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J-Dog



Posts: 4402
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 20 2013,18:01   

Quote (stevestory @ May 20 2013,17:36)
while I already have all 6 volumes of Modernist Cuisine in .pdf format, I just picked this up from the podunk local library by way of Interliberry Loan. It's huge and glorious.

Very interesting!  But it seems to me that your new treasure fits with your new diet plan like kairose "elliot" focus fits at a deep thinkers convention...

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Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
stevestory



Posts: 11089
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 20 2013,18:53   

Quote (J-Dog @ May 20 2013,19:01)
Very interesting!  But it seems to me that your new treasure fits with your new diet plan like kairose "elliot" focus fits at a deep thinkers convention...

I eat deliciously, actually, and on not much money. Steamed veggies, wonderful pastas with prosciutto matchsticks in a tomato gorgonzola sauce, chicken noodle soups with free range chicken and fresh herbs from the garden...the occasional gourmet burger with, say, goat cheese and slices of heirloom tomato and stone-ground mustard.

I like to eat well, I just have to not eat much. My constant-movement job and 2000 cals a day keeps me fitter than I was in my late 20's.

Really hoping the Black Krims start fruiting. Getting concerned.

   
franklin



Posts: 16
Joined: April 2013

(Permalink) Posted: May 20 2013,20:58   

Eating deliciously is key but it is pricy.  We get around that to a great extent by raising our own broilers, turkeys, and pigs with enough to supply friends at a price that covers our cost for the animals we keep.  While it doesn't cover the cost of my labor it works out to be pretty satisfying to supply 'the village' with quality products.  My wife also has a pretty large garden and far too big of a laying flock for just the two of us.  There is always someone who wants the extras and we donate a lot to the local soup kitchen as well.

I get a kick out of the 'free range' label which to me creates an image in the mind of a nice pastural setting with the chickens scratching around and eating bugs and grass and other stuff.  In reality it just isn't so!  

Broilers (cornish cross) make market size at 6-7 weeks of age (4.5-5.5 lbs dressed) and in that very short time of living will eat about 15 lbs (each) of a high protein diet (they convert at about 3 to 1 in weight of feed and if there isn't enough protein their legs won't support their fast growth and weight).  The only way I can exercise (aka free range my birds) is to put the feed at one end of the enclosure and the water at the other and I'm sure they don't behave any different in other settings.  

I do understand the concept of getting away from the 'factory' farming operations (well given the number of critters I raise I guess that's a moot point) and the quality of our product is certainly far superior than the average chicken, turkey or pork most people can get their hands on.  Paying a bit more to support that type of lifestyle is justified....to a point.  Some folks do get a bit nervous at Thanksgiving when I offer them a 40+ lb (dressed) tom turkey......some eventually get the hand of the idea of eating a half-turkey or letting me part it out for them to eat through the year and others like the novelty of the big bird if they have a oven it will fit into!  Nothing like a lightly brined turkey breast with a bit of smoke on it coming of the BBQ to get everyone hovering around the table.

I picked up some black russian tomato starts last year from a guy and I think they might have been the black Krims steve mentioned.  They were good but not as great as the Red zebra and some of the beef stakes we raised last year.  Regardless, snatching it off the vine in your garden always is a great thing for great flavor.  Currently gorging on fresh spinach, lettuce, radishes, and strawberries with the sugar snap peas a day or so away.  Ah well I'm rambling on too much here but a discussion of fresh quality food and what you can do with it always gets me going.

I've just started reading:  Medusa's gaze and vampires bite: The science of monsters by Matt Kaplan.  Can't say anything about it yet but I heard Matt on a NPR interview and the book sounded pretty interesting so I bought it.

  
stevestory



Posts: 11089
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 21 2013,15:26   

Quote (franklin @ May 20 2013,21:58)
I get a kick out of the 'free range' label which to me creates an image in the mind of a nice pastural setting with the chickens scratching around and eating bugs and grass and other stuff.  In reality it just isn't so!  

the lady i get the chickens from lives about 3 miles from me. The chickens, about a dozen or so at a time, run around eating bugs all day long. She's got about a 20' x 20'x fence for them. they are skinny, and a bit tough, but yummy.

   
stevestory



Posts: 11089
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 21 2013,15:32   

it's true that you can get expensive by eating well, no disagreement there. But if you're careful about shopping, and frankly don't eat much, it can be surprisingly affordable. In college I got hooked on BOGO (buy one, get one), and most of my food comes from that selection.

