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Antievolution.org Discussion Board > From the Panda's Thumb > After the Bar Closes... > Uncommonly Dense Thread 4

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REC Posts: 638 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2012,23:31    Quote (sparc @ Feb. 09 2012,23:27) Regarding the discussion about UD I would argue that sites like UD are the best Idiots like Dembski could have done fot their oponents. The comments by their followers display what ID means. Without them Dembski and the othe Idiots would just run fake journal pages like "Bio-Complexity" and fake labs like "Biologic Institute" and pretend to being serious scholars who are just ignored by mainstream science. Thus, the best thing for our side is if UD is kept alive and even better if it is run by people like Barry Arrington. Though....now that Barry has freed up about a half-hour per week...maybe I should fire off an article to Bio-complexity. Anyone want in? Suggestions on topic?

REC Posts: 638 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 09 2012,23:57    News: Quote Appeals to the authority of science are like appeals to the authority of the stock market. Anti-capitalist. Socialist. The logic of the free market reigns supreme.

CeilingCat Posts: 2363 Joined: Dec. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,00:14    Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Feb. 09 2012,15:50) which* one of you guys* is Zoe* again LMAO* shit* is too coherent* to be batshit* too complicated* to be joe* not* enough* hate* for KF*( Gen 1: 21, Emphasis added) (See also vv. 24,25) Fixed that for you. Edited to add highly scientific Bible verse.

paragwinn Posts: 539 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,00:20    Quote (REC @ Feb. 09 2012,20:30) Jammers found my bio.....aaaannnddd Cue the hate mail. Given who's been cc'ed tomorrow should be interesting. I tried to warn jammers about one of the possible consequences of his action. My money is on the chirping crickets. eta: correct identity of unveiler. how many veils left, DrREC? -------------- All women build up a resistance [to male condescension]. Apparently, ID did not predict that. -Kristine 4-19-11 F/Ns to F/Ns to F/Ns etc. The whole thing is F/N ridiculous -Seversky on KF footnote fetish 8-20-11 Sigh. Really Bill? - Barry Arrington

keiths Posts: 2195 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,02:27    Quote (Freddie @ Feb. 09 2012,13:11) keiths ... well played.  I very much enjoyed and appreciated your darned woolly posts at the asylum.  Champion Champignon indeed! Quote (Soapy Sam @ Feb. 09 2012,12:52) For shame! Many good posts under the mushroom banner. Anyone would think they didn't welcome critical examination of their scientific position... I did wonder if you were sailing a tad close to the wind calling KF a liar and hypocrite! Thanks, guys.  Yeah, I knew I was taking a risk, but my two main sock rules are 1) don't say anything you can't back up, and 2) don't censor yourself just to avoid bannination.  Rule 2 has cost me plenty of socks, but Rule 1 means I earn my banninations honestly. -------------- And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number. -- Joe G Please stop putting words into my mouth that don't belong there and thoughts into my mind that don't belong there. -- KF

keiths Posts: 2195 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,02:39    Quote (sparc @ Feb. 09 2012,21:20)     Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Feb. 09 2012,15:50) which one of you guys is Zoe again LMAO shit is too coherent to be batshit too complicated to be joe Not enough hate for KF not sure about KF. Back in 2009 I speculated if KairosFocus aka Gordon Elliot Mullings aka dictionary is identical with Zoe based on quite some evidence. You may be right, sparc. This sentence of Zoe's has the stench of KF all over it: Quote The only religious Worlview, across comparative difficulties, premised on warranted, credible facts and evidence, that meet and sustain to, all three of test, is the Historic Judeo/christian Worldview. And check this out: Quote And, Zoe is speaking in outline of worldview foundations... He has put forth a serious and provocative thesis... Zoe has also said something very important... And, as Zoe points out... -------------- And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number. -- Joe G Please stop putting words into my mouth that don't belong there and thoughts into my mind that don't belong there. -- KF

