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  Topic: Uncommonly Dense Thread 5, Return To Teh Dingbat Buffet< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Lethean



Posts: 292
Joined: Jan. 2014

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 23 2016,05:20   

Quote (Bob O'H @ Feb. 23 2016,04:45)
In contrast, Barry seems to be a true believer and views the Other Side (i.e. us) as the enemy.


Now why would you go and say something like tha...

 
Quote
We are in a war. That is not a metaphor. We are fighting a war for the soul of Western Civilization, and we are losing, badly. In the summer of 2015 we find ourselves in a positon very similar to Great Britain’s position 75 years ago in the summer of 1940 – alone, demoralized, and besieged on all sides by a great darkness that constitutes an existential threat to freedom, justice and even rationality itself.


... oh ... right.

--------------
"So I'm a pretty unusual guy and it's not stupidity that has gotten me where I am. It's brilliance."

"My brain is one of the very few independent thinking brains that you've ever met. And that's a thing of wonder to you and since you don't understand it you criticize it."


~Dave Hawkins~

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 23 2016,08:30   

Quote (Bob O'H @ Feb. 23 2016,05:45)
Quote
I'm not trying to impinge on anyone's present entertainment, but somehow, for me at least, there is a big difference between DaveScot's arrogance and Barry's, though I couldn't say exactly what. Barry is a blustery, mean-spirited, lunatic asshole that is as dumb as they come. Dave seemed to have an iota of smarts. About a few things. Occasionally.

I think Dave didn't take himself or the debates so seriously: he enjoyed the discussions for their own sake. In contrast, Barry seems to be a true believer and views the Other Side (i.e. us) as the enemy.

DaveTard was just arrogant, and in over his head. Barry's a lunatic.

I'm still waiting for someone to bait him into fleshing out his comments about when he "does science". That's going to be an epic meltdown.

   
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 23 2016,08:33   

I love how they try to call everything a "literature bluff" now to cover up the fact that they don't know, and don't understand, the literature.

   
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 23 2016,08:35   

Quote
450

Alicia Cartelli

February 23, 2016 at 8:16 am

EA: “Play around with binding sites all you want; it doesn’t help explain the origin of significant amounts of biological information.”
The paper demonstrates some of the possible final steps towards the evolution of a protein that exists today. The last few steps in the path.
Just because you decided to start using the word “significant” and demanding that we show how evolution traveled the entire path, doesn’t mean you can claim that I “literature bluffed.”
I never claimed that the paper demonstrates how a protein evolved from scratch.
I said the paper shows how a protein can evolve from intermediates, which is what pucci asked for in an earlier post.
“loss of binding site specificity” does not mean loss of information. And actually the same paper demonstrates exactly that.
The evolutionary intermediates bound the wild-type partner with less affinity, but they also bound other proteins with significant affinity. (Not that you would know this since you didn’t read the paper) So I would argue that in this case, and probably many others in the course of evolution, that “loss of binding spite specificity” can result in an increase in information. The protein may not be binding as tightly to a single specific protein, but it is now binding tightly to a few other proteins. This is binding promiscuity and is evolution exploring sequence space for binding sites that promote interactions with other proteins.

Anyways, even mungy accepts the fact that 99% of species to have ever liver are extinct.
He managed to get out of the third grade, why can’t you?


linky

   
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 23 2016,10:12   

Quote (stevestory @ Feb. 23 2016,16:35)
Quote
450

Alicia Cartelli

February 23, 2016 at 8:16 am

EA: “Play around with binding sites all you want; it doesn’t help explain the origin of significant amounts of biological information.”
The paper demonstrates some of the possible final steps towards the evolution of a protein that exists today. The last few steps in the path.
Just because you decided to start using the word “significant” and demanding that we show how evolution traveled the entire path, doesn’t mean you can claim that I “literature bluffed.”
I never claimed that the paper demonstrates how a protein evolved from scratch.
I said the paper shows how a protein can evolve from intermediates, which is what pucci asked for in an earlier post.
“loss of binding site specificity” does not mean loss of information. And actually the same paper demonstrates exactly that.
The evolutionary intermediates bound the wild-type partner with less affinity, but they also bound other proteins with significant affinity. (Not that you would know this since you didn’t read the paper) So I would argue that in this case, and probably many others in the course of evolution, that “loss of binding spite specificity” can result in an increase in information. The protein may not be binding as tightly to a single specific protein, but it is now binding tightly to a few other proteins. This is binding promiscuity and is evolution exploring sequence space for binding sites that promote interactions with other proteins.

