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  Topic: Uncommonly Dense Thread 3, The Beast Marches On...< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
fnxtr



Posts: 3504
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 07 2011,23:53   

Quote (sledgehammer @ Feb. 07 2011,21:34)
Quote (fnxtr @ Feb. 07 2011,20:25)
     
Quote (keiths @ Feb. 07 2011,20:06)
[URL=http://www.uncommondescent.com/science/careers-in-science-desk-from-successful-scientist-all-the-way-up-to-freelance-science-writ

er/#comment-372022]batshit77 takes Byers to task[/URL]

What is it about the long URL's that makes them work in preview but utterly fail when submitted or quoted?

ETA I had to edit it after submission to get it to work.

http shortcut button not working??

--------------
"[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory

"Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

  
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 08 2011,09:23   

Quote (Maya @ Feb. 07 2011,14:26)
[SNIP]

I was hoping Louis would bitch slap you for that one.  ;-)

ETA:  No, I'm not calling Louis a bitch.

I missed it, I was too late, sorry. Blame the kyriarchy. It's usually the problem after all. No, really, it is.

Louis

--------------
Bye.

  
DiEb



Posts: 312
Joined: May 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 08 2011,10:19   

Nature of Nature is the book to get … right now! - O'Leary
Quote
If Bill, and senior editor Bruce Gordon,  had just been willing to swallow the Darwinade ladled out to them, they could be pontificating today from some secure chair.

... and not to loose another job, Bill swallowed Noah's flood.

   
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 08 2011,10:28   

yeah bill's closet office has nothing to do with him being a whining backstabbing sanctimonious unprofessional fart-flashing ignorance peddler.

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 08 2011,13:50   

Quote (DiEb @ Feb. 08 2011,11:19)
Nature of Nature is the book to get … right now! - O'Leary
   
Quote
If Bill, and senior editor Bruce Gordon,  had just been willing to swallow the Darwinade ladled out to them, they could be pontificating today from some secure chair.

... and not to loose another job, Bill swallowed Noah's flood.

The conference agenda, speakers and titles of talks, as preserved by DDrr.. Dembski
 
Quote
WEDNESDAY, APRIL 12

3:30, Pre-Conference Lecture:

The Herbert H. Reynolds Lecture in the History and Philosophy of Science

Fifth Floor, Cashion Academic Center

"Cloned Sheep, Headless Frogs, Human Futures: Meanings for the New Biology" - Everett Mendelsohn, Professor and Chair
Department of the History of Science
Harvard University

5:30-6:45, Buffet Dinner -- Fountain Mall

7:00-7:15, Welcome and Opening Remarks -- Cashion 510

Robert Sloan, President, Baylor University
William Dembski, Director, Michael Polanyi Center

7:15-9:45, Plenary Session: The Nature of Nature, Cashion 510

Moderator: Alvin Plantinga, University of Notre Dame

"The Incompatibility of Naturalism and Scientific Realism" --Robert Koons, Philosophy, University of Texas, Austin

"Must Naturalists Be Realists?"--Michael Williams, Philosophy, Northwestern University

"Are There Any Sound Arguments for Supernaturalism?--Michael Tooley, Philosophy, University of Colorado, Boulder

THURSDAY, APRIL 13

8:00-10:00, Plenary Session: Are Evolution and Naturalism     Compatible? -- Cashion 510

Moderator: Bruce Gordon, Baylor University

"An Evolutionary Argument Against Naturalism"--Alvin Plantinga, Philosophy, University of Notre Dame

"Naturalism Undefeated"--William Talbott, Philosophy, University of Washington, Seattle

10:00-10:30, BREAK

10:30 -12:30,Plenary Session: Naturalism and the History of Science -- Cashion 510

Moderator: Stuart Rosenbaum, Baylor University

"Naturalistic Explanation and 19th Century Biology"--Everett Mendelsohn, History of Science, Harvard University

"Science without God: Natural Laws and Christian Beliefs"--Ronald Numbers, History of Medicine, University of Wisconsin, Madison

"Naturalism and Natural Theology"--Ernan McMullin, Philosophy of Science, University of Notre Dame

12:30-1:30, LUNCH -- MRH

1:30-3:30, CONCURRENT SESSIONS

Session 1, DEBATE: Is There Direction and Purpose in Evolution?

