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Richardthughes



Posts: 10762
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 04 2015,17:20   

Quote (Henry J @ Oct. 04 2015,11:32)
If words fail you, then try different words! ;)

Your position can't explain different words.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Texas Teach



Posts: 1508
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 04 2015,17:39   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 04 2015,17:20)
Quote (Henry J @ Oct. 04 2015,11:32)
If words fail you, then try different words! ;)

Your position can't explain different words.

Especially the words pygmies + dwarfs.



Edited by stevestory on Oct. 12 2015,17:30

--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3654
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 04 2015,18:48   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 04 2015,17:20)
Quote (Henry J @ Oct. 04 2015,11:32)
If words fail you, then try different words! ;)

Your position can't explain different words.

Does he still not understand that some words are information thick versions of other sets of words?

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
k.e..



Posts: 3898
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 04 2015,21:08   

Quote (OgreMkV @ Oct. 05 2015,02:48)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 04 2015,17:20)
Quote (Henry J @ Oct. 04 2015,11:32)
If words fail you, then try different words! ;)

Your position can't explain different words.

Does he still not understand that some words are information tick versions of other sets of words?

Fixed...

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
olegt



Posts: 1405
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 08 2015,16:54   

Vintage Joe:
 
Quote

wd400- How many papers are published tat support evolutionism?

And just where is unguided evolutionary biology? Evolutionary biologists can’t even answer any questions pertaining to how biological systems and subsystems evolved. Natural selection can’t even be modeled. Unguided evolution is a useless heuristic.

So here we are, with a useless heuristic and no answers. Nicely done.


The punctuation and a mistyped tat are just too familiar to ignore.

--------------
If you are not:
Galapagos Finch
please Logout

  
olegt



Posts: 1405
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 08 2015,16:59   

Oh, and this:
Quote
There isn’t any evidence that a mammalian inner ear evolved from a reptilian inner ear. There isn’t any evidence that a reptile can evolve into a mammal.


--------------
If you are not:
Galapagos Finch
please Logout

  
olegt



Posts: 1405
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 08 2015,17:09   

He even discusses his favorite subject with Zachriel!
Quote
So Zachriel proves, once again, that Zachriel doesn’t know jack about nested hierarchies and evolution.

And quotes one of his favorite authors – Knox. :D

"The Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal [is] a mindbogglingly stupid animal, it assumes that if you can't see it, it can't see you — daft as a bush, but very ravenous." (The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy)

--------------
If you are not:
Galapagos Finch
please Logout

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 10762
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 08 2015,18:02   

Quote (olegt @ Oct. 08 2015,17:09)
He even discusses his favorite subject with Zachriel!
 
Quote
So Zachriel proves, once again, that Zachriel doesn’t know jack about nested hierarchies and evolution.

And quotes one of his favorite authors – Knox. :D

"The Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal [is] a mindbogglingly stupid animal, it assumes that if you can't see it, it can't see you — daft as a bush, but very ravenous." (The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy)

You're late - and your dinners cold.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3654
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 08 2015,21:37   

Quote (olegt @ Oct. 08 2015,16:54)
Vintage Joe:
 
Quote

wd400- How many papers are published tat support evolutionism?

And just where is unguided evolutionary biology? Evolutionary biologists can’t even answer any questions pertaining to how biological systems and subsystems evolved. Natural selection can’t even be modeled. Unguided evolution is a useless heuristic.

So here we are, with a useless heuristic and no answers. Nicely done.


The punctuation and a mistyped tat are just too familiar to ignore.

My understanding is that some of the keys on his keyboard are rather... ummm... sticky.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Acartia_Bogart



Posts: 1146
Joined: Sep. 2014

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 11 2015,22:17   

Joey is testing Elizabeth's patience with his latest sock puppet at TSZ. A turd by any other name, will smell as sweet.

  
midwifetoad



Posts: 3992
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 12 2015,09:25   

Quote (Acartia_Bogart @ Oct. 11 2015,22:17)
Joey is testing Elizabeth's patience with his latest sock puppet at TSZ. A turd by any other name, will smell as sweet.

Elizabeth is fine. What I don't understand is why others are responding of Joey, or even reading his posts.