Anyways, even mungy accepts the fact that 99% of species to have ever liver are extinct.
He managed to get out of the third grade, why can’t you?


linky

Mungies liver assploded when his faith was questioned.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
KevinB



Posts: 525
Joined: April 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 23 2016,11:06   

Quote (k.e.. @ Feb. 23 2016,10:12)
Quote (stevestory @ Feb. 23 2016,16:35)
 
Quote
450

Alicia Cartelli

February 23, 2016 at 8:16 am

EA: “Play around with binding sites all you want; it doesn’t help explain the origin of significant amounts of biological information.”
The paper demonstrates some of the possible final steps towards the evolution of a protein that exists today. The last few steps in the path.
Just because you decided to start using the word “significant” and demanding that we show how evolution traveled the entire path, doesn’t mean you can claim that I “literature bluffed.”
I never claimed that the paper demonstrates how a protein evolved from scratch.
I said the paper shows how a protein can evolve from intermediates, which is what pucci asked for in an earlier post.
“loss of binding site specificity” does not mean loss of information. And actually the same paper demonstrates exactly that.
The evolutionary intermediates bound the wild-type partner with less affinity, but they also bound other proteins with significant affinity. (Not that you would know this since you didn’t read the paper) So I would argue that in this case, and probably many others in the course of evolution, that “loss of binding spite specificity” can result in an increase in information. The protein may not be binding as tightly to a single specific protein, but it is now binding tightly to a few other proteins. This is binding promiscuity and is evolution exploring sequence space for binding sites that promote interactions with other proteins.

Anyways, even mungy accepts the fact that 99% of species to have ever liver are extinct.
He managed to get out of the third grade, why can’t you?


linky

Mungies liver assploded when his faith was questioned.

At least the next time Barry nukes a critic's account into toast, there will be pate to go with it.

  
rossum



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 23 2016,15:59   

Quote (KevinB @ Feb. 23 2016,11:06)
At least the next time Barry nukes a critic's account into toast, there will be pate to go with it.

Or perhaps fava beans and a big Amarone.

(Yes, I know.  Read the book.)

--------------
The ultimate truth is that there is no ultimate truth.

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 26 2016,09:02   

Quote

See also: NatGeo interview: Plant intelligence ignored: One of the discoveries being made is that Lamarck’s theory, which was discredited for a century, is now being shown to be true.


Dense, of course.

   
JohnW



Posts: 3217
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 26 2016,12:14   

Friday meltdown!  Virgil Cain, who is not the noted mathematician JoeG, discusses conditional probabilities here.  Shockingly, he's not doing too well.

--------------
Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers

There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 26 2016,12:54   

So, was that result probable or improbable? :p

  
JohnW



Posts: 3217
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 26 2016,13:11   

Quote (Henry J @ Feb. 26 2016,10:54)
So, was that result probable or improbable? :p

There isn't any probability that JoeVirgil would have a clue.  The correct answer would be "not even 0".

(see my sig).

--------------
Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers

There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3668
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 26 2016,20:42   

Quote (JohnW @ Feb. 26 2016,13:11)
Quote (Henry J @ Feb. 26 2016,10:54)
So, was that result probable or improbable? :p

There isn't any probability that JoeVirgil would have a clue.  The correct answer would be "not even 0".

(see my sig).

Joey thinks he's the Isaac Newton of Information Theory.

He's actually the Fig Newton of Information Theory.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Texas Teach



Posts: 2084
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 26 2016,21:37   

Quote (OgreMkV @ Feb. 26 2016,20:42)
Quote (JohnW @ Feb. 26 2016,13:11)
Quote (Henry J @ Feb. 26 2016,10:54)
So, was that result probable or improbable? :p

There isn't any probability that JoeVirgil would have a clue.  The correct answer would be "not even 0".

(see my sig).

Joey thinks he's the Isaac Newton of Information Theory.

He's actually the Fig Newton of Information Theory.

Appropriate, since ID is the fig leaf of creationism.

--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 26 2016,21:54   

And, ID theory is a figment of their imaginations?

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 26 2016,23:50   

Quote (JohnW @ Feb. 26 2016,21:11)
     
Quote (Henry J @ Feb. 26 2016,10:54)
So, was that result probable or improbable? :p

There isn't any probability that JoeVirgil would have a clue.  The correct answer would be "not even 0".

(see my sig).

No no no; Given a Wavelength W, Probability T, Frequency F
Hypothesis H, ATP A, Uncommon descent U, Evolution E, Cannard C and Constant K.

