RSS 2.0 Feed

» Welcome Guest Log In :: Register

Pages: (1000) < ... 111 112 113 114 115 [116] 117 118 119 120 121 ... >   
  Topic: Official Uncommonly Dense Discussion Thread< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,08:04   

I wonder how DaveTard1 reconciles this:
Quote
I don’t get the connection. I’m not a reborn Christian. I gave up a positive disbelief in God for the belief that there might be a higher intelligence of some sort. I traded in atheism for agnosticism 15 years ago which is where I remain today.
 

With this "insight" :
Quote
"I’ve raised many different species of birds and mammals as pets...They’re as much God’s creatures as you are." Comment by DaveScot - November 2, 2005 @ 10:08 pm uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/445#comment-11687


Oh, that's right -- cognitive dissonance and B-S.

--------------
AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
GCT



Posts: 1001
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,08:05   

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1168#comments

Oh man, it gets better.  In the very next comment DaveTard explains how the country was founded on the Declaration of Independence...

Quote
...In point of fact, how can any nation founded upon God-given inalienable rights not mention God and still be the same nation? -ds

IN CONGRESS, JULY 4, 1776
The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America....


Then, in the very next comment, someone tries to proselytize to DaveTard...

Quote
26.  Hello, Dave. Might I suggest that the reason you are still in the same place you were 15 years ago (namely an agnostic, convinced of intelligent causation, but unsure of a creator) is that you might be using the wrong “organ” to seek that knowledge out (namely your intellect, which is space/time limited) when your intuitive perception, the voice of your spirit, is what is at your disposal, by design, for such higher pursuits? Just a friendly thought…

How does one determine that a sense of spiritual connectedness to something larger than oneself isn’t an internally generated illusion? Like billions of other people I have feelings of being part of something bigger but there’s no way to measure or quantify what it is or where it comes from. -ds

Comment by tinabrewer — May 31, 2006 @ 11:37 am

Plus, DaveTard shows us that he doesn't really understand agnosticism, although he did just chide someone with the definition of it a couple comments before this.

  
bourgeois_rage



Posts: 117
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,08:08   

Quote (GCT @ May 31 2006,12:56)
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1168#comments

I just found this comment rather funny:

 
Quote
“agnosticism holds that you can neither prove nor disprove God’s existence”–I call this arrogant agnosticism. My father was a humble agnostic–he didn’t know but neither did he know that you cannot know.

Comment by Rude — May 31, 2006 @ 11:29 am

Does that mean that there are "Arrogant Christians" (those who know Jesus loves them) and "Humble Christians" (those who don't know if Jesus loves them)?

--------------
Overwhelming Evidence: Apply directly to the forehead.

   
dhogaza



Posts: 525
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,08:10   

I'm starting to think Dembski's totally lost it ...

Does he think this post is any kind of argument for anything at all?
 
Quote
You get the idea. The correct answer to every question is C): “Hack her to death with a kitchen knife.” Likewise, with Darwinism (aka Darwinian theory, the blind watchmaker, mechanistic evolution, naturalistic evolution, unintelligent evolution, etc.), the answer to every question over how some complex biological system formed is:

C) Hack to death all organisms that don’t have that system or some precursor to it.

We can thank Darwin for that insightful answer. The short-hand for it is NATURAL SELECTION.


High comedy, given that Dembski's response to every question over how some complex biological system form is "The Designer did it".

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,08:19   

He's not even trying anymore. I think Dembski knows full well that his maundering would never impress anyone at an academic conference, or indeed any gathering of educated people, but he knows that for his crowd of ingenuous rubes, it's plenty profound. Them creationists love all them big words he uses.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
GCT



Posts: 1001
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,08:22   

Quote (dhogaza @ May 31 2006,13:10)
I'm starting to think Dembski's totally lost it ...

Just starting?

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,08:30   

Quote
Oh man, it gets better.  In the very next comment DaveTard explains how the country was founded on the Declaration of Independence...