--------------
Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

  
Acartia_Bogart



Posts: 1146
Joined: Sep. 2014

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 12 2015,12:52   

Quote (midwifetoad @ Oct. 12 2015,09:25)
Quote (Acartia_Bogart @ Oct. 11 2015,22:17)
Joey is testing Elizabeth's patience with his latest sock puppet at TSZ. A turd by any other name, will smell as sweet.

Elizabeth is fine. What I don't understand is why others are responding of Joey, or even reading his posts.

I agree, but interacting with Joe is like picking at a scab. You know you shouldn't do it but occasionally you give into the urge. And then you regret it.

  
KevinB



Posts: 356
Joined: April 2013

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 12 2015,13:22   

Quote (Acartia_Bogart @ Oct. 12 2015,12:52)
 
Quote (midwifetoad @ Oct. 12 2015,09:25)
 
Quote (Acartia_Bogart @ Oct. 11 2015,22:17)
Joey is testing Elizabeth's patience with his latest sock puppet at TSZ. A turd by any other name, will smell as sweet.

Elizabeth is fine. What I don't understand is why others are responding of Joey, or even reading his posts.

I agree, but interacting with Joe is like picking at a scab. You know you shouldn't do it but occasionally you give into the urge. And then you regret it.

Relax, don't do it

  
Glen Davidson



Posts: 1047
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 12 2015,13:28   

Quote (KevinB @ Oct. 12 2015,13:22)
Quote (Acartia_Bogart @ Oct. 12 2015,12:52)
 
Quote (midwifetoad @ Oct. 12 2015,09:25)
   
Quote (Acartia_Bogart @ Oct. 11 2015,22:17)
Joey is testing Elizabeth's patience with his latest sock puppet at TSZ. A turd by any other name, will smell as sweet.

Elizabeth is fine. What I don't understand is why others are responding of Joey, or even reading his posts.

I agree, but interacting with Joe is like picking at a scab. You know you shouldn't do it but occasionally you give into the urge. And then you regret it.

Relax, don't do it

Oh, come now.

Glen Davidson

--------------
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p....p

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of coincidence---ID philosophy

   
Ptaylor



Posts: 1040
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 13 2015,03:02   

Quote (midwifetoad @ Oct. 13 2015,02:25)
 
Quote (Acartia_Bogart @ Oct. 11 2015,22:17)
Joey is testing Elizabeth's patience with his latest sock puppet at TSZ. A turd by any other name, will smell as sweet.

Elizabeth is fine. What I don't understand is why others are responding of Joey, or even reading his posts.

Poor ronery Joe. Even when he finds himself allowed back at TSZ he finds all his comments (18 in the last few days) have been moved to guano.
So ronery...

--------------
We no longer say: “Another day; another bad day for Darwinism.” We now say: “Another day since the time Darwinism was disproved.”
-PaV, Uncommon Descent, 19 June 2016

  
Soapy Sam



Posts: 659
Joined: Jan. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 13 2015,03:59   

Quote (midwifetoad @ Oct. 12 2015,15:25)
What I don't understand is why others are responding of Joey, or even reading his posts.

I wonder the same about Gaulin- and Monsieur ID-respondents here.

And look at this thread! Partly the art of the successful troll - I'll give Joey that much - and partly amusement.

Not sure he's any more a waste of time than 'fifth' or Erik though.

Edited by Soapy Sam on Oct. 13 2015,10:01

--------------
SoapySam is a pathetic asswiper. Joe G

BTW, when you make little jabs like “I thought basic logic was one thing UDers could handle,” you come off looking especially silly when you turn out to be wrong. - Barry Arrington

  
midwifetoad



Posts: 3992
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 13 2015,13:26   

Quote (Soapy Sam @ Oct. 13 2015,03:59)
Quote (midwifetoad @ Oct. 12 2015,15:25)
What I don't understand is why others are responding of Joey, or even reading his posts.

I wonder the same about Gaulin- and Monsieur ID-respondents here.

And look at this thread! Partly the art of the successful troll - I'll give Joey that much - and partly amusement.

Not sure he's any more a waste of time than 'fifth' or Erik though.

Fifth is a loon and a crank. He doesn't even understand 9th grade math.

Eric seems to have some sort of legitimate academic perspective, although I find it so boring that I quit reading.

