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  Topic: A Separate Thread for Gary Gaulin, As big as the poop that does not look< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 22 2014,16:48   

You will note [actually, of course you won't] that Avida is based on a sound theoretical basis.
Your software is not.

The distinction is stark.
Who's actually using your software?  What have they done with it?

And if your "theory" is so good, why have you never once been able to use it to explain any of the cases we've presented to you?

  
Texas Teach



Posts: 2084
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 22 2014,17:06   

Quote (NoName @ Dec. 22 2014,16:48)
Who's actually using your software?  What have they done with it?

He'll dive into it, when he'll have time.

--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
Wesley R. Elsberry



Posts: 4991
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 22 2014,18:03   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ Dec. 22 2014,16:27)
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Dec. 22 2014,08:14)
Gary:

 
Quote

their neural network models of "evolution"


That delivers a message of astounding ignorance, right there.

See the paper you linked me to, for the Avida based software you were working on. This sort of thing:

http://avida-ed.msu.edu/informa...._2.html

Gary doubles down on ignorant commentary.

--------------
"You can't teach an old dogma new tricks." - Dorothy Parker

    
Wesley R. Elsberry



Posts: 4991
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 22 2014,18:19   

That exchange shows that Gary is ready and willing to dismiss what he demonstrably has not a clue about.

--------------
"You can't teach an old dogma new tricks." - Dorothy Parker

    
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2014,07:08   

Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Dec. 23 2014,02:19)
That exchange shows that Gary is ready and willing to dismiss what he demonstrably has not a clue about.

Only doubles?

I nominate that for the atbc understatement of 2014.

In Gary's casino of life he is changing the billboard light bulbs to pay for his losses until 2099.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2014,11:31   

Yes, sadly Gary doesn't so much double-down as shift downward by Graham's number.  The real tragedy is that this has been going on for as long as it has, and to so little effect on this loon.

In early 2009, Gary Gaulin posted this version of the 'Introduction' to his “theory”:
     
Quote
Introduction

The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause[1] where multicellular intelligence such as ours is emergent from cellular intelligence, which is emergent from molecular intelligence, which is emergent from atomic behavior, which is emergent from subatomic behavior, which is emergent from a source currently unknown to science that must always be present for living things to exist else all molecular motion stops. From matter/energy itself comes increasingly complex behavior that molecularly self-assembles into learned and instinctual memory based intelligence that responds to environment by attempting to control it for its own design dependant needs.

The intelligence mechanism first needs something to control (motors, muscles, metabolic cycle) secondly feedback to gauge failure or success thirdly a memory to store sensory input and action taken then finally a fourth part where a random guess tries a new action. In molecular intelligence are genomes where change in coding is a guess. Either a "good guess" as in conserved domains being used in new combinations. Or a "random guess" as in replication errors that from-scratch would design conserved domains. Successful responses to environment remain in memory in the population (gene pool) to in turn keep going the billions year old cycle of life that through continual reproduction of previous state of genetic memory one replication at a time builds upon a previous design. A cladogram of resultant lineage thus shows a treeslike progression of adapting designs evidenced by the fossil record where never once was there not a predecessor of like design present for the descendant design to have come from.

Behavior of forces (polar force, etc.) that give matter its vitality internally to externally connect us to a progression of intelligent causation where there are two question marks at each end going both into and out of the same physical universe. Living things are hereby shown to be a created by levels of emergent intelligence that begins with nonrandom subatomic behavior then builds upwards to us.

Since this is much more cleanly written and much more coherent than his more recent efforts, I thought it might be worthwhile going through and pointing out some of the places he goes spectacularly wrong.
It also appears that he has not modified these views in any meaningful or substantive way.  He does not appear to have abandoned nor particularly modified any of the claims presented above or discussed here.
If I am wrong about that, I welcome Gary's constructive input as to what changed and what difference the change makes.  I submit that if he responds it all, it will be with changes that make no difference whatsoever to the actual claims embodied in his text.