Plus, spending 20% more on your food is, in the long run, less expensive than a $100,000 triple-bypass surgery.

   
franklin



Posts: 16
Joined: April 2013

(Permalink) Posted: May 21 2013,17:47   

Quote (stevestory @ May 21 2013,15:26)
Quote (franklin @ May 20 2013,21:58)
I get a kick out of the 'free range' label which to me creates an image in the mind of a nice pastural setting with the chickens scratching around and eating bugs and grass and other stuff.  In reality it just isn't so!  

the lady i get the chickens from lives about 3 miles from me. The chickens, about a dozen or so at a time, run around eating bugs all day long. She's got about a 20' x 20'x fence for them. they are skinny, and a bit tough, but yummy.

likely she is raising either cockerels which are a byproduct of production for pullets (laying hens) which we used to get at the feed store for free.  They don't convert very well and as you said can be an workout for your dentition.  Or she may be raising a duel purpose breed (layers and meat production) which tend to get wee bit larger than something along the lines of a production red, Rhode Island red, or a barred rock breed.  They can be tasty no doubt but, IMO, can't hold a candle to a cornish cross raised properly.

I grew up eating farmyard bantam chickens when the flock over grew acceptable numbers.  A pain to butcher but everyone got their own half and they were tasty and a bit..well..chewy.

I ran into the same problem when I raised heritage turkeys (Narragansetts and Bourbons).  I loved the intense turkey flavor but folks were put off by the extra chew texture compared to the broad-breasted breeds.

That is great that you are supporting local production of meat and veggies.

  
franklin



Posts: 16
Joined: April 2013

(Permalink) Posted: May 21 2013,17:55   

Quote (stevestory @ May 21 2013,15:32)
it's true that you can get expensive by eating well, no disagreement there. But if you're careful about shopping, and frankly don't eat much, it can be surprisingly affordable. In college I got hooked on BOGO (buy one, get one), and most of my food comes from that selection.

Plus, spending 20% more on your food is, in the long run, less expensive than a $100,000 triple-bypass surgery.

It cost money (and from a production standpoint time) to produce high quality products for consumption.  There isn't anything wrong with that but lots of folks haven't been exposed to anything other than what is available in the major markets.

Eating frugally doesn't mean buying the cheapest but rather buying the best available (within reason).  For example I don't have a problem paying more $$ for veggies I'm not raising to someone at the local farmers market over what is in the grocery store.  Local production is harvested fresh and transport is minimal.  However, buying organic produce at the large-chain grocers is a waste of $$ (IMO) since much of the benefit has been lost due to longer transport, packaging, handling, and having to pick the produce at a less than optimum ripeness.

I agree with you that it is a much better deal being tastier and better for you in the short and long run.

  
stevestory



Posts: 11089
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 21 2013,17:56   

Well, a recent preoccupation of mine is the unsustainability of basically everything about human civilization. I don't think there's a fix, or I'd be an advocate, I think we're headed for a humongous collapse.

The local chicken thing is mostly because I've learned about how the big farms (smithfield, tyson, etc) operate, and it's horrific how chickens in the industrial farms live. I'm not the most ethical guy in the world, but that stuff sickened me, and I can't abide it.

   
stevestory



Posts: 11089
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 21 2013,18:02   

the heritage stuff is chewier, so I make chicken noodle soup. Cook anything long enough and it can get extremely soft. Throw in the herbs at the end IMHO.

   
franklin



Posts: 16
Joined: April 2013

(Permalink) Posted: May 21 2013,18:08   

I hear you, steve, and that is what set us on our path once we got our own little place back in 1980.  We do depend on commercial ag to provide the grains we need for our animal feed but we produce, by far, the largest portion of what we consume over a years time. It is a great lifestyle for us.

  
stevestory



Posts: 11089
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: May 21 2013,18:22   

that sounds fantastic. Wish you lived next door. (Although be glad you don't live in Lake City, Fla.)

   
Arctodus23



Posts: 322
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: May 22 2013,11:49   

I just finished reading, "Misquoting, Jesus". By Bart D. Erhman. A good read.  :)

--------------
"At our church’s funerals, we sing gospel songs (out loud) to God." -- FL

"So the center of the earth being hotter than the surface is a "gross
violation of the second law of thermodynamics??" -- Ted Holden

   
fnxtr



Posts: 2911
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 22 2013,16:08   

I've got two words for you, too, Card, and they're not "Happy Birthday".

--------------
"[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory

"Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

  
stevestory



Posts: 11089
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 22 2013,18:06   

That's the new thing, bigots complaining that they're being seen as bigots. See Maggie Gallagher, Fat Tony Scalia, etc...

Whenever I hear the term "protecting traditional marriage" I immediately hear "I'm a bigot" in my head because it's just such a bullshit excuse.

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 2167
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: July 22 2013,22:35   

I read "God's Demon" by Wanye Barlowe yesterday. It is a fantasy adventure story about a counter-rebellion in Hell. If you don't think about it it can be fun.