Gregory is on a mission from God. Triumph, the insult God.

--------------
Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

  
Soapy Sam



Posts: 659
Joined: Jan. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 13 2015,18:54   

Quote (midwifetoad @ Oct. 13 2015,19:26)
Gregory is on a mission from God. Triumph, the insult God.

Indeed. Telling people they are shitheads is guaranteed to make them mend their ways.

--------------
SoapySam is a pathetic asswiper. Joe G

BTW, when you make little jabs like “I thought basic logic was one thing UDers could handle,” you come off looking especially silly when you turn out to be wrong. - Barry Arrington

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3654
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,07:52   

Joey just lost another sock puppet on my blog. He just cannot be polite for any length of time or refrain from using his stock phrases that he's so proud of.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Joe G



Posts: 2040
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,07:55   

Quote (OgreMkV @ Oct. 15 2015,07:52)
Joey just lost another sock puppet on my blog. He just cannot be polite for any length of time or refrain from using his stock phrases that he's so proud of.

Well Kevin, you just proved that you are a piece-of-shit coward. As if we needed more proof of that.

--------------
Chromosomes. are. all. connected. It is one long polymer. Called the DNA. - oleg t

Smilodon's Retreat is a place for ignorant cowards

Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims. (don't know why Ogre has that, but it fits IDists)

   
Joe G



Posts: 2040
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,07:56   

Quote (olegt @ Oct. 08 2015,16:59)
Oh, and this:
Quote
There isn’t any evidence that a mammalian inner ear evolved from a reptilian inner ear. There isn’t any evidence that a reptile can evolve into a mammal.

All that is true. So what is your problem, oleg?

--------------
Chromosomes. are. all. connected. It is one long polymer. Called the DNA. - oleg t

Smilodon's Retreat is a place for ignorant cowards

Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims. (don't know why Ogre has that, but it fits IDists)

   
Joe G



Posts: 2040
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,07:57   

Quote (olegt @ Oct. 08 2015,17:09)
He even discusses his favorite subject with Zachriel!
 
Quote
So Zachriel proves, once again, that Zachriel doesn’t know jack about nested hierarchies and evolution.

And quotes one of his favorite authors – Knox. :D

"The Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal [is] a mindbogglingly stupid animal, it assumes that if you can't see it, it can't see you — daft as a bush, but very ravenous." (The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy)

oleg, you have proven that you are ignorant of nested hierarchies so perhaps you should just shut up about them.

--------------
Chromosomes. are. all. connected. It is one long polymer. Called the DNA. - oleg t

Smilodon's Retreat is a place for ignorant cowards

Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims. (don't know why Ogre has that, but it fits IDists)

   
Joe G



Posts: 2040
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,08:06   

Ten years since Dover and undirected evolution still has nothing. It can't be modeled and offers no testable hypotheses.

All someone needs to do is pay a Dover school teacher to defy Jones and we can have it, again. Maybe this time we will get a judge who actually listens to the evidence and is not fooled by evoTARD lies and deception.

--------------
Chromosomes. are. all. connected. It is one long polymer. Called the DNA. - oleg t

Smilodon's Retreat is a place for ignorant cowards

Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims. (don't know why Ogre has that, but it fits IDists)

   
Joe G



Posts: 2040
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,08:09   

Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,08:05)
Quote (MrIntelligentDesign @ Oct. 15 2015,07:32)
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,06:32)
 
Quote (MrIntelligentDesign @ Oct. 15 2015,05:02)
   
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,04:42)
     
Quote
All animals are using/doing naturen to live, thus, they are animals.

Humans are using/doing intellen, thus, they are not already categorized as animals. but intelligent beings or IA.

Humans have instincts and intelligence.
Crows have instincts and NO intelligence.
Likewise for other animals - no intelligence.

That is the reason why you should differentiate if instinct and intelligence are the same or not since you are dis-agreeing with me...

False.  
You have not shown that crows operate solely by instinct and lack intelligence.  

