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carlsonjok



Posts: 3326
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 25 2007,15:52   

Quote (Kristine @ May 25 2007,15:25)
   
Quote (stevestory @ May 25 2007,12:22)

 
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ May 25 2007,07:32)
Sad to say, this indicates that the even the crack UD/ID Google research team has been disbanded.

you left off "-head"



Sorry. :)

Another wildlife shot from the Galapagos?

--------------
It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 25 2007,16:30   

Now some Arcturian Megatard is trying to correct Avalos about what publication Avalos published in.

Cue Quentin Tarantino voice from Reservoir Dogs: "Jeeeee-zus Christ".

   
Ichthyic



Posts: 3325
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 25 2007,17:28   

I still think that's Tarantino's best movie.

--------------
"And the sea will grant each man new hope..."

-CC

  
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4265
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 25 2007,18:49   

Quote (Kristine @ May 25 2007,15:25)
 
Quote (stevestory @ May 25 2007,12:22)

 
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ May 25 2007,07:32)
Sad to say, this indicates that the even the crack UD/ID Google research team has been disbanded.

you left off "-head"


Sorry. :)

NOBODY recognizes DT's big houseboat?  I'm shocked.

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 2564
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 26 2007,05:16   

The sea looks a bit choppy for our Dave to be out on his boat.

Bob

--------------
It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

   
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4265
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 26 2007,05:41   

In my book, anyone who can dress his dongle in jeans and a tennis shoe is to be respected.

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 26 2007,20:23   

Paul Nelson is nostalgic for the days when creationism was respectable.

Quote
26 May 2007
Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose
Paul Nelson

Or something like that. This book looks WAY interesting…here’s the blurb from the University of California Press:
Quote
The world is configured in ways that seem systematically hospitable to life forms, especially the human race. Is this the outcome of divine planning or simply of the laws of physics? Ancient Greeks and Romans famously disagreed on whether the cosmos was the product of intelligent design or accident. In this book, David Sedley examines this question and illuminates new historical perspectives on the pantheon of thinkers who laid the foundations of western philosophy and science. Versions of what we call the “creationist” option were widely favored by the major thinkers of classical antiquity, including Plato, whose ideas on the subject prepared the ground for Aristotle’s celebrated teleology. But Aristotle aligned himself with the anti-creationist lobby, whose most militant members–the atomists–sought to show how a world just like ours would inevitably form by sheer accident, given only the infinity of space and matter. This stimulating study explores seven major thinkers and philosophical movements enmeshed in the debate: Anaxagoras, Empedocles, Socrates, Plato, the atomists, Aristotle, and the Stoics.
In our current cultural context, the equation of “creationism” and intelligent design is politically tendentious, of course (very useful for public school controversies, hopelessly wrong in most other respects). But that minor terminological caveat aside, I can hardly wait to see this book. Give me a pair of sandals, a clay jug of wine, a pleasant grove in which to stroll and argue: I’m there.

(HT to Ashby Camp for the forthcoming notice from the U of CA press…)


http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....e-chose

   
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4265
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,13:29   

WAD is happy to concede that Mercury once had other designations:
         
Quote
44 William Dembski  05/26/2007 8:52 pm

To Hector Avalos: I’m happy to concede whatever other designations the periodical MERCURY may have. The larger issue is that it is a popular periodical and you cite your piece in it as though it had some leverage against Guillermo Gonzalez and his scholarship.

Anyone can make a mistake.

But WAD would be very sad were he compelled to concede that a larger issue has become his baseless and flatly mistaken accusation that Avalos deliberately distorted the title of the publication to enhance its status.  

People who make mistakes of that sort generally acknowledge and apologize for them.  

Dear WAD: If it makes it any more palatable, you may deploy one of your patented "I'm still an angry prick" apologies, if you like.

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,14:33   

Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ May 27 2007,14:29)
WAD is happy to concede that Mercury once had other designations:
         
Quote
44 William Dembski  05/26/2007 8:52 pm

To Hector Avalos: I’m happy to concede whatever other designations the periodical MERCURY may have. The larger issue is that it is a popular periodical and you cite your piece in it as though it had some leverage against Guillermo Gonzalez and his scholarship.

Anyone can make a mistake.

But WAD would be very sad were he compelled to concede that a larger issue has become his baseless and flatly mistaken accusation that Avalos deliberately distorted the title of the publication to enhance its status.  

People who make mistakes of that sort generally acknowledge and apologize for them.  

Dear WAD: If it makes it any more palatable, you may deploy one of your patented "I'm still an angry prick" apologies, if you like.

DEMBSKI is complaining that someone's science writing was in a popular magazine instead of a real journal?!??!?!?!