Soapy Sam Posts: 659 Joined: Jan. 2012 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,03:11    Joe eats information Not only matter and energy, but Information and "Life", went into Joe's pizza. And the information, apparently, is separately processed. -------------- SoapySam is a pathetic asswiper. Joe G BTW, when you make little jabs like “I thought basic logic was one thing UDers could handle,” you come off looking especially silly when you turn out to be wrong. - Barry Arrington

Reciprocating Bill Posts: 4265 Joined: Oct. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,03:54    Quote (keiths @ Feb. 10 2012,03:39)                 Quote (sparc @ Feb. 09 2012,21:20)                       Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Feb. 09 2012,15:50) which one of you guys is Zoe again LMAO shit is too coherent to be batshit too complicated to be joe Not enough hate for KF not sure about KF. Back in 2009 I speculated if KairosFocus aka Gordon Elliot Mullings aka dictionary is identical with Zoe based on quite some evidence. You may be right, sparc. This sentence of Zoe's has the stench of KF all over it:           Quote The only religious Worlview, across comparative difficulties, premised on warranted, credible facts and evidence, that meet and sustain to, all three of test, is the Historic Judeo/christian Worldview. And check this out:           Quote And, Zoe is speaking in outline of worldview foundations... He has put forth a serious and provocative thesis... Zoe has also said something very important... And, as Zoe points out... There is other evidence that "Zoe" is Gordon. Zoe has repeatedly posted this chestnut, or fragments thereof, at the blog "Barbados Underground," supplying a Caribbean connection. Links to examples follow, although click with care, as these are slow loading, Flash laden pages that cause my browser to beachball for quite some time: Examples here and here. Somebody posting as Carlos Jordon has posted a version here. And indeed in response to one of Zoe's repetitions on Barbados Underground another commenter states:   Quote You see. this is a struggle for me and I dont want to be drawn into this argument (been there, done that with GP, Carlos, Gem of TKI etc.) On Gordon's own blag he links to and extensively quotes comments from a page on Barbados Underground. Although not quoted, those comments include yet another copy of Zoe's sermon on truth. (Another commenter named technician IS* quoted responding, "@ Zoe…..please dont start with your crap !!!") Further, on UD we find KF welcoming Zoe to UD, several favorable comments upon his contributions, and the repeated use of Zoe's comments to advance his own long-winded points. Gordon is lonely. He created Zoe for company. (And if he uses his left hand it feels like someone is really there.) [Edit: corrections vis Gordon's blag] -------------- Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be. "The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace "Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down." - Barry Arrington

