RSS 2.0 Feed

» Welcome Guest Log In :: Register

Pages: (22) < ... 11 12 13 14 15 [16] 17 18 19 20 21 ... >   
  Topic: FL Debate Peanut Gallery, Keep it Clean!< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,15:40   

Quote
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven


Which way is down to the surface of a sphere?

The measurement of the city described in Revelation chapters 21 and 22 is 12,000 furlongs. A furlong is 1/8 th of a mile. This makes the city about 1500 miles square, or 1500 miles in all directions.

Is Heaven in a geosynchronous orbit over Jerusalem (~36,000 km)?  

If so, the bugger should certainly be detectable.

--------------
"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,15:45   

Thieves in the night don't come and rob your house after you are dead. You don't have a house at that point. Duh.

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
FloydLee



Posts: 577
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,15:51   

Quote
But when it has been said that this is going to happen while some of you are still alive...


Not "...this IS going to happen while some of you are still alive", but instead "...this COULD happen while some of you are still alive."  Very big difference.

That's the point that has now been fully established by rationally examining the actual text and context of the 1 Thessalonians Rapture text.  The biblical evidence is clear at this point unless anybody has anything else to offer.

Quote
As far as I am concerned, unless you can prove it is true, my claim that it is false stands.


I would ask why "your claim that it is false stands", given that Chay was the only person who brought up any kind of rational point in support of your claim that the 1 Thessalonians text was a lie.  Now that Chay's specific point has been critically examined in light of the clear biblical text and its context, and visibiy refuted on both counts, I see no rational reason to consider the Rapture text a lie.

Floyd Lee

  
Chayanov



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,16:18   

Quote
Now that Chay's specific point has been critically examined in light of the clear biblical text and its context, and visibiy refuted on both counts...

By whom? Certainly not by you.

--------------
Help! Marxist literary critics are following me!

  
Chayanov



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,16:22   

Quote
15 According to the Lord's own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep.


I don't see the word "could" in there, either. And he doesn't give a specific date -- nobody claimed he did. But he does say to them that it will happen in their lifetime. And how would you know what his intent was? Where's the passage where Paul tells his friends about how he put one over on the yokels? Just admit you're making it all up as you go.

--------------
Help! Marxist literary critics are following me!

  
Chayanov



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,16:37   

Quote (Quack @ Dec. 23 2009,10:46)
That's easy. Just read the text. I consider it just another piece of BS but at face value, it is addressed to people alive at the time it was spoken or written. Some of them even will still be alive when the unbelievable events promised shall happen.

But with 2k years hindsight we know that not only are they all dead and gone a long time now, the events did not take place, and won't ever happen.

Since we now [B]know[B] that what was promised did not come true, the promise was a lie back then, and will forever remain a lie.

Jonas Gardell, author of  "Om Gud" (About God) and  "Om Jesus" (about Jesus) is honorary doctor at the Theological Faculty at Lunds University, Sweden.

He doesn't call it a lie but is otherwise of the same opinion: The events promised in 1 Thess 4:13-17 did not happen.

Well, it turns out your "expert" was wrong. Because he wasn't there, and FL was, and Paul told FL afterwards how hard it was to continue with Jesus' ministry and about all the rhetorical tricks necessary to keep the flock moving along. So there.

--------------
Help! Marxist literary critics are following me!

  
MichaelJ



Posts: 462
Joined: June 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,16:40   

Quote (FloydLee @ Dec. 24 2009,06:51)
Quote
But when it has been said that this is going to happen while some of you are still alive...


Not "...this IS going to happen while some of you are still alive", but instead "...this COULD happen while some of you are still alive."  Very big difference.

That's the point that has now been fully established by rationally examining the actual text and context of the 1 Thessalonians Rapture text.  The biblical evidence is clear at this point unless anybody has anything else to offer.

Quote
As far as I am concerned, unless you can prove it is true, my claim that it is false stands.


I would ask why "your claim that it is false stands", given that Chay was the only person who brought up any kind of rational point in support of your claim that the 1 Thessalonians text was a lie.  Now that Chay's specific point has been critically examined in light of the clear biblical text and its context, and visibiy refuted on both counts, I see no rational reason to consider the Rapture text a lie.

Floyd Lee

The clear text meaning in any translation was the expectation that it would occur within the current generation.

