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JohnW



Posts: 3217
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:33   

This is a genuine, snark-free question for FTK and/or anyone else who can remember more bible than me...

What, specifically, does the bible say about abortion, one way or the other?

--------------
Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers

There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

  
Ftk



Posts: 2239
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:34   

Quote (MadPanda, FCD @ Jan. 25 2011,12:17)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:05)
Hmmm...I always find it interesting to watch how people picture me.  It's funny....I don't harbor any feelings of hate for anyone.  What is the point?  I found out loooongggg ago that hate sucks...make ya feel horrible 24/7.  Life's too short.  

What kind of legal punishment could possibly be given?   I don't think I've ever heard pro-choice people offering possible ideas for punishing people legally who have had an abortion.  Honestly, it's never crossed my mind.  From where I stand, I've always wanted to see the numbers of abortions decrease by millions through education, counseling, etc..  I've never once considered someone who had an abortion evil.  Gawd...I'm a woman...I know full well what goes through one's mind when you become pregnant.  Come on....chill a little.

Pull ye the other one: you pass judgment at one remove and pretend that you don't, because it's all about what your imaginary friend wants.

You judge those who do not behave as you do, be they promiscuous, premarital, or gay...but you hide it behind nice language and friendly concern.  It's all about what your imaginary friend tells you is right.  It's all about the magic book with the magic words and unquestionable instructions.

Your very belief system entails consigning people with whom you do not agree to everlasting punishment on the basis of what a figment of your imagination is said to have commanded.  It certainly allows you to write others off as subhuman when it's convenient!  Or do you discard the doctrine of hell when it proves to be an embarrassment?  Whoops!  There goes the reason for obeying the Sky Daddy!

And yet, you think I am hateful because I point these uncomfortable truths out to you.  Funny, that.  Project much?


The MadPanda, FCD

You know...this doesn't even make sense to me AT ALL.  

So, are you saying that since I hold to a particular moral standard that I see as the perfect goal, that I then should be fucking mean as hell to people who can't maintain that standard?  How in the holy hell would I be able to do that and live with myself????  Wouldn't that be incredibly, insanely hypocritical???  Why do I have to be unfriendly, and not show friendly concern?  Shit, I would certainly hope that there would be people out there concerned when I fuck up.  Luckily there have been!

I am stating what I hold to be the best possible way of living.  We all make mistakes and all have regrets.  Must, then, my next response be to damn everyone to hell?  That is RIDICULOUS.

--------------
"Evolution is a creationism and just as illogical [as] the other pantheistic creation myths"  -forastero

  
MadPanda, FCD



Posts: 267
Joined: Nov. 2010

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:39   

Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:34)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:17)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:05)
Hmmm...I always find it interesting to watch how people picture me.  It's funny....I don't harbor any feelings of hate for anyone.  What is the point?  I found out loooongggg ago that hate sucks...make ya feel horrible 24/7.  Life's too short.  

What kind of legal punishment could possibly be given?   I don't think I've ever heard pro-choice people offering possible ideas for punishing people legally who have had an abortion.  Honestly, it's never crossed my mind.  From where I stand, I've always wanted to see the numbers of abortions decrease by millions through education, counseling, etc..  I've never once considered someone who had an abortion evil.  Gawd...I'm a woman...I know full well what goes through one's mind when you become pregnant.  Come on....chill a little.

Pull ye the other one: you pass judgment at one remove and pretend that you don't, because it's all about what your imaginary friend wants.

You judge those who do not behave as you do, be they promiscuous, premarital, or gay...but you hide it behind nice language and friendly concern.  It's all about what your imaginary friend tells you is right.  It's all about the magic book with the magic words and unquestionable instructions.

Your very belief system entails consigning people with whom you do not agree to everlasting punishment on the basis of what a figment of your imagination is said to have commanded.  It certainly allows you to write others off as subhuman when it's convenient!  Or do you discard the doctrine of hell when it proves to be an embarrassment?  Whoops!  There goes the reason for obeying the Sky Daddy!

And yet, you think I am hateful because I point these uncomfortable truths out to you.  Funny, that.  Project much?


The MadPanda, FCD

You know...this doesn't even make sense to me AT ALL.  