Freddie Posts: 371 Joined: Oct. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,04:56    Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Feb. 10 2012,03:54)   Quote (keiths @ Feb. 10 2012,03:39)                     Quote (sparc @ Feb. 09 2012,21:20)                           Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Feb. 09 2012,15:50) which one of you guys is Zoe again LMAO shit is too coherent to be batshit too complicated to be joe Not enough hate for KF not sure about KF. Back in 2009 I speculated if KairosFocus aka Gordon Elliot Mullings aka dictionary is identical with Zoe based on quite some evidence. You may be right, sparc. This sentence of Zoe's has the stench of KF all over it:               Quote The only religious Worlview, across comparative difficulties, premised on warranted, credible facts and evidence, that meet and sustain to, all three of test, is the Historic Judeo/christian Worldview. And check this out:               Quote And, Zoe is speaking in outline of worldview foundations... He has put forth a serious and provocative thesis... Zoe has also said something very important... And, as Zoe points out... There is other evidence that "Zoe" is Gordon. Zoe has repeatedly posted this chestnut, or fragments thereof, at the blog "Barbados Underground," supplying a Caribbean connection. Links to examples follow, although click with care, as these are slow loading, Flash laden pages that cause my browser to beachball for quite some time: Examples here and here. Somebody posting as Carlos Jordon has posted a version here. And indeed in response to one of Zoe's repetitions on Barbados Underground another commenter states:       Quote You see. this is a struggle for me and I dont want to be drawn into this argument (been there, done that with GP, Carlos, Gem of TKI etc.) On Gordon's own blag he links to and extensively quotes comments from a page on Barbados Underground. Although not quoted, those comments include yet another copy of Zoe's sermon on truth. (Another commenter named technician IS* quoted responding, "@ Zoe…..please dont start with your crap !!!") Further, on UD we find KF welcoming Zoe to UD, several favorable comments upon his contributions, and the repeated use of Zoe's comments to advance his own long-winded points. Gordon is lonely. He created Zoe for company. (And if he uses his left hand it feels like someone is really there.) [Edit: corrections vis Gordon's blag] I have a different theory (not to be confused with a well constructed scientific hypothesis, of course).   The prose and worldview are similar, however I find it impossible to believe (unless he is as capable of maintaining such a facade as Aaron in Primal Fear) that he can keep the pretence going over several years without reverting more closely to the writing style of gordon e. mullings of montserrat.  Then there is the brown nosing that goes on between them. I suspect Zoe is a hopelessly indoctrinated disciple (probably the star pupil) from his school of Renewal and Reformation, the "Kairos Initiative" ... that Gordon knows full well who Zoe really is and probably even persuaded he/she to start posting there.  This would be an almost as interesting ethical dilemma as KF posting as two different users on the same board.  If anyone cared about such things w.r.t. the  IDealogues over there, that is. Now, how to test the theory? (I can does science too although i am not one, not even a lawyer or a forensik man). -------------- Joe: Most criticisims of ID stem from ignorance and jealousy. Joe: As for the authors of the books in the Bible, well the OT was authored by Moses and the NT was authored by various people. Byers: The eskimo would not need hairy hair growth as hair, I say, is for keeping people dry. Not warm.

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,05:14    Here is around 50KB of "Zoe": http://pastebin.com/wUFRW1q....UFRW1qG -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,05:15    I'd say, if Zoe and KF are the same person, that Zoe is where KF let's his evangelical side hang out: Quote Yes, there is overwhelming factual scientific evidence* facts, supporting the creation narrative account, thousands of years AFTER* the FACT*, by literally MILLIONS of Fossil finds, all of which, each and every time they are discovered, no matter where on earth, or in the sea, each and every time, regardless of the species, they ALL appear ‘abruptly’ that IS* fully and comletely FORMED* exactly as they were Created* in the first place by Almighty God. Yes, I’m fully aware of all the facy, pseudo-scientific jargon that Evolutionists create, invent, such as ‘punctuated equilibrium theory’ and other such like fantacies, deviously for their own agenda, to keep Almighty God, our Creator, out of, their Atheist mind-set, and the Universe He Created and sustains. -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Soapy Sam Posts: 659 Joined: Jan. 2012 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,05:45    Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 10 2012,05:15) I'd say, if Zoe and KF are the same person I'd vote for not. That emphatic asterisk (I keep looking for a footnote) appears all over Zoe, but not in K/F, and other markers of common descent are absent in the other direction. I don't think he has the wit to keep two personas up-and-running. But the styles, the prose and the smackable certitude are certainly very close cousins. -------------- SoapySam is a pathetic asswiper. Joe G BTW, when you make little jabs like “I thought basic logic was one thing UDers could handle,” you come off looking especially silly when you turn out to be wrong. - Barry Arrington

k.e.. Posts: 5432 Joined: May 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,05:53    Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 10 2012,13:15) I'd say, if Zoe and KF are the same person, that Zoe is where KF let's his evangelical side hang out: Quote Yes, there is overwhelming factual scientific evidence* facts, supporting the creation narrative account, thousands of years AFTER* the FACT*, by literally MILLIONS of Fossil finds, all of which, each and every time they are discovered, no matter where on earth, or in the sea, each and every time, regardless of the species, they ALL appear ‘abruptly’ that IS* fully and comletely FORMED* exactly as they were Created* in the first place by Almighty God. Yes, I’m fully aware of all the facy, pseudo-scientific jargon that Evolutionists create, invent, such as ‘punctuated equilibrium theory’ and other such like fantacies, deviously for their own agenda, to keep Almighty God, our Creator, out of, their Atheist mind-set, and the Universe He Created and sustains. Right, so neither of them have a sense of humour? -------------- "I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit "ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus "I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