By the end of sentence one we see that Gary is a vitalist and may plausibly be supposed to be a mythicist/supernaturalist.  There is no warrant to asserting that ‘molecular motion’ requires some source other than the existence of molecules and the general laws of physics and chemistry.
Brownian motion is the result of thermodynamic forces in aggregates of atoms and/or molecules, notably where there are size differences between the movers and the moved.  There is no need to imagine a ‘lower level’ from which the motion is sustained.

But of course without the delusion of this unknown ‘substructure’, Gary has no grounds for asserting intelligence emerging from lower and lower levels, without end.  This is the ‘intelligence all the way down’ notion Gary has thrown together from his poorly understood encounters with various sciences.

And as is so typical of Gary’s incoherent approach, he immediately takes it all back in his second sentence.  The first portion of his second sentence is lucid and correct — “From matter/energy itself comes increasingly complex behavior that molecularly self-assembles…”  It gets a bit clumsy in the last two words, it would be better simply as ‘assembles’, but it is clear here that he is claiming that matter/energy suffice to generate increasingly complex behavior.  Standard model science and entirely uncontroversial.

But then he goes badly off the rails by asserting “self-assembles into learned and instinctual memory based intelligence that responds to environment by attempting to control it for its own design dependant needs.”  This is an appalling mess of assuming one’s conclusions and asserting a host of facts distinctly not in  evidence.  It is simply incorrect to claim that molecules as such learn or have ‘instinctual behavior’.  As is too often the case, Gary ignores scale and wants to assert that because intelligence is only found in material beings, that is, assemblies of assemblies (of assemblies…) of molecules, that molecules as such are intelligent.  Yes, Gary, learning and instinct only occur in beings made up of molecules.  This in no way warrants asserting that molecules learn or display instinctual behavior.  What learns, what displays behavior of any sort are not the molecules but the structure they make up.  We know this not least because the structures persist across a host of changes at the molecular level.  The structures display a dynamic identity that is not tied to the specific molecular entities which initially aggregated, through whatever mechanism, into the structure in question.  We should also take note, as Gary is unlikely to see this on his own, that this too is a layered organization.  The structures at a higher level, where higher means composed out of perhaps only slightly less structured assemblies, are to some varying degree insensitive to the replacement of their sub-assemblies.  

Gary wants to simplify all this down and sweep all the problems under the rug by claiming it is all ‘emergent’, as if that explained anything at all.  “Emergent” is the description, not the cause and not the  explanation.

The problem of emergence is how new behaviors, unknown at and often if not always unpredictable in principle from lower levels, spring into being as lower level entities aggregate into higher level entities. Again, we caution that ‘lower’ and ‘higher’ are merely quasi-measurement of the relative degree of aggregation at the various ‘level’s.  From subatomic particles to atoms to molecules to polymers, suspensions, solutions, etc., to cells, to cellular systems, to organs, to biological entities from the single-celled to the multi-cellular and on up to animals, including humans, we have levels of increasing organization where the specifics of the organization switch scales and we focus on the aggregate organization rather than the participatory elements.

Gary dearly loves collapsing all this in lieu of solving the problematic it exposes.  And no wonder -- it's a hard problem, a very hard problem.  Gary is simply not up to and so must rely on desperate pretense and hand-waving.
Terence Deacon, especially in Incomplete Nature is a good counter to this particular absurdism.

But we must not overlook the additional sleight-of-hand move Gary makes here.  Specifically, his allusion to “respond[ing] to environment by attempting to control it for its own design dependant needs.”  Molecules have no needs and no capability of responding in terms of control.  These are emergent phenomena that do not obtain at the level of atoms and individual molecules.  They emerge at quite high levels far removed from the simple physics and chemistry that rule at the molecular level.  Gary here smuggles purpose, intent, and responsiveness to an environment into his “theory” with full intent to make use of those concepts regardless of where along the chain of complexity he happens to be wibbling.  Gary is not good at attention to detail, nor is he sensitive to, if even aware of, scale effects.