The following are clear instances of learning and reasoning by any rational definition.  If we landed a probe on a distant planet and saw an alien doing these behaviors, there would be no question that we were seeing intelligent behavior.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....gP3Sw_8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....bHmuY04
http://www.lifebuzz.com/crows......s....ws
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....IttS9qg
http://www.sciencedaily.com/release....835.htm
http://www.cnn.com/2015.......studies
http://www.cracked.com/article....p2.html
Your sole objection is that you want a sharp dividing line to exist between humans and other animals, and you are determined to invent jargon and play word games in order to make a gradation look like a dichotomy.

I've watched and read all the links:

My goodness! That is not intelligence but only "instinct"! Maybe you will be surprised on how birds make their nests! You would probably call it "SUPERBIRD, HALLELUJAH!" Read my science book and see that you are totally wrong about intelligence...

Thank you for taking the time to watch the clips.
Note that I did not talk about nest building at all.

No reasonable definition of "instinct" covers the behaviors in those clips.  The ONLY way you can dismiss those as instinct is to be committed a priori to conclusions that make it impossible to do a rational analysis of the evidence.  Instinctive behavior means behavior that is preprogrammed, inherited, genetically hard-wired, and inflexible, and these behaviours are none of that.  They are clearly learned (and your use of "instinctive learning" is a monumentally stupid self-contradiction).  Even if we use your exceedingly silly and problematic idea of "it's instinctive if there are fewer than 1 (or 1.5) solutions per problem", tool use by crows clearly allows multiple solutions per problem.

   
Quote
I said that you are wrong since you could no longer answer that simple empirical evidence that I've shown
It is not clear that you have in fact shown any actual empirical evidence.

My goodness,

you need to be very careful in explaining reality since if you got a mistake and people died for that mistake, you cannot help them anymore... you cannot undo!

Now, as I said that I've opened all of your links but oh my goodness, even the bodily parts of every animals could be used as tools!

Now, if an animals used sticks or stones as tools, they used them since that are their instincts...some they did, some they don't..

but look at these pics from Google..do you think that these nests are products of intelligent agents like birds? They also used tools and used materials to build the nests!

https://www.google.co.jp/search?....h2LRgkE

Bird nests are largely instinctive and are not built with tools.  We know that they are largely instinctive because all birds build nests without learning how to do it, and nest style relates to genetic inheritance.  Bird nests are without doubt intricate and amazing, which is one of many reasons I said that bird instincts are sophisticated and can result in truly impressive behavior.

Also, no, by definition body parts don't count as tools unless they've been detached from the owner and are being used by somebody else.

Nonetheless, what I did show you are examples of learned behaviors, involving creating solutions to problems by using planning, reasoning, and symbolic thought.  Those are not instinctive behaviors by any rational definition of the term (therefore excluding your bizarre redefinition).

Saying something is "instinctive" is just another way of saying "we have no idea how they do it"

--------------
Chromosomes. are. all. connected. It is one long polymer. Called the DNA. - oleg t

Smilodon's Retreat is a place for ignorant cowards

Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims. (don't know why Ogre has that, but it fits IDists)

   
The whole truth



Posts: 1554
Joined: Jan. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,08:34   

Quote (Joe G @ Oct. 15 2015,06:09)
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,08:05)
Quote (MrIntelligentDesign @ Oct. 15 2015,07:32)
 
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,06:32)
 
Quote (MrIntelligentDesign @ Oct. 15 2015,05:02)
     
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,04:42)
     
Quote
All animals are using/doing naturen to live, thus, they are animals.

Humans are using/doing intellen, thus, they are not already categorized as animals. but intelligent beings or IA.

Humans have instincts and intelligence.
Crows have instincts and NO intelligence.
Likewise for other animals - no intelligence.

That is the reason why you should differentiate if instinct and intelligence are the same or not since you are dis-agreeing with me...

False.  
You have not shown that crows operate solely by instinct and lack intelligence.  

The following are clear instances of learning and reasoning by any rational definition.  If we landed a probe on a distant planet and saw an alien doing these behaviors, there would be no question that we were seeing intelligent behavior.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....gP3Sw_8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....bHmuY04
http://www.lifebuzz.com/crows......s....ws
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....IttS9qg
http://www.sciencedaily.com/release....835.htm
http://www.cnn.com/2015.......studies
http://www.cracked.com/article....p2.html
Your sole objection is that you want a sharp dividing line to exist between humans and other animals, and you are determined to invent jargon and play word games in order to make a gradation look like a dichotomy.

