Joe G
Posts: 12011
Joined: July 2007
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| Quote (OgreMkV @ Mar. 06 2012,16:10) | | Quote (Joe G @ Mar. 06 2012,16:04) | | Quote (OgreMkV @ Mar. 06 2012,16:01) | | Quote (Joe G @ Mar. 06 2012,15:20) | | Quote (REC @ Mar. 06 2012,15:17) | | Quote (Joe G @ Mar. 06 2012,15:15) | No kevin- the blind watchmaker is more than an ananlogy- it is a thesis
And you are still a childish imp |
Could you state what you think the 'blind watchmaker' thesis is? |
Again? For biology see dawkins
But anyway it would materialism's claim that matter, energy, necessity and chance are all that is required-> ie our existence is due to the unplanned, unguided interactions between matter and energy |
Quote it.
Point me to the book and page or journal and page (volume etc as well) where Dawkins develops A THESIS (your words) that describes a blind watchmaker.
Until you do that, you are either lying or too stupid to understand the point.
But that's what we get when talking to someone whose idea of rational discourse is talking about shit filled diapers.
So, can you actually talk about the 2nd law of thermodynamics or not? A yes or no answer will do here.
I've been doing research, but we still need to clear this issue up. |
THAT is your cowardly response?
You know you could always just ante up with some evidence that proves I am wrong- but you won't because you are a coward. |
No Joe, it's because I think you are lying. My secondary hypothesis is that you are too stupid (or willfully ignorant) to understand the difference between an analogy used in educating people who are not scientists and the actual scientific concept.
I want you to show me where you got your claims, so I can correctly choose the answer. you not giving me such information is effectively admitting you are a liar.
There is only one definition of 'mole' that pertains to chemistry. sigh...
Seriously Joe, there's been two pages of us laughing our asses off because you don't understand something that I taught to 9th grade students before Christmas (you know, when they actually had a chance to remember something).
We haven't even gotten to the actual discussion on thermodynamics yet. I just threw in "mole" to be sciency and to make the math slightly easier... if you could actually do any math.
That is NOT a fundamental part of the question. That fact that you can't even recognize that is just freaking hilarious and more evidence that you are utterly without a clue. |
Umm, asshole, I showed you where I got my claims and you threw a hissy fit because i provided quotes:
So here is the evolutionary references to support my claim:
Eric B Knox, "The use of hierarchies as organizational models
in systematics", <i>Biological Journal of the Linnean Society</I> (1998), 63: 1–49:
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Evolution is rife with examples of such apparent conflict because it is an inherently dualistic process. This dualism is obvious in Darwin’s enduring characterization of evolution as descent with modification. This dualism is manifested in a mechanism that is prospectively <b>blind</b>, but retrospectively capable of organic improvement. page 4 (bold added) |
Then we have:
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“Natural selection is the blind watchmaker, blind because it does not see ahead, does not plan consequences, has no purpose in view.” Dawkins in “The Blind Watchmaker” |
and:
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“Natural selection is the simple result of variation, differential reproduction, and heredity—it is mindless and mechanistic.” <a href=http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/IIIE6Nonrandom.shtml><b>UCBerkley</b></a> |
From the “Contemporary Discourse in the Field Of Biology” series I read- <i>Biological Evolution: An Anthology of Current Thought</i>, (edited by Katy Human). This is part of a reviewed series expressing the current scientific consensus.
<blockquote>
Uncertainty, randomness, nonlinearity, and lack of hierarchy seem to rule existence, at least where evolution is concerned.- page10</blockquote>
<blockquote>
The old, discredited equation of evolution with progress has been largely superseded by the almost whimsical notion that evolution requires mistakes to bring about specieswide adaptation. Natural selection requires variation, and variation requires mutations- <b>those accidental deletions or additions of material deep within the DNA of our cells</b>. In an increasingly slick, fast-paced, automated, impersonal world, one in which we are constantly being reminded of the narrow margin for error, it is refreshing to be reminded that <b>mistakes are a powerful and necessary creative force</b>. A few important but subtle “mistakes,” in evolutionary terms, may save the human race. -page 10 ending the intro</blockquote>
<a href=http://learn.genetics.utah.edu/archive/sloozeworm/mutationbg.html><b>What Causes Mutations?</b></a>:
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Mutations in DNA sequences generally occur through one of two processes:
1. DNA damage from environmental agents such as ultraviolet light (sunshine), nuclear radiation or certain chemicals
2. Mistakes that occur when a cell copies its DNA in preparation for cell division. |
[url= http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibr....;Causes of Mutations</b>[/url]:
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1. DNA fails to copy accurately
Most of the mutations that we think matter to evolution are "naturally-occurring." For example, when a cell divides, it makes a copy of its DNA — and sometimes the copy is not quite perfect. That small difference from the original DNA sequence is a mutation.
2. External influences can create mutations
Mutations can also be caused by exposure to specific chemicals or radiation. These agents cause the DNA to break down. This is not necessarily unnatural — even in the most isolated and pristine environments, DNA breaks down. Nevertheless, when the cell repairs the DNA, it might not do a perfect job of the repair. So the cell would end up with DNA slightly different than the original DNA and hence, a mutation. |
<b> DNA Replication and Causes of Mutation</b>
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DNA replication is a truly amazing biological phenomenon. Consider the countless number of times that your cells divide to make you who you are—not just during development, but even now, as a fully mature adult. Then consider that every time a human cell divides and its DNA replicates, it has to copy and transmit the exact same sequence of 3 billion nucleotides to its daughter cells. Finally, consider the fact that in life (literally), nothing is perfect. While most DNA replicates with fairly high fidelity, mistakes do happen, with polymerase enzymes sometimes inserting the wrong nucleotide or too many or too few nucleotides into a sequence. Fortunately, most of these mistakes are fixed through various DNA repair processes. Repair enzymes recognize structural imperfections between improperly paired nucleotides, cutting out the wrong ones and putting the right ones in their place. But some replication errors make it past these mechanisms, thus becoming permanent mutations. These altered nucleotide sequences can then be passed down from one cellular generation to the next, and if they occur in cells that give rise to gametes, they can even be transmitted to subsequent organismal generations. <b>Moreover, when the genes for the DNA repair enzymes themselves become mutated, mistakes begin accumulating at a much higher rate.</b> In eukaryotes, such mutations can lead to cancer. (bold added) |
?
And finally:
The Elie Wiesel Foundation for Humanity- Nobel Laureates Iinitiative
September 9, 2005
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Logically derived from confirmable evidence, evolution is understood to be the result of an unguided, unplanned process of random variation and natural selection. |
Yes I know I have a bunch of messed up tags but the above is more than enough to prove that you are a fucking asshole, liar and coward- and I would expect your ilk to laugh, apparently that is all you can do.
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"Facts are Stupid"- Timothy Horton aka Occam's Afterbirth
"Genetic mutations aren't mistakes"-ID and Timothy Horton
Whales do not have tails. Water turns to ice via a molecular code- Â Acartia bogart, TARD
YEC is more coherent than materialism and it's bastard child, evolutionism
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