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-Antievolution.org Discussion Board
+--Forum: After the Bar Closes...
+---Topic: Ben Stein plays the Nazi card started by Jason Spaceman


Posted by: Jason Spaceman on Jan. 23 2008,12:53



---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Why Darwinism is So Dangerous

Ben Stein, host of a new film on Intelligent Design vs. Darwinism, gives an answer

ByKatherine T. Phan
Christian Post Reporter
Wed, Jan. 23 2008 07:58 AM ET

For Ben Stein, host of an upcoming documentary on the dominance of Darwinism in academia, Darwinism is not just problematic but dangerous even.

In a media teleconference for the film Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed on Tuesday, Stein pointed out that Darwinian teaching on natural selection and random mutation "led in a straight line to the holocaust and Nazism."

Darwin said that there were certain species that were superior to other species and all were competing for scarce supplies of food or resources, Stein pointed out. But if there was a limited supply of basic resources, Darwinism taught that "you owe it to the superior race to kill the inferior race," he told reporters.

Darwinian evolutionary theory fueled Nazi idealism that felt gypsies, Eastern Europeans and others were competing with them for scarce basic resources, explained Stein.

"As a Jew, I am horrified that people thought Jews were so inferior they didn't deserve to live," he commented.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Read it < here. >
Posted by: JohnW on Jan. 23 2008,13:14

Quote (Jason Spaceman @ Jan. 23 2008,10:53)


---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Why Darwinism is So Dangerous

Ben Stein, host of a new film on Intelligent Design vs. Darwinism, gives an answer

ByKatherine T. Phan
Christian Post Reporter
Wed, Jan. 23 2008 07:58 AM ET

For Ben Stein, host of an upcoming documentary on the dominance of Darwinism in academia, Darwinism is not just problematic but dangerous even.

In a media teleconference for the film Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed on Tuesday, Stein pointed out that Darwinian teaching on natural selection and random mutation "led in a straight line to the holocaust and Nazism."

Darwin said that there were certain species that were superior to other species and all were competing for scarce supplies of food or resources, Stein pointed out. But if there was a limited supply of basic resources, Darwinism taught that "you owe it to the superior race to kill the inferior race," he told reporters.

Darwinian evolutionary theory fueled Nazi idealism that felt gypsies, Eastern Europeans and others were competing with them for scarce basic resources, explained Stein.

"As a Jew, I am horrified that people thought Jews were so inferior they didn't deserve to live," he commented.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Read it < here. >
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


< Antisemitism >:


---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Contents [hide]
1 Forms

2 Etymology and usage
2.1 Definitions
2.2 Use as a pejorative

3 History
3.1 Ancient world
3.2 Accusations of deicide
3.3 Persecution of Jews in the Middle Ages
3.4 Medieval Accusations of Deicide
3.5 Seventeenth century
3.6 Eighteenth century

3.7 Nineteenth century
3.8 Twentieth century

---------------------QUOTE-------------------


I fixed this. Darwin invented antisemitism.
Posted by: J-Dog on Jan. 23 2008,13:39

Damn!  From the Topic Headline,I thought Stein was coming clean, and saying that he looks good goose-stepping in field gray.
Posted by: jeannot on Jan. 23 2008,13:42


Bueller...?

(I couldn't help it.  :p )
Posted by: Glen Davidson on Jan. 23 2008,15:13

< I'm hoping that Stein is telling the truth for once: >

 

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Ben, himself, has lost opportunities because of his work on the project and regularly receives hate mail.

---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Not the hate mail, if true, but I don't mind either people telling him that he's an ignorant twit promoting theo-fascism, nor the fact of people who prefer liberty to his brand of dictatorship not hiring such a cheap con-man.

Glen D
Posted by: Kristine on Jan. 23 2008,15:42

Quote (Glen Davidson @ Jan. 23 2008,14:13)
< I'm hoping that Stein is telling the truth for once: >



---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Ben, himself, has lost opportunities because of his work on the project and regularly receives hate mail.

---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Not the hate mail, if true, but I don't mind either people telling him that he's an ignorant twit promoting theo-fascism, nor the fact that people who prefer liberty to his brand of dictatorship not hiring such a cheap con-man.

Glen D
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Well, considering that he's < on the carny circuit >, he's probably getting hate mail from the kind of fanatics who think you're the "wrong" kind of creationist.

But remember, this is the guy who screamed Nazis at the cops who arrested Larry Craig for doing what Craig says he wasnt doing but the ACLU will now defend his right to do (and I agree!;).

In other words, Ben Stein is a dramaqueen? :) (That slipped out. Naa, I dont think its true. If anyone needs to come out of the closet, its Ray Comfort. And yeah, hoo boy, imagine how the right wing will trumpet dangers of Nazism, which persecuted gays, then. Oh, yeah, we'll hear all about how we'd better not act like Nazis then.)
Posted by: Chayanov on Jan. 23 2008,17:02

If "Darwinism" is responsible for the Nazis, then Christianity is responsible for slavery and genocide in the Americas (Both supported by Biblical scripture). Time for all those churches to start paying out reparations.

Or at least drop that ridiculous "Darwinism leads to Nazism" non-argument.
Posted by: Doc Bill on Jan. 23 2008,18:17

You think that's bad?  Huh?

Well, there's nothing as bad as



< Nazis and Football! >
Posted by: rhmc on Jan. 23 2008,18:34

i laughed my ass off. pretty funny stuff.
Posted by: J-Dog on Jan. 23 2008,21:56

Quote (Doc Bill @ Jan. 23 2008,18:17)
You think that's bad? Huh?

Well, there's nothing as bad as



< Nazis and Football! >
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Doc Bill - You are my new bestest friend.  That was fucking Hitlerareous.

BTW - Since Ben Stein has decided not to be Jewish anymore, maybe someone could send him a TO shirt.
Posted by: Doc Bill on Jan. 23 2008,21:59

Well, for all you hard core gamers there's


< THIS! >

Awwwww, and Wii bowling is so cool.
Posted by: Advocatus Diaboli on Jan. 27 2008,18:03

Eversince I read < Faith and Fratrice: The theological roots of anti-semitism >, by Rosemary Radford Ruether, I've had real trouble keeping a straight face when reading comments like Ben is spewing. I can't remember learning anything about the history of Jewish-Christian relations back in school (perhaps kept quiet on purpose?), but this book was an eye-opener. Centuries of systematic persecution and pogroms on the Jews all over Europe, before Adolf came goose-stepping, and now we only hear from Disco how its all his fault (cuz he read Darwin, you see).
Posted by: bystander on Jan. 27 2008,23:48

* edit: repeated myself
Posted by: bystander on Jan. 28 2008,00:19

Quote (Advocatus Diaboli @ Jan. 28 2008,11:03)
Eversince I read < Faith and Fratrice: The theological roots of anti-semitism >, by Rosemary Radford Ruether, I've had real trouble keeping a straight face when reading comments like Ben is spewing. I can't remember learning anything about the history of Jewish-Christian relations back in school (perhaps kept quiet on purpose?), but this book was an eye-opener. Centuries of systematic persecution and pogroms on the Jews all over Europe, before Adolf came goose-stepping, and now we only hear from Disco how its all his fault (cuz he read Darwin, you see).
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


My father was East European and I am sure that a lot of his neighbours welcomed the Germans to rid them of the Jews and Moslems. They were "good" Christians and would have been aghast if they thought that Hitler was an atheist.

It's strange that the side of the science debate that has a lot of the anti-gay/anti-brown/anti-moslem* people on it's side think that Evolution supporters are the Nazis.

Michael
Posted by: Nomad on Jan. 28 2008,02:32

Quote (Doc Bill @ Jan. 23 2008,21:59)
Well, for all you hard core gamers there's


< THIS! >

Awwwww, and Wii bowling is so cool.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Yes, that one works much better for me.  Especially since the maker managed to work a "Hitler plays with his Wii" joke into it.
Posted by: PTET on Jan. 28 2008,07:34

Quote (Glen Davidson @ Jan. 23 2008,15:13)
< I'm hoping that Stein is telling the truth for once: >

   

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Ben, himself, has lost opportunities because of his work on the project and regularly receives hate mail.