Joe claims that since we already have W and H of A derives from T. Thus giving T and H both zero chance of E. Therefore F at U is a  C since K.

Which can be expressed as WHAT THE FUCK = ?

We know that id has no H, A is a red herring, one T is zero the other T is changing, id still has no H, E is null, U is given, C has velocity 0 (in a Vacuum), and K = 1

Giving  WHAT THE FUCK + (-2H -A -E -T +(0*T) -U -(C*0)) *1 = WTF

Same old argument.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
sparc



Posts: 2088
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2016,05:35   

The ultimate quintessence of ID-creationism and POTW.

--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2016,12:58   

So now a new guy named Origenes showed up and is acting so stupid Mung is complaining he makes ID look bad.

One of you guys Poeing?

   
Glen Davidson



Posts: 1100
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2016,13:03   

Quote (stevestory @ Feb. 27 2016,12:58)
So now a new guy named Origenes showed up and is acting so stupid Mung is complaining he makes ID look bad.

One of you guys Poeing?

Oh no, someone put a turd on the shitpile.

What a disgrace!

Glen Davidson

--------------
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p....p

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of coincidence---ID philosophy

   
midwifetoad



Posts: 4003
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2016,22:23   

Quote (Glen Davidson @ Feb. 27 2016,13:03)
Quote (stevestory @ Feb. 27 2016,12:58)
So now a new guy named Origenes showed up and is acting so stupid Mung is complaining he makes ID look bad.

One of you guys Poeing?

Oh no, someone put a turd on the shitpile.

What a disgrace!

Glen Davidson

Usurping mung's job?

--------------
Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

  
Glen Davidson



Posts: 1100
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 28 2016,22:29   

How ID makes one sure of God, according to Torley

Yes, Vincent, we know that recounting confirmation bias could bolster one's commitment.  What of that?

Now, let's suppose that the atheist madman actually demands a good, causality-based design explanation for the coccyx.  Sure, you believe your fantasies, but why don't you back up your horseshit for once?

The madman demands ID science--not wishful thinking--that explains why anyone would design bird wings to begin development as many (ancestral) bones, only to fuse into rather greater wing bones.   The madman demands actual evidence for the design of ATPase--for a causal design science rather than "you can just see that it's designed."  The madman demands the intelligence that decided mammal testes have to descend from their apparent ancestral positions into a scrotum (provided they have high body temperatures), while birds dispense with such requirements.

Instead of wallowing in your mindless prejudices, only reinforcing them, why not for once imagine what you'd do if you had to actually explain life according to design?  You can't do it meaningfully, and no one who isn't already beholden to such nonsense has any compelling reason to swallow it.  I don't care how much your blind faith is bolstered by pseudoscience, it's no good for doing science, nor for explaining a damned thing causally.

It's a good mind trick for the congregation, though, ramble on and on about how useful ID is for bolstering your belief in God "empirically" (no pretense there that it's not about God, its only saving grace), while ignoring all of the evidence that shows life not to be designed.

By the way, who has ever died for a scientific idea?  One dies for religion and other social causes, not for facts or scientific truths.  They can stand on their own--that seems to have been Galileo's reaction, and correct in that case, at least.  One might risk life or liberty over the right to do science (so it seems to me), but I can't imagine anyone sticking faithfully to evolutionary theory itself, as if it were some baseless belief like a religion, or ID.  To be sure, he recognizes that one wouldn't die for ID, either, but that its role is to bolster the religion--at least getting the relationship of ID and religion right.

Glen Davidson

--------------
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p....p

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of coincidence---ID philosophy

   
rossum



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 29 2016,05:55   

Quote (Glen Davidson @ Feb. 28 2016,22:29)
By the way, who has ever died for a scientific idea?

Some Soviet biologists were executed during the period of Lysenkoism.

--------------
The ultimate truth is that there is no ultimate truth.

  
Acartia_Bogart



Posts: 2927
Joined: Sep. 2014

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 29 2016,15:47   

Quote (Glen Davidson @ Feb. 28 2016,22:29)
How ID makes one sure of God, according to Torley

 The madman demands the intelligence that decided mammal testes have to descend from their apparent ancestral positions into a scrotum (provided they have high body temperatures), while birds dispense with such requirements.

Next time that one of the ID crazies claims that there are no poor "designs" in nature, kick him in the testicles and ask him to explain it again. Unfortunately, this will not work for Dense and Dreary.

  
Acartia_Bogart



Posts: 2927
Joined: Sep. 2014

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 29 2016,16:07   

Gordon Mullings (dba Kairosfocus)
Quote
GG, BTW, I am an eyewitness (among a significant number of others) to levitation that most definitely was no magic trick.