So, are you saying that since I hold to a particular moral standard that I see as the perfect goal, that I then should be fucking mean as hell to people who can't maintain that standard?  How in the holy hell would I be able to do that and live with myself????  Wouldn't that be incredibly, insanely hypocritical???  Why do I have to be unfriendly, and not show friendly concern?  Shit, I would certainly hope that there would be people out there concerned when I fuck up.  Luckily there have been!

I am stating what I hold to be the best possible way of living.  We all make mistakes and all have regrets.  Must, then, my next response be to damn everyone to hell?  That is RIDICULOUS.

Try reading for comprehension, ftk.

Are you saying that all that stuff about hellfire and damnation isn't to be taken seriously?

Do you deny that you earlier commented that it is your imaginary friend's business to judge?

Do you understand the concept of 'Minnesota nice'?  You're using it.


The MadPanda, FCD

--------------
"No matter how ridiculous the internet tough guy, a thorough mocking is more effective than a swift kick to the gentleman vegetables with a hobnailed boot" --Louis

  
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:39   

Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:34)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:17)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:05)
Hmmm...I always find it interesting to watch how people picture me.  It's funny....I don't harbor any feelings of hate for anyone.  What is the point?  I found out loooongggg ago that hate sucks...make ya feel horrible 24/7.  Life's too short.  

What kind of legal punishment could possibly be given?   I don't think I've ever heard pro-choice people offering possible ideas for punishing people legally who have had an abortion.  Honestly, it's never crossed my mind.  From where I stand, I've always wanted to see the numbers of abortions decrease by millions through education, counseling, etc..  I've never once considered someone who had an abortion evil.  Gawd...I'm a woman...I know full well what goes through one's mind when you become pregnant.  Come on....chill a little.

Pull ye the other one: you pass judgment at one remove and pretend that you don't, because it's all about what your imaginary friend wants.

You judge those who do not behave as you do, be they promiscuous, premarital, or gay...but you hide it behind nice language and friendly concern.  It's all about what your imaginary friend tells you is right.  It's all about the magic book with the magic words and unquestionable instructions.

Your very belief system entails consigning people with whom you do not agree to everlasting punishment on the basis of what a figment of your imagination is said to have commanded.  It certainly allows you to write others off as subhuman when it's convenient!  Or do you discard the doctrine of hell when it proves to be an embarrassment?  Whoops!  There goes the reason for obeying the Sky Daddy!

And yet, you think I am hateful because I point these uncomfortable truths out to you.  Funny, that.  Project much?


The MadPanda, FCD

You know...this doesn't even make sense to me AT ALL.  

So, are you saying that since I hold to a particular moral standard that I see as the perfect goal, that I then should be fucking mean as hell to people who can't maintain that standard?  How in the holy hell would I be able to do that and live with myself????  Wouldn't that be incredibly, insanely hypocritical???  Why do I have to be unfriendly, and not show friendly concern?  Shit, I would certainly hope that there would be people out there concerned when I fuck up.  Luckily there have been!

I am stating what I hold to be the best possible way of living.  We all make mistakes and all have regrets.  Must, then, my next response be to damn everyone to hell?  That is RIDICULOUS.

So I'm not going to hell?

--------------
"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:42   

yes but not for that.  for the cats

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:44   

Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Jan. 25 2011,18:42)
yes but not for that.  for the cats

Massive LOL right there!

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
Ftk



Posts: 2239
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:44   

Quote (khan @ Jan. 25 2011,12:32)
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 25 2011,13:17)
You should be very justifiably proud.

I shall have to beat my boy more, he's 19 months and barely knows any quantum mechanics and he cannot even write a symphony yet.*

Louis

*I'm not serious. Of course he can write a symphony! (I'm not serious about the beating of course...is that Child Services at the door?)

I'm 60, I've been married & divorced; I've had an abortion; I've had wisdom teeth yanked; I've had sex outside of marriage.
I've also eaten shrimp & clams; & have worn clothes of mixed fabrics; & interplanted crops.

Which of these behaviors are subject to stoning or shunning?

Always looking for punishment, aren't you?  I'm giving you the ideal....what is strived for.  Even 'ol SD has fallen into the one man/one woman.  It's what works in the end.  