I've seen the apologetics to this as well and it is only achieved by giving certain words meanings that are shared nowhere else in the Bible.
I think it is convincing to somebody who is desperate to hang on to a literal interpretation of the Bible but to the rest of us it is just funny.

  
Chayanov



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,16:46   

Quote
The clear text meaning in any translation was the expectation that it would occur within the current generation.

I've seen the apologetics to this as well and it is only achieved by giving certain words meanings that are shared nowhere else in the Bible.
I think it is convincing to somebody who is desperate to hang on to a literal interpretation of the Bible but to the rest of us it is just funny.


I think it's funny how FL can spin his tortured interpretation of that text and then claim that the passage has been critically examined. As if he had the faintest notion of how to critically examine anything.

--------------
Help! Marxist literary critics are following me!

  
RDK



Posts: 229
Joined: Aug. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,17:06   

Floyd I'm still waiting for a response to my cows.  Why do you believe in the rapture but not in my cows?

A prediction that gives no details as to even a vague idea of when it will happen or, in this case, what the hell is even happening, is not a prediction at all.

It's exactly like prayer; your god always wins.  If some random event happens to correspond even vaguely to what you prayed for, then god answered yes.  If nothing happens, he either answered no, or he wants you to wait.  How is that indicative of anything except the fact that you're a crazy loon and you're so emotionally and mentally unhinged from reality that you need an imaginary friend to soften the blow of how miserable your life is?

--------------
If you are not:
Leviathan
please Logout under Meta in the sidebar.

‘‘I was like ‘Oh my God! It’s Jesus on a banana!’’  - Lisa Swinton, Jesus-eating pagan

  
fnxtr



Posts: 3504
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,18:11   

Quote (FloydLee @ Dec. 23 2009,15:37)
Quote
Of course, the Beatles were bigger than Jesus.

John Lennon's famous declaration, of course.

Btw, this is the same John Lennon who privately asked for spiritual help from the late evangelist Oral Roberts.  

Rev. Roberts sent a private reply to Lennon.  The media apparently never found out about this.  Would you like to know exactly what that reply was, and would you lke to find out what happened to Lennon afterwards?  

If so, please check this out:

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/januaryweb-only/001-22.0.html

Floyd Lee

So he dabbled in Christianity like everything else.  Jesus had some good ideas.  So did Buddha. So did K'ung Fu-tzu.

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=69569

--------------
"[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory

"Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

  
Chayanov



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,19:15   

Quote (fnxtr @ Dec. 23 2009,18:11)
Quote (FloydLee @ Dec. 23 2009,15:37)
 
Quote
Of course, the Beatles were bigger than Jesus.

John Lennon's famous declaration, of course.

Btw, this is the same John Lennon who privately asked for spiritual help from the late evangelist Oral Roberts.  

Rev. Roberts sent a private reply to Lennon.  The media apparently never found out about this.  Would you like to know exactly what that reply was, and would you lke to find out what happened to Lennon afterwards?  

If so, please check this out:

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/januaryweb-only/001-22.0.html

Floyd Lee

So he dabbled in Christianity like everything else.  Jesus had some good ideas.  So did Buddha. So did K'ung Fu-tzu.

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=69569

He could also imagine no religion. Unlike FL.

--------------
Help! Marxist literary critics are following me!

  
Badger3k



Posts: 861
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,21:17   

Quote (Chayanov @ Dec. 23 2009,19:15)
Quote (fnxtr @ Dec. 23 2009,18:11)
Quote (FloydLee @ Dec. 23 2009,15:37)
 
Quote
Of course, the Beatles were bigger than Jesus.

John Lennon's famous declaration, of course.

Btw, this is the same John Lennon who privately asked for spiritual help from the late evangelist Oral Roberts.  

Rev. Roberts sent a private reply to Lennon.  The media apparently never found out about this.  Would you like to know exactly what that reply was, and would you lke to find out what happened to Lennon afterwards?  

If so, please check this out:

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/januaryweb-only/001-22.0.html

Floyd Lee

So he dabbled in Christianity like everything else.  Jesus had some good ideas.  So did Buddha. So did K'ung Fu-tzu.

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=69569

He could also imagine no religion. Unlike FL.

Considering what a low-life scum, fraudulent huckster, and all-around piece of shit that Oral Roberts was, I'm not sure anyone should use him as a "positive" for Christianity (or anything else).

