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+--Forum: Young-Earth Antievolution
+---Topic: geocentrism started by VoxRat


Posted by: VoxRat on Feb. 21 2003,13:31

Have any of you YEC trackers followed this guy, Marshall Hall? :0  Check out his < website > I especially like this pearl of wisdom:


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Qualified and able Creationist/Geocentrists around the world are speaking out on the two facts that ICR (and AIG) are steadfastly resisting, viz., The Bible teaches a moving sun, not a moving earth; &: Both the heliocentricity and the geocentricity models explain all the phenomena. Thus, support of heliocentricity is a philosophical, not a scientific, choice, & not fit for Biblical Creationists.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------

Point that out when our more urbane pseudointellectual anti-intellectual friends(e.g. Discovery Institute) use the same "philosophical bias" gambit.
Posted by: RBH on Feb. 22 2003,00:02

I particularly like this one:

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Christian Creationism is controlled by those who are doctrinally wedded to Zionist Dispensational goals. This marriage has blinded the Creationist leadership to the fact that both the Zionist and the Dispensational concepts come from that same 13th century anti-Christ Kabbalist source as did Relativism, Big Bangism, and the Expanding Universe concepts. Add it up!

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RBH
Posted by: Dr.GH on Feb. 22 2003,15:42

Here is another:
< SCIENTIFIC EXPLANATION OF GEOCENTRICITY >

and another:

< 200001NL -- The Creation Science Association For Mid-America (CSA) >


Posted by: efvinson on Feb. 22 2003,16:32

It is perfectly astounding to me that if I set out to write satire like that, I couldn't be a tenth that good. And those folks possibly, just possibly, aren't writing it as satire. A mind is a terrible thing......
Posted by: The Ghost of Paley on Oct. 28 2005,06:49



---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Have any of you YEC trackers followed this guy, Marshall Hall?   Check out his website I especially like this pearl of wisdom:
Quote  
Qualified and able Creationist/Geocentrists around the world are speaking out on the two facts that ICR (and AIG) are steadfastly resisting, viz., The Bible teaches a moving sun, not a moving earth; &: Both the heliocentricity and the geocentricity models explain all the phenomena. Thus, support of heliocentricity is a philosophical, not a scientific, choice, & not fit for Biblical Creationists.  
Point that out when our more urbane pseudointellectual anti-intellectual friends(e.g. Discovery Institute) use the same "philosophical bias" gambit.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Amen and Amen. All conclusions about the world are ultimately derived from philosophical presuppositions. Evolutionists start with the assumption that the autonomous human mind is capable of coming to accurate conclusions. However, since the human mind is fallible; this is false. Ergo, evolutionists have no basis at all to ground any knowledge claims. Christians start with the Bible as a guide to knowledge. The Bible makes it possible to ground knowledge claims.

I can hear the screaming demands to prove the reliabiility of the Bible now. This however, misses the point. Autonomous human reason can not prove the truth of the Bible more than it can prove the truth of evolution or anything else. It must be accepted as an ultimate presupposition in order to prove anything at all.

Any reasonably careful reading of the Bible makes it clear that Geocentricity is the correct view of the issue. Hence, geocentricity has been proven. If you want to use autonomous human reason to settle the question, it will be just one opinion against another
Posted by: MidnightVoice on Oct. 28 2005,09:05

Quote (The Ghost of Paley @ Oct. 28 2005,11:49)
Any reasonably careful reading of the Bible makes it clear that Geocentricity is the correct view of the issue. Hence, geocentricity has been proven. If you want to use autonomous human reason to settle the question, it will be just one opinion against another
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Of course, you mind being fallible, you cannot come to that conclusion, so we can ignore it.  :)
Posted by: The Ghost of Paley on Oct. 28 2005,10:11



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Of course, you mind being fallible, you cannot come to that conclusion, so we can ignore it.
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 Well, we're also relying on an outside source, the Bible. Yes, our relations with the Bible are filtered through our senses; that is where blind faith comes in. With it, we can escape the logical paradoxes/ undecidable propositions that are imbued in any man-made construct. Since all systems are built on quicksand, we must realise that we are only capturing a projection of truth, not truth itself. We are prisoners of our senses and logic; only God possesses the key that liberates.
Posted by: MidnightVoice on Oct. 28 2005,10:39

Quote (The Ghost of Paley @ Oct. 28 2005,15:11)


---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Of course, you mind being fallible, you cannot come to that conclusion, so we can ignore it.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


 Well, we're also relying on an outside source, the Bible. Yes, our relations with the Bible are filtered through our senses; that is where blind faith comes in. With it, we can escape the logical paradoxes/ undecidable propositions that are imbued in any man-made construct. Since all systems are built on quicksand, we must realise that we are only capturing a projection of truth, not truth itself. We are prisoners of our senses and logic; only God possesses the key that liberates.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Blind faith in your case is HIGHLY approriate  :)

I perfer my fallible mind, thank you very much.  At least it has a chance of getting it right, and changing, and is not ossified.  :)
Posted by: rimby on Oct. 28 2005,15:44

Ghost of Paley


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Well, we're also relying on an outside source, the Bible.

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Since your mind is falllible, how do you know it's really an outside source? Blind faith?

You seem to confusing science and religion. Science is about understanding how nature works using repeatable empirical experiences. It has nothing to do with philosophy or some sort of ultimate truth.

As for these geocentric types, perhaps you would admit there is a difference between faith and pig-headedness?
end


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