The whole truth Posts: 1554 Joined: Jan. 2012 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,06:14    Quote (keiths @ Feb. 10 2012,00:27) Quote (Freddie @ Feb. 09 2012,13:11) keiths ... well played.  I very much enjoyed and appreciated your darned woolly posts at the asylum.  Champion Champignon indeed!   Quote (Soapy Sam @ Feb. 09 2012,12:52) For shame! Many good posts under the mushroom banner. Anyone would think they didn't welcome critical examination of their scientific position... I did wonder if you were sailing a tad close to the wind calling KF a liar and hypocrite! Thanks, guys.  Yeah, I knew I was taking a risk, but my two main sock rules are 1) don't say anything you can't back up, and 2) don't censor yourself just to avoid bannination.  Rule 2 has cost me plenty of socks, but Rule 1 means I earn my banninations honestly. Kudos to you and your standards. -------------- Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. - Jesus in Matthew 10:34 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. -Jesus in Luke 19:27

Erasmus, FCD Posts: 6349 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,06:34    Quote (k.e.. @ Feb. 10 2012,06:53) Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 10 2012,13:15) I'd say, if Zoe and KF are the same person, that Zoe is where KF let's his evangelical side hang out:   Quote Yes, there is overwhelming factual scientific evidence* facts, supporting the creation narrative account, thousands of years AFTER* the FACT*, by literally MILLIONS of Fossil finds, all of which, each and every time they are discovered, no matter where on earth, or in the sea, each and every time, regardless of the species, they ALL appear ‘abruptly’ that IS* fully and comletely FORMED* exactly as they were Created* in the first place by Almighty God. Yes, I’m fully aware of all the facy, pseudo-scientific jargon that Evolutionists create, invent, such as ‘punctuated equilibrium theory’ and other such like fantacies, deviously for their own agenda, to keep Almighty God, our Creator, out of, their Atheist mind-set, and the Universe He Created and sustains. Right, so neither of them have a sense of humour? they do, it's just centered around the smoke eternally rising from your charring soul -------------- You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

Erasmus, FCD Posts: 6349 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,06:36    how many pupils does this cocksmoke have at UD where he now spends most of his time? zero as far as i can tell the probability that another person would find his bullshit appealing is near nil, as far as i can tell.  from observing how the UDers deal with him, anyway -------------- You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