Gary loses it entirely in the first portion of his third sentence, the start of his second paragraph.  No more need be said to disqualify the entirety of his efforts than this:
“The intelligence mechanism first needs something to control (motors, muscles, metabolic cycle) “.  This rules out a host of phenomena widely if not universally taken to be signs of intelligence, acts of intelligence.  His “theory” can be judged a failed attempt at the moment he ties intelligence to motor control.

Gary's entire '4 level' or '4 element' schematic for intelligence fails in every way when considering intelligence as expressed in the form of the recognition of a missing note from a melody transposed to a different key and played a different tempo than that learned by the person who can nonetheless identify that there is a note missing.
Each of his spurious requirements explodes into irrelevance and falsehood under the assault of this one example.

It is as if having heard of intelligence, and AI, and computer programs, and robotics, he decided that robotics was the answer to the problems of emergence and intelligence.
No serious researcher could possibly entertain such notions for long except perhaps with psychoactive chemical assistance.  Counter-examples abound, and Gary has fled from even considering them each time they have been raised.

Gary compounds his errors and laughable absurdities by embedding the process of guessing as an undifferentiated primitive with alleged explanatory power for change in time and/or circumstances by the process of intelligence.  He goes so far as to assert that molecules guess when/where/how to bind, that species guess when/where/how to mutate, and yet that ‘guess’ is primitive, not to be further explicated nor elaborated on.

Utter nonsense, and sufficient to render his alleged explanation nonsense by virtue of circularity — guessing is a function of intelligence, not a sub-element within the process of ‘intelligence’ despite Gary’s assertions to the contrary.  As always, Gary is either smuggling his answers into this premises, sweeping the genuine problems under the rug of  his logorrhea, or simply contradicting himself and/or the facts known to obtain in the real world.

The generous, especially those not yet exposed to the entirety of Gary’s blunderful world of gibbering nonsense, may be tempted so suspect that I’ve been engaging in hyperbole, that surely Gary could not be so risibly inept as to be proposing what I claim he is proposing.

The final paragraph quoted above puts paid to any such notion.  Gary quite explicitly asserts “Living things are hereby shown to be a created by levels of emergent intelligence that begins with nonrandom subatomic behavior then builds upwards to us.”

It is critical to his assemblage of verbiage miscast as a ‘theory’ that intelligence pervade reality from the lowest most fundamental and least “structured” layer to the highest reaches of assemblies of assemblies of …(of assemblies…).  Yet intelligence, taken as cause of these layers and the emergence of such things as intelligence is inherent or it couldn’t emerge.  Yes, Gary truly is that insane.  Intelligence is omnipresent, always and everywhere 'just there'.  At the same time, intelligence emerges.  Emerges from what?  Gary neither knows nor cares, it just emerges from what was always already there, which includes that which emerges.  (Later, after mis-learning a tiny bit more science, he will abuse the term 'fractal' and the term 'self-similar' to further obfuscate his claims in service of explaining them.  Of course, this compounds his errors, for emergence and self-similarity are contraries when applied to the same thing at the same time.)

Looking at his “theory” after 5+ years of polish and modification improves matters not at all.  If anything, Gary’s ability to be fairly clear and coherent has been suppressed in his ongoing attempt to maintain his original claims at all cost while perverting the text so as to make any clear assessment of what he is, in fact, asserting or claiming increasingly difficult.
Worse, he will never, ever, under any circumstances, engage with the substance of any challenge raised against his assertions, claims, counterfactuals, violations of logic or meaning.

Gary, as is his habit, is likely to once again raise the challenge "Oh, yeah, where's the competing theory?" as if his rubbish doesn't fall on its own (lack of) merit.
But to hand him an answer -- the competing theory is in the work of Terence W. Deacon, referenced above.  Incomplete Nature is the title and it is readily available, both for purchase and from well-stocked library systems.
Until and unless he can provide at least this level of critique of Deacon's work, there's the "competing theory".  Not only does Gary's effluent fail, other work is available to do what it attempts and more, without the reek of failure embedded in his nonsense.