It's not a perfect world, obviously.  I personally believe we learn a lot about life from our mistakes.  That doesn't mean that Ima support abortion because it makes you all feel better.

You bringing up stoning and shunning is entirely a different subject that should be taken back to Christianity 101.

--------------
"Evolution is a creationism and just as illogical [as] the other pantheistic creation myths"  -forastero

  
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:44   

Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,18:17)
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 25 2011,11:33)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,17:18)
 
Quote
These "lifestyles" to which people who don't share your precise response to a photo, what are they? How do you know what you claim to know? Why is someone's emotional response to a photo predicated on some claimed lifestyle that person has?

You're making claims and judgements you have no basis for, do you think that might have some bearing on your intellectual integrity?

Louis


Same lifestyle as I've lived from time to time.  You play, you pay.  I'm not be condescending.  I could bring up my past payments, but I don't particularly care to see this thread turn into a Jerry Springer circus.

I'm just stating the obvious...chill brother.

Does anything you've said even remotely resemble details? No.

Does anything you've said even remotely resemble an argument? No.

I'm not asking for your personal details, FTK, I profoundly do not care about them.

You made a very specific claim which runs thus:

"People who do not share my emotional and visceral reaction to a photo of an aborted foetus are Dahmeresque sub-humans who do not share my emotional and visceral reaction because of their lifestyle".

This is not obvious, it's not even true as it happens, and this brother is so chilled you could keep a side of meat in him for a month.

You make a claim, you support a claim. Period. End of story, The fat lady she singeth and cetera.

If you cannot support the claim, say so and retract it. No biggie.

Louis

Again, stating the obvious.....no scientific graphs and charts needed.

Let's say for a moment, that we all lived the life....one man/one woman forever Amen.

That imediately does away with virtually all std's and the vast, vast majority of all unwanted pregnancies.  Not all....but most.  And, we'd have those little babies anyway and work things out.  

Lifestyle....period.

Where does one even start?

And weren't we talking about REACTIONS TO PHOTOS, FTK? Weren't you the one who complained (wrongly) about the errors of others for ascribing an inconsistent position to you?

So the people who are the Dahmer-esque sub-humans are not the ones who do not share your reaction to a photo, but the people who have an abortion now? You're being more than a little inconsistent FTK. I've bolded your claim in the quoted post above. Support that claim.

You said that people who looked at a photo and didn't feel a set of feelings you described yourself as feeling were Dahmeresque sub-humans and only felt that way because of their lifestyle. Let me give you a hint, the set of people who do not share your reaction to those sorts of photos are not necessarily the same as the set of people who have had abortions. You are talking about two different sets of people.

To clarify this even more for you, it is possible for, say, a single, celibate pathologist to look at photos of dimembered foetuses with a greater degree of dispassion than you and to have never had, or been responsible for, a pregnancy that was deliberately terminated by abortion. Thus the set of people who have had abortions does not include the set of people who have different reactions to your own when presented with those photographs. Lifestyle? I think not.

It is equally possible for a promiscuous person, who has had many abortions, or been responsible for many pregnancies which ended in abortions, to have precisely the visceral, emotional reaction to those photos you do. Thus the set of people who have the same reactions to these photos as you does not include the set of people who have not had abortions. Lifestyle again? In a word: no.

Your tedious moralising is as unexamined and bigotted as your life.

Louis

--------------
Bye.

  
Ftk



Posts: 2239
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:45   

Quote (khan @ Jan. 25 2011,12:39)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:34)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:17)
 
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:05)
Hmmm...I always find it interesting to watch how people picture me.  It's funny....I don't harbor any feelings of hate for anyone.  What is the point?  I found out loooongggg ago that hate sucks...make ya feel horrible 24/7.  Life's too short.  

What kind of legal punishment could possibly be given?   I don't think I've ever heard pro-choice people offering possible ideas for punishing people legally who have had an abortion.  Honestly, it's never crossed my mind.  From where I stand, I've always wanted to see the numbers of abortions decrease by millions through education, counseling, etc..  I've never once considered someone who had an abortion evil.  Gawd...I'm a woman...I know full well what goes through one's mind when you become pregnant.  Come on....chill a little.