---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Not the hate mail, if true, but I don't mind either people telling him that he's an ignorant twit promoting theo-fascism, nor the fact of people who prefer liberty to his brand of dictatorship not hiring such a cheap con-man.

Glen D
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


This seems like a good a place as any for a competition competition... Obviously the attached pic is far too childish to publish anywhere... But what *could* Ben Stein be writing with that spray-can? He is after all, this generation's rebel...

The best caption "wins a prize".


Posted by: Occam's Toothbrush on Jan. 28 2008,08:56


Posted by: Lowell on Mar. 24 2008,23:32

I haven't seen the film. (I RSVPd for a viewing and received an e-mail confirmation, but had to cancel the day before.)

Nevertheless, Dawkins's review made me think we should revive this thread because it describes the evolution/Nazism theme the movie apparently tries to push. It also suggests the idea (which is purely my own deduction) that the filmakers wanted a Jewish spokesperson (Ben Stein) for "cover" because of how flimsy that connection is.

Dawkins wrote:

"He visits Dachau and, when informed by the guide that lots of Jews had been killed there, he buries his face in his hands as though this is the first time he has heard of it. Obviously it was not his intention, but I thought his rotten acting was an insult to the memory of the victims."

I was raised Jewish (although I'm now an open atheist), but I find the evolution/Holocaust conflation extraordinarily offensive for all the obvious reasons, including (1) the Reich clearly relied more on religious rhetoric than scientific, (2) whatever scientific grounds it relied on were wrong, and (3) even if those scientific grounds were not wrong, the fact that scientific knowledge is put to an immoral end has no bearing on its truth value.

ERV blogged previously on a potential ADL (Anti-Defamation League) response (which I'm not yet computer-savvy enough to link to). I hope such a response will be forthcoming (probably not until after the release).

It seems to me that even non-scientists (like me) from a Jewish heritage would see through this movie insofar as it misrepresents the forces that drove the Holocaust. It's not quite Holocaust-denial, but it smells similar.
Posted by: BWE on Mar. 24 2008,23:53

Quote (Doc Bill @ Jan. 23 2008,18:17)
You think that's bad?  Huh?

Well, there's nothing as bad as



< Nazis and Football! >
---------------------QUOTE-------------------




---------------------QUOTE-------------------
This video is no longer available due to a copyright claim by Demand Entertainment
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Posted by: Kristine on Mar. 25 2008,00:02

Quote (PTET @ Jan. 28 2008,06:34)
 
Quote (Glen Davidson @ Jan. 23 2008,15:13)
< I'm hoping that Stein is telling the truth for once: >



---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Ben, himself, has lost opportunities because of his work on the project and regularly receives hate mail.

---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Not the hate mail, if true, but I don't mind either people telling him that he's an ignorant twit promoting theo-fascism, nor the fact of people who prefer liberty to his brand of dictatorship not hiring such a cheap con-man.

Glen D
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


This seems like a good a place as any for a competition competition... Obviously the attached pic is far too childish to publish anywhere... But what *could* Ben Stein be writing with that spray-can? He is after all, this generation's rebel...

The best caption "wins a prize".


---------------------QUOTE-------------------


< "Strength through Joy"? > :p

 

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
At age eighteen young German men served for a year in the ReichsarbeitsdienstImperial Labor Servicewhile the young women served as farm workers both in the fields and in the house. Shirer remembered humorously that Inevitably, moral problems arose. The presence of a pretty young city girl sometimes disrupted a peasants household he said, and angry complaints from parents, about their daughters having been made pregnant on the farms, began to be heard. Soon a lively little song about the plight of the young female volunteers was circulated. It was a takeoff on Strength Through Joy, the Nazis slogan for its puppet German Labor Front. The song, which in German rhymed poetically, went:
In the fields and on the heath
I lose Strength Through Joy.


---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Posted by: dochocson on Mar. 25 2008,00:03

Consider the contrast between the ham handed scene of Stein at Dachau and Jacob Bronowski's wrenching visit (at Auschwitz?) in The Ascent of Man.

I can only imagine what Bronowski would have to say about all this.
Posted by: BWE on Mar. 25 2008,00:25


Posted by: Kristine on Mar. 25 2008,00:52

That's beautiful. :D
Posted by: Lowell on Mar. 25 2008,00:58

Quote (dochocson @ Mar. 25 2008,00:03)
Consider the contrast between the ham handed scene of Stein at Dachau and Jacob Bronowski's wrenching visit (at Auschwitz?) in The Ascent of Man.

I can only imagine what Bronowski would have to say about all this.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


It was Auschwitz. Thank you for the reference.

< Bronowski at Auschwitz >
Posted by: BWE on Mar. 25 2008,01:04

Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 25 2008,00:52)
That's beautiful. :D
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Do you mean the Ben-Guernica?
Posted by: Kristine on Mar. 25 2008,01:04


;)
Posted by: Doc Bill on Mar. 25 2008,01:12

I watched Bronowski's original series when it was broadcast.  I have his book, the Ascent of Man, and the DVD collection.  Jacob Bronowski is a towering intellectual and a personal hero of mine.

Ben Stein is a buffoon and an idiot.

Ben Stein is an insult to Bronowski and to all those who lost their lives during WW2.

Ben Stein should be ashamed and humiliated about what he has done.

It's not funny, Ben Stein, you have dishonored your people and people you never knew.  Ben Stein, you have mocked the death of millions of innocent people for your own personal gain.  You are disgusting beyond words.

Ben Stein, you are a disgrace to your family.  You are an intellectual vandal, and a scientific slanderer.

Shame on you, Ben Stein, shame on you.
Posted by: Reed on Mar. 25 2008,04:09

< >
My take on Ben.
Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 25 2008,11:31

Quote (Reed @ Mar. 25 2008,04:09)
< >
My take on Ben.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


I think you have caught the essence of Ben Stein.

Rather than stand on the shoulders of giants, he has chosen to stand on the shoulders of piss-ants.
Posted by: KimvdLinde on Mar. 25 2008,12:05

Ok, it is 60 years ago that the nazi's were squashed, and in the years after, most ideas loosely based on severe misinformed social Darwinisms have been eliminated in society. Nowadays, scientists are among the most liberal, most pro helping the weak, including most so-called "Darwinists". So, and now we suddenly have to believe that because some idiot who misused Christianity-based antisemitism, mixed with misrepresented Social Darwinism SIXTY years ago, we are NOWADAYS not anything better.

Lets see, if the so-called Christian get there way, they would like to sterilize Gays, export them, kil them, because why, because they are deviant. Humm that was exactly the motivation from, guess who, Hitler. Cool. Interracial marriage. If any group does not have an issue with that, it is academics, while our average Joe Fundamentalist will nicely go to a white church and shivers with the idea that his daughter wants to marry a black guy.