"The Contingent Nature of Evolution"--Michael Shermer, Well-Known Author, Editor of Skeptic Magazine

"The Direction of Evolution"--Robert Wright, Well-Known Science Writer

Session 2, Miller Chapel

"Naturalism and the Nature of Philosophy"--David Yandell, Philosophy, Loyola University, Chicago

"How Can God Do Anything?"--Evan Fales, Philosophy, University of Iowa

Session 3, Cashion 101

"Application of Mathematics, Naturalism, and Underdetermination"--Otavio Bueno, Philosophy, California State University, Fresno

"Can Naturalism in Psychology Tolerate the Objectivity of Norms?"--Terry Winant, Philosophy, California State University, Fresno

"Naturalism and the Problem of Consciousness"--Todd Moody, Philosophy, St. Joseph's University

Session 4, Cashion 102

"Scientific Analysis of Paracelsus' Late Conceptualization of Remedy Underlines Pantheistic Naturalism"--Béatrice Anner, Pharmacology, Geneva University Medical School, Switzerland

"The Social Construction of Naturalism in 19th Century Debates about the Cambrian Explosion"--Michael Keas, History of Science, Oklahoma Baptist University

"A Conceptual Bridge Between Intelligent Design and Darwinian Evolution"--Robert DeHaan, Developmental Psychology, University of Chicago (Retired)

Session 5, Cashion 105

"Solar Ultraviolet Radiation is Finely Tuned to Enhance the Survival of Many Forms of Life"--Forrest Mims III, Solar and Atmospheric Physics, Sun Photometer Atmospheric Network

"Information, Entropy and the Origin of Life"--Walter Bradley, Mechanical Engineering, Texas A&M University

"Does Quantum Theory Pose a Problem for Naturalistic Metaphysics?"--Bruce Gordon, Philosophy of Science, Baylor University

"Natural Theology: Cosmic Coincidences, Carbon, and Conundrums"--Allen Utke, Chemistry, University of Wisconsin, Oshkosh (Emeritus)

Session 6, Cashion 107

"The Nature of Nature: A Perspective from Traditional Christianity"--Rudolf Brun, Biology, Texas Christian University

"Naturalism in New Testament Studies"--Jay Richards, Senior Fellow, Discovery Institute

"An Evidentiary Challenge to Naturalism: A Randomized, Controlled Trial of the Effects of Remote Intercessory Prayer on Coronary Care Unit Patients"--William Harris, Medicine, University of Missouri, Kansas City

"The Impotence of the Gap Argument"--John Mark Reynolds, Philosophy, Biola University

Session 7

"Is Natural Selection a Biological Designer?"--Paul Nelson, Philosophy of Biology, Senior Research Fellow, Discovery Institute

"Junk DNA: A Case History in the Interpretation and Reinterpretation of Data"--Timothy Standish, Biology, Andrews University

3:30-4:00, BREAK

4:00-6:00, Plenary Session: Does Science Support Naturalism?

Moderator: Robert Koons, University of Texas, Austin

"Naturalism as a Non-Issue"--Steven Weinberg, Theoretical Physics, University of Texas, Austin

"Science and Theism: Conflict or Coherence?"-- Henry F. Schaeffer III, Quantum Chemistry, University of Georgia, Athens

6:00-7:30, DINNER -- Fountain Mall

FRIDAY, APRIL 14

8:00-9:00, Plenary Session: Biological Complexity I   -- Cashion 510

"What's Inevitable in Evolution?"-- Simon Conway Morris, Paleontology, University of Cambridge

9:00-9:30, BREAK

9:30-12:30, Plenary Session: Biological Complexity II -- Cashion 510

Moderator: Simon Conway Morris, University of Cambridge

"What Counts as Evidence of Darwinism vs. Intelligent Design?"--Michael Behe, Biochemistry, Lehigh University