Pull ye the other one: you pass judgment at one remove and pretend that you don't, because it's all about what your imaginary friend wants.

You judge those who do not behave as you do, be they promiscuous, premarital, or gay...but you hide it behind nice language and friendly concern.  It's all about what your imaginary friend tells you is right.  It's all about the magic book with the magic words and unquestionable instructions.

Your very belief system entails consigning people with whom you do not agree to everlasting punishment on the basis of what a figment of your imagination is said to have commanded.  It certainly allows you to write others off as subhuman when it's convenient!  Or do you discard the doctrine of hell when it proves to be an embarrassment?  Whoops!  There goes the reason for obeying the Sky Daddy!

And yet, you think I am hateful because I point these uncomfortable truths out to you.  Funny, that.  Project much?


The MadPanda, FCD

You know...this doesn't even make sense to me AT ALL.  

So, are you saying that since I hold to a particular moral standard that I see as the perfect goal, that I then should be fucking mean as hell to people who can't maintain that standard?  How in the holy hell would I be able to do that and live with myself????  Wouldn't that be incredibly, insanely hypocritical???  Why do I have to be unfriendly, and not show friendly concern?  Shit, I would certainly hope that there would be people out there concerned when I fuck up.  Luckily there have been!

I am stating what I hold to be the best possible way of living.  We all make mistakes and all have regrets.  Must, then, my next response be to damn everyone to hell?  That is RIDICULOUS.

So I'm not going to hell?

lol....no one is going to hell just for having an abortion.

--------------
"Evolution is a creationism and just as illogical [as] the other pantheistic creation myths"  -forastero

  
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:47   

Quote
Even 'ol SD has fallen into the one man/one woman.  It's what works in the end.  


Hey FTK, don't get carried away!

if Ali was into all that moresome hot steamy stuff, we'd be out shagging a whole college dorm right now. She's just not into it, and I'm loving and gentlemanly enough to put her at the top of my priorities.

I live well with that, because she allows me to watch porn and wank as much as I want when needed.*



*TMI?

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:50   

what if you have sex with an abortion.  out side of marriage.  while eating shellfish wearing a cotton-polyester blend in the middle of cherokee beans-corn-squash agriculture plot?  

for fucks sake FtK you called people Dahmeresque simply because they have a different aesthetic than you.  own that shit you hypocrite

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:51   

Quote
Where does one even start?

And weren't we talking about REACTIONS TO PHOTOS, FTK? Weren't you the one who complained (wrongly) about the errors of others for ascribing an inconsistent position to you?

So the people who are the Dahmer-esque sub-humans are not the ones who do not share your reaction to a photo, but the people who have an abortion now? You're being more than a little inconsistent FTK. I've bolded your claim in the quoted post above. Support that claim.

You said that people who looked at a photo and didn't feel a set of feelings you described yourself as feeling were Dahmeresque sub-humans and only felt that way because of their lifestyle. Let me give you a hint, the set of people who do not share your reaction to those sorts of photos are not necessarily the same as the set of people who have had abortions. You are talking about two different sets of people.

To clarify this even more for you, it is possible for, say, a single, celibate pathologist to look at photos of dimembered foetuses with a greater degree of dispassion than you and to have never had, or been responsible for, a pregnancy that was deliberately terminated by abortion. Thus the set of people who have had abortions does not include the set of people who have different reactions to your own when presented with those photographs. Lifestyle? I think not.

It is equally possible for a promiscuous person, who has had many abortions, or been responsible for many pregnancies which ended in abortions, to have precisely the visceral, emotional reaction to those photos you do. Thus the set of people who have the same reactions to these photos as you does not include the set of people who have not had abortions. Lifestyle again? In a word: no.

Your tedious moralising is as unexamined and bigotted as your life.

Louis


This, right here, sums it up very nicely. I would push for PotW for the simple fact that it's simple, effective, unbiased, and Louis paid me to do so...

So... PotW?

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
MadPanda, FCD



Posts: 267
Joined: Nov. 2010

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:51   

Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:45)
lol....no one is going to hell just for having an abortion.

