Crabby Appleton
Posts: 250
Joined: May 2006
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| Quote (JonF @ Sep. 05 2006,15:30) | | Quote (afdave @ Sep. 05 2006,10:35) | | JonF is still yelling "Fraud, fraud" while failing to see how completely irrelevant and silly his fraud claim is. But alas ... what's a Darwinist to do? Honest dealing with facts is impossible for many of them ... so that leaves goofy techniques such as yelling "Fraud" just for the fun of it. |
Actually, and incredibly, Dave has somewhat of a point; there's more to the paper than Snelling's fraud. But not much more ... I'm going to reproduce the entire conclusions section so everyone can see exactly how bizarre it is:
| Quote | The Rb-Sr, Sm-Nd and Pb-Pb radioisotopic ratios in these samples of the recent (1949-1975) andesite lava flows at Mt Ngauruhoe, New Zealand, as anticipated, do not yield any meaningful "age"; information, even with selective manipulation of the data. Instead, these data provide evidence of the mantle source of the lavas, of magma genesis, and of crustal contamination of the parental basalt magmas. Subduction of the Pacific Plate beneath the Taupo Volcanic Arc has carried trench sediments with it -- sediments identical in composition to the Torlesse metasediment basement underlying, and outcropping adjacent to, these volcanoes. Scraped off the subducting slab, the sediments have contaminated the basalt magmas generated by partial melting of the peridotitic mantle wedge at the mantle-slab interface. The resultant andesite magmas rose in the melt column through the mantle wedge, and then ascended through fracture conduits in the overlying crust into magma chambers below the volcanoes that erupted when full.
The Sr-Nd-Pb radioisotopic systematics are thus characteristic of the depleted mantle source, modified by mixing with the crustal contaminant. Variations in the depleted mantle Nd "model ages", which range from 724.5 to 1453.3 Ma, and which are meaningless in this recent (even in conventional terms) tectonic and petrogenetic framework, and the Pb isotopic linear arrays, indicate geochemical heterogeneity in the mantle wedge. Thus the radioisotopic ratios in these recent Ngauruhoe andesite lava flows were inherited from both the peridotitic mantle wedge and the subducted trench sediments, and are fundamental characteristics of their geochemistry. They therefore only reflect the origin and history of the mantle and crustal sources from which the magma was generated, and therefore have no age significance.
By implication, the radioisotopic ratios in ancient lavas found throughout the geologic record are likely fundamental characteristics of their geochemistry. They therefore probably only reflect the magmatic origin of the lavas from mantle and crustal sources, and any history of mixing or contamination in their petrogenesis, rather than any valid age information. Even though radioisotopic decay has undoubtedly occurred during the earth's history, conventional radioisotopic dating of these rocks therefore does not necessarily provide valid absolute "ages" for them. This is especially so if accelerated nuclear decay accompanied the catastrophic operation of those geologic and tectonic processes responsible for the mixing of the radioisotopic decay products during magma genesis. |
Now, we know that Davie-doodles (the one in the corner with the dunce cap) can't see how incredibly disjointed this is, but can anyone else in the class see it? Anyone? OK, you in the back with your hand up, Maurice?
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Absolutely correct, Maurice! The last paragraph is not supported by the data and discussions in the paper. It's actually even worse than that; the last paragraph, claiming that all radiometric dating is wrong, has absolutely no relationship to the rest of the paper!. Here, I'll summarize the paper on the blackboard so we can all see the disconnect:
- A K-Ar dating test on samples known to be invalid produced incorrect results. Duh. Fraud.
- Isochron analyses produced no valid age and the data clearly and objectively indicated that no valid age could be obtained.
- Nd model age calculations are also meaningless since the data clearly and objectively indicates that the samples contain Nd derived from other sources than in-situ radioactive decay.
- Analyses of isotope concentrations produced results consistent with those of nearby volcanoes.
- The isotope concentrations are also consistent with mainstream theories of mantle-generated lava and subduction of plates.
- The existing isotopic profiles of this young lava are inherited from the parent lava. (Since it's too young to have developed an age-determining isotopic profile -- jonf)
- Therefore all isotopic profiles are inherited from the parent lava and all radiometric dating is wrong.
Yes, Sarah?
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True, Sarah, it's difficult to see how anyone could fall for that, but they do. Af "sedimentary tuffs" dave swallowed it hook, line, and sinker. The major problem is that they don't understand how age-diagnostic radiometric methods work (although Snelling does, and knows that his last paragraph is bovine excrement). The secondary problem is that they immediately and unquestioningly accept anything that agrees with their preconceptions; they can't handle the easy questions, much less the tough ones. Sad, really, and kind of pathetic. |
Got dang it Jon I had my hand up but you completely ignored me (no doubt because I'm a member of of devolved race).
The last paragraph MAKES EVERYTHING CLEAR WITH THIS STATEMENT!
| Quote | | Even though radioisotopic decay has undoubtedly occurred during the earth's history, conventional radioisotopic dating of these rocks therefore does not necessarily provide valid absolute "ages" for them. This is especially so if accelerated nuclear decay accompanied the catastrophic operation of those geologic and tectonic processes responsible for the mixing of the radioisotopic decay products during magma genesis. |
Those continents whizzing around at great speeds obviously sped up nucular decay at the same time. How much clearer can it be?
We can trust the Naval Observatory Clock nowadays but obviously there was something going on 6000 YA to mess things up. I ain't saying goddidit but SOMEBODY did.
Now please kindly stop trying to indoctrinate me and mine into the cult of IT'SOLDERTHANMYFEEBLEBRAINCANCOMPREHENDISM
Thanks and have a nice day!
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since I thanked the various people who used AF "Sergeant Schultz" Dave's nose as the tee for some very interesting shots about (especially) geology and dating methods. I pointed out then that no possible lurker could gain more by watching you trying to point out to Dave that he was trying to sell a very dead parrot indeed (how unbelievably apt that sketch matches Dave's arguments here! If only he would end it by asking you to "come over to his place") but you've all kept bloody on and on.
) 