"Mysteries of Life: Is There 'Something Else'?"--Christian de Duve, Cytology and Biochemistry, Université Catholique de Louvain, Belgium

"On the Evolvability of Gene (and Other) Regulatory Systems"--Mark Ptashne, Molecular Biochemistry, Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center

12:30-1:30, LUNCH -- MRH

1:30-3:30, Plenary Session: The Origin of Biological Information -- Cashion 510

Moderator: Horace Freeland Judson, George Washington University

"DNA and the Origin of Life: Information, Specification and Explanation"--Stephen Meyer, Philosophy of Science, Director, Discovery Institute's Center for the Renewal of Science and Culture

"On the Emergence of Semiotic Information in Macromolecular Systems"--Sahotra Sarkar, Philosophy of Biology, University of Texas, Austin

3:30-4:00, BREAK

4:00-6:0, Plenary Session: Cosmology -- Cashion 510

Moderator: Robin Collins, Messiah College

"How Well Can We Understand Cosmology with the Principles of Physics?"--Alan Guth, Theoretical Physics, Massachusetts Institute of Technology

"Cosmic Evolution as the Manifestation of Divine Activity"
--Howard Van Till, Astronomy and Physics, Calvin College

"Naturalism and the Origin of the Universe"--William Lane Craig, Philosophy, Biola University

6:30 - 9:30, Conference Banquet and Banquet Lecture -- Fountain Mall

Remarks by Donald Schmeltekopf, Provost, Baylor University

"Speculations about Conceptual Blocks"--Prof. Horace Freeland Judson, Director, Center for History of Recent Science, George Washington University

SATURDAY, APRIL 15

8:00-10:00, Plenary Session: Naturalism and Ethics -- Barfield Room, 2nd Floor BDSC

Moderator: J. Budziszewski, University of Texas, Austin

"Naturalism's Incapacity to Capture the Good Will"--Dallas Willard, Philosophy, University of Southern California

"Thomistic Natural Law as Darwinian Natural Right"--Larry Arnhart, Political Science, Northern Illinois University

10:00-10:30, BREAK

10:30-12:30, Plenary Session: Naturalism and the Barfield Room, 2nd Floor BDSC

Effectiveness of Mathematics          

Moderator: William Dembski, Baylor University

"Effectiveness Without Design: A Naturalist Philosophy of Mathematics"--Edward Zalta, Senior Research Scholar, Center for the Study of Language and Information, Stanford University

"The Unreasonable Uncooperativeness of Mathematics in the Natural Sciences "--Mark Wilson, Philosophy of Science, University of Pittsburgh

12:30-1:30, LUNCH -- MRH

1:30-3:30, CONCURRENT SESSIONS

Session 1

"Evolutionary Naturalism and the Reduction of Ethical Demand"--John Hare, Philosophy, Calvin College

"The Limits of Reductive Materialism: Dualistic Theory in Recent Scientific Accounts of Human Altruism"--Jeffrey Schloss, Biology, Westmont College

Session 2

"Can Evolutionary Algorithms Generate Specified Complexity?"--William Dembski, Probability and Complexity Theory, Baylor University

"Can an Inflationary Many-Universes Hypothesis Explain the Fine-Tuning?"--Robin Collins, Philosophy of Science, Messiah College

Session 3, Houston Room, BDSC

"Naturalism and Material Objects"--Michael Rea, Philosophy, University of Deleware

"Teleology, Free Will, and Materialism"--Stewart Goetz, Philosophy, Ursinus College

Session 4, Lipscomb Room, BDSC

"Science and Naturalism: Life Without Design, Purpose, and Meaning"--Steven Schafersman, Geology, University of Texas, Permian Basin

"The Design Inference: Methodological Naturalism to the Rescue"--Robert O'Connor, Philosophy, Wheaton College

"Agency, Explanation, and Evolution"--Stephen Griffith, Philosophy, Lycoming College