Eugenetics was rampant throughout the world before World War II, including the USA. After the war, it lost it traction and the world has changed since then. And that is where I think we should focus on, not whether or not the movie is actually correct. Because of we are going to dig, it will become clear that Social Darwinism was happily embraced by many with an agenda based on century-old prejudices against anything non-white and "deviant".
Posted by: midwifetoad on Mar. 25 2008,12:12






Posted by: dogdidit on Mar. 25 2008,12:21

Quote (midwifetoad @ Mar. 25 2008,12:12)

---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Do you guys have a Post-of-the-week award?
Posted by: Kristine on Mar. 25 2008,12:38

I second the motion! Midwifetoad, that is brilliant! :)
Posted by: midwifetoad on Mar. 25 2008,12:50

Thanks. I only have a few posts here, but I'm < not a total n00b >.
Posted by: Gary Bohn on Mar. 25 2008,13:03

Quote (midwifetoad @ Mar. 25 2008,12:50)
Thanks. I only have a few posts here, but I'm < not a total n00b >.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


You have 17 posts here and you haven't hawked your < darwincentral blog posts > yet? Midwifetoad, you be slackin'.
Posted by: Lou FCD on Mar. 25 2008,13:08

Quote (dogdidit @ Mar. 25 2008,13:21)
Do you guys have a Post-of-the-week award?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Done.
Posted by: midwifetoad on Mar. 25 2008,13:13

Quote (Gary Bohn @ Mar. 25 2008,13:03)
Quote (midwifetoad @ Mar. 25 2008,12:50)
Thanks. I only have a few posts here, but I'm < not a total n00b >.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


You have 17 posts here and you haven't hawked your < darwincentral blog posts > yet? Midwifetoad, you be slackin'.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


I just did. ;)

I am not particularly pleased when people come to a forum just to flog their own, so I don't plan to spend my time here linking to my own stuff.

The Stein fiasco, however, just drives me wild. I have been called a Nazi by better people than the Discoveroids.
Posted by: guthrie on Mar. 25 2008,15:42

Is there any sign of a real Nazi complaining about the misuse of the label by the Creationists?
Posted by: steve_h on Mar. 25 2008,16:42

Quote (midwifetoad @ Mar. 25 2008,19:13)
I am not particularly pleased when people come to a forum just to flog their own, so I don't plan to spend my time here linking to my own stuff.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


A warm belated welcome to the Antio'leary. Are you here to buy books?
Posted by: Richardthughes on Mar. 25 2008,17:48

From before:



< http://www.antievolution.org/cgi-bin....;t=5412 >
Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 25 2008,17:52

Richard - you should update your ID Tree to include YOUR POTW sticker...

The Darwin Mit Uns is GREAT, but hey, I got to stick up for ma homies too yall..
Posted by: Stanton on Mar. 25 2008,19:13

Charles Darwin and a baby rhesus macaque are the mother and father of Adolf Hitler?
Posted by: Richardthughes on Mar. 25 2008,19:18

Quote (Stanton @ Mar. 25 2008,19:13)
Charles Darwin and a baby rhesus macaque are the mother and father of Adolf Hitler?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


HAS NOT SEEN EXPELLED?
Posted by: Quidam on Mar. 25 2008,22:59


Posted by: dogdidit on Mar. 26 2008,08:19

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 25 2008,17:48)
From before:

---------------------QUOTE-------------------


must.
swallow.
coffee.
before.
reading.
forum.

Wow.
Okay, so the FNG sits back in slack-jawed admiration.
And dammit that was STARBUCKS dammit, not that swill from the company cafeteria. Cost more than this shirt.

Back to work...
Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 26 2008,08:22

Quote (Quidam @ Mar. 25 2008,22:59)

---------------------QUOTE-------------------


OUTSTANDING!  

Welcome and Thank You.
Posted by: Quidam on Mar. 26 2008,09:25

The emphasis the movie makes on the holocaust is a Godsend (literally).  Everyone knows about Holocaust revisionists and how to deal with them.  That the notorious antisemite Mathis actually paid a Jew to stand up and lie for him makes it all the more ironic.

If they had chosen Stalin it would have been more difficult to rebut in a way that the average 'Merkin could comprehend, but Nazis are too easy. Since the Expelled site publicly claims "Evolution leads to atheism leads to eugenics leads to Holocaust and Nazi Germany", that's hate speech in virtually all countries.  If that aspect is emphasised the ID folk will be backpedalling from the movie so fast only AiG will be left.
Posted by: bourgeois_rage on Mar. 26 2008,10:18

I've been away far too long. These shops are brilliant.
Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 26 2008,10:26

Quote (bourgeois_rage @ Mar. 26 2008,10:18)
Overwhelming Evidence:  Apply Directly To The Forehead
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Love your tag line...

Be careful though - I hear you can OD on that stuff.
Posted by: Mr_Christopher on Mar. 26 2008,10:46

Speaking on Nazis and Ben Stein, Michael Shermer noted that during his Expelled interview Stein made some questionable comments about "blacks" that lead him to believe Stein probably harbors racist ideas.  He also said he (Shermer) wrote a review for Scientific American.

Has anyone seen that review or read more about Stein's alleged racist leanings?
Posted by: Lowell on Mar. 26 2008,14:15

Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Mar. 26 2008,10:46)
Speaking on Nazis and Ben Stein, Michael Shermer noted that during his Expelled interview Stein made some questionable comments about "blacks" that lead him to believe Stein probably harbors racist ideas. He also said he (Shermer) wrote a review for Scientific American.

Has anyone seen that review or read more about Stein's alleged racist leanings?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


A google search for '"Ben Stein' racist" returned this article he wrote for the American Spectator after Katrina.

< http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=8799 >

After Goodwining himself in the first sentence, he gives us his thesis: "The big lie of the Hurricane Katrina story is that it reveals deep and hateful racism in America, that blacks were treated worse than other people because they were black, and that this shows the hypocrisy of this supposedly egalitarian nation."

The fact that black people were disproportionately affected is merely a coincidence, in Stein's view. It was "poverty" that was to blame.

Well, maybe they were poor, at least in part, because they were black? No, says Stein. Their poverty was "in no sense caused by white mistreatment of blacks unless it was white mistreatment of blacks that ended many decades ago." (The possibility that past discrimination could have an effect on future generations is not addressed.)

Oh, and lots of white people tried to help out afterwards. So, obviously, racism had nothing to do with it.
Posted by: Kristine on Mar. 26 2008,14:23

Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Mar. 26 2008,09:46)
Speaking on Nazis and Ben Stein, Michael Shermer noted that during his Expelled interview Stein made some questionable comments about "blacks" that lead him to believe Stein probably harbors racist ideas. He also said he (Shermer) wrote a review for Scientific American.

Has anyone seen that review or read more about Stein's alleged racist leanings?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


:O Jeebus...H...Chriminey...
That Spectator article:  

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Josef Goebbels would have been happy with much of the mainstream media in the past few weeks since Hurricane Katrina hit the Gulf Coast. Goebbels, for those of you too young to know, was Hitler's propaganda minister. He is credited with creating the concept of The Big Lie. The idea was that if you tell a lie big enough often enough, people will believe it.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Josef Goebbels, again! Josef Goebbels! He's everywhere! Nazis in our public schools! Nazis in the bathroom of the Mpls/St Paul airport! The Nazis are taking ovahhhhhhh!

I can't stand it.
Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 26 2008,14:26

Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 26 2008,14:23)
Josef Goebbels, again! Josef Goebbels! He's everywhere! Nazis in our public schools! Nazis in the bathroom of the Mpls/St Paul airport! The Nazis are taking ovahhhhhhh!

I can't stand it.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


What???

You can't belly dance wearing black leather boots?
Posted by: midwifetoad on Mar. 26 2008,14:37

This is a bit like salted peanuts. I can't make just one.


Posted by: Lowell on Mar. 26 2008,14:39

Here's a really long article from the Hollywood Investigator in 2003 that traces Stein's career:

< http://www.hollywoodinvestigator.com/2003/benstein.htm >

Ben's a real pull-yourself-up-by-your-own-bootstraps kind of guy:



---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Stein recalled a black woman who'd asked him, following his speech at Pepperdine University, how people were to get an education after cuts in the school budget. "What I said to her was, no public school system has ever been invented that is so poor that a really well-motivated, well- disciplined student cannot get an education. There's libraries, there's internet, there's newspapers, there are inexpensive books. Some of the problem of the unemployment among inner city African-Americans is due to their own inability to educate themselves, to get themselves marketable skills.