AAAAA! Gotta turn off the irony meter while there's still ti--


   
dhogaza



Posts: 525
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,15:15   

Quote of the day ...
Quote
Anthropogenic warming through CO2 is a fallacy. It can’t stand up against the evidence even now and all it’s going to take to make a laughingstock of the consensus science and agenda driven politics behind it is finding the real cause of climate heating and cooling. When the anthropogenic global warming hoax falls it’s going to give consensus science a black eye that will IMO take down other consensus science just-so stories along with it. NeoDarwinian macro-evolution is one of those other stories.

I won't bother identifying the author of this gem.  Y'all have already figured it out :)

  
someotherguy



Posts: 398
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,15:55   

Quote (dhogaza @ May 27 2007,15:15)
Quote of the day ...
 
Quote
Anthropogenic warming through CO2 is a fallacy. It can’t stand up against the evidence even now and all it’s going to take to make a laughingstock of the consensus science and agenda driven politics behind it is finding the real cause of climate heating and cooling. When the anthropogenic global warming hoax falls it’s going to give consensus science a black eye that will IMO take down other consensus science just-so stories along with it. NeoDarwinian macro-evolution is one of those other stories.

I won't bother identifying the author of this gem.  Y'all have already figured it out :)

That would be the latest piece of paradigm-shattering, autodidactical research from our much-beloved DaveScot.

--------------
Evolander in training

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,16:09   

Quote
When the anthropogenic global warming hoax falls it’s going to give consensus science a black eye that will IMO take down other consensus science just-so stories along with it. NeoDarwinian macro-evolution is one of those other stories.


And the HIV conspiracy! -Philip Johnson

   
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,19:02   

When thinking about the complicated situation of Guillermo Gonzales's tenure, we should consult the finest minds.

Like Terri Shiavo's lawyer, of course.

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,19:45   

DaveTard!

http://www.uncommondescent.com/off-top....-change

Quote
27 May 2007
Cosmic Rays Implicated in Climate Change
DaveScot
In a nutshell - cosmic rays induce particle formation in the atmosphere.

....




--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,19:54   

Quote (stevestory @ May 27 2007,20:02)
When thinking about the complicated situation of Guillermo Gonzales's tenure, we should consult the finest minds.

Like Terri Shiavo's lawyer, of course.

Quote
27 May 2007
Columnist and lawyer Ken Connor weighs in on Gonzalez tenure case
O'Leary

Here’s columnist Ken Connor (Terry Schiavo lawyer) on the Gonzalez tenure denial:


Terry Shiavo lawyer? Denyse, for a professional writer, it's really not good to make two mistakes in three words.

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,20:41   

Do you has wordz?

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,20:57   

I haz wordz for ur face!!!!!111111oneoneone

   
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,20:59   

Quote (someotherguy @ May 27 2007,15:55)
Quote (dhogaza @ May 27 2007,15:15)
Quote of the day ...
   
Quote
Anthropogenic warming through CO2 is a fallacy. It can’t stand up against the evidence even now and all it’s going to take to make a laughingstock of the consensus science and agenda driven politics behind it is finding the real cause of climate heating and cooling. When the anthropogenic global warming hoax falls it’s going to give consensus science a black eye that will IMO take down other consensus science just-so stories along with it. NeoDarwinian macro-evolution is one of those other stories.

I won't bother identifying the author of this gem.  Y'all have already figured it out :)

That would be the latest piece of paradigm-shattering, autodidactical research from our much-beloved DaveScot.

I like how Dave's now throwing around the phrase 'consensus science' like it's a dirty word. Shows he's continuing his descent into straight crackpottery, which pleases me.  :)

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,21:03   

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 27 2007,21:59)
I like how Dave's now throwing around the phrase 'consensus science' like it's a dirty word. Shows he's continuing his descent into straight crackpottery, which pleases me.  :)

that comes direct from Michael Crichton, who gives immensely stupid speeches about how anything which is 'consensus' is not 'science'.

Goddam, it hurts my head even thinking about that comment. A little bit of tard gets me nice and tipsy, way too much gives me a painful hangover.

   
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,21:09   

Quote (stevestory @ May 27 2007,21:03)
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 27 2007,21:59)
I like how Dave's now throwing around the phrase 'consensus science' like it's a dirty word. Shows he's continuing his descent into straight crackpottery, which pleases me.  :)

that comes direct from Michael Crichton, who gives immensely stupid speeches about how anything which is 'consensus' is not 'science'.

Goddam, it hurts my head even thinking about that comment. A little bit of tard gets me nice and tipsy, way too much gives me a painful hangover.