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2014,12:02   

Quote (NoName @ Dec. 23 2014,12:31)
Since this is much more cleanly written and much more coherent than his more recent efforts,

i've always been of the belief that gary starts with a fairly simple sentance, then, in an attempt to make it somehow resistant to quote-mining, he goes back and adds little precision details in an iterative process, but thanks to bad punctuation it bones the grammar up. That's how i used to emulate him.

   
JohnW



Posts: 3217
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2014,12:28   

Quote (stevestory @ Dec. 23 2014,10:02)
Quote (NoName @ Dec. 23 2014,12:31)
Since this is much more cleanly written and much more coherent than his more recent efforts,

i've always been of the belief that gary starts with a fairly simple sentance, then, in an attempt to make it somehow resistant to quote-mining, he goes back and adds little precision details in an iterative process, but thanks to bad punctuation it bones the grammar up. That's how i used to emulate him.

I think it's less complicated than that.

I think his "theory" came to him in a flash of (for want of a better word) inspiration.  It's blindingly, crashingly obvious to him, and surely this ought to be recognized as a phenomenal, Nobel-worthy breakthrough.  

So if everyone else thinks it's nonsense, the problem isn't that it's nonsense.  It's that it needs rewording.  So he rewords it.  Everyone still thinks it's nonsense.  So he rewords it, with qualifiers, digressions and supplementary detail.  Everyone now thinks it's not just nonsense, but incoherent nonsense.  So he rewords it...

Lather, rinse, repeat for five years.

--------------
Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers

There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

  
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2014,12:51   

I'm gonna have to go with JohnW on this one.  Not least because it avoids having to grant that Gary has ever once managed to detect, let alone add, 'precisions' to anything ;-)

But I think John's perspective offers real explanatory power.  Blinding flashes of "insight" tend to be missing the details and the power of the 'blinding flash' tends to obscure the need for details.  
So yes, the problem is we "just don't get it" and insofar as it's up to Gary to do anything about that, it must be just more wordsmithing.  So the descent into madness is accompanied by a descent into gibberish.

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2014,13:18   

Sure he does.


The centrosome is a trehaub type circuit which displays intelligence (motor addressing etc)

is kinda vague, whereas

The centrosome is an as it were trehaub type circuit which here displays intelligence (motor addressing etc)

is way more precise. Any Real-Scientist (not this being the forum for which that were for, is) can see, with how it fits into The Theory, for all K-12 science to need, for progressing.

   
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2014,13:20   

Needs more comas.

Oh, wait, it's possible that's a typo  :D

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2014,23:11   

Quote
One of the complaints about peer review — a widely used by poorly studied process — is that it tends to reward papers that push science forward incrementally, but isn’t very good at identifying paradigm-shifting work. Put another way, peer review rewards mediocrity at the expense of breakthroughs.

A new paper in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (PNAS) by Kyle Silera, Kirby Leeb, and Lisa Bero provides some support for that idea.

http://retractionwatch.com/2014.......s-study


--------------
The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2014,06:42   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ Dec. 24 2014,07:11)
Quote
One of the complaints about peer review — a widely used by poorly studied process — is that it tends to reward papers that push science forward incrementally, but isn’t very good at identifying paradigm-shifting work. Put another way, peer review rewards mediocrity at the expense of breakthroughs.

A new paper in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (PNAS) by Kyle Silera, Kirby Leeb, and Lisa Bero provides some support for that idea.

http://retractionwatch.com/2014.......s-study

sic Gary look it up.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2014,07:16   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ Dec. 24 2014,00:11)
Quote
One of the complaints about peer review — a widely used by poorly studied process — is that it tends to reward papers that push science forward incrementally, but isn’t very good at identifying paradigm-shifting work. Put another way, peer review rewards mediocrity at the expense of breakthroughs.