This morning, I finished
"Hitler's Professors: The Part of Scholarship in Germany's Crimes Against the Jewish People" by Max Weinreich, (1946, 1999 reissue YIVO Institute for Jewish Research). Excellent. It should be more widely known.

I started "What is Life: How Chemistry Becomes Biology" by "systems chemist" Addy Pross (2012 Oxford University Press), but it is a piece of shit. The guy hasn't read more than a dozen of the significant papers from just 10 years. Wasted money. So, instead I started  "The Heidelberg Myth: The Nazification and Denazification of a German University" by Steven P. Remy (2002 Harvard University Press). The first 30 pages are fairly good.

Edited by Dr.GH on July 22 2013,20:38

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
fnxtr



Posts: 2911
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 22 2013,23:41   

Quote (Dr.GH @ July 22 2013,20:35)
I read "God's Demon" by Wanye Barlowe yesterday. It is a fantasy adventure story about a counter-rebellion in Hell. If you don't think about it it can be fun.

Have you read Farmer's "Inside, Outside" or Moorcock's "The War Amongst the Angels"?

--------------
"[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory

"Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

  
Dr.GH



Posts: 2167
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: July 23 2013,02:28   

Quote (fnxtr @ July 22 2013,21:41)
Quote (Dr.GH @ July 22 2013,20:35)
I read "God's Demon" by Wanye Barlowe yesterday. It is a fantasy adventure story about a counter-rebellion in Hell. If you don't think about it it can be fun.

Have you read Farmer's "Inside, Outside" or Moorcock's "The War Amongst the Angels"?

I think I may have read them decades ago.  :)

   
midwifetoad



Posts: 4003
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: July 23 2013,09:32   

Quote (stevestory @ May 21 2013,17:56)
Well, a recent preoccupation of mine is the unsustainability of basically everything about human civilization. I don't think there's a fix, or I'd be an advocate, I think we're headed for a humongous collapse.

The local chicken thing is mostly because I've learned about how the big farms (smithfield, tyson, etc) operate, and it's horrific how chickens in the industrial farms live. I'm not the most ethical guy in the world, but that stuff sickened me, and I can't abide it.

There seems to be a conspiracy (or the unplanned equivalent) to make child rearing expensive. That seems to have reduced population growth in developed nations.

If I weren't a skeptic I'd think it's a deliberate policy.

--------------
Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

  
fnxtr



Posts: 2911
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 16 2013,13:12   

Bump.

--------------
"[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory

"Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5414
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 16 2013,13:38   

I read "The Selfish Gene" by Dawkins a month or two ago (the 30th anniversary edition). Man, was it a powerful read.

There was no gene for selfishness described, however, which I found odd since O'Leary had assured us all that was the thesis of the book, a few years back.

--------------
Lou FCD is still in school, so we should only count him as a baby biologist. -carlsonjok -deprecated
I think I might love you. Don't tell Deadman -Wolfhound

Work-friendly photography
NSFW photography

   
Woodbine



Posts: 1212
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 16 2013,14:40   

Just finished A Maze of Death by Philip K Dick.



It was OK but typically 'Dickian', i.e. a foundation of  interesting ideas groaning under the weight of terrible writing, implausible characterization and the author's own neuroses.

I've just started George Johnson's Fire in the Mind which looks much more promising. The blurb says....

 
Quote
Are there really laws governing the universe? Or is the order we see a mere artifact of the way evolution wired the brain? And is what we call science only a set of myths in which quarks, DNA, and information fill the role once occupied by gods?


Only read Chapter 1 but so far it's good.

  
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 16 2013,15:02   

Quote (Lou FCD @ Oct. 16 2013,20:38)
I read "The Selfish Gene" by Dawkins a month or two ago (the 30th anniversary edition). Man, was it a powerful read.

There was no gene for selfishness described, however, which I found odd since O'Leary had assured us all that was the thesis of the book, a few years back.

I've never been disapointed with Prof. Dawkins' writings. The only book of his I own and haven't read yet is "The Magic of reality"*. And I'm waiting for my copy of "The Selfish Gene".







*I went on a row with "The Greatest Show on Earth" and Prof. Ceiling Cat's "Why Evolution is True", so I fear TMOR might be redundant. Yet again, I might be proven wrong, and anyway it was bought for Ali to get more familiar with RD's writings. I'm finishing my re-re-re-reading of Pratchett's "Snuff" and getting down to it!

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
Woodbine



Posts: 1212
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 16 2013,15:46   

TMOR is a kids book, isnt it?

  
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 16 2013,15:58   

Quote (Woodbine @ Oct. 16 2013,22:46)
TMOR is a kids book, isnt it?

Young adults, from what I've gathered, but might be a kids book. I'll say more when I'm done with it.

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
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