In point of fact, how can any nation founded upon God-given inalienable rights not mention God and still be the same nation? -ds



Slightly off-topic, I've always been baffled by people who talk about the 'Christian foundation' of the US and cite the tiny handful of times the word 'Creator' or 'God' is mentioned in the Constitution or Declaration of Independence as 'proof', even tho neither document ever mentions Jesus or Christianity.

And of course, this means they have to ignore the Establishment Clause, but we already knew that.

Gee, if I didn't know better, I'd think the evidence pointed to the Constitution being written by a bunch of deists and agnostics who were highly suspicious of organized religion of all kinds, but hey, if DaveTard says otherwise, I must be wrong.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,08:33   

Heh, even his theodicy is a joke. Reading it gives insight into the kind of evil God that Debski subscribes to.

One that -- to use an analogy I was prevented from posting there -- resembles a parent of 7 children who beats all of them daily for the misconduct of the firstborn.

--------------
AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
Wonderpants



Posts: 115
Joined: Sep. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,08:40   

Quote (Bob O'H @ May 31 2006,10:04)
[quote=GCT,May 31 2006,07:53]I had imagined DaveScot to be older than that: I thought he was mid-60s at least: one of those sclerotic old codgers who just complained about how bad the world was nowadays.

Egads!  What will he be like when he becomes a sclerotic old codger?!

Bob

Let's not even go there.

If you thought John Davison was bad enough, wait till you get a load of a 70 year old DaveScot....

--------------
Fundamentalism in a nutshell:
"There are a lot of things I have concluded to be wrong, without studying them in-depth. Evolution is one of them. The fact that I don't know that much about it does not bother me in the least."

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 2564
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,09:08   

Quote (Wonderpants @ May 31 2006,13:40)
[quote=Bob O'H,May 31 2006,10:04]
Quote (GCT @ May 31 2006,07:53)
I had imagined DaveScot to be older than that: I thought he was mid-60s at least: one of those sclerotic old codgers who just complained about how bad the world was nowadays.

Egads!  What will he be like when he becomes a sclerotic old codger?!

Bob

Let's not even go there.

If you thought John Davison was bad enough, wait till you get a load of a 70 year old DaveScot....

Oh, please.  I was trying to blank that thought out of my mind.  I want to sleep tonight.

Bob

--------------
It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

   
GCT



Posts: 1001
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,09:17   

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 31 2006,13:30)
Slightly off-topic, I've always been baffled by people who talk about the 'Christian foundation' of the US and cite the tiny handful of times the word 'Creator' or 'God' is mentioned in the Constitution or Declaration of Independence as 'proof', even tho neither document ever mentions Jesus or Christianity.

And of course, this means they have to ignore the Establishment Clause, but we already knew that.

They also have to disregard Article VI.

Oh, and they have to disregard the fact that the word "Lord" only happens in the Constitution in the date.

Oh, and they have to disregard the fact that the Declaration of Independence is not a legally binding document on our country.

  
GCT



Posts: 1001
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,09:27   

Yay, more dumb comments!

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1169#comments

Quote
8.  When intelligent and engaging people grapple with ID, we ratchet down the rhetoric. And we need more grappling with the claims science makes against faith that science itself can’t sustain.

It seems Darwinsists are claiming ID presupposes God exists, while Darwinsism claims it doesn’t presuppose anything about God. If you look at Darwinist claims, however, they presuppose God as the ultimate Straw Man–misrepresented so he can be handily refuted.

Comment by kathy — May 31, 2006 @ 1:48 pm

Kathy, you got us.  We are making a Straw Man of god so that we can refute god, even though science has nothing to do with god.  It's really just an atheist conspiracy.  Darn you for uncovering our attempts.

Quote
9.  Why is it that natural selection discourages inefficiency, but when one needs to argue against an intelligent designer one has no problem finding many examples of inefficiency in nature?