"Can Natural Law Lead Science Beyond Naturalism?"--Karl Stephan, Electrical and Computer Engineering, University of Massachussetts, Amherst

Session 5, Claypool Room, BDSC

"Complex Idea Systems in Biological Organisms and a Conjecture as to their Origins"--Arne Wyller, Astrophysics, Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences (Retired)

"Can a Conscious Universe Obviate Philosophical Naturalism and Vanguard Physical Teleology?--Richard Amoroso, Philosophy of Mind, Noetic Advanced Studies Institute

"Finding God in Prozac, or Finding Prozac in God: Preserving a Christian View of the Person Amidst a Biopsychological Revolution"--Michael Boivin, Psychology, Indiana Wesleyan University

Session 6, Cowden Room, BDSC

"The Place of Teleology in Nature"-- James Barham, History of Science, Independent Scholar

"A Problem of Evil for Naturalism"--R. Douglas Geivett

3:30-4:00, BREAK

4:30-6:30, Plenary Session: Neuroscience and Consciousness -- Cashion 510

Moderator: David Berlinski, Université Interdisciplinaire de Paris, France

"Current Research Into Consciousness"--John Searle, Philosophy and Cognitive Science, University of California, Berkeley

"Theism and Nonreductive Physicalism: Why Christians Should Appreciate John Searle's Account of the Mind"--Nancey Murphy, Theology and Philosophy, Fuller Theological Seminary

"Neurogenesis and Being a Person"--Howard Ducharme, Philosophy, University of Akron, Ohio

6:30-9:00, Dinner for plenary and concurrent speakers at the Northwood Inn

END OF CONFERENCE


The conference proceedings
 
Quote
Contents

Foreword: Beyond Naturalism to Science — Steve Fuller

Introduction: The Nature of Nature Confronted — Bruce L. Gordon and William A. Dembski

PART I:

NATURALIZING SCIENCE: SOME HISTORICAL AND PHILOSOPHICAL CONSIDERATIONS

1. The Rise of Naturalism and Its Problematic Role in Science and Culture — Bruce L. Gordon

2. Science without God: Natural Laws and Christian Beliefs — Ronald L. Numbers

3. Varieties of Methodological Naturalism — Ernan McMullin

4. Sauce for the Goose: Intelligent Design, Scientific Methodology, and the Demarcation Problem — Stephen C. Meyer

PART II:

THE EPISTEMOLOGICAL AND ONTOLOGICAL FOUNDATIONS OF NATURALISM

5. Evolution versus Naturalism — Alvin C. Plantinga

6. More on the Illusion of Defeat — William J. Talbott

7. Evolutionary Naturalism: Epistemically Unseated or Illusorily Defeated?

   A. It’s No Illusion! — Alvin C. Plantinga

   B. The End of an Illusion? — William J. Talbott

8. A Quantum-Theoretic Argument against Naturalism — Bruce L. Gordon

9. The Incompatibility of Naturalism and Scientific Realism — Robert C. Koons

10. Truth and Realism — Alvin I. Goldman

11. Must Naturalists Be Realists? — Michael Williams

12. The Role of Concepts in Our Access to Reality — Nicholas Wolterstorff

PART III:

THE ORIGIN OF BIOLOGICAL INFORMATION AND THE EMERGENCE OF BIOLOGICAL COMPLEXITY

13. On the Origins of Life — David Berlinski

14. DNA: The Signature in the Cell — Stephen C. Meyer

15. Mysteries of Life: Is There “Something Else”? — Christian de Duve

16. Life’s Conservation Law: Why Darwinian Evolution Cannot Create Biological Information — William A. Dembski and Robert J. Marks II

17. Regulated Recruitment and Cooperativity in the Design of Biological Regulatory Systems — Mark Ptashne

18. The Nature of Protein Folds: Quantifying the Difficulty of an Unguided Search through Protein Sequence Space — Douglas D. Axe

19. The Limits of Non-Intelligent Explanations in Molecular Biology — Michael J. Behe

20. The Chain of Accidents and the Rule of Law: The Role of Contingency and Necessity in Evolution — Michael Shermer

21. Molecular Convergence: Repeated Evolution or Repeated Designs? — Fazale R. Rana

PART IV:

