thank you, Dembski, for disabusing us of this. -------------- -- Rob, the fartist formerly known as 2ndclass

Rob Posts: 154 Joined: July 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,11:16    Quote (Tom Ames @ Oct. 02 2007,15:57) Anyone look at the CV of Dembski's colleague Thomas English? Tom English has actually published well-regarded papers on NFL topics.  He has given Dembski his due on the rare occasion that Dembski deserves it, but he has no love for Dembski's pseudologic.  He made it clear to me that his joining the EIL does not constitute an endorsement of the work that they've done so far. -------------- -- Rob, the fartist formerly known as 2ndclass

stevestory Posts: 13407 Joined: Oct. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,11:19    How bad is Denyse O'Leary's new book? Quote Whoa. Bryan Appleyard has reservations about the book. That tells you how bad it has got to be. If you show your new baby to your sister, and she doesn't scrunch up her face and say "OOOH, she's cute widdle one!" but instead starts talking about the miracles plastic surgery can do, you know you've got a really ugly baby. http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2007/10/the_spiritual_brain.php Edited by stevestory on Oct. 03 2007,12:20

Arden Chatfield Posts: 6657 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,11:33    Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 03 2007,11:19) How bad is Denyse O'Leary's new book?   Quote Whoa. Bryan Appleyard has reservations about the book. That tells you how bad it has got to be. If you show your new baby to your sister, and she doesn't scrunch up her face and say "OOOH, she's cute widdle one!" but instead starts talking about the miracles plastic surgery can do, you know you've got a really ugly baby. http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2007/10/the_spiritual_brain.php According to family legend, once long ago an old high school girlfriend of my mom's had a baby that was apparently so ugly that the best compliment my mom could come up with when shown the baby was "that sure is a baby!" -------------- "Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,11:53    Some great question begging from BA77: http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-140071 At least we didn't get his list of "evolution can't explain", which would have been quite apt given what he's replying to. -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Louis Posts: 6436 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,12:14    Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Oct. 03 2007,17:33) Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 03 2007,11:19) How bad is Denyse O'Leary's new book?     Quote Whoa. Bryan Appleyard has reservations about the book. That tells you how bad it has got to be. If you show your new baby to your sister, and she doesn't scrunch up her face and say "OOOH, she's cute widdle one!" but instead starts talking about the miracles plastic surgery can do, you know you've got a really ugly baby. http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2007/10/the_spiritual_brain.php According to family lgend, once long ago an old high school girlfriend of my mom's had a baby that was apparently so ugly that the best compliment my mom could come up with when shown the baby was "that sure is a baby!" I'm not saying that baby was ugly, but when it was born the doctor slapped its momma. Try the fish. Louis -------------- Bye.

J-Dog Posts: 4402 Joined: Dec. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,12:29    Dr. Dembski!  That man insulted me! Oh, I'm sorry Denyse, I'm sure you'll be okay... and would you like a banana for your pet monkey? Ba-Ching!   Don't forget to tip your waiters and waitresses! -------------- Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10 Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08 UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,12:29    This is worth a thought or two: http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-140080 Quote 28 dacook 10/03/2007 12:14 pm What troubles me most about ID is its message that it is appropriate to stop looking for explanations at that point. This is a straw-man. I’ve never heard an ID proponent make this argument. Some Creationists, maybe. But ID is not Creationism. Is Dacook implying that you don't stop looking for other explanations - that you can NEVER KNOW something is designed? I like the Popperian sentiment, but would they have to check Mt. Rushmore every day with a new EF that contained the updated sum knowledge of all the natural forces? If God designed everything, when could we expect the EF not to go off? Would a "not designed" be a falsification of the Christian God? I love ID - the less you know, the more things are designed! -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,12:35    Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 03 2007,11:53) Some great question begging from BA77: http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-140071 At least we didn't get his list of "evolution can't explain", which would have been quite apt given what he's replying to. And Bourne just keeps on giving Quote The fact that DNA contains error trapping mechanisms implies knowledge. There is no such thing as ‘error correction’ without knowledge. But DNA does not have it’s own knowledge therefore it was designed by someone with knowledge of what proper states are within the genome versus erroneous states. Only intelligently designed processes can detect error. The very existence of logical absolutes implies the existence of an absolute mind. Logic is conceptual, not physical. There is no absolute logic without mind. Link What do you think he means by the "DNA does not have it's own knowledge" line? -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,12:39    Quote Only intelligently designed processes can detect error. Sometimes, creatures aren't formed perfectly and so they die. Sometimes, creatures don't have the right attributes to cope with their environment, so they die. Is death an "intelligently designed process that can detect error"? Would that make the NS "intelligently designed" in RMNS? -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Oct. 03 2007,12:51    Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 03 2007,12:39) Quote Only intelligently designed processes can detect error. Sometimes, creatures aren't formed perfectly and so they die. Sometimes, creatures don't have the right attributes to cope with their environment, so they die. Is death an "intelligently designed process that can detect error"? Would that make the NS "intelligently designed" in RMNS? Bob, go on ask em that over at UD, dare ya! -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

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