I've watched and read all the links:

My goodness! That is not intelligence but only "instinct"! Maybe you will be surprised on how birds make their nests! You would probably call it "SUPERBIRD, HALLELUJAH!" Read my science book and see that you are totally wrong about intelligence...

Thank you for taking the time to watch the clips.
Note that I did not talk about nest building at all.

No reasonable definition of "instinct" covers the behaviors in those clips.  The ONLY way you can dismiss those as instinct is to be committed a priori to conclusions that make it impossible to do a rational analysis of the evidence.  Instinctive behavior means behavior that is preprogrammed, inherited, genetically hard-wired, and inflexible, and these behaviours are none of that.  They are clearly learned (and your use of "instinctive learning" is a monumentally stupid self-contradiction).  Even if we use your exceedingly silly and problematic idea of "it's instinctive if there are fewer than 1 (or 1.5) solutions per problem", tool use by crows clearly allows multiple solutions per problem.

   
Quote
I said that you are wrong since you could no longer answer that simple empirical evidence that I've shown
It is not clear that you have in fact shown any actual empirical evidence.

My goodness,

you need to be very careful in explaining reality since if you got a mistake and people died for that mistake, you cannot help them anymore... you cannot undo!

Now, as I said that I've opened all of your links but oh my goodness, even the bodily parts of every animals could be used as tools!

Now, if an animals used sticks or stones as tools, they used them since that are their instincts...some they did, some they don't..

but look at these pics from Google..do you think that these nests are products of intelligent agents like birds? They also used tools and used materials to build the nests!

https://www.google.co.jp/search?....h2LRgkE

Bird nests are largely instinctive and are not built with tools.  We know that they are largely instinctive because all birds build nests without learning how to do it, and nest style relates to genetic inheritance.  Bird nests are without doubt intricate and amazing, which is one of many reasons I said that bird instincts are sophisticated and can result in truly impressive behavior.

Also, no, by definition body parts don't count as tools unless they've been detached from the owner and are being used by somebody else.

Nonetheless, what I did show you are examples of learned behaviors, involving creating solutions to problems by using planning, reasoning, and symbolic thought.  Those are not instinctive behaviors by any rational definition of the term (therefore excluding your bizarre redefinition).

Saying something is "instinctive" is just another way of saying "we have no idea how they do it"

Shouldn't you be saying that to Edgar Postrado?

And I'm curious, YEC joey, do you believe that there's no such thing as instinct?

--------------
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. - Jesus in Matthew 10:34

But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. -Jesus in Luke 19:27

   
Joe G



Posts: 2040
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,08:38   

Quote (The whole truth @ Oct. 15 2015,08:34)
Quote (Joe G @ Oct. 15 2015,06:09)
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,08:05)
 
Quote (MrIntelligentDesign @ Oct. 15 2015,07:32)
 
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,06:32)
   
Quote (MrIntelligentDesign @ Oct. 15 2015,05:02)
     
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,04:42)
       
Quote
All animals are using/doing naturen to live, thus, they are animals.

Humans are using/doing intellen, thus, they are not already categorized as animals. but intelligent beings or IA.

Humans have instincts and intelligence.
Crows have instincts and NO intelligence.
Likewise for other animals - no intelligence.

That is the reason why you should differentiate if instinct and intelligence are the same or not since you are dis-agreeing with me...

False.  
You have not shown that crows operate solely by instinct and lack intelligence.  

The following are clear instances of learning and reasoning by any rational definition.  If we landed a probe on a distant planet and saw an alien doing these behaviors, there would be no question that we were seeing intelligent behavior.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....gP3Sw_8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....bHmuY04
http://www.lifebuzz.com/crows......s....ws
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....IttS9qg
http://www.sciencedaily.com/release....835.htm
http://www.cnn.com/2015.......studies
http://www.cracked.com/article....p2.html
Your sole objection is that you want a sharp dividing line to exist between humans and other animals, and you are determined to invent jargon and play word games in order to make a gradation look like a dichotomy.

I've watched and read all the links:

My goodness! That is not intelligence but only "instinct"! Maybe you will be surprised on how birds make their nests! You would probably call it "SUPERBIRD, HALLELUJAH!" Read my science book and see that you are totally wrong about intelligence...