COSMOLOGICAL ORIGINS AND FINE-TUNING

22. Eternal Inflation and Its Implications — Alan Guth

23. Naturalism and the Origin of the Universe — William Lane Craig

24. Cosmic Evolution, Naturalism and Divine Creativity, or Who Owns the Robust Formational Economy Principle? — Howard J. Van Till

25. Living in the Multiverse — Steven Weinberg

26. Balloons on a String: A Critique of Multiverse Cosmology — Bruce L. Gordon

27. Habitable Zones and Fine-Tuning — Guillermo Gonzalez

PART V:

MATHEMATICS

28. Mathematical Naturalism — Philip Kitcher

29. Mathematics—Application and Applicability — Mark Steiner

PART VI:

EVOLUTIONARY PSYCHOLOGY, NEUROSCIENCE, AND CONSCIOUSNESS

30. Toward Mapping the Evolved Functional Organization of Mind and Brain — John Tooby and Leda Cosmides

31. On the Origins of the Mind — David Berlinski

32. Consciousness — John R. Searle

33. Consciousness and Neuroscience — Francis Crick and Christof Koch

34. Supervenience and the Downward Efficacy of the Mental: Nonreductive Physicalism and the Christian Tradition — Nancey Murphy

35. Conscious Events as Orchestrated Space-Time Selections (with a new addendum) — Stuart Hameroff and Roger Penrose

36. Quantum Interactive Dualism: The Libet and Einstein-Podolsky-Rosen Causal Anomalies — Henry P. Stapp

37. The Physical Sciences, Neuroscience, and Dualism — James P. Moreland

PART VII:

SCIENCE, ETHICS, AND RELIGION

38. Evolution and Ethics — Michael Ruse

39. Naturalism’s Incapacity to Capture the Good Will — Dallas Willard

40. Naturalism, Science, and Religion — Michael Tooley

41. Theism Defended — William Lane Craig


Here's a fun game - find all the differences in these two lists. William Lane Craig has two entries in the proceedings, but only one on the conference schedule. Stephen Meyer, similary has gone from one to two, one of which is now magically the title of his latest book. Dembski's article on whether evolutionary algorithms can generate specified complexity has become a Life's Conservation Law article by him and Robert Marks. David Berlinski goes from being a moderator at the conference to having two papers in the proceedings.

Other articles have gone missing. It is one thing to publish partial proceedings because you lost the records of the actual papers while shouting "Waterloo!" It is another to interpolate papers and material (a foreword by Steve Fuller?) that never existed in association with the conference. Dembski seems to think it is acceptable and appropriate to let authors update their material and positions, which in real science publishing would play hob with questions of primacy and the development and history of ideas.

--------------
I’m referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I’m not an evolutionist, I’m a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2780
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 08 2011,14:51   

Quote (dvunkannon @ Feb. 08 2011,13:50)
Dembski seems to think it is acceptable and appropriate to let authors update their material and positions, which in real science publishing would play hob with questions of primacy and the development and history of ideas.

Well, if ever there was a bunch of folks able and willing to play hob with the history of ideas, it would be the IDiots.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 08 2011,16:00   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Feb. 08 2011,15:51)
Quote (dvunkannon @ Feb. 08 2011,13:50)
Dembski seems to think it is acceptable and appropriate to let authors update their material and positions, which in real science publishing would play hob with questions of primacy and the development and history of ideas.

Well, if ever there was a bunch of folks able and willing to play hob with the history of ideas, it would be the IDiots.

Here are some of my counts:

Proceedings articles - 41
Corresponding presentations - 4
Same author, new content - 16

So brand new content makes up more than 50% of the proceedings by even the most generous measure.

Conference presentations not in proceedings - 43
(or 59 if you add back in those 16 authors)

Who are the new authors? Gordon, Dembski, Meyer, Berlinski, Fuller, Craig, Gonzalez, Rana... and Ruse! (List not complete.)

