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Antievolution.org Discussion Board > From the Panda's Thumb > After the Bar Closes... > Senator calls for answer on creation of universe

Jason Spaceman Posts: 163 Joined: Nov. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,02:26    Quote By TOM HUMPHREY, NASHVILLE - Sen. Raymond Finney proposes to use the legislative process to get an answer to the question of whether the universe was created by a "Supreme Being." Under Senate Resolution 17, introduced by the Maryville Republican, the answer would come from state Education Commissioner Lana Seivers "in report form" no later than Jan. 15, 2008. Finney, a retired physician, said Monday that his objective is to formally prod the Department of Education into a dialogue about the teaching of evolution in school science classes without also teaching the alternative of "creationism," or "intelligent design." The move would thus renew a debate that has raged off and on in the Tennessee Legislature since at least 1925, when the 64th General Assembly enacted a law forbidding the teaching of evolution - setting the stage for the famous John Scopes "monkey trial" in Dayton, Tenn., later that year. Finney said there is no doubt in his own mind that everything in the universe, including human beings, was created by a Supreme Being. "There has never been any proof offered that Darwin's theory of evolution is correct," he said. "I'm not demanding that she (Seivers) to do anything," he said, "just asking, 'Are you sure we're doing the right thing?' " He said the resolution is "giving her the opportunity to say, 'You're wrong. There is no creationism.' " As the resolution is written, if Seivers does answer no to the first question - stating that the universe was not created by a Supreme Being - she would be offered "the General Assembly's admiration for being able to decide conclusively a question that has long perplexed and occupied the attention of scientists, philosophers, theologians, educators and others." But if she answers yes, or states that the answer to the creation of the universe is uncertain, then there is a follow-up question that must also be answered: Why is creationism not being taught in Tennessee schools? Read it here. The text of Senate Resolution 17 is here.

Jason Spaceman Posts: 163 Joined: Nov. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,02:30    For the PDF challenged, here is the text of Resolution 17: Quote SR0017 00380013 -1- Filed for intro on 02/21/2007 SENATE RESOLUTION 17 By Finney R. A RESOLUTION to request the commissioner of education to provide answers to questions concerning creationism and public school curriculums in Tennessee. BE IT RESOLVED BY THE SENATE OF THE ONE HUNDRED FIFTH GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF THE STATE OF TENNESSEE, that the commissioner of the department of education, in consultation with any other persons whether within or without state government, is hereby respectfully requested by this body to respond to the following questions: (1) Is the Universe and all that is within it, including human beings, created through purposeful, intelligent design by a Supreme Being, that is a Creator? Understand that this question does not ask that the Creator be given a name. To name the Creator is a matter of faith. The question simply asks whether the Universe has been created or has merely happened by random, unplanned, and purposeless occurrences. Further understand that this question asks that the latest advances in multiple scientific disciplines –such as physics, astronomy, molecular biology, DNA studies, physiology, paleontology, mathematics, and statistics – be considered, rather than relying solely on descriptive and hypothetical suppositions. If the answer to Question 1 is “Yes,” please answer Question 2: (2) Since the Universe, including human beings, is created by a Supreme Being (a Creator), why is creationism not taught in Tennessee public schools? If the answer to Question 1 is “This question cannot be proved or disproved,” please answer Question 3: (3) Since it cannot be determined whether the Universe, including human beings, is created by a Supreme Being (a Creator), why is creationism not taught as an alternative concept, explanation, or theory, along with the theory of evolution in Tennessee public schools? If the answer to Question 1 is “No” please accept the General Assembly’s admiration for being able to decide conclusively a question that has long perplexed and occupied the attention of scientists, philosophers, theologians, educators, and others. BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that the commissioner of education is requested to deliver her response to this request in report form to the Speaker of the Senate before January 15, 2008. BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that an appropriate copy of this resolution be prepared and sent to the commissioner of education.

Ichthyic Posts: 3325 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,03:21    holy crap. to think these idiots get paid to be representatives.     Quote Further understand that this question asks that the latest advances in multiple scientific disciplines –such as physics, astronomy, molecular biology, DNA studies, physiology, paleontology, mathematics, and statistics – be considered, rather than relying solely on descriptive and hypothetical suppositions. yeah, sure, if the writer had actually relied on ANY of these things to begin with, they wouldn't be asking such a stupid ass question. If i were the "commissioner of education", I'd publically announce that the government intends to force the issue, ask if that's what all of his constituents really feel should be the role of their government, and then laugh evilly as I announce that indeed, God is dead. -------------- "And the sea will grant each man new hope..." -CC

Renier Posts: 276 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,04:35    Quote (1) Is the Universe and all that is within it, including human beings, created through purposeful, intelligent design by a Supreme Being, that is a Creator? Understand that this question does not ask that the Creator be given a name. To name the Creator is a matter of faith... ...(2) Since the Universe, including human beings, is created by a Supreme Being (a Creator), why is creationism not taught in Tennessee public schools?... Some nasty, arrogant assumption in there that an evil person might exploit. Can you imagine their faces when: "The conclusion of this report is that it cannot be determined if a supernatural being created the universe or not. However, let it be stated for the record that the closest creationist theory with regards to the various science disciplines is.... HINDU! The recommendation, based on the initial request (see (2)), is therefore that Hindu creationism be taught in all science classes as an alternative to the natural sciences."  :p  :D

