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  Topic: The Discovery Institute Thread, Everyone's Favorite Propaganda Mill< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
JAM



Posts: 517
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 27 2010,02:01   

Quote (Glen Davidson @ July 01 2010,02:15)
There's a highly dishonest (perhaps too prejudiced and stupid to know what honesty is, but whatever) piece of slime on the Biologos forum who goes by the name of Rich, ...

Is that Rich Deem?

  
Wesley R. Elsberry



Posts: 4926
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 12 2010,07:08   

David Klinghoffer Gets an Education

Lauri Lebo provides the tutelage.

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"You can't teach an old dogma new tricks." - Dorothy Parker

    
J-Dog



Posts: 4402
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 12 2010,08:09   

Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Aug. 12 2010,07:08)
David Klinghoffer Gets an Education

Lauri Lebo provides the tutelage total spanking pwnage .


Excellent write up by Lauri, Wes.  Thanks for posting, and for you "onlookers" out there, the link Wes points to is an outstanding summary of the how and why ID is creationism and the how and why of the Discovery Institute's illegal shenanagins and attempts to get their brand of religion taught in science class.

Wes - BTW - Fixed That For You!

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Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
JLT



Posts: 740
Joined: Jan. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 14 2010,09:01   

The Disco'tute made a little video promoting their totally scientific book "God and evolution". And they're allowing comments at YouTube! There even is a complete moron active in the comments section with this killer argument:
Quote
I? did NOT ask for articles about evolution. I want to know WHO, WHERE and WHEN was the hypothesis of evolution tested. I want to know the probability.

Delicious!

--------------
"Random mutations, if they are truly random, will affect, and potentially damage, any aspect of the organism, [...]
Thus, a realistic [computer] simulation [of evolution] would allow the program, OS, and hardware to be affected in a random fashion." GilDodgen, Frilly shirt owner

  
JAM



Posts: 517
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 20 2010,19:13   

Quote (Glen Davidson @ July 01 2010,02:15)
There's a highly dishonest (perhaps too prejudiced and stupid to know what honesty is, but whatever) piece of slime on the Biologos forum who goes by the name of Rich, whose passive-aggressive nastiness is apparently allowed, while calling him on his constant dishonesty about others is not approved.

Rich is having another meltdown…

http://tinyurl.com/33lmgl3

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11110
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 21 2010,14:50   

Where's the islam?

http://www.evolutionnews.org/2010....71.html

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
JLT



Posts: 740
Joined: Jan. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 07 2010,08:00   

Meet Pakicetus, the Terrestrial Mammal BioLogos Calls a "Whale"
   
Quote
But these aren't the only marine mistakes on the page. BioLogos says regarding the evolution of whales:
       
Quote
Recently, a 52-million-year-old whale fossil, Pakicetus, was found in Pakistan. It was clearly a small, wolf-sized whale, but it did not have the characteristic fat-pad, a structure that allows the whale's jaw vibrations to be used for hearing. Also, its teeth were much like those of the terrestrial animals already thought to be related to whales.

Aside from the fact that Pakicetus was discovered in 1983, there's quite a bit more that should be said about this fossil. The claim that Pakicetus is a whale is a bit misleading, and depends on how you define "whale."Most of us think of whales as aquatic mammals. While Pakicetus is often claimed to be an ancestor of whales based on its ear-bones and other skull-bones, it was a terrestrial land mammal.
[snip]
Evolutionary thinking may force-fit this terrestrial mammal into being labeled a "cetacean," but by any standard definition of the term, it was certainly no "whale."  

Lasey Cuskin never fails to deliver.
BioLogos lists a few fossils that show the transition from land-living mammals to aquatic whales, with Pakicetus being the earliest, least whale-like one.
Lasey complains that they're calling it a whale because, presumably, modern whales (and other Cetaceans) are aquatic. To support this complaint, he cites Thewissen, who originally described Pakicetus:
 
Quote
Taken together, the features of the skull indicate that pakicetids were terrestrial, and the locomotor skeleton displays running adaptations. Some features of the sense organs of pakicetids are also found in aquatic mammals, but they do not necessarily imply life in water. Pakicetids were terrestrial mammals, no more amphibious than a tapir.

(J. G. M. Thewissen, E. M. Williams, L. J. Roe, & S. T. Hussain, "Skeletons of terrestrial cetaceans and the relationship of whales to artiodactyls," Nature, Vol. 413:277-281 (September 20, 2001).)