--------------
I’m referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I’m not an evolutionist, I’m a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
Texas Teach



Posts: 2084
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 08 2011,17:38   

Quote (DiEb @ Feb. 08 2011,10:19)
Nature of Nature is the book to get … right now! - O'Leary
 
Quote
If Bill, and senior editor Bruce Gordon,  had just been willing to swallow the Darwinade ladled out to them, they could be pontificating today from some secure chair.

... and not to loose another job, Bill swallowed Noah's flood.

Is that where all the water went?

--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
sparc



Posts: 2088
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 08 2011,22:07   

Somebody burning his deep cover sock? Frost122585 could have asked Dembski directly for positive comments by a reader from Riesel:  
Quote
5
Frost122585
02/08/2011
12:09 pm

Alright Bill I am getting a copy. Make sure you get as many good reviews on Amazon as you can- because all those very honest one star reviews are comming.
(emphasis mine)

--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
REC



Posts: 638
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 08 2011,23:06   

Quote
Who are the new authors? Gordon, Dembski, Meyer, Berlinski, Fuller, Craig, Gonzalez, Rana... and Ruse! (List not complete.)


You forgot Francis Crick...this volume publishes "Consciousness and Neuroscience" 13 years after the publication of an article with the same title and co-author, and 7 years after Crick's death! Gotta lay claim to those Nobel Laureates somehow.

Link

What an odd volume. I honestly can't think of anything like this-new and old ID arguments paired with conference presentations and recycled articles. Strange pairings: Steven Weinberg (from the title, it looks like in the form of a recycled 2005 paper) along side nobodies. Crick posthumously in the same volume as Behe.  

Clearly some of these papers should be of a view strongly opposing ID, if they are truly representative, but watch the spin begin!

  
Wesley R. Elsberry



Posts: 4991
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,07:35   

Forging a new history to take us to an old future.

--------------
"You can't teach an old dogma new tricks." - Dorothy Parker

    
Sol3a1



Posts: 110
Joined: July 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,13:26   

Asking a favor from those of you far more edumacated in dat der "evil evilutionism"

Here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIezfosDNJM

It is on the Discovery Institute's You Tube channel.  I'm engaged with a user known as "toobsucker".  If what I've been told is true, "toobsucker" is a sock used by various DI interns and sometimes even some of the "big boys" come to play.

I'm no bio-anything and while I can go after the blatantly stupid, I don't know where to go to answer some of their questions.

So if you want to go up against some at the Disco Tute, please feel free to do so.

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,15:11   

d00d that is some hard tard.  send that shitbird here

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
Sol3a1



Posts: 110
Joined: July 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,15:17   

Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Feb. 09 2011,15:11)
d00d that is some hard tard.  send that shitbird here

I'll do my best but I doubt if they'll come over here to play

They can control their own space over there and hate a level playing field

Should I say, "Hey toobsucker, the gang of "AntiEvolution" led by the evil Dr Wesley E. requests your participation at that board"?

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,15:22   

Well, I would start with the assumption that they ain't gonna come over here and play.  So, shame.  shame shame shame shame shame shame on them for keeping all of those delicious ideas to themselves.  shame on them for not trying to spread The Word to unbelievers.  shame on them for not taking Teh Gospel to the philistines.  

i dunno if that doesn't work you can point out that JoeG is like the ID champion and he even comes by every once in a while so it's sort of like an obligation or something.

then curse their mother's wombs, last resort.

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
Sol3a1



Posts: 110
Joined: July 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,15:37   

I've invited them over here

We'll see if they come

I dropped Dr. Wesley Elsberry's name, not as one who invited, but as one of the founders of this and Talk Origins

"Curse their mothers' wombs"?

I like MILFs

  
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,15:47   

Quote (Sol3a1 @ Feb. 09 2011,15:37)
I've invited them over here

We'll see if they come

I dropped Dr. Wesley Elsberry's name, not as one who invited, but as one of the founders of this and Talk Origins

"Curse their mothers' wombs"?