The whole truth Posts: 1554 Joined: Jan. 2012 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,06:47    Quote (Robin @ Feb. 09 2012,06:03) Quote (The whole truth @ Feb. 09 2012,02:17) The reason I brought up importance is partly due to some comments by you and others and partly due to this question from Erasmus: "who gives a fuck what they think?" I think it's fair to say that most or all people here (at ATBC) care about what's said at UD (and elsewhere) by the IDiots (and by their opponents). Otherwise they likely wouldn't be here, or at least wouldn't stick around for long. The level of importance from one person to another undoubtedly varies, but I don't think that anyone here can honestly say that what the IDiots do or say (or "think") is completely unimportant. I realize that we all have our own way of dealing with things, and I'm not trying to 'make' any ID opponents change their methods. I'm just speaking up about something that bugs me and hoping to influence EL to consider some things. I do feel strongly about it but I know that she can, and will, ultimately do whatever she wants. To prevent any misunderstanding, by "this site" I meant ATBC. I agree for the most part, though I could quibble with you about your choice of the word "important". I certainly don't find what goes on at UD important in a strict sense of the term:   Quote Adjective:    1. Of great significance or value; likely to have a profound effect on success, survival, or well-being: "important habitats for wildlife".   2.  (of a person) Having high rank or status. For me, UD is more compelling than important. The discussions and behavior there are indicative of a mindset that I find a little shocking, a little frightening at times, and unbelievable, but also fascinating. I'll engage in discussions there every so often just to see how they defend what I see as an obviously ignorant and erroneous claim. Still, I agree with you in principle - a lot of us would not come to AtBC if not for UD, so clearly most of us care about UD...at least in the sense that we care enough about what they say and how they behave to gather and comment on it. I am still curious though - what do you think one of the UD folks "pouncing" on a weak Lizzie would look like? What do you think would happen that would be significant in some way? Pouncing on a weak EL would look like the way she's treated at UD, especially by the most arrogant assholes there. You may have noticed that some ID opponents are treated differently than others at UD. Bullies, which is what most or all of the IDiots are, are much more likely to pounce on what they perceive as an easy victim, and that's especially true when the bullies are part of a 'gang', like the IDiots at UD are. If someone (e.g EL) shows weaknesses, even though they show strengths too, the predators at UD, and especially the most arrogant ones, are going to pounce on those weaknesses. The weaknesses enable and embolden the IDiots, and it should be obvious that most or all of the IDiots need see only a tiny bit of weakness to trigger their pounce reaction. They are looking for weaknesses. The vast majority of their thinking and their arguments are based on their desire to attack, dominate, and destroy any opponents. That desire is the driving force behind their mindset and agenda. Whether something is compelling, important, or significant is up to each individual. I used the word important because it's what came to mind at the time, and I still think that it's an appropriate word for my points. Debating the specifically applicable term seems rather useless to me. I realize that you or others do not or may not agree with the words I use and that I may not always choose the right words, but I stand by what I've said. I think that the overall points I've made are valid. -------------- Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. - Jesus in Matthew 10:34 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. -Jesus in Luke 19:27

The whole truth Posts: 1554 Joined: Jan. 2012 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,06:56    Quote (REC @ Feb. 09 2012,21:31) Quote (sparc @ Feb. 09 2012,23:27) Regarding the discussion about UD I would argue that sites like UD are the best Idiots like Dembski could have done fot their oponents. The comments by their followers display what ID means. Without them Dembski and the othe Idiots would just run fake journal pages like "Bio-Complexity" and fake labs like "Biologic Institute" and pretend to being serious scholars who are just ignored by mainstream science. Thus, the best thing for our side is if UD is kept alive and even better if it is run by people like Barry Arrington. Though....now that Barry has freed up about a half-hour per week...maybe I should fire off an article to Bio-complexity. Anyone want in? Suggestions on topic? How about an article on the the ignorance, dishonesty, and redundancy of the assertions of IDiots, and the underlying causes?  :) -------------- Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. - Jesus in Matthew 10:34 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. -Jesus in Luke 19:27

k.e.. Posts: 5432 Joined: May 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,07:05    Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Feb. 10 2012,14:34) Quote (k.e.. @ Feb. 10 2012,06:53) Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 10 2012,13:15) I'd say, if Zoe and KF are the same person, that Zoe is where KF let's his evangelical side hang out:   Quote Yes, there is overwhelming factual scientific evidence* facts, supporting the creation narrative account, thousands of years AFTER* the FACT*, by literally MILLIONS of Fossil finds, all of which, each and every time they are discovered, no matter where on earth, or in the sea, each and every time, regardless of the species, they ALL appear ‘abruptly’ that IS* fully and comletely FORMED* exactly as they were Created* in the first place by Almighty God. Yes, I’m fully aware of all the facy, pseudo-scientific jargon that Evolutionists create, invent, such as ‘punctuated equilibrium theory’ and other such like fantacies, deviously for their own agenda, to keep Almighty God, our Creator, out of, their Atheist mind-set, and the Universe He Created and sustains. Right, so neither of them have a sense of humour? they do, it's just centered around the smoke eternally rising from your charring soul ...ah yes the bonfire of the vanities.. a great christain tradition -------------- "I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit "ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus "I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