"I'm a huge fan of rap. I'm floored at the incredible creativity and discipline and hard work of some of these rap stars who make themselves into giant sensations. I keep thinking to myself, the inner city is an enormous reservoir of talent that has yet to be tapped by America -- but it has to tap itself first of all."
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Posted by: Arden Chatfield on Mar. 26 2008,15:32

Quote (Lowell @ Mar. 26 2008,14:39)
Stein recalled a black woman who'd asked him, following his speech at Pepperdine University, how people were to get an education after cuts in the school budget. "What I said to her was, no public school system has ever been invented that is so poor that a really well-motivated, well- disciplined student cannot get an education.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Ben Stein, in addition to this neurotic thing of seeing Nazis behind every corner and under every rock, is plainly VERY VERY sheltered...
Posted by: Quidam on Mar. 26 2008,16:29

Great idea MidWifeToad. But do you mind if I take the blue ball and run with it a bit

Posted by: Doc Bill on Mar. 26 2008,16:32

Call me stupid but I just do not understand this fascination with Nazis.

I mean, I think I went through a Nazi phase in the third grade, but it was short lived.

So, let me get this straight.  Darwinism leads to Nazi-ism.  OK, right.  But, only in Germany in the 1930's.  Nowhere else in the world, in no other country, at no other time in the past 150 years except in Germany in the 1930's.

Therefore it would appear that Expelled was produced by third graders, or is that being unfair to third graders?
Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 26 2008,17:10

Quote (Doc Bill @ Mar. 26 2008,16:32)
Call me stupid but I just do not understand this fascination with Nazis.

I mean, I think I went through a Nazi phase in the third grade, but it was short lived.

So, let me get this straight. Darwinism leads to Nazi-ism. OK, right. But, only in Germany in the 1930's. Nowhere else in the world, in no other country, at no other time in the past 150 years except in Germany in the 1930's.

Therefore it would appear that Expelled was produced by third graders, or is that being unfair to third graders?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Doc Bill - Brilliant - I think you just got put on the Nixon D. I. Enemies list.

Congratualtions.
Posted by: Quidam on Mar. 26 2008,17:33

Ben Repaints History

Posted by: Doc Bill on Mar. 26 2008,17:50

Must be a mistake!

I voted for Nixon in '72.

After being a young Nazi in the third grade I became a young Republican in high school.  

Eventually I got laid and the rest is history.
Posted by: Nomad on Mar. 26 2008,22:07

Quote (Doc Bill @ Mar. 26 2008,16:32)
Call me stupid but I just do not understand this fascination with Nazis.

I mean, I think I went through a Nazi phase in the third grade, but it was short lived.

So, let me get this straight.  Darwinism leads to Nazi-ism.  OK, right.  But, only in Germany in the 1930's.  Nowhere else in the world, in no other country, at no other time in the past 150 years except in Germany in the 1930's.

Therefore it would appear that Expelled was produced by third graders, or is that being unfair to third graders?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Actually no, after covering the Holocaust they tried to tap into current fundie hot button issues.  After saying that while Evolution wasn't guaranteed to cause eugenics it was a required element for it to be able to happen (ignoring that whole Spartan thing, apparently the producers didn't see 300), they went on to cover Planned Parenthood.

This shocked me.  I guess I must be out of touch, I had no idea how much animosity the fundies had for Planned Parenthood.  They showed the PP logo on screen and the audience at the Expelled screening gasped collectively.  To them Planned Parenthood was more horrifying than piles of dead bodies being shoveled into an incinerator.  Because Planned Parenthood supplies birth control to the poor the audience was told that that means they're practicing eugenics.

Not just Planned Parenthood, the filmmakers tried to tie birth control, abortion, and euthanasia into one big warning that eugenics was alive and well in America today, that "darwinism" was devaluing human life in our modern world.

In other words, the message wasn't just "it could happen here", but that it is happening now and that all those good Christians out there are obligated to fight against the theory of evolution for the good of the country.
Posted by: Dr.GH on Mar. 26 2008,22:39

Quote (midwifetoad @ Mar. 26 2008,12:37)
This is a bit like salted peanuts. I can't make just one.


---------------------QUOTE-------------------


This is all so excellent!
Posted by: Quidam on Mar. 26 2008,22:58

Ben Stein  

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Darwinism does not always lead to Nazism. It is, though, a necessary albeit not sufficient component
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Posted by: Quidam on Mar. 26 2008,23:50


Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 27 2008,08:04

Quote (Quidam @ Mar. 26 2008,22:58)
Ben Stein  

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Darwinism does not always lead to Nazism. It is, though, a necessary albeit not sufficient component
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Very Interesting....

Thanks for the Mein Kampf re-print.  I'd forgotten what a steaming pile of tard it was.

BUT - There is a passage in your re-print that is worth pointing out that seems to be direct evidence that HITLER  WAS A YEC!!

"... and once again this planet, empty of mankind, will move through the ether as it did thousands of years ago " - (my emphasis)

WTF?  Is it time for Ben and Friends to do another expose?
This one linking the YEC's to Hitler and Nazism?

Well, that solves the problem of what to do for the sequel for their Award-Winning Docutrashery!*



*Razzie Award 2008- The Worst Story Ever Told
Posted by: Wesley R. Elsberry on Mar. 27 2008,08:38

Quote (J-Dog @ Mar. 27 2008,08:04)

BUT - There is a passage in your re-print that is worth pointing out that seems to be direct evidence that HITLER  WAS A YEC!!

"... and once again this planet, empty of mankind, will move through the ether as it did thousands of years ago " - (my emphasis)

---------------------QUOTE-------------------



< Skip back a dozen years... > the second edition used "millions" instead, so even Hitler eventually figured out YEC-ism was not a winning rhetorical ploy.
Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 27 2008,09:12

Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Mar. 27 2008,08:38)
Quote (J-Dog @ Mar. 27 2008,08:04)

BUT - There is a passage in your re-print that is worth pointing out that seems to be direct evidence that HITLER  WAS A YEC!!

"... and once again this planet, empty of mankind, will move through the ether as it did thousands of years ago " - (my emphasis)

---------------------QUOTE-------------------



< Skip back a dozen years... > the second edition used "millions" instead, so even Hitler eventually figured out YEC-ism was not a winning rhetorical ploy.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Damn! There goes my Nobel Prize.

Damn you Hitler!  Damn you to hell!
Posted by: Kristine on Mar. 27 2008,09:15

Quote (Nomad @ Mar. 26 2008,21:07)
 
Quote (Doc Bill @ Mar. 26 2008,16:32)
Call me stupid but I just do not understand this fascination with Nazis.

I mean, I think I went through a Nazi phase in the third grade, but it was short lived.

So, let me get this straight. Darwinism leads to Nazi-ism. OK, right. But, only in Germany in the 1930's. Nowhere else in the world, in no other country, at no other time in the past 150 years except in Germany in the 1930's.

Therefore it would appear that Expelled was produced by third graders, or is that being unfair to third graders?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Actually no, after covering the Holocaust they tried to tap into current fundie hot button issues. After saying that while Evolution wasn't guaranteed to cause eugenics it was a required element for it to be able to happen (ignoring that whole Spartan thing, apparently the producers didn't see 300), they went on to cover Planned Parenthood.

This shocked me. I guess I must be out of touch, I had no idea how much animosity the fundies had for Planned Parenthood. They showed the PP logo on screen and the audience at the Expelled screening gasped collectively. To them Planned Parenthood was more horrifying than piles of dead bodies being shoveled into an incinerator. Because Planned Parenthood supplies birth control to the poor the audience was told that that means they're practicing eugenics.

Not just Planned Parenthood, the filmmakers tried to tie birth control, abortion, and euthanasia into one big warning that eugenics was alive and well in America today, that "darwinism" was devaluing human life in our modern world.

In other words, the message wasn't just "it could happen here", but that it is happening now and that all those good Christians out there are obligated to fight against the theory of evolution for the good of the country.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


I too watched in astonishment as the audience gasped in horror as the Planned Parenthood logo was displayed on screen. (For my part I said, This is ridiculous! right out loud.) I wasnt entirely surprised, given the attitudes out there, but I was surprised that Stein would go so far as to associate himself with a project that condemns birth control itself. But I guess thats when I felt relief, ironically, at how batshit insane this film is.