A new paper in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (PNAS) by Kyle Silera, Kirby Leeb, and Lisa Bero provides some support for that idea.

http://retractionwatch.com/2014.......s-study

What does this have to do with any of what has been discussed over the last 10 or so pages?

Oh, right, you wanted to provide a perfect example of your 'distraction and deflection' maneuver.

Why do you never speak to any of the content of any of the reviews of your work?  Is it sufficient that it is perfect in your eyes, and only your eyes?  In which case, why share it around?

You'll note that this is related to, but distinct from, the question of why your behavior never changes.  Same now as it was six years ago, you post, you get rejected, you post some more, you get more rejection, you attempt distraction and deflection, you get more rejection, repeat.
Shouldn't you be guessing a new approach?  Or are you getting exactly what you want?  Or, could it be, you don't count as 'intelligent'?

  
Woodbine



Posts: 1218
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2014,08:27   

I think he's just pulling a Dembski - issuing excuses as to why he's circumventing peer review.

Gary, have you considered creating your own journal?

Edited by Woodbine on Dec. 24 2014,14:27

  
Wesley R. Elsberry



Posts: 4991
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2014,11:29   

"Journal of Here"?

--------------
"You can't teach an old dogma new tricks." - Dorothy Parker

    
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2014,12:13   

lol

   
N.Wells



Posts: 1836
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2014,14:45   

Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Dec. 24 2014,11:29)
"Journal of Here"?

Journal of Challenge-for All K-12 Simple Real-Science, Here with Highest possible PSC 5 Globes Excelllent Rating until the usual creepy political activist bullies only vandalized its rating which was then 2.5 globes but since it was obvious to the reviewers/judges that they were just creepy bullies causing trouble their votes were disqualified from Awards Judging Journal.

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2014,14:55   

K.e.. Stands and claps. 9.2 globes sir.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2014,23:33   

Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Dec. 24 2014,11:29)
"Journal of Here"?

I don't know. It seems to me like I already have that. I can even keep my notes "Here".

--------------
The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 25 2014,05:38   

I thought I would have nothing under the science tree for you to play with for Christmas. But Christmas was like saved by my discovering something very simple that makes electronic neuron design child's play!

Where I left off (in this thread) I needed to set the power supply and bias voltages for the "Mathematical Model and Equivalent Circuit of Neuron" circuit. At that point it seemed best to start from scratch.

The biology basics of "Voltage-Gated Channels and the Action Potential" led to the realization that the two channels shown in this video are each electrically the same to a transistor, or opamp. The membrane conducts the "Base" signal that turns on the sodium channel/pump allowing current to flow inward, which in turn generates a voltage spike that causes the potassium channel/pump to turn on restoring the system back to its starting state:
http://highered.mheducation.com/sites......al.html

With that simple process well in mind there was only one circuit in all of electronics like this, a simple "Flip-Flop"! Not only that its inherently an "Astable Multivibrator", which means that neither state is normally controlled. This would explain why during experiments neurons that are damaged beyond repair go into free running Astable Multivibrator mode. Over a loudspeaker it's a loud screaming sound that lasts for some time, then complete silence for good after that.

To run the files I made sure to have here by now see "Circuit simulation in LTSpice" video for what to install for your operating system to automatically startup ".asc" files in LTspiceIV.

On the left is shown the a standard circuit for an astable flip-flop. Component values selected to represent the larger capacitance of the entire membrane and smaller capacitance for the short pulse duration of each neuron spike.

On the right is the only thing that needs to be done to control it, simply not give the membrane associated bias resistor less than full supply voltage!


https://sites.google.com/site.......een.png

The files are:
FlipFlopAstable.asc
FlipFlopMonostable.asc

Anyway, if the only thing you got for Christmas was a day off work then you at least have that to have science fun with!
Ho! Ho!! Ho!!!

--------------
The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 25 2014,07:18   

Yet another Gary plop with no science.  Yes, he does manage to squeeze in some engineering and technology, but no science.  The engineering and technology are pretty antiquated, too -- the op amp circuit was designed/discovered in the middle of the last century.  The transistor even earlier.