I like MILFs

I made a thread and invited them too.

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
Sol3a1



Posts: 110
Joined: July 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,15:51   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 09 2011,15:47)
Quote (Sol3a1 @ Feb. 09 2011,15:37)
I've invited them over here

We'll see if they come

I dropped Dr. Wesley Elsberry's name, not as one who invited, but as one of the founders of this and Talk Origins

"Curse their mothers' wombs"?

I like MILFs
I made a thread and invited them too.

They've marked your posts as spam

Actually, there are great big piles of TARD over there

Dig in my brothers and sisters and revel in the TARD that spews from the DI channel

  
Maya



Posts: 702
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,15:51   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 09 2011,15:47)
Quote (Sol3a1 @ Feb. 09 2011,15:37)
I've invited them over here

We'll see if they come

I dropped Dr. Wesley Elsberry's name, not as one who invited, but as one of the founders of this and Talk Origins

"Curse their mothers' wombs"?

I like MILFs

I made a thread and invited them too.

The MILFs?  I didn't know this was that kind of forum.

  
Sol3a1



Posts: 110
Joined: July 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,15:54   

Quote (Maya @ Feb. 09 2011,15:51)
The MILFs?  I didn't know this was that kind of forum.

There was talk about cursing their mothers' wombs

I felt the need to protect the moms

:D  :p

  
Sol3a1



Posts: 110
Joined: July 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,16:04   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 09 2011,15:47)
I made a thread and invited them too.

If you went to the older pages, you'll see even though their argument sucks, it is still better than the sock user who was answering before

  
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,17:08   

In honor of my 1,000th post here at AtBC, I offer the following, which is actually the beginning of an essay I am writing. The essay is a reaction to Michael Polanyi's 1968 article, Life's Irreducuble Structure. That article is the touchstone for the modern ID movement.

I want to thank Wes, et al and all of the crowd here for making this forum such a great place to hang out.

 
Quote
Do Life Processes Transcend Physics and Chemistry?
I don’t think you will easily find scientists who will answer yes to the above question. However, it was asked to a panel of distinguished scientists in 1968, and got a surprising number of ‘yes’ answers. Surprising, at least, 40 years later.

Thinking about different life processes, let us ask whether anyone would currently think the answer is yes.

What about moving our muscles? We understand muscles pretty well, and it is all about nerve potentials, mitochondria, ATP, actin, etc. Ever since Volta and frog legs, the world has grown accustomed to the material, physicochemical explanations of muscle movement. So no takers for transcendence here.

How about respiration? The general process of taking in chemicals (gases through our lungs, water and food into our stomach) using them, and excreting wastes… Anyone think that contains a transcendent process? The synthesis of urea started us along the path away from thinking so.

What about development? No, we know how bodies develop. A lot of respiration (see above) and genetic guidance. We can follow the process step by step in sea urchins, C. elegans, fruit flies, and other well studied species. We can create clones, chimera, and babies conceived with a variety of aids and techniques. None of this requires an assumption or accommodation of a transcendent quality.

What the history of life on earth until now? We humans, and other species, have attributes defined by our genes, but how did our genes come to be what they are, and at the rate they did? The answer most would agree on is that there is nothing in our genes that requires special pleading for a mechanism that would change them in some special, transcendent way from the genes of our ancestors. We changed via duplication, mutation, selection, and all the other dull processes that affect every other species. Perhaps the rate of change in some of our genes has been quick, but if the selection pressure, the benefits of the changes to the population that has them, is strong, this is to be expected also.

What about the beginning of life itself? Here our knowledge is more limited today than in other areas, but we do know that the stuff of life, the amino acids of proteins, the sugars, the nucleobases, the trace minerals, were all present at the surface of the young planet, with liquid water to mix them and sources of energy to push them into action. We know that proteins and RNA can catalyze each other. Single metal ions can act as catalysts, and RNA can self catalyze if necessary.