You cant pull that stuff and have a mainstream blockbuster documentary and end up the Republican Michael Moore. You just cant.
Posted by: Arden Chatfield on Mar. 27 2008,09:22

Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Mar. 27 2008,08:38)
Quote (J-Dog @ Mar. 27 2008,08:04)

BUT - There is a passage in your re-print that is worth pointing out that seems to be direct evidence that HITLER WAS A YEC!!

"... and once again this planet, empty of mankind, will move through the ether as it did thousands of years ago " - (my emphasis)

---------------------QUOTE-------------------



< Skip back a dozen years... > the second edition used "millions" instead, so even Hitler eventually figured out YEC-ism was not a winning rhetorical ploy.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Hitler was in fact very poorly educated and was the quintessential auto-didact. Probably one of his less illiterate cronies like Hess or Goebbels suggested that revision before the second edition of MK. (Rumor has it that in addition to typing out MK, Hess also fixed AH's bad spelling and grammar.) It's ironic to think that creationists have a level of scientific understanding equal to that held by Hitler circa 1922.
Posted by: midwifetoad on Mar. 27 2008,13:49



---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Great idea MidWifeToad.  But do you mind if I take the blue ball and run with it a bit
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Not at all. You've finished what I started. I'm not a Photoshop ace, and it would have taken me hours to get that kind of merger.

Someone needs to fire that off the Harvard.
Posted by: Richardthughes on Mar. 27 2008,14:18

Quote (Quidam @ Mar. 26 2008,22:58)
Ben Stein

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Darwinism does not always lead to Nazism. It is, though, a necessary albeit not sufficient component
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



---------------------QUOTE-------------------


This is excellent. It says it all, using a primary source.

I doff my tardcap.
Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 27 2008,14:32

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 27 2008,14:18)
Quote (Quidam @ Mar. 26 2008,22:58)
Ben Stein    

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Darwinism does not always lead to Nazism. It is, though, a necessary albeit not sufficient component
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



---------------------QUOTE-------------------


This is excellent. It says it all, using a primary source.

I doff my tardcap.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Yes, Heads Up To Quidem -

So, Quidem, tease us with a little background!
Posted by: Quidam on Mar. 27 2008,15:38

I think Ben Stein as a Schoolgirl Hooker was enough teasing. :D
Posted by: J-Dog on Mar. 27 2008,18:07

Quote (Quidam @ Mar. 27 2008,15:38)
I think Ben Stein as a Schoolgirl Hooker was enough teasing. :D
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Aha a clue!  You must be from Kansas?

Tease = FTK = KS

On the other hand, artwork & comments too clever = Not From Kansas...

= Tease = FTK = KS

Help!  I'm stuck in a friggin' loop...
Posted by: Quidam on Mar. 27 2008,20:38


PZ Ben
Posted by: Badidea on Mar. 27 2008,21:52

I made these for a post < way back when about a recent origin of life discovery >.

Evolution:


Creationism:


Intelligent Design:

Posted by: Damian on Mar. 28 2008,02:23

Here is my effort:



Who knew that Ben Stein thinks in Comic Sans and carries a modified bedroom unit around with him?
Posted by: Epicurian on Mar. 29 2008,22:46



Found the background still in a video from my archive, it's not WWII era just be clear, these people are still around somewhere.
Posted by: Quidam on Mar. 29 2008,23:25


Posted by: Jason Spaceman on Mar. 30 2008,02:32

< The American Family Association's website (better known as OneNewsNow) interviews Ben Stein >



---------------------QUOTE-------------------
AFA: But scientists say the question of God isnt a scientific one, and that to talk about God isnt helpful.
Stein: [W]ere just asking why a professor in a university dedicated to free thought and free inquiry can be expelled if he even suggests that there might be a God who had a hand in this. Why is it illegal to talk about God? When Darwin was writing, it was perfectly allowable to talk about God in the classroom. When Newton was doing his experiments it was perfectly allowable to talk about God in the classroom. When Einstein wrote about physics, he said it was the hand of God at work. Why do we now say that all of a sudden God is not allowed to even be mentioned in the classroom in connection with a scientific theory?

AFA: But maybe those are issues that are best left to the philosophy class or the religion class.
Stein: Im saying that maybe all these classes should not be so clearly separated from one another. Maybe all of them belong, to a certain extent, together. When Issac Newton was doing his study of the laws of physics and motion, he said he was trying to understand how God had ordered the universe and what the work of God had been. He was showing Gods handiwork. Maybe when people say they are working on intelligent design, they are just expressing Gods handiwork. Maybe when the Darwinists are explaining evolution, theyre explaining Gods handiwork. Im a little suspicious of putting everything into neat pigeon holes.

AFA: Is this movie suggesting that intelligent design or creationism be the only thing that is taught in schools?
Stein: Absolutely not! And not only that, were not by any means certain, at least Im not, that intelligent design is the answer. Its a subject this origins of life and the development and evolution of life those are such complex subjects. [So] we dont think that we have all the answers. We dont think that anyone has all the answers. We just want free speech. Its interesting in one of his famous letters, Darwin said, Its all so complicated, I just want to have free speech and have people able to talk about what they want to talk about.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Posted by: Reed on Mar. 30 2008,04:03

Wow that's some mighty strong stupid. But there's more:
   

---------------------QUOTE-------------------

 AFA: Despite the angry responses, what is going to keep you going on this campaign?
 Stein: I think Im going to keep going on with this because were missing something extremely basic in our understanding of the world and how God created it, and Id like us to return to that, and I think by returning to those bigger subjects of how the world got created and what our place in the world is, we will find a new moral fence which is very much lacking

---------------------QUOTE-------------------


All Science So Far!

Oh the Sternberg caption is great too:
 

---------------------QUOTE-------------------

[Sternberg] explains to Ben Steinhow he lost his job with the Smithsonian Institute over the issue of Intelligent design. Sternberg hand been managing editor of a scientific journal and OK'd the publication of an article supporting the theory.

---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Posted by: Badidea on Mar. 30 2008,14:53

Lost his job with the....

I can't ever decide whether or not these people are really for reals or not.  They have to know that this is complete bullshit: that he never had a job at the Smithsonian to lose, that he lost 0 jobs in total over this controversy, and that implying that he lost his editorship (when in fact it's exactly the other way around: his tenure was ending and THUS chose to put a creationist rant in his final issue).  

Then again, Stein declared in the Expelled 7minute trailer that the Meyer article "merely suggested that we are not lightning and mud after all" when in fact it says nothing even remotely close to that or anything about the origin of life.   So it doesn't seem like they even read the phenomenally important "research" they claim is being suppressed.
Posted by: Kristine on Mar. 30 2008,18:10

Quote (Badidea @ Mar. 30 2008,13:53)
Lost his job with the.... *snip*
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


< Troy Britain gets at the real stories of firings >.


---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Nancey Murphy, a religious scholar at Fuller Theological Seminary in Pasadena, Calif., said she faced a campaign to get her fired because she expressed the view that intelligent design was not only poor theology, but so stupid, I dont want to give them my time.

Murphy, who believes in evolution, said she had to fight to keep her job after one of the founding members of the intelligent design movement, legal theorist Phillip Johnson, called a trustee at the seminary and tried to get her fired.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Okay, we've laughed at Ben Stein and his flapdoodle mates enough. Now it's time to really go after these frauds and expose them for who and what they are! :angry:
Posted by: snscience on Mar. 31 2008,19:52

Another example of an evangelical Christian expressing support for evolution and getting in some trouble for it is Dr. Richard Colling. He has for 24 years been Professor and Chair of the Biological Sciences Department at Olivet Nazarene University. He wrote the Book Random Designer and when a major financial supporter of the school objected to his pro-evolutionary stance, he was suspended from the classroom. I am not sure if there has been any resolution to this yet.
Posted by: godsilove on April 01 2008,03:30

Quote (Quidam @ Mar. 26 2008,23:50)

---------------------QUOTE-------------------


XXXpelled?
Posted by: Quidam on April 01 2008,16:48

I had to have a cold shower after shopping that one.  It was disturbing on so many levels. I can't pass a High School now without getting some very strange impulses.