Where the rest of us left off in this thread is with a proof that your approach is fatally self-contradictory and thus inherently and unavoidably wrong.
This renders the rest of your efforts here entirely irrelevant.  Until and unless you rectify the fundamental flaws in your approach, you will never rise above the level of risible pseudo-science.
You were even presented with an alternative to your "theory" and so our work here should be done.  Yours certainly is, regardless of how much further effort you put into distracting yourself from that fact.

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 25 2014,08:27   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ Dec. 25 2014,13:38)
I thought I would have nothing under the science tree for you to play with for Christmas. But Christmas was like saved by my discovering something very simple that makes electronic neuron design child's play!

Where I left off (in this thread) I needed to set the power supply and bias voltages for the "Mathematical Model and Equivalent Circuit of Neuron" circuit. At that point it seemed best to start from scratch.

The biology basics of "Voltage-Gated Channels and the Action Potential" led to the realization that the two channels shown in this video are each electrically the same to a transistor, or opamp. The membrane conducts the "Base" signal that turns on the sodium channel/pump allowing current to flow inward, which in turn generates a voltage spike that causes the potassium channel/pump to turn on restoring the system back to its starting state:
http://highered.mheducation.com/sites......al.html

With that simple process well in mind there was only one circuit in all of electronics like this, a simple "Flip-Flop"! Not only that its inherently an "Astable Multivibrator", which means that neither state is normally controlled. This would explain why during experiments neurons that are damaged beyond repair go into free running Astable Multivibrator mode. Over a loudspeaker it's a loud screaming sound that lasts for some time, then complete silence for good after that.

To run the files I made sure to have here by now see "Circuit simulation in LTSpice" video for what to install for your operating system to automatically startup ".asc" files in LTspiceIV.

On the left is shown the a standard circuit for an astable flip-flop. Component values selected to represent the larger capacitance of the entire membrane and smaller capacitance for the short pulse duration of each neuron spike.

On the right is the only thing that needs to be done to control it, simply not give the membrane associated bias resistor less than full supply voltage!


https://sites.google.com/site.......een.png

The files are:
FlipFlopAstable.asc
FlipFlopMonostable.asc

Anyway, if the only thing you got for Christmas was a day off work then you at least have that to have science fun with!
Ho! Ho!! Ho!!!

Yes here folks you first it heard teh Gualin Gallop. Dodge, divert, dribble and dive. Half assery to teh max. Old spice with a twist of bluster mixed with dead DJs FCC depository records.

A man on a mission to nowhere with so much time on his hands he gets paid less than a cleaner.

No science for you Gary.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 25 2014,08:35   

It's beyond funny how Gary took care to present the circuits and take credit for them.  These circuits are old new and can be found in analog logic reference and training materials from the 70's and 80's and likely long before.

So instead of actually accomplishing something, Gary re-invented the wheel.  Worse, he seems to conceive of it solely in its role as barbell weight.
He then moves on to use the wheel-as-barbell-weight to model pyramidal battleship maneuverability in a vacuum.

If he had any skill as a researcher at all, he could find volumes of work done on modeling nerves and [small and simple] nerve complexes with transistors and op amps.  The relevant fields abandoned that whole approach as a blind alley decades ago.  So far Gary, this is cutting-edge brand new and a revelation to the ignorant masses [everyone else] who never noticed these possibilities.

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 25 2014,08:49   

Quote (NoName @ Dec. 25 2014,16:35)
It's beyond funny how Gary took care to present the circuits and take credit for them.  These circuits are old new and can be found in analog logic reference and training materials from the 70's and 80's and likely long before.

So instead of actually accomplishing something, Gary re-invented the wheel.  Worse, he seems to conceive of it solely in its role as barbell weight.
He then moves on to use the wheel-as-barbell-weight to model pyramidal battleship maneuverability in a vacuum.