Terrestrial cetaceans = land-living WHALES, you idiot. The standard definition of whales is not "What looks like a whale to Casey Luskin".
I can't even begin to understand what amount of twisted "thinking" (for lack of a better word) must go on in the "brain" of someone like Luskin. As if it even mattered how we formally classify Pakicetus, when the important point is that it isn't a clear cut! Pakicetus had both features characteristic for land-living mammals AND for whales. That's the f*ing point.

/rant

--------------
"Random mutations, if they are truly random, will affect, and potentially damage, any aspect of the organism, [...]
Thus, a realistic [computer] simulation [of evolution] would allow the program, OS, and hardware to be affected in a random fashion." GilDodgen, Frilly shirt owner

  
Kattarina98



Posts: 1266
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 07 2010,08:26   

Quote (JLT @ Nov. 07 2010,08:00)
Meet Pakicetus, the Terrestrial Mammal BioLogos Calls a "Whale"
<snip>

Haha! Little Luskin is annoyed that Darrel Falk - who is the main author of the article - refused to "rumble" during "The Vibrant Dance".

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Barry Arrington is a bitch.

  
Timothy McDougald



Posts: 1030
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 08 2010,18:55   

This bit cracks me up. Notice how Casey defines whales:

Quote
The claim that Pakicetus is a whale is a bit misleading, and depends on how you define "whale." Most of us think of whales as aquatic mammals. While Pakicetus is often claimed to be an ancestor of whales based on its ear-bones and other skull-bones, it was a terrestrial land mammal. And its lack of a fat-pad is by no means its only decidedly non-whale characteristic. Pakicetus discoverer J.G.M. Thewissen reviewed many aquatic features of true whales and notes that "Pakicetids display none of these features."

Ear bones and skull bones similar to whales in a terrestrial animal. I wonder what that could mean.

--------------
Church burning ebola boy

FTK: I Didn't answer your questions because it beats the hell out of me.

PaV: I suppose for me to be pried away from what I do to focus long and hard on that particular problem would take, quite honestly, hundreds of thousands of dollars to begin to pique my interest.

   
MichaelJ



Posts: 462
Joined: June 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 08 2010,20:09   

Biologos must be becoming as bad as Judge Jones to Luskin. They put a big hole in the Evolution=atheism=Nazi theory.

I bet Casey's current wet dream is to be called to the new congress after they have dealt with those pesky Climatologists.

  
MichaelJ



Posts: 462
Joined: June 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 08 2010,20:21   

Biologos must be becoming as bad as Judge Jones to Luskin. They put a big hole in the Evolution=atheism=Nazi theory.

I bet Casey's current wet dream is to be called to the new congress after they have dealt with those pesky Climatologists.

  
Henry J



Posts: 4981
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 08 2010,21:08   

Quote
This bit cracks me up. Notice how Casey defines whales:

But does he provide a cetacean for his source material?

Henry

  
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4265
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 08 2010,21:18   

Quote (Henry J @ Nov. 08 2010,22:08)
Quote
This bit cracks me up. Notice how Casey defines whales:

But does he provide a cetacean for his source material?

Henry

Yes - consult the biolography.

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
sledgehammer



Posts: 533
Joined: Sep. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 08 2010,23:36   

Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Nov. 08 2010,19:18)
Quote (Henry J @ Nov. 08 2010,22:08)
Quote
This bit cracks me up. Notice how Casey defines whales:

But does he provide a cetacean for his source material?

Henry

Yes - consult the biolography.

He just keeps blubbering on about how it must all be a big fluke.

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The majority of the stupid is invincible and guaranteed for all time. The terror of their tyranny is alleviated by their lack of consistency. -A. Einstein  (H/T, JAD)
If evolution is true, you could not know that it's true because your brain is nothing but chemicals. ?Think about that. -K. Hovind

  
Henry J



Posts: 4981
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 09 2010,10:15   

Quote (sledgehammer @ Nov. 08 2010,22:36)
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Nov. 08 2010,19:18)
Quote (Henry J @ Nov. 08 2010,22:08)
 
Quote
This bit cracks me up. Notice how Casey defines whales:

But does he provide a cetacean for his source material?

Henry

Yes - consult the biolography.

He just keeps blubbering on about how it must all be a big fluke.

So you think he's telling a tall tail?