Yup, that ads credibility to Gordo's arguments. I wonder what he will come up with next?
Quote
And in fact the positive miracle there was in suppressing then getting rid of it and what went with it. That is, it was a manifestation of evil being exorcised.

Oh, the devil made him do it. Why am I not surprised?

  
Texas Teach



Posts: 2084
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 29 2016,17:07   

Quote (Acartia_Bogart @ Feb. 29 2016,16:07)
Gordon Mullings (dba Kairosfocus)
Quote
GG, BTW, I am an eyewitness (among a significant number of others) to levitation that most definitely was no magic trick.

Yup, that ads credibility to Gordo's arguments. I wonder what he will come up with next?
Quote
And in fact the positive miracle there was in suppressing then getting rid of it and what went with it. That is, it was a manifestation of evil being exorcised.

Oh, the devil made him do it. Why am I not surprised?

Quote
Dr Ray Stantz: Of course you forget, Peter. I was present at an undersea, unexplained mass sponge migration.
Dr. Peter Venkman: Ray, the sponges migrated about a foot-and-a-half.


--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Feb. 29 2016,20:34   

Quote
Dr Ray Stantz: Of course you forget, Peter. I was present at an undersea, unexplained mass sponge migration.
Dr. Peter Venkman: Ray, the sponges migrated about a foot-and-a-half.

So they didn't even cross the streams?

  
Woodbine



Posts: 1218
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 01 2016,00:00   

Hang on a sec, didn't KF previously claim to have heroically prevented this levitation before it could happen? But now he's saying there was in fact demonic hoverage?

Either I'm remembering wrong or KF is a superstitious crackpot telling porkies. Both probably.

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 2564
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 01 2016,05:02   

Quote (Woodbine @ Mar. 01 2016,00:00)
Hang on a sec, didn't KF previously claim to have heroically prevented this levitation before it could happen? But now he's saying there was in fact demonic hoverage?

Either I'm remembering wrong or KF is a superstitious crackpot telling porkies. Both probably.

Here he said he hasn't seen levitation:
 
Quote
But naturalists deny this and claim that neo-Darwinian evolution is reasonable. But this is an extraordinary claim. After all, just like with levitation, I have never seen one type of organism change into another type.


and here he writes
 
Quote
I am acquainted with a case where the greater miracle being witnessed was in suppressing the degree of levitation and then breaking the hold of destructive forces.


and later
 
Quote
From my perspective of direct knowledge that levitation happens (and the direct knowledge was a big surprise to me –> and there was no question of an illusionist being at work so that talking point falls apart)...


and a bit later a fuller telling
 
Quote
On the order of a year past, in a semi-public case and in the presence of others, I witnessed a clear case of demonic attempted full levitation suppressed by the Liberating power of God. The Gospel Minister in charge — for obvious reasons — did not draw attention to this repeated phenomenon across the course of maybe an hour. He refused to be intimidated and proceeded with the business in hand of setting the victim free by the power of the One who set the Gadarene free.

Successfully.

Nope, no pulleys, invisible strings, magnets, plates etc. There were no cameras there, strictly eyeball, mark I. At a range of about 20 ft under quite well-lighted conditions. With multiple trained observers present, myself included. (And, do I need to add that I have fiddled a bit with a mag lev control system apparatus?)


and more explanation, in response to Graham2's "Oh, but you saw someone that didn’t levitate."
 
Quote
G2, nope. There was levitation of several inches (in a level position as on a slab . . . probably symbolic, I suspect . . . and with the floor and carpet underneath clearly visible . . . ), but the hips down were pinned to the ground as though by a pressing hand, resulting in a truly abnormal bodily posture. Arms sometimes dangled limply to the floor, as did head, falling back . . . as would be expected of an unconscious, limp body. The victim at the time was indeed unconscious. KF

Make of this what you will. Personally I needed this soundtrack to keep me sane for this trip down the tard mines.



Edited by stevestory on Mar. 02 2016,12:08

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It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

   
fnxtr



Posts: 3504
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 01 2016,08:37   

Erm... that's not levitation. We call that "sit-ups".

--------------
"[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory

"Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 01 2016,10:26   

Wonder how much cash Dembski got out of Barry for the keys to that shack of idiots?

   
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 01 2016,12:11   

Quote (fnxtr @ Mar. 01 2016,07:37)
Erm... that's not levitation. We call that "sit-ups".

Thou shalt not confuse exorcism with exercise! Not even if the words are a bit similar!

  
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