I hope you appreciate the suffering I'm going through for your entertainment.
Posted by: carlsonjok on April 01 2008,18:46

Quote (Quidam @ April 01 2008,16:48)
I had to have a cold shower after shopping that one.  It was disturbing on so many levels. I can't pass a High School now without getting some very strange impulses.

I hope you appreciate the suffering I'm going through for your entertainment.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


You are truly a martyr for the cause. Thus, I bestow upon you your first HA HA THIS IS YOU.

HA HA THIS IS YOU


Posted by: J-Dog on April 01 2008,19:29

Quote (carlsonjok @ April 01 2008,18:46)
Quote (Quidam @ April 01 2008,16:48)
I had to have a cold shower after shopping that one. It was disturbing on so many levels. I can't pass a High School now without getting some very strange impulses.

I hope you appreciate the suffering I'm going through for your entertainment.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


You are truly a martyr for the cause. Thus, I bestow upon you your first HA HA THIS IS YOU.

HA HA THIS IS YOU


---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Quidam -That's beautiful! sniff... and you'll always remember your first time man....

we hope it was good for you too.
Posted by: Quidam on April 01 2008,21:06

I like the eXXXoelled idea, time for a revision

Posted by: Louis on April 02 2008,01:45

Quote (Quidam @ April 01 2008,22:48)
I had to have a cold shower after shopping that one. It was disturbing on so many levels. I can't pass a High School now without getting some very strange impulses.

I hope you appreciate the suffering I'm going through for your entertainment.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Strange impulses? What like wanting to argue about IDCreationism with sexy 18 year old schoolgirls in pigtails and short skirts?

That's the only impulse I can think of as being strange under those circumstances.

The ones about giving them a darn good rogering are of course perfectly normal, your Honour, and I stand by that.

Your sacrifice is noted. Recompense in the form of a naked Arden Chatfield will be sent to your abode forthwith.

Louis
Posted by: J-Dog on April 02 2008,09:02

Quote (Quidam @ April 01 2008,21:06)
I like the eXXXoelled idea, time for a revision

---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Umm...

Via a National Technical Means Intercept at Homeland Security, this latest exchange was downloaded and saved:


W. Dembski:
So, what do you get exactly for the $9.50 per minute?

B. Stein:  What? Who IS this?

Dial Tone
Posted by: Quidam on April 02 2008,09:40

W. Dembski:
So, what do you get exactly for the $9.50 per minute?

You get to explore your fantasy with someone who will agree with anything you say.

"Oooh - show me some specified complexity, sweety."

"Now that's what I call an Explanatory Filter, big boy!"

"I've been naughty, will you expel me again - please, Dr Dr?"

"I'll show you my black box if you show me your flagellum"

"Yeah baby, eject that atheist, now, now - Oh you missed one"

"It's OK Honey, I don't need results. No really it's all right, I'm used to it with cdesign proponentists."

"It's Dover now, or would you like another 5 minutes?"
Posted by: J-Dog on April 02 2008,10:09

SWEET!  ( or SWEAT?)

Come ON Quidam!  

Stop! - give somebody else a chance to get a Post Of The Week sticker.

Stop!  No! Don't stop...Don't Stop!
Posted by: Louis on April 02 2008,10:35

Quote (Quidam @ April 02 2008,15:40)
W. Dembski:
So, what do you get exactly for the $9.50 per minute?

You get to explore your fantasy with someone who will agree with anything you say.

"Oooh - show me some specified complexity, sweety."

"Now that's what I call an Explanatory Filter, big boy!"

"I've been naughty, will you expel me again - please, Dr Dr?"

"I'll show you my black box if you show me your flagellum"

"Yeah baby, eject that atheist, now, now - Oh you missed one"

"It's OK Honey, I don't need results. No really it's all right, I'm used to it with cdesign proponentists."

"It's Dover now, or would you like another 5 minutes?"
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Surely it should have ended with Dembski panting the word "Waterloo"?

Louis
Posted by: Quidam on April 02 2008,15:50

No Bonaparte, no Waterloo.

I don't think Dr Dr could get a Bonaparte, (unless he thinks of DO'L first)
Posted by: J-Dog on April 02 2008,17:13

Quote (Quidam @ April 02 2008,15:50)
No Bonaparte, no Waterloo.

I don't think Dr Dr could get a Bonaparte, (unless he thinks of DO'L first)
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


And based on all his other poor performance problems in the past, I don't think the Dr. Dr. is gonna have to pony up more that $9.50 either.
Posted by: Lou FCD on April 02 2008,20:43

Ben Stein.

Nazis.

Let's mosey on back in that direction, shall we?
Posted by: Quidam on April 02 2008,21:44

Not Nazi enough for you?

Ben can do Nazi Slut too, only $11.32/min

Posted by: Louis on April 03 2008,03:07

Quote (Lou FCD @ April 03 2008,02:43)
Ben Stein.

Nazis.

Let's mosey on back in that direction, shall we?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


No! Shan't! I'm going to hold my breath until you let me make willy jokes about Dr Dembski phoning HAWT STEAMY ID Chat lines.

{stands in corner, holding breath}

{stamps foot}

Louis

P.S. Nazi? Stein? Perhaps Stein is only following orders?
Posted by: Lou FCD on April 03 2008,07:05

Quote (Louis @ April 03 2008,04:07)
Quote (Lou FCD @ April 03 2008,02:43)
Ben Stein.

Nazis.

Let's mosey on back in that direction, shall we?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


No! Shan't! I'm going to hold my breath until you let me make willy jokes about Dr Dembski phoning HAWT STEAMY ID Chat lines.

{stands in corner, holding breath}

{stamps foot}

Louis

P.S. Nazi? Stein? Perhaps Stein is only following orders?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Now see, you could have gone the much pithier route of "< Jawohl Herr Kommandant! >".

That would have been funny.
Posted by: Louis on April 03 2008,07:27

Quote (Lou FCD @ April 03 2008,13:05)
Quote (Louis @ April 03 2008,04:07)
Quote (Lou FCD @ April 03 2008,02:43)
Ben Stein.

Nazis.

Let's mosey on back in that direction, shall we?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


No! Shan't! I'm going to hold my breath until you let me make willy jokes about Dr Dembski phoning HAWT STEAMY ID Chat lines.

{stands in corner, holding breath}

{stamps foot}

Louis

P.S. Nazi? Stein? Perhaps Stein is only following orders?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Now see, you could have gone the much pithier route of "< Jawohl Herr Kommandant! >".

That would have been funny.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Dammit did I screw up again?

In that case I shall redeem myself by some means fair or foul, oh yes I shall. I just don't know what it is yet.

Louis
Posted by: J-Dog on April 03 2008,08:18

Quote (Lou FCD @ April 03 2008,07:05)
Quote (Louis @ April 03 2008,04:07)
 
Quote (Lou FCD @ April 03 2008,02:43)
Ben Stein.

Nazis.

Let's mosey on back in that direction, shall we?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


No! Shan't! I'm going to hold my breath until you let me make willy jokes about Dr Dembski phoning HAWT STEAMY ID Chat lines.

{stands in corner, holding breath}

{stamps foot}

Louis

P.S. Nazi? Stein? Perhaps Stein is only following orders?
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Now see, you could have gone the much pithier route of "< Jawohl Herr Kommandant! >".

That would have been funny.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Ach!  General Lou FCD !  How Goot to see you again!

Ve vere chust talking about what a Great Moderator you are, weren't we , Ja?
Posted by: midwifetoad on April 03 2008,10:05


Posted by: J-Dog on April 03 2008,11:06

YES!  Me Likey!

Every generation has its Rebel Without A Clue.

Like some one who paints over an X with another X.