  
Texas Teach



Posts: 1609
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 09 2010,17:09   

Quote (Henry J @ Nov. 09 2010,10:15)
Quote (sledgehammer @ Nov. 08 2010,22:36)
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Nov. 08 2010,19:18)
 
Quote (Henry J @ Nov. 08 2010,22:08)
 
Quote
This bit cracks me up. Notice how Casey defines whales:

But does he provide a cetacean for his source material?

Henry

Yes - consult the biolography.

He just keeps blubbering on about how it must all be a big fluke.

So you think he's telling a tall tail?

He's definitely blowing something out a hole.

--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 09 2010,19:23   

Quote (Texas Teach @ Nov. 09 2010,23:09)
Quote (Henry J @ Nov. 09 2010,10:15)
Quote (sledgehammer @ Nov. 08 2010,22:36)
 
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Nov. 08 2010,19:18)
 
Quote (Henry J @ Nov. 08 2010,22:08)
   
Quote
This bit cracks me up. Notice how Casey defines whales:

But does he provide a cetacean for his source material?

Henry

Yes - consult the biolography.

He just keeps blubbering on about how it must all be a big fluke.

So you think he's telling a tall tail?

He's definitely blowing something out a hole.

You win the internet...

...and unfortunately a go on Arden's mum, but that can't be helped I'm afraid. She's on the internet alot, it's kind of inevitable.

Louis

--------------
Bye.

  
Timothy McDougald



Posts: 1030
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 09 2010,22:23   

Quote (Louis @ Nov. 09 2010,19:23)
 
Quote (Texas Teach @ Nov. 09 2010,23:09)
 
Quote (Henry J @ Nov. 09 2010,10:15)
   
Quote (sledgehammer @ Nov. 08 2010,22:36)
   
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Nov. 08 2010,19:18)
     
Quote (Henry J @ Nov. 08 2010,22:08)
     
Quote
This bit cracks me up. Notice how Casey defines whales:

But does he provide a cetacean for his source material?

Henry

Yes - consult the biolography.

He just keeps blubbering on about how it must all be a big fluke.

So you think he's telling a tall tail?

He's definitely blowing something out a hole.

You win the internet...

...and unfortunately a go on Arden's mum, but that can't be helped I'm afraid. She's on the internet alot, it's kind of inevitable.

Louis

Which brings us strait to sperm* - whale we are talking about arden's mum anyway...

(Edit to add: On a more serious note, apparently Casey has gone for a meaningless definition of whales (under his definition one can include seals, walrusses, and Richardthugs - at least while he is taking a bath) and has never heard of systematics. )

* Sorry, I'm normally not that bawdy but some of you are bad influences. Not naming names but you all know who you are.

--------------
Church burning ebola boy

FTK: I Didn't answer your questions because it beats the hell out of me.

PaV: I suppose for me to be pried away from what I do to focus long and hard on that particular problem would take, quite honestly, hundreds of thousands of dollars to begin to pique my interest.

   
midwifetoad



Posts: 3992
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,13:48   

“Darwin’s Dilemma” Case: Sudden Turnabout

http://sensuouscurmudgeon.wordpress.com/2010....rnabout

Quote
One of AFA’s allegations in all of its complaints is that the unauthorized press releases were from the Discovery Institute, which wasn’t a party to the film screening contract, so such activities didn’t justify the cancellation of the contract. On that point, the Cross Complaint says, in paragraphs 16 & 17 on page 5, that the AFA and Discovery Institute “consistently communicated and collaborated.” They mention an AFA communication to Discoveroid John West stating: “I would like to coordinate our efforts.” Then they mention a response a week later from Discoveroid Robert Crowther saying: “Before we begin aggressively promoting this …”

In paragraph 18 on page 6 they quote an email from West to AFA saying that the “national media might get interested because the California Science Center is the west coast affiliate of the Smithsonian.” Paragraph 19 quotes a Crowther email saying “Once we let the jinni [sic] out of the bottle it’s likely all hell will break loose.”