Darth Robo Posts: 148 Joined: Aug. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,07:18    "Sen. Raymond Finney proposes to use the legislative process to get an answer to the question of whether the universe was created by a "Supreme Being." Under Senate Resolution 17, introduced by the Maryville Republican, the answer would come from state Education Commissioner Lana Seivers "in report form" no later than Jan. 15, 2008." Okay, you've got until the end of the year to discover the meaning of life.  Come on now, we've had long enough! "holy crap. to think these idiots get paid to be representatives." I second that motion.  Combine the complete disregard for the seperation of church and state aswell as the total stupidity, how the friggin' heck do these guys get away with it?  It's insane.  Somebody should keep Finney away from that whiskey!    ??? -------------- "Commentary: How would you like to be the wholly-owned servant to an organic meatbag? It's demeaning! If, uh, you weren't one yourself, I mean..."

Ichthyic Posts: 3325 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,15:33    ... and they tried to impeach Clinton for lying about getting  a blowjob. *sigh* -------------- "And the sea will grant each man new hope..." -CC

Henry J Posts: 5786 Joined: Mar. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,15:56    What would prevent a supreme being from using evolution as the method, I wonder? It appears that ID pushers think something does so. Henry

J-Dog Posts: 4402 Joined: Dec. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,15:56    Yeah.  I saw this earlier...un - effing - believable. -------------- Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10 Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08 UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,16:01    His website shows him to be a bad-ted-Charlie-churcher. -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Arden Chatfield Posts: 6657 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,16:03    I could make some comment about how these things always seem to emanate out of Southern, or at least very red states... ...but that would be cruel. Hey! It just occurred to me! What if they passed a resolution like this in, I dunno, California or Massachusetts, and the answer was totally different? How would we decide between these competing realities? Maybe stage a boxing match? A footrace? Or just a coin toss? Decisions, decisions... -------------- "Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Mr_Christopher Posts: 1238 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,16:25    Senator Finney (no relation to Col Sanders) has an online survey that I have been having fun with.  Help him assess his 07 priorities by completing it here. -------------- Uncommon Descent is a moral cesspool, a festering intellectual ghetto that intoxicates and degrades its inhabitants - Stephen Matheson

Ichthyic Posts: 3325 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,18:28    Quote How would we decide between these competing realities? Maybe stage a boxing match? A footrace? Or just a coin toss? Decisions, decisions... turtle stacking competition? -------------- "And the sea will grant each man new hope..." -CC

bystander Posts: 301 Joined: Oct. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,18:57    Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Feb. 28 2007,09:25) Senator Finney (no relation to Col Sanders) has an online survey that I have been having fun with.  Help him assess his 07 priorities by completing it here. I've put in my opinions. I'm sure he will value opinions from Australia Michael

J-Dog Posts: 4402 Joined: Dec. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,19:31    Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Feb. 27 2007,16:25) Senator Finney (no relation to Col Sanders) has an online survey that I have been having fun with.  Help him assess his 07 priorities by completing it here. Excellent link!  I wrote and told him that God wants him to resign immediatly for being such an idiot. -------------- Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10 Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08 UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

MidnightVoice Posts: 380 Joined: Aug. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 27 2007,22:10    Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Feb. 27 2007,16:03) What if they passed a resolution like this in, I dunno, California, and the answer was totally different? How would we decide between these competing realities? Fist fight between Arnold and ..... -------------- If I fly the coop some time And take nothing but a grip With the few good books that really count It's a necessary trip I'll be gone with the girl in the gold silk jacket The girl with the pearl-driller's hands

phonon Posts: 396 Joined: Nov. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 28 2007,09:36    Quote (Ichthyic @ Feb. 27 2007,03:21) holy crap. to think these idiots get paid to be representatives. The sad thing is that they are probably accurately representing their constituents. I live in Tennessee, so hopefully he will care about my comments. I doubt he will, but it only took a few seconds of typing. Since most of the questions were about taxes and allocations, I phrased it as if I were a monetary conservative. (A "true" conservative.) My comment: "Why are you wasting time and money to use the legislative process to debate the question of how or why the universe was created? This is a question that cannot be answered by a state legislature, if it can be answered at all be mere mortals. Please end this ridiculous waste of time and money." -------------- With most men, unbelief in one thing springs from blind belief in another. - Georg Christoph Lichtenberg To do just the opposite is also a form of imitation. - Georg Christoph Lichtenberg

JohnW Posts: 3217 Joined: Aug. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 28 2007,10:35    Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Feb. 27 2007,16:25) Senator Finney (no relation to Col Sanders) has an online survey that I have been having fun with.  Help him assess his 07 priorities by completing it here. Senator Finney's priority for 2007 should be: [ ] Get a clue [ ] Resignation [ ] A nice rest in the Tennessee Home For The Bewidered [ ] Boil head [ ] All of the above -------------- Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

J-Dog Posts: 4402 Joined: Dec. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 28 2007,11:27    Quote (JohnW @ Feb. 28 2007,10:35) Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Feb. 27 2007,16:25) Senator Finney (no relation to Col Sanders) has an online survey that I have been having fun with.  Help him assess his 07 priorities by completing it here. Senator Finney's priority for 2007 should be: [ ] Get a clue [ ] Resignation [ ] A nice rest in the Tennessee Home For The Bewidered [ ] Boil head [ ] All of the above John - I believe the correct answer is "All of The Above". Please have the Announcer Dude tell me what I have won today! -------------- Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10 Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08 UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

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