Comment by Mung — May 31, 2006 @ 2:20 pm

Wait, what was it Kathy was just saying about Straw Man arguments?

  
GCT



Posts: 1001
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,09:34   

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1168#comments

This is too good.  Tinabrewer is not done proselytizing to DaveTard:

Quote
28.  It might be an internally generated illusion, but one feels it nonetheless. This deep inner feeling, which is synonymous with intuition, is the “still small voice” (Gandhi again) which yearns for expression and exploration. The brain says things like “to measure or quantify” because that is its nature. The spirit says things like “bliss. beauty. eternity.” because that is its nature. Like anything, the spirit obeys the laws of creation. If one wishes to makes ones muscles stronger, one must USE them to lift things. If one wishes to make one’s intuition (and its associated insights) stronger, one must USE it. Its voice is so small because it so little used, and so grossly overshadowed by the very loud voice which says “to measure and to quantify”.

You can exercise the spirit but it doesn’t change its nature. It still comes from within while reality comes from without. Blurring the boundaries between physical reality and spiritual feeling has no benefit as far as I can tell. Indeed, it just seems to lead to quashing of the spirit. For instance, just about the time you get the spiritual feeling that God loves you your dog gets hit by a car in the prime of his life and you then wonder what sort of rotten God would do that to you. It’s best to keep the real and the spiritual in different compartments and don’t mingle the two together. -ds

Comment by tinabrewer — May 31, 2006 @ 1:03 pm

Poor DaveTard.  How does he let her in on the secret that he's really one of them?  She just doesn't seem to get it.

Then, there's a couple comments that may not last long:
Quote
29.  Re #28. I completely respect Tina’s opinion - but it is also rather a clear demonstration of how religious belief is based on a very different kind of evidence than atheism. An atheist restricts themselves to the intellect, and that is why atheism is not based on faith and is not a religion.

Comment by Mark Frank — May 31, 2006 @ 1:32 pm

30.  Re #24. Atheists are arrogant. Some agnostics are arrogant. How come believers are never arrogant for believing their particular God exists?

Comment by Mark Frank — May 31, 2006 @ 1:35 pm


Then, tinabrewer comes back for more and in the process demonstrates that she has no clue what Mark Frank just said:
Quote
31.  well said, Mark Frank. now what was that thing again with which the serpent tempted us? The “fruit of the tree of knowledge”? I can’t think of a better metaphor for enslavement to the bounds of intellect.

Dave: just about the time you think “what sort of rotten God would do that to [me]” all of a sudden you get a flash of insight from your intuition which says “maybe everything isn’t all about me, and my hopes and desires…”

Comment by tinabrewer — May 31, 2006 @ 2:12 pm

  
Ichthyic



Posts: 3325
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,09:40   

Davey tries to go all new age on us:

Quote
It still comes from within while reality comes from without.


hmm, this seems like the new age definition of projection to me.

...and he continues to document his struggles with dissonance:

Quote
It’s best to keep the real and the spiritual in different compartments and don’t mingle the two together


attempts at compartmentalization that have dismally failed with poor Dave.

Dave subconsciously recognizes he's got a serious problem, but the rampant use of denial helps to prevent him from consciously recognizing it.

classic.

--------------
"And the sea will grant each man new hope..."

-CC

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5455
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,09:45   

Help, we've just been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of society!

We don't need no stinkin' edumakation.  Nolige is fo da devil!

--  Paraphrase of TinaBrewer

--------------
“Why do creationists have such a hard time with commas?

Linky“. ~ Steve Story, Legend

   
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,09:45   

Wouldn't it be hilarious if DT had to ban Tina Brewer for trying to convert him?

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,10:19   

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1170#comment-41101

and of course ID 'theory' gives us the answers where science cannot..

1) God did it
2) God did it
3) God did it
4) God did it

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Dante



Posts: 61
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,14:12   

Quote
That's funny, because reading his crap, I pictured him as about 14.