If he had any skill as a researcher at all, he could find volumes of work done on modeling nerves and [small and simple] nerve complexes with transistors and op amps.  The relevant fields abandoned that whole approach as a blind alley decades ago.  So far Gary, this is cutting-edge brand new and a revelation to the ignorant masses [everyone else] who never noticed these possibilities.

Dead as an Heatkit analogue AI computer.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 25 2014,08:49   

Double vacuum battleship vacuum post.

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"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 25 2014,09:07   

Surely it lives, and is merely pining for the fjords?

Give it a good whack on the counter there, that will wake it right up!

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 26 2014,06:15   

The typos were caused by a serious case of sleep deprevation. Instead of having it posted here by midnight (so I could finally get some sleep) I was still working on it past 7 AM in the morning. And I also had to be at my dad's house at noontime for the Christmas Day celebration!

I ended up having to post what I had before fussing with it even more made it even worse! That happens when I am having trouble staying awake. It's more or less normal for all people. In my case writing abilities are gone before the math and engineering related areas of my brain likewise call it quits. So thankfully I was able to get the circuits just right and well labeled but I badly needed at least a few hours of sleep before being able to properly form sentences.

Whatever I wrote seemed good enough to explain what it is in what Wesley wants to name the "Journal of Here" where all final editing is done AFTER getting what is most important is here published online for others to experiment with. So make that "simply not give the membrane associated bias resistor less than full supply voltage!" And in a case like that the scholarly venture depends on submissions being "As big as the poop that does not look" but thanks to ID we're all set, here.

After searching using Google and Google Scholar I found papers for novel multivibrator/flip-flop networks and making flip-flops using neurons, but not this exactly where one neuron is being modeled. It is possible that others tried it too. That though does not change the fact that this circuit was found by starting with how Na+ and K+ channels work together to generate pulses, to figure out what its most Occam's razor simple representative circuit looks like. Something similar is then evidence that it's true, not reason to dismiss the information as important.

I will next try to make the circuit even more representative of biology and versatile by simplifying the schematic even more.

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 26 2014,07:26   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ Dec. 26 2014,07:15)
...
I will next try to make the circuit even more representative of biology and versatile by simplifying the schematic even more.

Nothing more clearly speaks to your ignorance and incompetence in this arena.

Biology is complex, not simple.
The schematic is not the circuit [ever heard of phantom capacitance?]
etc.

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 26 2014,07:30   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ Dec. 26 2014,14:15)
The typos were caused by a serious case of sleep deprevation. Instead of having it posted here by midnight (so I could finally get some sleep) I was still working on it past 7 AM in the morning. And I also had to be at my dad's house at noontime for the Christmas Day celebration!

I ended up having to post what I had before fussing with it even more made it even worse! That happens when I am having trouble staying awake. It's more or less normal for all people. In my case writing abilities are gone before the math and engineering related areas of my brain likewise call it quits. So thankfully I was able to get the circuits just right and well labeled but I badly needed at least a few hours of sleep before being able to properly form sentences.

Whatever I wrote seemed good enough to explain what it is in what Wesley wants to name the "Journal of Here" where all final editing is done AFTER getting what is most important is here published online for others to experiment with. So make that "simply not give the membrane associated bias resistor less than full supply voltage!" And in a case like that the scholarly venture depends on submissions being "As big as the poop that does not look" but thanks to ID we're all set, here.

After searching using Google and Google Scholar I found papers for novel multivibrator/flip-flop networks and making flip-flops using neurons, but not this exactly where one neuron is being modeled. It is possible that others tried it too. That though does not change the fact that this circuit was found by starting with how Na+ and K+ channels work together to generate pulses, to figure out what its most Occam's razor simple representative circuit looks like. Something similar is then evidence that it's true, not reason to dismiss the information as important.

I will next try to make the circuit even more representative of biology and versatile by simplifying the schematic even more.

Ye gods get a life moron. You have contributed zero to science other than to provide an example of how not to do it. Gary you need to realize you are just another example of a severely under educated underachiever with a ridiculously over inflated view of himself.

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"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
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