Can I has to update my Sig Line?

edited for maximum coolness
Posted by: midwifetoad on April 03 2008,11:18

Toad's gift to the world.
Posted by: FutureMD on April 17 2008,20:51

Hope I'm not too late to the photoshops

< http://img210.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bensteinliesmementomv4.jpg >
Posted by: Lou FCD on April 17 2008,21:00

Quote (FutureMD @ April 17 2008,21:51)
Hope I'm not too late to the photoshops

< http://img210.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bensteinliesmementomv4.jpg >
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


It's never too late for photoshops.
Posted by: FutureMD on April 17 2008,21:06


fixed it to show the picture
Posted by: Louis on April 18 2008,01:59

Quote (FutureMD @ April 18 2008,03:06)

fixed it to show the picture
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Love your work!

Well done.

Louis
Posted by: godsilove on April 18 2008,02:16

Some veritable photoshop geniuses in this thread.  Keep up the great work!
Posted by: Kristine on April 18 2008,12:50

Yes, well, I do not possess fabulous photoshop talents.

Im just a humble pseudoscience watcher who decided to blow up the famous still from the Patterson-Gimlin film of Patty



and found another film that Ben Neinstein wont acknowledge as having done for some $$$.



Too bad he never saw any of the major moulah that the Patty footage made for other people, either! :D
Posted by: pop16 on April 26 2008,10:42


Their < MySpace-Expelled > poll 26/4 kl. 16.25
Posted by: J-Dog on April 26 2008,18:48

Quote (pop16 @ April 26 2008,10:42)

Their < MySpace-Expelled > poll 26/4 kl. 16.25
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


pop16 - Pretty damn good first post!  

Watch out Quidam - there's a new kid in town...
Posted by: pop16 on April 27 2008,05:39

Quote (J-Dog @ April 26 2008,18:48)
pop16 - Pretty damn good first post!
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Thanks!
As "my" server is temporary down. Here is a link to the image on another server:
< http://www.evolutionsteori.se/images/expelled_poll.jpg >
Posted by: Lou FCD on April 27 2008,06:28

Quote (pop16 @ April 27 2008,06:39)
Quote (J-Dog @ April 26 2008,18:48)
pop16 - Pretty damn good first post!
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Thanks!
As "my" server is temporary down. Here is a link to the image on another server:
< http://www.evolutionsteori.se/images/expelled_poll.jpg >
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


It is a good first post, but at the bottom, shouldn't it read  

---------------------QUOTE-------------------
"MySpace by Spun Media"
---------------------QUOTE-------------------

?
Posted by: Quidam on April 27 2008,10:28

Quote (J-Dog @ April 26 2008,17:48)
Watch out Quidam - there's a new kid in town...
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Young Punks!
Too slow on the draw
Posted by: J-Dog on April 27 2008,11:30

and when PhotoShop Artists do battle -  We Win!
Posted by: Richardthughes on April 27 2008,13:04

This I didn't know:

< http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Weikart >



---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Weikart is best known for his 2004 book From Darwin to Hitler, Evolutionary Ethics, Eugenics and Racism in Germany.[2][3] This is controversial because of his association with the Discovery Institute that partly funded his research. Political Science professor Larry Arnhart states that "Weikart's book was financed by the Discovery Institute as part of their 'wedge strategy' for attacking Darwinian science as morally corrupting in its atheism."[4] This strategy aims to "defeat [the] materialist world view" represented by the theory of evolution in favor of "a science consonant with Christian and theistic convictions."[5]
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Posted by: Quidam on April 27 2008,18:59

It's all pretty incestuous.  

Isn't it great that we have the wedge document to predict their every move.  One day they'lll realize it's been made public and work out a new strategy.
Posted by: J-Dog on April 27 2008,20:05

Quote (Quidam @ April 27 2008,18:59)
It's all pretty incestuous.

Isn't it great that we have the wedge document to predict their every move. One day they'lll realize it's been made public and work out a new strategy.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



Quidam says: "It's all pretty incestuous."

Yes, based on their behavior, I think that what they are trying to do is make the world safe for incest. Incestuous Design anyone?

When ID is viewed in this new light, I think it explains an awful lot.
Posted by: Quidam on April 28 2008,10:23


Inspired by < Pharyngula > today




Posted by: Richardthughes on April 28 2008,10:24

Quote (Quidam @ April 28 2008,10:23)

Inspired by < Pharyingula > today
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


I have just done a sex we in my pants.

*applause*
Posted by: Tracy P. Hamilton on April 28 2008,10:28

Quote (Quidam @ April 28 2008,10:23)

Inspired by < Pharyingula > today
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Post of the week, there!  I hope it can get the notice of Pharyngula.
Posted by: Quidam on April 28 2008,10:36

I wish there was an edit button so that I could correct my spelling of Pharyngula.  

Oh well, what can I say, I are an enjinear.
Posted by: pop16 on May 07 2008,14:20


Posted by: Kristine on May 21 2008,15:34

Rev. Barky heard a "Clear Eyes" commercial today and < registered a complaint > about the spokesman. :)

"Science leads you to killing people." So we should let them know that eyedrops are murder. Right? :D
Posted by: Patashu on May 22 2008,19:18

It's OK to be a murderer because you were designed that way. People are not accountable for their actions, they were designed to act like that.
Posted by: Richardthughes on Aug. 14 2008,16:53

Kinda on-topic.

Check out this nugget:

< http://beastrabban.wordpress.com/2008....science >
Posted by: Mr_Christopher on Aug. 14 2008,17:16

Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 14 2008,16:53)
Kinda on-topic.

Check out this nugget:

< http://beastrabban.wordpress.com/2008....science >
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


That guy is an ass clown.  Read the last paragraph again.

He seems to have a very limited undersatanding of history, and completely ignored the naughty bits caused by Christianity.

There must be a stupid gene or something that guys like this carry.
Posted by: Assassinator on Aug. 14 2008,19:20

Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Aug. 14 2008,17:16)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 14 2008,16:53)
Kinda on-topic.

Check out this nugget:

< http://beastrabban.wordpress.com/2008....science >
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


That guy is an ass clown. Read the last paragraph again.

He seems to have a very limited undersatanding of history, and completely ignored the naughty bits caused by Christianity.

There must be a stupid gene or something that guys like this carry.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


That guy goes beyond stupid. He has lost any touch with reality, or so it seems. Almost made me vomit, that's one helluva thick vein o' tard.
Posted by: Richardthughes on Aug. 14 2008,20:12

Quote (Assassinator @ Aug. 14 2008,19:20)
Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Aug. 14 2008,17:16)
 
Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 14 2008,16:53)
Kinda on-topic.

Check out this nugget:

< http://beastrabban.wordpress.com/2008....science >
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


That guy is an ass clown. Read the last paragraph again.

He seems to have a very limited undersatanding of history, and completely ignored the naughty bits caused by Christianity.

There must be a stupid gene or something that guys like this carry.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


That guy goes beyond stupid. He has lost any touch with reality, or so it seems. Almost made me vomit, that's one helluva thick vein o' tard.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Feel free to add your $0.02. At least the posts go through straight away...
Posted by: Nomad on Aug. 15 2008,00:52

Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 14 2008,20:12)
Feel free to add your $0.02. At least the posts go through straight away...
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Mine don't appear to be...  I thought I'd sent a comment through once, but it never showed up.  I've recently sent it through again, with a bit of an addition of some more stuff that occurred to me in the interval, and it's still not appearing.

It's possible that my first post was somehow lost, or maybe I was being particularly scatterbrained and never sent it (I do that on occasion, I have a bad habit of reading multiple things at once and leaving posts or emails half written while I do so, sometimes I forget to send them).  And maybe this second time it's just taking a while to show up.

My post was no amazing revelation, I'm mostly harping on the same things other people already have commented on, but it just ticks me off.

