Utunumsint
Posts: 103
Joined: Jan. 2010
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| Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 11 2010,09:56) | | Quote (Utunumsint @ Feb. 11 2010,09:14) |
It was the Catholic church that gave us universities, and the laid the foundation for western tought. I think *you* should bone up on *your* history.
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| Quote | | None of that is because of "revealed truth". None whatsoever. And anyway, universities existed before Catholics. |
| Quote | Greece
* The Platonic Academy (sometimes referred to as the University of Athens[3][4]), founded ca. 387 BC in Athens by Plato.
China
* Taixue was established in 3CE.
* Nanjing University (National Central University) was founded in 259 AD.
Korea
* Taehak was founded in 372 and Gukhak was established in 682.
India
* Nalanda University an ancient university was established in the 5th century AD in Bihar, India.
Iran
* Academy of Gundishapur was an important medical centre of the 6th and 7th centuries AD.
Japan
* Ashikaga Gakko was founded in 9th century and restored in 1432.
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| Quote | | So, er, perhaps it's you that needs a history lesson. |
Lets start with Plato's academy, since all the other schools you mentioned are not western.
The only reason we still have plato's works, or the works of stoics, or the works of aristotle, or pythagoras, or any work of classical history is because some Monk in the dark ages decided it was worth preserving on hides.
Another thing they preserved was Roman Law. The Catholiic Church was the only institution that still practiced Roman Law in the dark ages. Roman law was an indispensible part of the development of canon law (religious law). Since in the dark ages, with the constant attacks from north African muslims, magyares, and vikings, the secular kingdoms had degenerated into lawless tyrannies, all looked to Rome for some kind of justice. After the invasions had settled down, the secular rules soon saw the benefits of emulating this law, so they set up the foundations for universities. Most notable are Oxford and Paris. The magistrates there based their model of education on what was taught in the monasteries. The curiculum was called the trivium and quadrivium. Notable in this curriculum was the teaching of physics, theology, philosophy, geometry, and even biology.
My point here is that their ties with religious institutions set them apart from the secular world of politics, and power, unlike Plato's school. Reason and clear thinking were essential, and produced some of the very great thinkers.
How this all relates to theology is well illustrated in the link provided by Quack on the dividing line between science and theology worked out during the middle ages.
| Quote | Exactly what do you want religion to fix?
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| Quote | | could start with the Jihads and holy wars you yourself mentioned. I seem to remember some incidents where some believers killed some other believers simply because they were of different religions. Fix that first eh? |
Actually, the crusades were to free European pilgrims to the holy land from molestation from muslim raiders and rulers. Muslims were also pressing in on the borders of Byzantium an Constantinople. Without the forsight of the early popes, we would all now be under Sharia law. The Crusades were primarily a defensive war.
There is one notable exception to this, and that is the Albigentian crusade. Not a memorable moment in Catholic history.
Religious warefare got really bad during the Protestant reformation, but there were many factors involved with these truggles, and most of the time, the underlying motivation for these wars was political and financial. Not religious.
| Quote | Thanks. I hear what you are saying, but I dispute your logic. You say more time is required to apply reason to revealed truth. I say you've had thousands of years and you are still fighting amongst yourselves as to what "truth" is.
As this is your turf, perhaps you can say how much longer it is before all religions accept each other peacefully? You've had thousands of years already, you really think it's happening anytime soon? |
Can you answer me this question for the secular world? Why is there no world peace today? Why has the UN not solved all the problems in the world? Why was the 20th century one of the bloodiest centuries in human history?
Cheers,
Ut
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