Thank you for taking the time to watch the clips.
Note that I did not talk about nest building at all.

No reasonable definition of "instinct" covers the behaviors in those clips.  The ONLY way you can dismiss those as instinct is to be committed a priori to conclusions that make it impossible to do a rational analysis of the evidence.  Instinctive behavior means behavior that is preprogrammed, inherited, genetically hard-wired, and inflexible, and these behaviours are none of that.  They are clearly learned (and your use of "instinctive learning" is a monumentally stupid self-contradiction).  Even if we use your exceedingly silly and problematic idea of "it's instinctive if there are fewer than 1 (or 1.5) solutions per problem", tool use by crows clearly allows multiple solutions per problem.

     
Quote
I said that you are wrong since you could no longer answer that simple empirical evidence that I've shown
It is not clear that you have in fact shown any actual empirical evidence.

My goodness,

you need to be very careful in explaining reality since if you got a mistake and people died for that mistake, you cannot help them anymore... you cannot undo!

Now, as I said that I've opened all of your links but oh my goodness, even the bodily parts of every animals could be used as tools!

Now, if an animals used sticks or stones as tools, they used them since that are their instincts...some they did, some they don't..

but look at these pics from Google..do you think that these nests are products of intelligent agents like birds? They also used tools and used materials to build the nests!

https://www.google.co.jp/search?....h2LRgkE

Bird nests are largely instinctive and are not built with tools.  We know that they are largely instinctive because all birds build nests without learning how to do it, and nest style relates to genetic inheritance.  Bird nests are without doubt intricate and amazing, which is one of many reasons I said that bird instincts are sophisticated and can result in truly impressive behavior.

Also, no, by definition body parts don't count as tools unless they've been detached from the owner and are being used by somebody else.

Nonetheless, what I did show you are examples of learned behaviors, involving creating solutions to problems by using planning, reasoning, and symbolic thought.  Those are not instinctive behaviors by any rational definition of the term (therefore excluding your bizarre redefinition).

Saying something is "instinctive" is just another way of saying "we have no idea how they do it"

Shouldn't you be saying that to Edgar Postrado?

And I'm curious, YEC joey, do you believe that there's no such thing as instinct?

I am curious, child molesting TWiT, who cares what you post?

--------------
Chromosomes. are. all. connected. It is one long polymer. Called the DNA. - oleg t

Smilodon's Retreat is a place for ignorant cowards

Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims. (don't know why Ogre has that, but it fits IDists)

   
The whole truth



Posts: 1554
Joined: Jan. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,08:39   

Quote (Joe G @ Oct. 15 2015,05:55)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Oct. 15 2015,07:52)
Joey just lost another sock puppet on my blog. He just cannot be polite for any length of time or refrain from using his stock phrases that he's so proud of.

Well Kevin, you just proved that you are a piece-of-shit coward. As if we needed more proof of that.

Says one of the most sniveling cowards that has ever existed.

Are you on your way to Portland yet, YEC crybaby joey? LMAO!

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Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. - Jesus in Matthew 10:34

But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. -Jesus in Luke 19:27

   
Joe G



Posts: 2040
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,08:44   

Quote (The whole truth @ Oct. 15 2015,08:39)
Quote (Joe G @ Oct. 15 2015,05:55)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Oct. 15 2015,07:52)
Joey just lost another sock puppet on my blog. He just cannot be polite for any length of time or refrain from using his stock phrases that he's so proud of.

Well Kevin, you just proved that you are a piece-of-shit coward. As if we needed more proof of that.

Says one of the most sniveling cowards that has ever existed.

Are you on your way to Portland yet, YEC crybaby joey? LMAO!

But YOU are a proven sniveling coward and pathological liar.

I was in Portland and you were a no-show. Loser.

--------------
Chromosomes. are. all. connected. It is one long polymer. Called the DNA. - oleg t

Smilodon's Retreat is a place for ignorant cowards

Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims. (don't know why Ogre has that, but it fits IDists)

   
Woodbine



Posts: 1204
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,08:49   

Quote (Joe G @ Oct. 15 2015,14:06)
Ten years since Dover and undirected evolution still has nothing.






