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  Topic: Travelling the gallaxy, an offshoot of the UD thread.< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 18 2008,13:25   

Quote (Lou FCD @ May 18 2008,18:27)
[SNIP]

Louis, I think calculating "the odds" is rather pointless until we have more information.  The sample size and our knowledge of the samples we have are just too incomplete yet.  Of course, I haven't made a correct statement on this thread yet, so why break the streak?

[SNIP]

Oh no, that sounds about right to me. Hence why I mentioned the Drake equation. Anyone familiar with the ructions surrounding it knows at least one reason for ignoring many discussions about "odds" (aside from all the other good reasons of course). The Drake equation is a good start for an assessment of what we need to know to know anything about odds at all.

Louis

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Bye.

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5455
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2008,10:21   

Quote (Louis @ May 18 2008,14:25)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 18 2008,18:27)
[SNIP]

Louis, I think calculating "the odds" is rather pointless until we have more information.  The sample size and our knowledge of the samples we have are just too incomplete yet.  Of course, I haven't made a correct statement on this thread yet, so why break the streak?

[SNIP]

Oh no, that sounds about right to me. Hence why I mentioned the Drake equation. Anyone familiar with the ructions surrounding it knows at least one reason for ignoring many discussions about "odds" (aside from all the other good reasons of course). The Drake equation is a good start for an assessment of what we need to know to know anything about odds at all.

Louis

Hey, I get a point, I get a point!

Forgive my inordinate happiness, this thread was beginning to make me feel like a perennially rejected teenager again.

---------

On another note, let me just inform everyone that it's safe to say that if you ask ten different physicists about the possibility of FTL and interstellar space travel, you're sure to receive (at least) twenty different and mutually exclusive, directly contradictory responses.  I think I'm going with a version of my original drive for the book, because it's A) easiest for me to write B) plausible enough to engender suspension of disbelief C) works best for my plot and most importantly D) doesn't require 15 years of physics education to understand and 500 pages to explain.

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I was wondering what the latest tardological pronouncements were on the whole "What if we discover intelligent aliens?" thing.  One of the various permutations of search parameters I force-fed Teh Google was 'aliens "original sin"'.

Google barfed up this.  I hate when a really good idea jumps the shark, then gets eaten by the shark, shit out by the shark, climbs back on the skis, and starts all over.

I loved the first two, but it's been all downhill from there.  AVP was mildly entertaining and amusing for the "Dracula vs. the Wolfman" value, but other than that, someone really just needs to euthanize the franchise.

Alien remains the single scariest book I've ever read, though admittedly I was like 10 or 12 when I read it.

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“Why do creationists have such a hard time with commas?

Linky“. ~ Steve Story, Legend

   
J-Dog



Posts: 4402
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2008,11:16   

Quote (Lou FCD @ May 19 2008,10:21)
Alien remains the single scariest book I've ever read, though admittedly I was like 10 or 12 when I read it.

As a True Member ™ of the Atheistic Darwinism Ebola Boy Brigade, I have to say that the Bible  is the scariest book I've ever read.  

It threatens to beat you up  and/or stone you here and now, and even tries to threaten you after you're dead.  

Reminds me of a bad Stephen King novel, or a zombie movie.

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Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5455
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2008,11:26   

Quote (J-Dog @ May 19 2008,12:16)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 19 2008,10:21)
Alien remains the single scariest book I've ever read, though admittedly I was like 10 or 12 when I read it.

As a True Member ™ of the Atheistic Darwinism Ebola Boy Brigade, I have to say that the Bible  is the scariest book I've ever read.  

It threatens to beat you up  and/or stone you here and now, and even tries to threaten you after you're dead.  

Reminds me of a bad Stephen King novel, or a zombie movie.

I stand corrected.

again.

ETA: Although technically, the Bible is an anthology of books and letters...

Edited by Lou FCD on May 19 2008,12:27

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“Why do creationists have such a hard time with commas?

Linky“. ~ Steve Story, Legend

   
guthrie



Posts: 696
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2008,11:50   

Quote (Lou FCD @ May 19 2008,10:21)
Forgive my inordinate happiness, this thread was beginning to make me feel like a perennially rejected teenager again.

I know an author or two, and I think it safe to say that many of them feel like that for years at a time.  One I know has taken a year or two to get over the fact that they have published his first book, and his second, and he's now at work on a third.

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2008,13:44   

Just a thought to add:

This is why cyberspace is better than real space. You make the rules.

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"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
RupertG



Posts: 80
Joined: Nov. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2008,16:35   

Quote (Richardthughes @ May 19 2008,13:44)
Just a thought to add:

This is why cyberspace is better than real space. You make the rules.

And that's why cyberspace is so much worse than real space for fiction - it's ridiculously easy to deus ex machina your way out of anything. Like the transporters and communicators on Star Trek, they seem real cool at first, but as a "Scotty, get my arse outta here" system they have to go wrong for dramatic purposes. A lot.

Incidentally, I dreamed up a space drive that doesn't need to throw any mass away, can work up to relativistic speeds and doesn't use any energy to translate to any velocity in free space. It only needs one tiny little bit of magic - something that can instantaneously reverse the directional vector of momentum (I tried picking apart relativistic and quantum momentum maths to see what breaks if you change the sign of v, but gave up. Quickly.).  

You're allowed one piece of magic in all but the very hardest SF, after all.

Imagine you accelerate an object in any way you like to an appreciable velocity, and then let it coast for time T1. Flip its direction 180 degrees and let it travel for T2. If T1 equals T2 it's back where it started. Flip it again. Make T1 = T2 = very, very, very small, and the object appears to just sit there. Then start varying the mark-space ratio, and it moves in the direction of whatever direction has the larger T - and in the absence of external acceleration or gravity or whatever, it carries on moving at a velocity proportional to the ration of T1:T2.

This means you can 'charge' up your object in situ anywhere you've got enough energy, and then bugger off at willl, especially if you bung in energy in all three axes. You'll use up energy getting out of gravity wells, but assuming your instantaneous velocity is high enough that won't be a problem. About the only issue i can think of (excepting the bit of magic) is that if you do charge up to a healthy fraction of c, your mass and time dilation will become annoying to you and those around you, but what that means when your local frame becomes very small... wibble.

But it makes for some interesting ways to go through space, from hovering ominously above peasants through to visiting Alpha Centuri, and suggests some rather spectacular failure modes/weaponry applications. You know what happens when a flywheel seizes...

I read a _lot_ of SF when I was young; less so now so I've missed a lot. I was just wondering whether anyone else has used this device? (Was rather annoyed when I found Larry Niven had stolen my idea for radioactive money that goes critical if you get too rich, and he'd had the bad taste to do so ten years before I'd had it. As it was the only original SF idea I've ever had, I found that unforgivable.)

R

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Uncle Joe and Aunty Mabel
Fainted at the breakfast table
Children, let this be a warning
Never do it in the morning -- Ralph Vaughan Williams

  
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