If the processes of early life, if bacteria and viruses are not transcendent, what about the thinking processes of man? Is there something going on inside our skulls which is not reducible to physics and chemistry? If so, we haven’t found it yet. What we have found is the opposite, that our brains operate by the same physics and chemistry as the nerves in our muscles and sense organs, that our brains develop in the same way as our other organs, and in the same way as the brains of other animals – via chemical and genetic signals. Our thoughts are electrical potentials and the distribution of chemicals at the synapses, neurotransmitters, and the enhancers or suppressors of the same.

40+ years after the question was asked, we can answer more strongly ‘No’ than ever before. In every part of the body, at every point in its life, we have discovered a great medley of chemical reactions regulating each other, but we have never discovered anything that isn’t chemistry, that transcends chemistry. We are very large collections of simple things. We are mundane.


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I’m referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I’m not an evolutionist, I’m a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
Texas Teach



Posts: 2084
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,17:10   

Quote (Maya @ Feb. 09 2011,15:51)
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 09 2011,15:47)
Quote (Sol3a1 @ Feb. 09 2011,15:37)
I've invited them over here

We'll see if they come

I dropped Dr. Wesley Elsberry's name, not as one who invited, but as one of the founders of this and Talk Origins

"Curse their mothers' wombs"?

I like MILFs

I made a thread and invited them too.

The MILFs?  I didn't know this was that kind of forum.

I was under the impression that this is exactly that kind of forum.  <Insert comment about carlson's/Louis's/Arden's mom>

--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
Sol3a1



Posts: 110
Joined: July 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,17:33   

Quote (Texas Teach @ Feb. 09 2011,17:10)
<Insert comment about carlson's/Louis's/Arden's mom>

Insert what into whose mom?

  
Doc Bill



Posts: 1039
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,17:39   

Quote
Insert what into whose mom?


By Jove I think he's got it!!




(that's what she said)

  
Sol3a1



Posts: 110
Joined: July 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,18:14   

So 49ui39ude9, did you enjoy your debate?

Funny how wehn pressed to give examples of design and how that was determined, the old talk about "It just looks that way dammit" seemed to come out

  
Sol3a1



Posts: 110
Joined: July 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,18:20   

Well the good user "toobsucker" won't be back until Monday but there are several other mines with incredible veins that produce freight cars full of TARD

Check out the Atheist Experience Channels, the YEC/IDiots love those channels, NephilimFree's channel (if that doesn't deconvert you into a rational person away from theism, nothing will) or the DI's own DiscoveryChannel

Guaranteed to get you more TARD than you can get here

  
Badger3k



Posts: 861
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,19:37   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 09 2011,15:47)
Quote (Sol3a1 @ Feb. 09 2011,15:37)
I've invited them over here

We'll see if they come

I dropped Dr. Wesley Elsberry's name, not as one who invited, but as one of the founders of this and Talk Origins

"Curse their mothers' wombs"?

I like MILFs

I made a thread and invited them too.

Wait a minute...you've invited MILFs?  :)

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"Just think if every species had a different genetic code We would have to eat other humans to survive.." : Joe G

  
carlsonjok



Posts: 3326
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2011,20:46   

Quote (Maya @ Feb. 09 2011,15:51)
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 09 2011,15:47)
 
Quote (Sol3a1 @ Feb. 09 2011,15:37)
I've invited them over here

We'll see if they come

I dropped Dr. Wesley Elsberry's name, not as one who invited, but as one of the founders of this and Talk Origins

"Curse their mothers' wombs"?

I like MILFs

I made a thread and invited them too.

The MILFs?  I didn't know this was that kind of forum.

Yes, it is.  Here is the thread.

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It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

  
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2011,02:51   

Quote (Sol3a1 @ Feb. 09 2011,18:14)
So 49ui39ude9, did you enjoy your debate?

Funny how wehn pressed to give examples of design and how that was determined, the old talk about "It just looks that way dammit" seemed to come out

It was amusing as far as it went but when you are talking to somebody who might as well be a bot for all the originality in their arguments it quickly pales.

toober eventually moved onto "polystrate trees" and I laughed and left!

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I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
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