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  Topic: The Skeptical Zone, with Lizzie< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Woodbine



Posts: 1197
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 19 2017,06:32   


  
fnxtr



Posts: 2564
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 19 2017,08:48   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....8dx-h8M

--------------
"But it's disturbing to think someone actually thinks creationism -- having put it's hand on the hot stove every day for the last 400 years -- will get a different result tomorrow." -- midwifetoad

"I am in a rush to catch up with science work." -- Gary Gaulin

  
k.e..



Posts: 3854
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 19 2017,08:56   

I agree that Byers brain doesn't think it is a brain.



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"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
stevestory



Posts: 10371
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 19 2017,10:15   

Quote (fnxtr @ April 19 2017,09:48)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....8dx-h8M

If Byers was hopelessly addicted to bath salts and veterinary tranquilizers, that might explain a few things.

   
clamboy



Posts: 217
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 19 2017,22:41   

KN provided, in "Moderation Issues", a pretty good defense, or maybe explanation, of fifthmonarchyman's behavior, pointing out that FMM does not, and indeed can not, use words according to their generally accepted definitions, and that when FMM says that all people know the Christian god exists and is the only god capable of existing, FMM really does mean it.

FMM and their position of presuppositionalism makes me want to write an original post, in light of the spike in sales of the novel "1984" since last November's American election. FMM reminds me of O'Brien, especially when that character is talking to Winston Smith in the Ministry of Love after Smith's arrest and routine torture. Smith foolishly attempts to use reason when responding to O'Brien, as if O'Brien could actually be convinced that his position is even questionable. When Patrick (sorry to pick on you again, Patrick) demands that FMM "put up or shut up", that is the equivalent of Smith demanding O'Brien defend his, or rather, The Party's, view. To FMM, Patrick is, like Smith to O'Brien, insane. (Further ETA: the same holds for keiths, who continues to point out what, to many, would be considered proper points of contention. But again, keiths is, to FMM, insane.)

I hope that makes sense. I have been doing some reading on presuppositionalism, pro and con, and I think my take is a right one. Debate is impossible since, for FMM, holding a position contrary to theirs is, by definition, irrational (ETA: and you already know that FMM's position is the correct one, you are simply stuck in - what? - a state of rebellion against what you know to be true). It's weird, but that is what presuppositionalism entails.

  
stevestory



Posts: 10371
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 20 2017,00:30   

You can't use reason to argue against a presupposationalist, because they assume that your reasoning, lacking the necessary christian perspective, must be inferior to their belief. But it's a double-edged sword. Since our reasoning must be defective, what hope is there that he can convince us that he's correct? None. According to his own argument he's pointlessly wasting his time.

FMM is lost in an especially labyrinthine form of cluelessness.

   
clamboy



Posts: 217
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 20 2017,00:48   

Except, FMM has repeatedly asserted that they are not proposing an argument. FMM is merely stating what they know (for a certain definition of "know") to be true.

Wacky, yes, but the wacky interests me.

  
stevestory



Posts: 10371
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 20 2017,10:08   

But he's not just picking random internet pages and making random comments. Saying what he's saying, where he's saying it, implies some kinda argumentation. Although FMM is incredibly clueless, so I suppose he doesn't understand that either.

Sakes alive, I just went and checked out the latest three comment threads, and it's a garbage dump over there. 4-5 people quarreling over who insulted who and whether or not it was justified.

Ugh.

Edited by stevestory on April 20 2017,11:09

   
stevestory



Posts: 10371
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 20 2017,10:12   

In general, most good websites have a clear purpose. If TSZ has one, I haven't divined what it is.

   
fnxtr



Posts: 2564
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 20 2017,12:56   

Quote (stevestory @ April 20 2017,08:12)
In general, most good websites have a clear purpose. If TSZ has one, I haven't divined what it is.


To be the. Monster Trucks mudpit of ID?

--------------
"But it's disturbing to think someone actually thinks creationism -- having put it's hand on the hot stove every day for the last 400 years -- will get a different result tomorrow." -- midwifetoad

"I am in a rush to catch up with science work." -- Gary Gaulin

  
Alan Fox



Posts: 1400
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 20 2017,15:29   

Quote (stevestory @ April 20 2017,05:12)
In general, most good websites have a clear purpose. If TSZ has one, I haven't divined what it is.

You could read the "about" page. Dr Elizabeth Liddle, the blog founder and owner, sets out her stall quite clearly. On the other hand, her last active participation (apart from one comment in November 2016) was back in January, 2016.

She built it. People came. Any forum is only as good as the people that contribute.

  
Alan Fox



Posts: 1400
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 20 2017,15:32   

Quote
FMM and their position of presuppositionalism makes me want to write an original post, in light of the spike in sales of the novel "1984" since last November's American election.


You'd be very welcome! I see you are already registered there.

  
Patrick



Posts: 608
Joined: July 2011

(Permalink) Posted: April 20 2017,22:11   

Quote (clamboy @ April 19 2017,23:41)
When Patrick (sorry to pick on you again, Patrick) demands that FMM "put up or shut up", that is the equivalent of Smith demanding O'Brien defend his, or rather, The Party's, view. To FMM, Patrick is, like Smith to O'Brien, insane.

Pick away.

I'm not yet personally insane enough to expect FMM to actually support his views.  It is, however, The Skeptical Zone, so I feel something of an obligation to keep asking.