Freddie Posts: 371 Joined: Oct. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,07:08    Quote (Soapy Sam @ Feb. 10 2012,05:45) Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 10 2012,05:15) I'd say, if Zoe and KF are the same person I'd vote for not. That emphatic asterisk (I keep looking for a footnote) appears all over Zoe, but not in K/F, and other markers of common descent are absent in the other direction. I don't think he has the wit to keep two personas up-and-running. But the styles, the prose and the smackable certitude are certainly very close cousins. What is it with creationists and the inappropriate use of punctuation marks? -------------- Joe: Most criticisims of ID stem from ignorance and jealousy. Joe: As for the authors of the books in the Bible, well the OT was authored by Moses and the NT was authored by various people. Byers: The eskimo would not need hairy hair growth as hair, I say, is for keeping people dry. Not warm.

The whole truth Posts: 1554 Joined: Jan. 2012 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,07:09    Quote (Freddie @ Feb. 10 2012,02:56) Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Feb. 10 2012,03:54)     Quote (keiths @ Feb. 10 2012,03:39)                       Quote (sparc @ Feb. 09 2012,21:20)                             Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Feb. 09 2012,15:50) which one of you guys is Zoe again LMAO shit is too coherent to be batshit too complicated to be joe Not enough hate for KF not sure about KF. Back in 2009 I speculated if KairosFocus aka Gordon Elliot Mullings aka dictionary is identical with Zoe based on quite some evidence. You may be right, sparc. This sentence of Zoe's has the stench of KF all over it:                 Quote The only religious Worlview, across comparative difficulties, premised on warranted, credible facts and evidence, that meet and sustain to, all three of test, is the Historic Judeo/christian Worldview. And check this out:                 Quote And, Zoe is speaking in outline of worldview foundations... He has put forth a serious and provocative thesis... Zoe has also said something very important... And, as Zoe points out... There is other evidence that "Zoe" is Gordon. Zoe has repeatedly posted this chestnut, or fragments thereof, at the blog "Barbados Underground," supplying a Caribbean connection. Links to examples follow, although click with care, as these are slow loading, Flash laden pages that cause my browser to beachball for quite some time: Examples here and here. Somebody posting as Carlos Jordon has posted a version here. And indeed in response to one of Zoe's repetitions on Barbados Underground another commenter states:         Quote You see. this is a struggle for me and I dont want to be drawn into this argument (been there, done that with GP, Carlos, Gem of TKI etc.) On Gordon's own blag he links to and extensively quotes comments from a page on Barbados Underground. Although not quoted, those comments include yet another copy of Zoe's sermon on truth. (Another commenter named technician IS* quoted responding, "@ Zoe…..please dont start with your crap !!!") Further, on UD we find KF welcoming Zoe to UD, several favorable comments upon his contributions, and the repeated use of Zoe's comments to advance his own long-winded points. Gordon is lonely. He created Zoe for company. (And if he uses his left hand it feels like someone is really there.) [Edit: corrections vis Gordon's blag] I have a different theory (not to be confused with a well constructed scientific hypothesis, of course).   The prose and worldview are similar, however I find it impossible to believe (unless he is as capable of maintaining such a facade as Aaron in Primal Fear) that he can keep the pretence going over several years without reverting more closely to the writing style of gordon e. mullings of montserrat.  Then there is the brown nosing that goes on between them. I suspect Zoe is a hopelessly indoctrinated disciple (probably the star pupil) from his school of Renewal and Reformation, the "Kairos Initiative" ... that Gordon knows full well who Zoe really is and probably even persuaded he/she to start posting there.  This would be an almost as interesting ethical dilemma as KF posting as two different users on the same board.  If anyone cared about such things w.r.t. the  IDealogues over there, that is. Now, how to test the theory? (I can does science too although i am not one, not even a lawyer or a forensik man). I'm inclined to go along with the "hopelessly indoctrinated disciple (probably the star pupil)" idea, although anything's possible. -------------- Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. - Jesus in Matthew 10:34 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. -Jesus in Luke 19:27