Dave Tard seems to be sliding toward being a garden variety, T-Rex-ate-coconuts Creationist -- he didn't used to make snide remarks about 'macroevolution', did he?

I think the IDers are basically getting drunk on their own failure.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,21:27   

It is highly weird to read their comment sections, where they talk about signs that materialists are having their Waterloo, etc. ID has been a complete failure. They don't even try to publish. They lose in court. The media is starting to ignore them. And yet they're high on some kind of Failure Crack, where if they just pretend hard enough, they think they're winning. It's really bizarre to watch people sink into complete delusion, like you say.

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,21:35   

Quote (stevestory @ May 27 2007,21:27)
It is highly weird to read their comment sections, where they talk about signs that materialists are having their Waterloo, etc. ID has been a complete failure. They don't even try to publish. They lose in court. The media is starting to ignore them. And yet they're high on some kind of Failure Crack, where if they just pretend hard enough, they think they're winning. It's really bizarre to watch people sink into complete delusion, like you say.

Kudos to DaveTard, though. As they are such a poor fit in the current environment, he's trying to evolve UD to broader science denying. Tard will find a way...

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,22:07   

Re "[...] a garden variety, T-Rex-ate-coconuts Creationist [...]"

Ah ha - that explains the teeth, then. They needed them to crack open the coconuts!!!!!!

Glad we got that straightened out. (Just had to milk that coconut remark for what ah could get out of it.)

Henry

  
Ichthyic



Posts: 3325
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 27 2007,22:44   

Quote
Goddam, it hurts my head even thinking about that comment. A little bit of tard gets me nice and tipsy, way too much gives me a painful hangover.


that's why i keep pushing for warning labels, Steve.

I'm working on some bumper stickers too:


"Don't 'Tard and drive"

"Mothers Against Tard Excess"

--------------
"And the sea will grant each man new hope..."

-CC

  
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4265
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 28 2007,07:10   

Suspense at UD! Will WAD issue an "I'm still an angry prick" apology after Avalos embarrassed his unfounded accusations vis Mercury?

No. All we get is "I'm still an angry prick," sans apology. But we knew that.

Avalos then dismantled WAD's further paranoid musings vis Avalos' tenure application. NOW an "I'm still an angry prick" apology?  

Sigh. All we get is "This initially appears gracious but I'm still an angry prick." First the faux gracious introduction:
                         
Quote
To Hector Avalos: Thank you for your forthright response and for answering my questions. You certainly seem worthy of tenure, and I expect I would have voted for your tenure had I been on any of the appropriate committees. (Would you do the same for Guillermo Gonzalez?)

But it can't last:
                         
Quote
Your preceding comment, however, raises another question, which is, How do you understand persecution? If you think the questions I raised on this blog constitute persecution, then you live a very cossetted life.

Note to WAD: It was not your questions, which were answered and shown to be off point, nor Avalos understanding of persecution, that are at issue. It is your false accusation that he deliberately distorted the title of Mercury magazine to inflate its status, which is indeed a "highly personalized attack" upon his integrity, that is at issue. An issue you have yet to be big enough to address.

The rest is pure "I'm an angry prick."
                         
Quote
I suspect that you did not lose any sleep over my blog post. On the other hand, by poisoning the well for Guillermo with your petition and attacks against him on campus, I suspect that you did cause him considerable upset.

You really did institute a witch hunt against Guillermo. In referring to a witch hunt here, I was merely being ironic. In any case, please be sure to let us know what negative repercussions this post has on your career at ISU. If anything, you seem to be getting considerable mileage now by playing the martyr. So even your past detractors are now coming to your defense because of the “attack” here? You are welcome to these new supporters — I certainly have no use for them.

By the way, my wife is from Iowa, and I get up there now and again. I’d be happy to debate you at ISU if you’re up for it. My one condition is that I have as much uninterrupted time to present my case as you do yours. The title of my talk would be “How to be an intellectually fulfilled atheist.”


--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 28 2007,08:29   

They try to steer Avalos onto the right track. It's not ID, it's just his ignorance of what ID really is that's the problem, apparently.
Quote
Prof. Hector Avalos

Having read some of your comments on Intelligent Design, may I encourage you to read original ID source material sufficient to grasp the basic principles ID.

...
 
Quote
By this comment, you appear to be unaware of the foundational distinction made by Intelligent Design between Chance, Law (“order”) and Information (or “intelligence.”) The critical hypothesis or theory of ID is that neither Chance nor Law can form Design Information or “Complex Specified Information”. See Dembski’s Filter. Your comments on self assembly fall within “Law” and give no basis for information in DNA and proteins. With your comment: “Many crucial biological substances do have properties that allow them to assume very orderly structures” you appear to be oblivious of these distinctions between chance, law and design information. (NOT “Shannon entropy”.)