Right.  And you would know this, how, exactly?  And your credentials in this matter would be what, exactly?  (Forgive the snarky tone.  This isn't so different from FL or Biggy claiming to have the right interpretation of scripture, all others be damned.  Just because I LIKE your take on the matter doesn't mean I should just overlook the questions.)

Instead of telling this to us, why aren't you out trying to convince your fellow believers of this?  Because this makes you the first (Christian) pro-birther I've ever heard make this (welcome and encouraging) concession...and there are a whole lot of others who haven't gotten the memo.

I would add that, all snark on my part aside, I do find your commitment to reducing the number of abortions by education and other means of birth control to be more consistent and helpful than the usual noise that results.  Credit where it's due...


The MadPanda, FCD

--------------
"No matter how ridiculous the internet tough guy, a thorough mocking is more effective than a swift kick to the gentleman vegetables with a hobnailed boot" --Louis

  
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:54   

Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:45)
Quote
lol....no one is going to hell just for having an abortion.


Why not?

What about interplanting?

Is my arthritis some sort of intergenerational punishment?

--------------
"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
Ftk



Posts: 2239
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:57   

"Try reading for comprehension, ftk."

OK

"Are you saying that all that stuff about hellfire and damnation isn't to be taken seriously?"

IN REGARD TO WHAT?  ABORTION?  DO I THINK THERE IS A HELL?  YES.  DO I THINK THAT BECAUSE YOU HAVE AN ABORTION, YOU'RE GOING TO HELL?  NO.

"Do you deny that you earlier commented that it is your imaginary friend's business to judge?"

OF COURSE NOT...IT'S *ONLY* HIS PLACE TO JUDGE.  IT IS MY PLACE TO SHARE MY VIEWS IN REGARD TO GOALS BEST STRIVED FOR.

"Do you understand the concept of 'Minnesota nice'?  You're using it."

NO, NOR DO I CARE.  I AM BEING ME...I WILL NOT BE MEAN (UNLESS I LOSE IT EMOTIONALLY) TO PEOPLE WHO HOLD DIFFERENT VIEWS THAN I DO JUST TO MAKE YOU FEEL BETTER FOR SOME WEIRD TWISTED REASON.  THAT'S NO WHO I AM, AND IT'S NOT HOW I FEEL REGARDLESS OF THE GOD FACTOR OR NOT.

--------------
"Evolution is a creationism and just as illogical [as] the other pantheistic creation myths"  -forastero

  
Ftk



Posts: 2239
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:58   

Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Jan. 25 2011,12:50)
what if you have sex with an abortion.  out side of marriage.  while eating shellfish wearing a cotton-polyester blend in the middle of cherokee beans-corn-squash agriculture plot?  

for fucks sake FtK you called people Dahmeresque simply because they have a different aesthetic than you.  own that shit you hypocrite

pull the doobie out and retype that

--------------
"Evolution is a creationism and just as illogical [as] the other pantheistic creation myths"  -forastero

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,12:59   

DONT TELL ME WHAT TO DO

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:01   

Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:58)
Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:50)
what if you have sex with an abortion.  out side of marriage.  while eating shellfish wearing a cotton-polyester blend in the middle of cherokee beans-corn-squash agriculture plot?  

for fucks sake FtK you called people Dahmeresque simply because they have a different aesthetic than you.  own that shit you hypocrite

pull the doobie out and retype that

So you think the biblical condemnations are a piece of shit? Or do you pick & choose which shit you adhere to?

--------------
"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:02   

Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Jan. 25 2011,18:59)
DONT TELL ME WHAT TO DO

DONT TELL HER TO NOT TELL YOU WHAT TO DO!!!111ONE1








Sorry, been working out this morning, low blood-sugar, etc...

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:02   

Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Jan. 25 2011,13:42)
yes but not for that.  for the cats

I've known for a long time that the cats would lead me to hell.

--------------
"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
dheddle



Posts: 545
Joined: Sep. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:04   

Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:51)
 
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:45)
lol....no one is going to hell just for having an abortion.

Right.  And you would know this, how, exactly?  And your credentials in this matter would be what, exactly?  (Forgive the snarky tone.  This isn't so different from FL or Biggy claiming to have the right interpretation of scripture, all others be damned.  Just because I LIKE your take on the matter doesn't mean I should just overlook the questions.)