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Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11110
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,14:49   

Quote (midwifetoad @ Nov. 15 2010,13:48)
“Darwin’s Dilemma” Case: Sudden Turnabout

http://sensuouscurmudgeon.wordpress.com/2010....rnabout

Quote
One of AFA’s allegations in all of its complaints is that the unauthorized press releases were from the Discovery Institute, which wasn’t a party to the film screening contract, so such activities didn’t justify the cancellation of the contract. On that point, the Cross Complaint says, in paragraphs 16 & 17 on page 5, that the AFA and Discovery Institute “consistently communicated and collaborated.” They mention an AFA communication to Discoveroid John West stating: “I would like to coordinate our efforts.” Then they mention a response a week later from Discoveroid Robert Crowther saying: “Before we begin aggressively promoting this …”

In paragraph 18 on page 6 they quote an email from West to AFA saying that the “national media might get interested because the California Science Center is the west coast affiliate of the Smithsonian.” Paragraph 19 quotes a Crowther email saying “Once we let the jinni [sic] out of the bottle it’s likely all hell will break loose.”


Fantastic - and wonderfully ironic given the AFA were demanding copies of all communications..


http://www.evolutionnews.org/2009....81.html

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
midwifetoad



Posts: 3992
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,15:30   

Discovery can be a bitch.

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Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

  
Doc Bill



Posts: 1039
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,16:31   

Luskin had a gerbgasm over the "fact" that the California Science Center is a GOVERNMENT ORGANIZATION and therefor, ergo and lorum ipsum it was both a violation of Free Speech ™ and viewpoint discrimination to boot.

Both are bad, bad things but Especially Bad if done by a GOVERNMENT INSTITUTION.

Ahem, however, the moluskito failed to realize that the actual contract was between the AFA and the CSC Foundation, a private organization whose purpose was twofold:  raise private money for the CSC, and keep the CSC isolated from the kind of bullshit activities the DI specializes in.

Oopsie, can we say "My lawsuit fell apart and I can't get it up."

  
midwifetoad



Posts: 3992
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,17:08   

DI should hire some lawyers if they intend to pursue a bunch of lawsuits.

--------------
Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

  
midwifetoad



Posts: 3992
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,17:09   

What I meant to say is they should seek sound legal advice.

--------------
Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

  
Henry J



Posts: 4981
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,17:12   

Quote (midwifetoad @ Nov. 15 2010,16:09)
What I meant to say is they should seek sound legal advice.

Oh, you mean they need professional help?

  
Wesley R. Elsberry



Posts: 4926
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,17:38   

Told you so

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"You can't teach an old dogma new tricks." - Dorothy Parker

    
Doc Bill



Posts: 1039
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,19:15   

The Cross Complaint lays it out in wonderful detail.  So refreshing to see plain English instead of DI weaselish.

Joe Peterson of the AFA, the organization that contracted the CSC Foundation to show the film, wrote in an email:

Quote
Whomever at (sic) wrote the copy on the Discovery Institutes press releases should have his head examined ... I thought the problem was buried in the text of the documents ... NOT THE HEADLINES.  Talk about waving a red flag in front of a bull.  It seems like they were deliberately trying to screw this up!!!


Well, when you let the jinni out of the bottle, as Crowther put it, you tend to screw things up.

In the other legal documents available on the NCSE website is one that refers to dismissing the lawsuit because of "unclean hands."  IANAL, but that appears to imply that the DI screwed the pooch ... in public!

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11110
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,19:27   

Quote (Doc Bill @ Nov. 15 2010,19:15)
The Cross Complaint lays it out in wonderful detail.  So refreshing to see plain English instead of DI weaselish.

Joe Peterson of the AFA, the organization that contracted the CSC Foundation to show the film, wrote in an email:

Quote
Whomever at (sic) wrote the copy on the Discovery Institutes press releases should have his head examined ... I thought the problem was buried in the text of the documents ... NOT THE HEADLINES.  Talk about waving a red flag in front of a bull.  It seems like they were deliberately trying to screw this up!!!


Well, when you let the jinni out of the bottle, as Crowther put it, you tend to screw things up.

In the other legal documents available on the NCSE website is one that refers to dismissing the lawsuit because of "unclean hands."  IANAL, but that appears to imply that the DI screwed the pooch ... in public!

The Dishonesty Institute fabricates a notroversy? Colour me shocked!

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3668
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,22:03   

I still say there's a plant in the DI.  Someone is the ultimate poe by getting a job there and convincing them that these ideas are good ones.

"Hey, this looks like a discrimination case, we should sue."

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Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
fnxtr



Posts: 2769
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,23:13   

I think Mike Elzinga described them best as bumbling around "like drunken clowns".

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"But it's disturbing to think someone actually thinks creationism -- having put it's hand on the hot stove every day for the last 400 years -- will get a different result tomorrow." -- midwifetoad

"I am in a rush to catch up with science work." -- Gary Gaulin

  
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