So sayz word salad meister DLH
However the bolded text above seems to contradict what King Tard had to say in a earlier episode of this slow train wreck.
 
Quote
We can’t, or at least I believe we can’t, come up with an objective formula that distinguishes specification from non-specification. But that doesn’t negate the fact that specification is tangible and can be practically employed to discriminate between chance and design

Link
So we cannot define it, but we know what cannot create it. How does that go again DS? Crazy stuff.
DLH later says
 
Quote
Foundationally, ID looks for objective empirical evidence in nature for a designer.

So far that seems to consist of finding articles that contain particular words and highlighting them


--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
Alan Fox



Posts: 1556
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 28 2007,08:59   

Quote (dhogaza @ May 27 2007,10:15)
Quote of the day ...
   
Quote
Anthropogenic warming through CO2 is a fallacy. It can’t stand up against the evidence even now and all it’s going to take to make a laughingstock of the consensus science and agenda driven politics behind it is finding the real cause of climate heating and cooling. When the anthropogenic global warming hoax falls it’s going to give consensus science a black eye that will IMO take down other consensus science just-so stories along with it. NeoDarwinian macro-evolution is one of those other stories.

I won't bother identifying the author of this gem.  Y'all have already figured it out :)

I had a feeling of "déja vu" looking at Dave Springer's latest thread on climate change. I get "New Scientist" by mail and sure enough, page 40 of the 19 May edition:

 
Quote
Myth: It's all down to cosmic rays


covers Svensmark's claim that cosmic rays are the culprit, pointing out that he used "unjustified" corrections to his data to achieve correlation between cloud cover and cosmic ray activity. Their website is , apparently, unavailable at the moment, so, no link, sorry.

Edit: there is this though, in case anyone hasn't already seen it.

Edit:New Scientist link found!

  
N.Wells



Posts: 1836
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 28 2007,10:30   

Quote
(From Dr. Dr. Dembski at http://www.uncommondescent.com/evoluti....22911): I expect I would have voted for your tenure had I been on any of the appropriate committees. (Would you do the same for Guillermo Gonzalez?)


So now Dr. Dr. Dembski thinks that tenure decisions should be a matter of trading votes?  

As others have noted, much irony and more than a little hypocrisy can be found in Dembski criticizing someone for not publishing in peer-reviewed journals and belittling him for publishing outside his area of expertise.

 
Quote
If anything, you seem to be getting considerable mileage now by playing the martyr.

Well, IDists certainly know about that tactic.

 
Quote
If so, why shouldn’t Gonzalez’s PRIVILEGED PLANET count likewise in favor of his tenure?

Here the good Dr. Dr. demonstrates even greater ignorance of the tenure process.  Tenure committees go to great lengths to evaluate publication accomplishments in the humanities.  Mostly, tenure committees rely on (1) evaluations by independent experts in the candidate's specialty, (2) any awards from professional organizations, (3) the existence of favorable professional reviews (i.e., in professional journals, not in the mass media), and, above all else, (4) the "venue", which is to say the status or reputation of the publisher.  People in the humanities know this, so there is considerable competition to get published in the most prestigious venues.  On a scale of 0-10, judging from what I see coming off its presses in recent years (e.g., Jonathan Wells' "Icons of Evolution", O'Neill & Corsi's "Unfit for Command", Ann Coulter's "High Crimes & Misdemeanours"), I would guess that Regnery now rates at 0 (if not less), so no, Gonzalez's book wouldn't contribute much toward winning tenure.

 
Quote
Or do you know in advance (on what grounds? scientific? ideological? philosophical? …) that he’s full of it and you’re not.

Well, that was part of Avalos' original point: he was able to tell in advance that "Privileged Planet" is hogwash, because he published an article that countered those sorts of arguments in 1998, whereas "Privileged Planet" was published in 2004.  Sheesh.

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 2564
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 28 2007,11:47   

Quote (Alan Fox @ May 28 2007,08:59)
Edit:New Scientist link found!

Wo-hoo!  Evilution is proven: Alan's found a missing link!

Bob

--------------
It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

   
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 28 2007,12:14   

Quote (stevestory @ May 27 2007,21:03)
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 27 2007,21:59)
I like how Dave's now throwing around the phrase 'consensus science' like it's a dirty word. Shows he's continuing his descent into straight crackpottery, which pleases me.  :)

that comes direct from Michael Crichton, who gives immensely stupid speeches about how anything which is 'consensus' is not 'science'.

And, if you have DT's shaky grasp of logic, that means that anything that is not 'consensus' is science.

At this point the door is wide open to bottomless crackpottery.  :)

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
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