Instead of telling this to us, why aren't you out trying to convince your fellow believers of this?  Because this makes you the first (Christian) pro-birther I've ever heard make this (welcome and encouraging) concession...and there are a whole lot of others who haven't gotten the memo.

I would add that, all snark on my part aside, I do find your commitment to reducing the number of abortions by education and other means of birth control to be more consistent and helpful than the usual noise that results.  Credit where it's due...


The MadPanda, FCD

You are kidding, right? Ftk is absolutely correct in this theological point--and it is broad-based Christianity 101. That is, Christianity teaches that you go to heaven if you have placed your faith in the power of Christ's death to atone for your sins. And if you don't, then you don't. On that there is nearly universal agreement--so much so that that is as good of a working definition of Christianity that you can find.

The consequence of which is:

If you have had abortions and have the aforementioned saving faith, you are saved.

If you devote your entire life to charity yet lack this faith, then you are lost.

The are a lot of details about which have internecine  warfare--such as how the faith is acquired, but on what I just wrote--no disagreement to speak of.  

We must associate with different Christians--because I never heard even one say "if you have an abortion you will go to hell." If I did, I'd be tempted to smack him.

--------------
Mysticism is a rational enterprise. Religion is not. The mystic has recognized something about the nature of consciousness prior to thought, and this recognition is susceptible to rational discussion. The mystic has reason for what he believes, and these reasons are empirical. --Sam Harris

   
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:04   

Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:44)
Quote (khan @ Jan. 25 2011,12:32)
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 25 2011,13:17)
You should be very justifiably proud.

I shall have to beat my boy more, he's 19 months and barely knows any quantum mechanics and he cannot even write a symphony yet.*

Louis

*I'm not serious. Of course he can write a symphony! (I'm not serious about the beating of course...is that Child Services at the door?)

I'm 60, I've been married & divorced; I've had an abortion; I've had wisdom teeth yanked; I've had sex outside of marriage.
I've also eaten shrimp & clams; & have worn clothes of mixed fabrics; & interplanted crops.

Which of these behaviors are subject to stoning or shunning?

Always looking for punishment, aren't you?  I'm giving you the ideal....what is strived for.  Even 'ol SD has fallen into the one man/one woman.  It's what works in the end.  

It's not a perfect world, obviously.  I personally believe we learn a lot about life from our mistakes.  That doesn't mean that Ima support abortion because it makes you all feel better.

You bringing up stoning and shunning is entirely a different subject that should be taken back to Christianity 101.

Jesus fucking shit: what behaviors should lead to death/hell?

--------------
"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
Ftk



Posts: 2239
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:05   

Quote (khan @ Jan. 25 2011,13:01)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:58)
Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:50)
what if you have sex with an abortion.  out side of marriage.  while eating shellfish wearing a cotton-polyester blend in the middle of cherokee beans-corn-squash agriculture plot?  

for fucks sake FtK you called people Dahmeresque simply because they have a different aesthetic than you.  own that shit you hypocrite

pull the doobie out and retype that

So you think the biblical condemnations are a piece of shit? Or do you pick & choose which shit you adhere to?

khan, you got about a month of one on one time for me to go into this with you?  In the long run, you don't care...so just let it go.

--------------
"Evolution is a creationism and just as illogical [as] the other pantheistic creation myths"  -forastero

  
MadPanda, FCD



Posts: 267
Joined: Nov. 2010

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:06   

Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:57)
"Try reading for comprehension, ftk."

OK

"Are you saying that all that stuff about hellfire and damnation isn't to be taken seriously?"

IN REGARD TO WHAT?  ABORTION?  DO I THINK THERE IS A HELL?  YES.  DO I THINK THAT BECAUSE YOU HAVE AN ABORTION, YOU'RE GOING TO HELL?  NO.

"Do you deny that you earlier commented that it is your imaginary friend's business to judge?"

OF COURSE NOT...IT'S *ONLY* HIS PLACE TO JUDGE.  IT IS MY PLACE TO SHARE MY VIEWS IN REGARD TO GOALS BEST STRIVED FOR.

"Do you understand the concept of 'Minnesota nice'?  You're using it."