Well, I'm 16 but I like to think I'm more mature than DaveRot, who is the same age as my father.

--------------
Dembski said it, I laughed at it, that settles it!

    
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,14:53   

Dante, I know DaveTard1, I've been banned by DaveTard1 ( three times in diff. names). I've seen DaveTard1's hysterics. You , sir, are no DaveTard1 ( hallefuckinfallujah!;)

--------------
AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
keiths



Posts: 2195
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,15:58   

Some select comments from an old but good thread on UD entitled Why I ruthlessly edit comments on this blog:

From the one and only member (ever) of the Josh Bozeman Fan Club:
Quote
Josh,

What is your website…I like your posts and would like to check it out.

Dan

Comment by Dan — November 30, 2005 @ 7:31 pm

Dan searches for more common ground:
Quote
Cool site Josh,

Do you wrestle? I am a wrestler and I think everyone from your neck of the woods wrestles.

Dan

Comment by Dan — December 1, 2005 @ 12:39 pm

...but Josh dashes his hopes:
   
Quote

Dan-

Thanks, and no I don’t wrestle. There must be something I missed in my neck of the woods.  

Comment by Josh Bozeman — December 1, 2005 @ 7:00 pm


Here's DougMoron (in his pre-contributor days) demonstrating his objectivity:
     
Quote
Red Reader says: “It’s a privilege to participate”.

Ditto from me. I appreciate the privilege to be exposed to the [mostly] fine thoughts expressed here as much as I am permitted to interract with their authors. And I’ve never once felt I was being deprived of hearing opposing viewpoints. The lively debates should be enough to convince anyone that there is no unfairness here.

Comment by dougmoran — November 30, 2005 @ 10:27 pm

I can't decide if this one is sardonic or not:
 
Quote

What Dembski’s atheistic materialist opponents obviously can’t understand is that in this case censorsip is free speech.

Comment by CharlesW — December 1, 2005 @ 8:47 am

Or this one:    
 
Quote
Mr Dembski has every right to run his blog as he wishes and I imagine that teaching ID to our youth will work in much the same fashion.

Comment by Jeffahn — December 1, 2005 @ 10:55 am

hlwarren gets fed up and bails:
     
Quote

Dear DaveScot
You do bore me.
Goodbye.

Dear Dr. Dembski,
Please expell me from this blog. It is too boring for more words than this.
Thank you and goodbye.

Comment by hlwarren — December 1, 2005 @ 3:44 pm

DaveScot manages to alienate everyone by digging up dirt on his opponents and making a tasteless reference to AIDS-related dementia.  Even Dembski slaps his wrist:
     
Quote

DaveScot:
1) What does what puckSR choose to do in his personal life have to do with this blog?
2) Unless i am sorely mistaken,he said on one of his earlier posts that he is a Christian, so why do you label him as an atheist?
3) Your comments have been way off subject and quite unproductive, so why have you not been expelled from this blog? Mr. Dembski clearly states, “If you post a comment that I don’t think is productive, I’ll probably not just eliminate your comment but you from this blog.”

[I take infamous’s point to heart. Let’s stay on topic and keep things interesting. –WmAD]

Comment by infamous — December 1, 2005 @ 3:57 pm


--------------
And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number. -- Joe G

Please stop putting words into my mouth that don't belong there and thoughts into my mind that don't belong there. -- KF

  
Ichthyic



Posts: 3325
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,16:23   

Quote
What Dembski’s atheistic materialist opponents obviously can’t understand is that in this case censorsip is free speech.


I'm sure that more of them actually believe this than will admit.

oh wait, most of them DO admit this.

oops.

anyone else remember their true fantasy:




--------------
"And the sea will grant each man new hope..."

-CC

  
Ved



Posts: 398
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,18:45   

That's an interesting bit of intelligent design. Co-opting a Darwin Doll and vise.

