Joined: July 2007
|Quote (Occam's Aftershave @ Aug. 14 2018,20:21)|
|Quote (Joe G @ Aug. 14 2018,18:09)|
|Humans cannot be machines because dead people don't move.|
Cars are not machines because they use combustion, which is a process. The jury is still out on whether or not electric cars are machines.
This is the wisdumb of Neil Rickert
Actually it's just example #36534 of compulsive liar Joe Gallien drastically misrepresenting what someone else argued just to make his sorry fat ass feel better. Not unlike our moronic Orange Stain in the White House.
What Neil actually said about the question "are humans machines?" was
|"In any case, this argument is pointless. “Machine” is not defined precisely enough to settle the question on the basis of the definition. If you want to see a living system as a machine, that’s your choice. For me, it just doesn’t match what I expect of a machine."|
Wow, what a quote-mining asshole you are, timmy.
What Neil said, starting HERE
I countered with the accepted dictionary definitions, one that Neil had an issue with:
For example this definition: (1) an assemblage of parts that transmit forces, motion, and energy one to another in a [predetermined] manner
|With that definition, it seems a stretch to say that a living organism is a machine. I see an organism as a process or system of processes, rather than as an assemblage.|
A system of processes would be an assemblage- ** 2 : the act of [assembling] the state of being [assembled], which leads to ** 1 to bring together (as in a particular place or for a particular purpose)
And it remains that a process or system of processes needs a means of being carried out/ being implemented. It so happens that in living organisms that includes an assemblage of parts that transmit forces, motion, and energy one to another in a [predetermined] manner
We are clearly physical beings- the parts would be the organs, tissues, bones, systems etc., all assembled and working in a predetermined manner. All of the systems require an assemblage of parts that transmit forces, motion and energy one to another in a predetermined manner. The nervous system provides the voltage and the proper muscles with their supply of calcium (cat)ions respond to do the work. We are powered by electricity. Take away our (wet) electricity and all functions stop.
Even at the molecular level we see that, for example, ATP synthase is an assemblage of parts that transmit forces, motion and energy one to another in a predetermined manner. It isn’t a metaphor to call it a protein machine. You would have to invent new words that have the same meaning as the words we now use in order to describe what we observe in biology.
So no stretch required, Neil. Just an understanding of what is at play. Take a kinesiology course or two. Read an anatomy and physiology book- it isn’t any stretch at all to see that living organisms are an assemblage of parts that transmit forces, motion, and energy one to another in a [predetermined] manner. There really isn’t any other logical way of looking at them.
|A dead person, immediately after death, is the same assemblage of parts as before death. What has changed, are the processes.|
In any case, this argument is pointless. “Machine” is not defined precisely enough to settle the question on the basis of the definition.
If you want to see a living system as a machine, that’s your choice. For me, it just doesn’t match what I expect of a machine.
Stupid, dumbass argument- people die so they can't be machines. The word machine is precisely defined and science sees living things as machines and collections of machines.
|Anyway, for perspective, I’ll stick my neck out and say that an automobile is not a machine. It is mainly a machine, but not completely a machine. It’s operation depends on a combustion process, and that combustion process is not something that I would consider a machine.|
That process requires a machine. That process is what propels the machine and allows it to function as it was designed.
But anyway it figures that timmy hootie Horton would step in to try to defend such blatant ignorance. Morons supporting morons- it doesn't get any better than that.
Chromosomes. are. all. connected. It is one long polymer. Called the DNA. - oleg t
simple English (hint: "equal" and "interchangeable" aren't synonyms)- JohnW
"Genetic mutations are mistakes"- evolutionary biology
"Genetic mutations aren't mistakes"- Intelligent Design and Timothy Horton