NO, NOR DO I CARE.  I AM BEING ME...I WILL NOT BE MEAN (UNLESS I LOSE IT EMOTIONALLY) TO PEOPLE WHO HOLD DIFFERENT VIEWS THAN I DO JUST TO MAKE YOU FEEL BETTER FOR SOME WEIRD TWISTED REASON.  THAT'S NO WHO I AM, AND IT'S NOT HOW I FEEL REGARDLESS OF THE GOD FACTOR OR NOT.

Here's the thing.

You judge, all right.  You are perfectly willing to write other people off for not believing in your imaginary friend, or following your oh-so-perfect interpretation of your magic book with magic words...but you pretend that it's all your imaginary friend's doing.  That's an abdication of responsibility.  It's also deliberately acting in bad faith.  It's 'Minnesota nice' of you.

Why are you getting so upset over this?  It's all just whispers, isn't it?  It ought not be so divisive.  Remember?


The MadPanda, FCD

--------------
"No matter how ridiculous the internet tough guy, a thorough mocking is more effective than a swift kick to the gentleman vegetables with a hobnailed boot" --Louis

  
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:09   

Quote (dheddle @ Jan. 25 2011,14:04)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:51)
 
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:45)
lol....no one is going to hell just for having an abortion.

Right.  And you would know this, how, exactly?  And your credentials in this matter would be what, exactly?  (Forgive the snarky tone.  This isn't so different from FL or Biggy claiming to have the right interpretation of scripture, all others be damned.  Just because I LIKE your take on the matter doesn't mean I should just overlook the questions.)

Instead of telling this to us, why aren't you out trying to convince your fellow believers of this?  Because this makes you the first (Christian) pro-birther I've ever heard make this (welcome and encouraging) concession...and there are a whole lot of others who haven't gotten the memo.

I would add that, all snark on my part aside, I do find your commitment to reducing the number of abortions by education and other means of birth control to be more consistent and helpful than the usual noise that results.  Credit where it's due...


The MadPanda, FCD

You are kidding, right? Ftk is absolutely correct in this theological point--and it is broad-based Christianity 101. That is, Christianity teaches that you go to heaven if you have placed your faith in the power of Christ's death to atone for your sins. And if you don't, then you don't. On that there is nearly universal agreement--so much so that that is as good of a working definition of Christianity that you can find.

The consequence of which is:

If you have had abortions and have the aforementioned saving faith, you are saved.

If you devote your entire life to charity yet lack this faith, then you are lost.

The are a lot of details about which have internecine  warfare--such as how the faith is acquired, but on what I just wrote--no disagreement to speak of.  

We must associate with different Christians--because I never heard even one say "if you have an abortion you will go to hell." If I did, I'd be tempted to smack him.

So you think I am going to some sort of eternal torment because your fucking god declared it so from the beginning?

Thank you jebus & heddle & nascat.

--------------
"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
Ftk



Posts: 2239
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:10   

Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Jan. 25 2011,12:59)
DONT TELL ME WHAT TO DO

lmfao.  That there is funny.  

See there?  

Now, Eramus is a TOTAL ass, but how can I possibly not love him?

--------------
"Evolution is a creationism and just as illogical [as] the other pantheistic creation myths"  -forastero

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:11   

hell yeah, she "judges"

for instance, anyone who doesn't have the FtK sanctioned reaction to a picture of an aborted fetus is "Dahmeresque" and "sub-human"

all this bullshit about who is going to hell just lets her equivocate and vacillate far away from her original statement, which by the way Heddle echoed.

So, again, you twinks,

Quote
Anyone who can look at an aborted fetus and think anything but MMMMMM MEAT is sub-human


suck on that.  see how stupid this is

*ETA FtK you love sub-humans?  You realize that is almost beast

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
MadPanda, FCD



Posts: 267
Joined: Nov. 2010

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:12   

Quote (dheddle @ Jan. 25 2011,13:04)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:51)
 
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:45)
lol....no one is going to hell just for having an abortion.

Right.  And you would know this, how, exactly?  And your credentials in this matter would be what, exactly?  (Forgive the snarky tone.  This isn't so different from FL or Biggy claiming to have the right interpretation of scripture, all others be damned.  Just because I LIKE your take on the matter doesn't mean I should just overlook the questions.)