--------------
"Just think if every species had a different genetic code We would have to eat other humans to survive.." : Joe G

  
Dr.GH



Posts: 2333
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2009,22:25   

Quote (fnxtr @ Dec. 23 2009,16:11)
So did K'ung Fu-tzu.

So did Lao Tzu. And so did Bruce Lee Tzu who taught a K'ung Fu to Lew who became Kreem.

Edited by Dr.GH on Dec. 23 2009,20:29

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Quack



Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2009,06:49   

Quote
The clear text meaning in any translation was the expectation that it would occur within the current generation.

We also have Mark 9:1:
   
Quote
And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

It takes an inhuman effort to reconcile all the conflicting words of the Bible.
Floyd is desperate; he "knows" the truth but have hell of a job convincing himself as well as anyone else. I am afraid he is lost. His intellectual house of cards is a Damocles sword demanding a perpetual struggle for peace of mind.

Without studying to origins of the Bible, the who, when and why of the different, often contradictory texts, sorting out the more or less obvious forgeries, editions, cut-and-paste jobs, additions, deletions. What has been left out and why? Why just the four gospels; there were many others?

Don't remember, may have been Tertullian who felt the need of explaining: "There are no more, no less that four gospels because of the four corners of the Earth and the four principal winds." Convincing?
...
Both Pagan and Gnostic sources also deserve to be studied.

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
              Robert Byers.

  
Badger3k



Posts: 861
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2009,11:07   

Quote (Quack @ Dec. 24 2009,06:49)
Quote
The clear text meaning in any translation was the expectation that it would occur within the current generation.

We also have Mark 9:1:
     
Quote
And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

It takes an inhuman effort to reconcile all the conflicting words of the Bible.
Floyd is desperate; he "knows" the truth but have hell of a job convincing himself as well as anyone else. I am afraid he is lost. His intellectual house of cards is a Damocles sword demanding a perpetual struggle for peace of mind.

Without studying to origins of the Bible, the who, when and why of the different, often contradictory texts, sorting out the more or less obvious forgeries, editions, cut-and-paste jobs, additions, deletions. What has been left out and why? Why just the four gospels; there were many others?

Don't remember, may have been Tertullian who felt the need of explaining: "There are no more, no less that four gospels because of the four corners of the Earth and the four principal winds." Convincing?
...
Both Pagan and Gnostic sources also deserve to be studied.

I'm surprised he hasn't used the "Wandering Jew" apologetic - that was the origin of that myth, so that the medieval apologists could say that there was one who heard and was made immortal so that the "prophecy" could be fulfilled.

--------------
"Just think if every species had a different genetic code We would have to eat other humans to survive.." : Joe G

  
FloydLee



Posts: 577
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 04 2010,14:20   

Quote
There is now a Creation Letter Project in opposition to the Clergy Letter Project.


Thanks for the heads-up!  Been lookin' for some place like that to sign-up on.

FL

(Umm, if this post does not appear in the YEC News thread, that's because somebody has caused all my posts to re-direct to one specific thread no matter what thread I am "post replying" in.)

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 04 2010,20:27   

waaaah

that's because it's good to keep all the turds in one pile

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
Wolfhound



Posts: 468
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 04 2010,21:44   

And what a mighty collection of creoturds it is, too!



--------------
I've found my personality to be an effective form of birth control.

  
MichaelJ



Posts: 462
Joined: June 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 04 2010,23:53   

Pretty embarrassing for FL. He has ended up on a thread that he ran away from.

  
FloydLee



Posts: 577
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 12 2010,22:45   

The main debate thread is over for now, Michael.  I only use this thread on occasion.  Like today.

In the PT thread "A Theological Perspective..." by Matt Young, Rilke's Granddaughter asked:

<quote>But really - based on what you’ve posted that I can read, you’ve never made any attempt to discuss a topic in good faith.

Can you point me to a counter-example?</quote>

Yes.  Earlier in the thread, you made a blanket declaration:  "Unitarians are Christians."  I pointed out that such a blanket statement is wrong, and gave the reason why.  

At 4:48 pm today, one of your fellow evo-posters, David Fickett-Wilbar reluctantly (and with "great pain", he said) chose to agree with me, instead of with you.  This is on page 16 of the "Theological Perspective" thread, the very same page where you posted the above request to point you to a counter-example, less than 3 hours later.  (As if you were totally unaware of the existence of David FW's post, btw.  You have not replied to him at all, as of this writing.)