  
The whole truth



Posts: 1554
Joined: Jan. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 15 2015,08:52   

Quote (Joe G @ Oct. 15 2015,06:38)
Quote (The whole truth @ Oct. 15 2015,08:34)
Quote (Joe G @ Oct. 15 2015,06:09)
 
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,08:05)
 
Quote (MrIntelligentDesign @ Oct. 15 2015,07:32)
   
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,06:32)
   
Quote (MrIntelligentDesign @ Oct. 15 2015,05:02)
       
Quote (N.Wells @ Oct. 15 2015,04:42)
       
Quote
All animals are using/doing naturen to live, thus, they are animals.

Humans are using/doing intellen, thus, they are not already categorized as animals. but intelligent beings or IA.

Humans have instincts and intelligence.
Crows have instincts and NO intelligence.
Likewise for other animals - no intelligence.

That is the reason why you should differentiate if instinct and intelligence are the same or not since you are dis-agreeing with me...

False.  
You have not shown that crows operate solely by instinct and lack intelligence.  

The following are clear instances of learning and reasoning by any rational definition.  If we landed a probe on a distant planet and saw an alien doing these behaviors, there would be no question that we were seeing intelligent behavior.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....gP3Sw_8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....bHmuY04
http://www.lifebuzz.com/crows......s....ws
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....IttS9qg
http://www.sciencedaily.com/release....835.htm
http://www.cnn.com/2015.......studies
http://www.cracked.com/article....p2.html
Your sole objection is that you want a sharp dividing line to exist between humans and other animals, and you are determined to invent jargon and play word games in order to make a gradation look like a dichotomy.

I've watched and read all the links:

My goodness! That is not intelligence but only "instinct"! Maybe you will be surprised on how birds make their nests! You would probably call it "SUPERBIRD, HALLELUJAH!" Read my science book and see that you are totally wrong about intelligence...

Thank you for taking the time to watch the clips.
Note that I did not talk about nest building at all.

No reasonable definition of "instinct" covers the behaviors in those clips.  The ONLY way you can dismiss those as instinct is to be committed a priori to conclusions that make it impossible to do a rational analysis of the evidence.  Instinctive behavior means behavior that is preprogrammed, inherited, genetically hard-wired, and inflexible, and these behaviours are none of that.  They are clearly learned (and your use of "instinctive learning" is a monumentally stupid self-contradiction).  Even if we use your exceedingly silly and problematic idea of "it's instinctive if there are fewer than 1 (or 1.5) solutions per problem", tool use by crows clearly allows multiple solutions per problem.

     
Quote
I said that you are wrong since you could no longer answer that simple empirical evidence that I've shown
It is not clear that you have in fact shown any actual empirical evidence.

My goodness,

you need to be very careful in explaining reality since if you got a mistake and people died for that mistake, you cannot help them anymore... you cannot undo!

Now, as I said that I've opened all of your links but oh my goodness, even the bodily parts of every animals could be used as tools!

Now, if an animals used sticks or stones as tools, they used them since that are their instincts...some they did, some they don't..

but look at these pics from Google..do you think that these nests are products of intelligent agents like birds? They also used tools and used materials to build the nests!

https://www.google.co.jp/search?....h2LRgkE

Bird nests are largely instinctive and are not built with tools.  We know that they are largely instinctive because all birds build nests without learning how to do it, and nest style relates to genetic inheritance.  Bird nests are without doubt intricate and amazing, which is one of many reasons I said that bird instincts are sophisticated and can result in truly impressive behavior.

Also, no, by definition body parts don't count as tools unless they've been detached from the owner and are being used by somebody else.

Nonetheless, what I did show you are examples of learned behaviors, involving creating solutions to problems by using planning, reasoning, and symbolic thought.  Those are not instinctive behaviors by any rational definition of the term (therefore excluding your bizarre redefinition).

Saying something is "instinctive" is just another way of saying "we have no idea how they do it"

Shouldn't you be saying that to Edgar Postrado?

And I'm curious, YEC joey, do you believe that there's no such thing as instinct?

I am curious, child molesting TWiT, who cares what you post?

Aw, little YEC joey the turd faced boy is mad because he can't have everything his way. Poor thing.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

--------------
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. - Jesus in Matthew 10:34

But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. -Jesus in Luke 19:27

   
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