Instead of telling this to us, why aren't you out trying to convince your fellow believers of this?  Because this makes you the first (Christian) pro-birther I've ever heard make this (welcome and encouraging) concession...and there are a whole lot of others who haven't gotten the memo.

I would add that, all snark on my part aside, I do find your commitment to reducing the number of abortions by education and other means of birth control to be more consistent and helpful than the usual noise that results.  Credit where it's due...


The MadPanda, FCD

You are kidding, right? Ftk is absolutely correct in this theological point--and it is broad-based Christianity 101. That is, Christianity teaches that you go to heaven if you have placed your faith in the power of Christ's death to atone for your sins. And if you don't, then you don't. On that there is nearly universal agreement--so much so that that is as good of a working definition of Christianity that you can find.

The consequence of which is:

If you have had abortions and have the aforementioned saving faith, you are saved.

If you devote your entire life to charity yet lack this faith, then you are lost.

The are a lot of details about which have internecine  warfare--such as how the faith is acquired, but on what I just wrote--no disagreement to speak of.  

We must associate with different Christians--because I never heard even one say "if you have an abortion you will go to hell." If I did, I'd be tempted to smack him.

Heddle, I understand that you can't help it because you're a Calvinist, but since I consider Calvinism to be an immoral doctrine at best, your interpretation of ftk isn't helpful here.

Here you go with the argument from incredulity again!  You have either redefined Christian to mean an incredibly tiny subset of the whole, or you have some heavy-duty blinders on.

There is a reason I refer to your variation of the imaginary friend as a monster, but that's a completely different discussion for another time.


The MadPanda, FCD

--------------
"No matter how ridiculous the internet tough guy, a thorough mocking is more effective than a swift kick to the gentleman vegetables with a hobnailed boot" --Louis

  
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:12   

Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,19:10)
Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:59)
DONT TELL ME WHAT TO DO

lmfao.  That there is funny.  

See there?  

Now, Eramus is a TOTAL ass, but how can I possibly not love him?

At least he's our ass!


Wait, that didn't come out right...

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
Ftk



Posts: 2239
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 25 2011,13:13   

Quote (MadPanda, FCD @ Jan. 25 2011,13:06)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:57)
"Try reading for comprehension, ftk."

OK

"Are you saying that all that stuff about hellfire and damnation isn't to be taken seriously?"

IN REGARD TO WHAT?  ABORTION?  DO I THINK THERE IS A HELL?  YES.  DO I THINK THAT BECAUSE YOU HAVE AN ABORTION, YOU'RE GOING TO HELL?  NO.

"Do you deny that you earlier commented that it is your imaginary friend's business to judge?"

OF COURSE NOT...IT'S *ONLY* HIS PLACE TO JUDGE.  IT IS MY PLACE TO SHARE MY VIEWS IN REGARD TO GOALS BEST STRIVED FOR.

"Do you understand the concept of 'Minnesota nice'?  You're using it."

NO, NOR DO I CARE.  I AM BEING ME...I WILL NOT BE MEAN (UNLESS I LOSE IT EMOTIONALLY) TO PEOPLE WHO HOLD DIFFERENT VIEWS THAN I DO JUST TO MAKE YOU FEEL BETTER FOR SOME WEIRD TWISTED REASON.  THAT'S NO WHO I AM, AND IT'S NOT HOW I FEEL REGARDLESS OF THE GOD FACTOR OR NOT.

Here's the thing.

You judge, all right.  You are perfectly willing to write other people off for not believing in your imaginary friend, or following your oh-so-perfect interpretation of your magic book with magic words...but you pretend that it's all your imaginary friend's doing.  That's an abdication of responsibility.  It's also deliberately acting in bad faith.  It's 'Minnesota nice' of you.

Why are you getting so upset over this?  It's all just whispers, isn't it?  It ought not be so divisive.  Remember?


The MadPanda, FCD

The capitals weren't to be equated with yelling or being upset..lol.  Just a way to respond so it's easy to read who said what.

--------------
"Evolution is a creationism and just as illogical [as] the other pantheistic creation myths"  -forastero

  
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