Reciprocating Bill Posts: 4265 Joined: Oct. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,08:09    Googling fragments of Zoetext from Oldman's sample it becomes obvious that a large percentage of his output is cut and pasted from other sources. So there is a third alternative: Zoe has has large chunks of genuine KF in his stool, including the passages quoted upthread. Passages with the unmistakeable texture of KF are in fact Gordon - yet Zoe is not. -------------- Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be. "The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace "Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down." - Barry Arrington

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,08:16    One such source: http://www.peterkreeft.com/audio....ion.htm -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,08:21    Barry: Quote Glad to. If someone comes onto my site and calls me that name, they can expect to be identified so that the whole world can know whose dispicable behavior is on view and then banned. http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-419848 -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Erasmus, FCD Posts: 6349 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,08:23    Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 10 2012,09:21) Barry:   Quote Glad to. If someone comes onto my site and calls me that name, they can expect to be identified so that the whole world can know whose dispicable behavior is on view and then banned. http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-419848 whats even more hilarious is that 1)  no one actually called that prick a "prick" and 2)  the prick ostensibly *has* a prick yet finds it despicable LMFFFFAO -------------- You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

Reciprocating Bill Posts: 4265 Joined: Oct. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,08:31    I do believe we have a promising start to a Friday meltdown on our hands. -------------- Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be. "The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace "Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down." - Barry Arrington

OgreMkV Posts: 3668 Joined: Oct. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,08:38    That is a fantastic thread.  The blatant hypocrisy is there for all to see. I especially love Gordon's "reverse appeal to authority", i.e. the dismissing of a lawyer's data because he's a lawyer complaint. paraphrase: You should dismiss the argument on the facts, not the job of the presenter. Of course, the facts are that Johnson doesn't have a clue about what's going on, or if he does have clue, then he is misrepresenting the facts to support his position. It's not that Johnson is a lawyer, it's that he's Phillip Johnson. -------------- Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims. http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

Tracy P. Hamilton Posts: 1239 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,09:05    Quote (Freddie @ Feb. 10 2012,07:08) Quote (Soapy Sam @ Feb. 10 2012,05:45) Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Feb. 10 2012,05:15) I'd say, if Zoe and KF are the same person I'd vote for not. That emphatic asterisk (I keep looking for a footnote) appears all over Zoe, but not in K/F, and other markers of common descent are absent in the other direction. I don't think he has the wit to keep two personas up-and-running. But the styles, the prose and the smackable certitude are certainly very close cousins. What is it with creationists and the inappropriate use of punctuation marks? What you talkin' bout, Freddie,,,,,,,,,,,, -------------- "Following what I just wrote about fitness, you’re taking refuge in what we see in the world."  PaV "The simple equation F = MA leads to the concept of four-dimensional space." GilDodgen "We have no brain, I don't, for thinking." Robert Byers

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,09:35    Peter Griffin (who, he?) collects together some of Joe's recent insults and pastes them into a single comment. KF says: Quote Joe: Pardon, but if you have been speaking in that way [and it looks like the clips are accurate, from your responses . . . ], I suggest you will find it best to dial back your tone a few notches. We in the main need to focus on issues not personalities. Controversial matters are best addressed in that way, otherwise the sidetracks will tend to derail serious discussion. KF Barry says: Quote I agree with KF Joe. You are warned. http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-419857 Funny how Joe get's a warning after dozens of "offences" and others are insta-banned after one... -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Robin Posts: 1431 Joined: Sep. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Feb. 10 2012,09:55    Quote (REC @ Feb. 09 2012,21:37) The sad thing is that the Barry only got mad when I asked him to explain if appeal to authority was always a fallacy, and what an "expert witness" is. Those posts have gone missing. Well poop! I will miss your and Keith's posts over there. Very good stuff! -------------- we IDists rule in design for the flagellum and cilium largely because they do look designed.  Bilbo The only reason you reject Thor is because, like a cushion, you bear the imprint of the biggest arse that sat on you. Louis

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