(ten seconds later) It's hard to imagine either one could exist without the other.

  
Ichthyic



Posts: 3325
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,18:57   

I'm sure that's one of the reasons Dembski chose it for his "vice strategy".

*rolleyes*

--------------
"And the sea will grant each man new hope..."

-CC

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,19:02   

Quote (keiths @ May 31 2006,20:58)

From the one and only member (ever) of the Josh Bozeman Fan Club:    
Quote
Josh,

What is your website…I like your posts and would like to check it out.

Dan

"Your ideas are intriguing to me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter!"

Quote
What Dembski’s atheistic materialist opponents obviously can’t understand is that in this case censorship is free speech.

Comment by CharlesW — December 1, 2005 @ 8:47 am


I've also heard rumors that freedom is slavery.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
Ichthyic



Posts: 3325
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,19:19   

no no, it's "Ignorance is Strength"!

--------------
"And the sea will grant each man new hope..."

-CC

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 2564
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2006,19:51   

John Wilkins points to an article in the Grauniad about a Vardy school near Doncaster:

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/publicservices/story/0,,1785743,00.html

Why, you are wondering, is this not totally off-topic? Because of this:

Quote
"When all this started we thought they were trying to get rid of the under-achievers but now we think they are getting rid of any child, regardless of academic ability, who thinks for themselves, who challenges things ..."


Sound familiar?

Bob

--------------
It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

   
GCT



Posts: 1001
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: June 01 2006,01:35   

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1168#comment-41104

I'm just going to put this one up, then sit back.  I don't think I need to say anything at all...

Quote
On the topic of religious faith and evidence… one musn’t overlook the powerful testimony of historical evidence. For example, there is compelling historical evidence which supports the bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ. And the attempts to explain this particular event away simply don’t stand up in light of the volumes of harmonious manuscript evidence that we have in support of it. In fact, there is more consistent historical evidence in support of Christ’s resurrection than there is of George Washington as the first President. There is the science of Textual Criticism which is used to determine the integrity of historical documents, etc… So, I would argue that legitimate faith is a faith based in facts.

And great point, Gil.

Comment by Scott — May 31, 2006 @ 3:16 pm

  
GCT



Posts: 1001
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: June 01 2006,01:58   

I think Chris Hyland just nailed DaveTard...

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1168#comment-41172

Quote
“As a former devout atheist I can attest to the fact that atheism is based on a philosophical pre-commitment, not reason or evidence.”

That may be true for you but most atheists I know say that they do not believe in God becuase they see no evidence for God. If they see evidence for a God they have nothing to gain by ignoring it.

“My father was a humble agnostic–he didn’t know but neither did he know that you cannot know.”

The question I always want to ask agnotics is are they agnostic to simply the supernatural or specifically the Christian God. If the latter does that mean there is a chance in their mind that they are going to ####?

It’s nothing short of incredible that any thinking adult can look at the world around them and not see evidence of creation. Equivocal evidence, sure, but evidence nonetheless. Atheism is positive belief that the universe is an accident without design. There’s no rational basis at all for that positive belief. -ds

Comment by Chris Hyland — May 31, 2006 @ 6:23 pm

There goes DT's "I'm an agnostic but you'd be crazy not to believe in god" thing again.  I think Chris got it just right.  I think DT is just agnostic toward the Xtian god.

  
k.e



Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 01 2006,02:45   

Ah well GCT unCommon Deficiency are redefining arrogance

--------------
The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

   
k.e



Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 01 2006,02:46   

oops ...reconfigure ie

--------------
The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

   
  29999 replies since Jan. 16 2006,11:43 < Next Oldest | Next Newest >  

Pages: (1000) < ... 111 112 113 114 115 [116] 117 118 119 120 121 ... >   


Track this topic Email this topic Print this topic

[ Read the Board Rules ] | [Useful Links] | [Evolving Designs]