So yes, you now have a serious counterexample there for you to meditate on.  Perhaps, if that thread is now closed as I believe it may be, you will decide to offer your OWN "serious attempt" to respond to the comments offered to you?

FL



Thanks.

<quote>

  
midwifetoad



Posts: 4003
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,05:58   

Quote
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Annoyed Sports Radio Host: I'm looking for one brave Gators fan to call, just one. Oh so Gators fans talk trash all the time but when they play a game and lose nobody has the guts to call in?

Confused Sports Radio Call In: I'm a Gators fan.

Annoyed Sports Radio Host: And what do you have to say?

Confused Sports Radio Call In: You said that Gators fans don't have the guts to call in.

Annoyed Sports Radio Host: Your point?

Confused Sports Radio Call In: My point is that I'm calling you now.


--------------
Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

  
FloydLee



Posts: 577
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,08:38   

Not sure what your point is, but my purpose in posting that is specific  and twofold:

(1) If RG herself sees it, she'll know that her specific question, (which was addressed to me), was answered despite the closure of the PT thread.

(2) If she does not see the post, but repeats the same question on the same issue in a future PT thread, I'll already have this response ready to copy and paste.

That's all!

  
Doc Bill



Posts: 1039
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,08:48   

Quote
I'll already have this response ready to copy and paste.


It's what you do (only) best, FL.

Thinking, not so much.

  
FloydLee



Posts: 577
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,09:21   

Whatever, Doc. Didn't see you doing much of anything in the "Theological Perspective" PT thread.    :p

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3668
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,09:33   

Quote (FloydLee @ April 13 2010,09:21)

FL, you ever figure out why ID isn't science and therefore can't be taught in public schools?

I mean, you just skipped that whole half of your initial debate thread.  I'm hoping that you figured it out.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
FloydLee



Posts: 577
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,11:11   

Hey, we spent quite a few pages showing why ID is science, remember?  AND.....you also remember that it wasn't me who ended that thread.  

You'll have to talk to the guy who pulled the plug.  He must'a got tired or something.

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,11:13   

Quote (FloydLee @ April 13 2010,11:11)
Hey, we spent quite a few pages showing why ID is science, remember?  AND.....you also remember that it wasn't me who ended that thread.  

You'll have to talk to the guy who pulled the plug.  He must'a got tired or something.

"If not this therefore that" is not science, Floyd.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3668
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,12:35   

Quote (FloydLee @ April 13 2010,11:11)
Hey, we spent quite a few pages showing why ID is science, remember?  AND.....you also remember that it wasn't me who ended that thread.  

You'll have to talk to the guy who pulled the plug.  He must'a got tired or something.

No falsification
No hypothesis
No measurement
No independent review of data
(Oh wait... no data!)

All science so far.

Let's see what we do have:
A federal court case where the main player in ID cancelled
That case unambiguously decided that ID is religion
Multiple quotes from Dembski and other proponents of ID that ID is religous based
A new book every few years that is pretty much immediately fisked (am I using that word correctly) by real scientists within a few weeks
The main proponents of ID speaking at churches rather than science symposiums

All science so far.

I know you didn't end the thread Floyd.  My question is why you refused to talk about what you said you would.  You said that you would spend about a month talking about why ID is science.  You're start time came and went and you didn't shift gears.  As I recall, most of this time was spent showing you that the bible can't be taken literally.

You said you would do something and you didn't do it.  That's what I wanted to know.

Thanks

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
FloydLee



Posts: 577
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,13:17   

Quote
That case unambiguously decided that ID is religion


Unambiguously....?  Try "Incorrectly."

http://www.intelligentdesignnetwork.org/Remarks....609.pdf

  
FloydLee



Posts: 577
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 13 2010,13:29   

Quote
The main proponents of ID speaking at churches rather than science symposiums


I watched evolutionist Ken Miller give a lecture at a Presbyterian church about 4 or 5 years ago.  Therefore evolution isn't science, right?

  
  634 replies since Sep. 09 2009,12:17 < Next Oldest | Next Newest >  

Pages: (22) < ... 11 12 13 14 15 [16] 17 18 19 20 21 ... >   


Track this topic Email this topic Print this topic

[ Read the Board Rules ] | [Useful Links] | [Evolving Designs]