I know, I know, someone is wrong on the Internet, big surprise.
Posted by: Assassinator on Aug. 15 2008,07:10

Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 14 2008,20:12)
Quote (Assassinator @ Aug. 14 2008,19:20)
Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Aug. 14 2008,17:16)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 14 2008,16:53)
Kinda on-topic.

Check out this nugget:

< http://beastrabban.wordpress.com/2008....science >
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


That guy is an ass clown. Read the last paragraph again.

He seems to have a very limited undersatanding of history, and completely ignored the naughty bits caused by Christianity.

There must be a stupid gene or something that guys like this carry.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


That guy goes beyond stupid. He has lost any touch with reality, or so it seems. Almost made me vomit, that's one helluva thick vein o' tard.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Feel free to add your $0.02. At least the posts go through straight away...
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Meeh, I've engaged in so many discussions like this over the past 2 years, I'm totally done with responding. Hence why I'm still hoping for some new, refreshing and creative tard.
Posted by: Erasmus, FCD on Aug. 15 2008,07:44



---------------------QUOTE-------------------
Hence why I'm still hoping for some new, refreshing and creative tard.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------



In creationism there is nothing new under the sun.  Only the parasitic hijacking of new discoveries made by actual science.  But I share your dream.
Posted by: Richardthughes on Aug. 15 2008,09:03

Looks like he's turned moderation on to stop the influx of facts:


So I'll park this here for a while:

"I never denied that they did. However, Darwinism and evolution created a whole new set of racial anxieties and provided a scientific, or pseudo-scientific, justification for racial extermination. "

But Hitler never mentions it:

< http://sneerreview.blogspot.com/2008/05/darwin-exposed.html >

;-)


John is correct, he does deny Common descent and in the first edition I believe leans towards a "young earth":

< http://evolutionlist.blogspot.com/2008/03/godwins-darwin.html >

"Like a creationist, Hitler asserts fixity of kinds:


"The fox remains always a fox, the goose remains a goose, and the tiger will retain the character of a tiger." - Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, vol. ii, ch. xi.


Like a creationist, Hitler claims that God made man:


"For it was by the Will of God that men were made of a certain bodily shape, were given their natures and their faculties." - Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, vol. ii, ch. x.


Like a creationist, Hitler affirms that humans existed "from the very beginning", and could not have evolved from apes:


"From where do we get the right to believe, that from the very beginning Man was not what he is today? Looking at Nature tells us, that in the realm of plants and animals changes and developments happen. But nowhere inside a kind shows such a development as the breadth of the jump , as Man must supposedly have made, if he has developed from an ape-like state to what he is today." - Adolf Hitler, Hitler's Tabletalk (Tischgesprache im Fuhrerhauptquartier).


Like a creationist, Hitler believes that man was made in God's image, and in the expulsion from Eden:


"Whoever would dare to raise a profane hand against that highest image of God among His creatures would sin against the bountiful Creator of this marvel and would collaborate in the expulsion from Paradise." - Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, vol ii, ch. i.


Like a creationist, Hitler believes that:


"God ... sent [us] into this world with the commission to struggle for our daily bread." - Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, vol ii, ch. xiv.


Like a creationist, Hitler claims Jesus as his inspiration:


"My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them." - Adolf Hitler, speech, April 12 1922, published in My New Order.


Like a creationist, Hitler despises secular schooling:


"Secular schools can never be tolerated because such schools have no religious instruction, and a general moral instruction without a religious foundation is built on air; consequently, all character training and religion must be derived from faith . . . we need believing people." - Adolf Hitler, Speech, April 26, 1933.


Hitler even goes so far as to claim that Creationism is what sets humans apart from the animals:


"The most marvelous proof of the superiority of Man, which puts man ahead of the animals, is the fact that he understands that there must be a Creator." - Adolf Hitler, Hitler's Tabletalk (Tischgesprache im Fuhrerhauptquartier).


Hitler does not mention evolution explicitly anywhere in Mein Kampf. However, after declaring the fixity of the fox, goose, and tiger, as quoted above, he goes on to talk of differences within species:


"[T]he various degrees of structural strength and active power, in the intelligence, efficiency, endurance, etc., with which the individual specimens are endowed." Mein Kampf, vol. ii, ch. xi.


So, like a creationist, there is some evolution he is prepared to concede -- evolution within species, or "microevolution", to which people like Phillip Johnson and Michael Behe have no objection. It is on the basis of the one part of evolutionary theory which creationists accept that Hitler tried to find a scientific basis for his racism and his program of eugenics.

Ergo, Hitler did not base his eugenic and genocidal policies on evolutionary theory, but rather on views that are very similar to those held by most creationists and many ID supporters."

Many Thanks to my good friend Allen MacNeil
Posted by: J-Dog on Aug. 15 2008,09:24

Rich - excellent post.

It should also be noted however, that

like an IDist on UD, by the 2nd edition of Mein Kampf,  most of the creo fundy nonsense stuff had been eliminated by someone more attuned to marketing than Adolf.

Probably an ancestor of Herr Rove.
Posted by: Nomad on Aug. 15 2008,15:21

Yes, moderation is on, but also my post did at first appear to be blocked because of the link to a site that lists some Nazi guidelines for banned books.  I removed the link and I at least got through to moderation.


I'll just repeat my favorite part, a new angle after Beast suggested that Hitler got his supposedly Darwinian thinking second hand through Haeckel.  He specifically mentioned the monists as well.  In the banned list you'll find:

"Writings of a philosophical and social nature whose content deals with the false scientific enlightenment of primitive Darwinism and Monism (Hckel)"

So they pretty much had it covered, Darwin, Haeckel, and the monists.  Darwinism was both insulted and banned.
Posted by: Richardthughes on Aug. 15 2008,15:28

I wonder how long he'll keep trying?
Posted by: Wesley R. Elsberry on Aug. 16 2008,04:06

< Sixteen years and still going... >
Posted by: Amadan on Aug. 27 2008,11:01

< What goes around comes around. > It'll be interesting to see who starts shouting the loudest about this in the ID camp.
Posted by: Arden Chatfield on Aug. 27 2008,12:18

Quote (Amadan @ Aug. 27 2008,09:01)
< What goes around comes around. > It'll be interesting to see who starts shouting the loudest about this in the ID camp.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


My prediction:

With a completely straight face, they will scream about how horribly inappropriate it is to compare your opponents to Hitler.

When presented with the double standard, they will (a) not reply or (b) say 'that's different'.
Posted by: dnmlthr on Aug. 27 2008,17:14

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Aug. 27 2008,18:18)
 
Quote (Amadan @ Aug. 27 2008,09:01)
< What goes around comes around. > It'll be interesting to see who starts shouting the loudest about this in the ID camp.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


My prediction:

With a completely straight face, they will scream about how horribly inappropriate it is to compare your opponents to Hitler.

When presented with the double standard, they will (a) not reply or (b) say 'that's different'.
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


Or c) accuse you of daily atheism
Posted by: Kristine on Jan. 11 2009,13:06

There are doctors that are killing people, again, in Germany. - Ben Stein on Glenn Beck's show.

Jeez, when it rains, it pours. I came across something quite ironic in my readings for my Academic Librarianship class:


---------------------QUOTE-------------------
The most profound influence on Johns Hopkins [University] was the German university. The place of science [in society] and the model of the German university are inextricably linked. In the abstract, this model focused on two central tenets--lehrfreiheit (the freedom to teach) and lernfreiheit (the freedom to learn). In the German model, and at Johns Hopkins, these ideals of freedom were best realized through individual freedom of inquiry. Less emphasis was placed on the lecturer and the teacher [after the British model, where presumably they also lecture on "Darwinism"] and more on the personal investigation of the learner (including both student and professor).
---------------------QUOTE-------------------


So...Stein is basically advocating (or claiming to advocate) for the German model of teaching. But they shoot people, don't they?

"Science leads you to killing people!" :p What a mess.
Posted by: Henry J on Jan. 24 2017,11:49

Good grief.

ETA: never mind.
Posted by: Milesunath on Nov. 21 2017,15:42

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