  
Patrick



Posts: 608
Joined: July 2011

(Permalink) Posted: April 20 2017,22:12   

Quote (Alan Fox @ April 20 2017,16:32)
Quote
FMM and their position of presuppositionalism makes me want to write an original post, in light of the spike in sales of the novel "1984" since last November's American election.


You'd be very welcome! I see you are already registered there.

Hear, hear!

  
JohnW



Posts: 2825
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 31 2017,15:12   

I was amused to see this at TSZ:
Quote
My talk addresses the design of chromatin and the problem of evil.

It's not satire, it's Sal.

--------------
Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers

There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

  
Quack



Posts: 1959
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: June 02 2017,13:28   

Saltire?

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Rocks have no biology.
              Robert Byers.

  
clamboy



Posts: 217
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 14 2017,19:48   

Despite forays into civilized discussion, phoodoo remains a horrific troll, and continues to sink and sink:

http://theskepticalzone.com/wp....-179079

  
paragwinn



Posts: 518
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 12 2017,00:12   

Something with which to set off a chain reaction of explodey heads at TSZ: Stochastic Supertasks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....V0L99sw

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All women build up a resistance [to male condescension]. Apparently, ID did not predict that. -Kristine 4-19-11
F/Ns to F/Ns to F/Ns etc. The whole thing is F/N ridiculous -Seversky on KF footnote fetish 8-20-11
Sigh. Really Bill? - Barry Arrington

  
fnxtr



Posts: 2564
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 12 2017,00:51   

Quote (paragwinn @ Aug. 11 2017,22:12)
Something with which to set off a chain reaction of explodey heads at TSZ: Stochastic Supertasks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v....V0L99sw

"Oh, fuck off." -- Xeno.

--------------
"But it's disturbing to think someone actually thinks creationism -- having put it's hand on the hot stove every day for the last 400 years -- will get a different result tomorrow." -- midwifetoad

"I am in a rush to catch up with science work." -- Gary Gaulin

  
Ptaylor



Posts: 1034
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 14 2017,03:49   

If you've ever wondered why Salvador Cordova gets referred to as the human shit stain look no further than his latest comment on the thread on the violence and death in Charlottesville at TSZ. It begins
 
Quote
I didn’t vote for Trump, I’m an immigrant, I’m not white, I think Nazi’s[sic] and white supremacists are scary and evil.

and of course the next word is    
Quote
But...


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We no longer say: “Another day; another bad day for Darwinism.” We now say: “Another day since the time Darwinism was disproved.”
-PaV, Uncommon Descent, 19 June 2016

  
Woodbine



Posts: 1197
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 15 2017,11:57   

Martin Luther Byers

 
Quote
I’m Canadian.

first you use the term African american. then you use the term white. So these Africans get a title that gives a segregated identity but you deny Southeners a segregated identity. they are just white. like Swedes or Polish.

Words matter. Terms matter.
In reality there is no such thing as racism. its a left wing invention like,m anti-semitism, xenophobia, sexism , homophobia etc etc etc.
To discredit conclusions or opinions of one people group toward another.
These conclusions/opinions can be right or wrong, good or evil. thats not the point.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS RACISM.

Southeners always were a morally better people then the ‘africans” in the south.

However both people groups were segregated in heart and in body as far as they could be.
anyone alive today knows blacks think/live as segregated as can be.
they never, as pretended, meant to become colour blind single people group.
I have no moral problem with old southern segregationism by the southerners.
ON:Y that it was illegal after the blacks became citizens and its a aggressive insistance that they would not accept/assimilate blacks like they did everyone else. europeans especially.
That was the only sin. Mostly Southerners treated blacks with respect and kindness, and blacks right back. most people were good though determined to live segregated.
Those days are over. Southeners don’t desire anymore to live like another segregated group. Like in New York city.
Its the “africans” who want to think and live segregated.
They cause the injustice and unhappiness more then southeners.
On a curve.

The Southener has not just become a republican but finally a true American. In fact he is called, as you are witness, WHITE. No different then white yankees.
He has finally graduated. likewise many of the earlier european tribes.

You know the tree by the fruit.
People calling themselves after a foreign continent are people saying identity is important and segregation is okay. They just don’t want to be the losers.
You should of taught Southern kids to get both sides. Then or now.

All these problems come from the historic ethnic identities who congregate in the democratic party. Starting with the old Southeners etc.
They provoke tiny, tiny, tiny, numbers of ‘whites”.

There is not a moral equality between the people groups in America or Canada.

  
stevestory



Posts: 10371
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 15 2017,15:02   

If Byers insists that racism doesn't exist, I can understand why he doesn't believe brains exist--it takes one to know one

   
stevestory



Posts: 10371
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 15 2017,15:04   

Quote
Mostly Southerners treated blacks with respect and kindness, and blacks right back. most people were good though determined to live segregated.
Those days are over.


In this past sunday's episode of the Cognitive Dissonance podcast, Cecil talks about an in-law telling him this very thing. I think Cecil's take on it was something like "That's Fucking Stupid."

   
fnxtr



Posts: 2564
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 15 2017,19:51   

Can I just apologize on behalf of Canada again?
Thank you.

--------------
"But it's disturbing to think someone actually thinks creationism -- having put it's hand on the hot stove every day for the last 400 years -- will get a different result tomorrow." -- midwifetoad

"I am in a rush to catch up with science work." -- Gary Gaulin

  
stevestory



Posts: 10371
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 16 2017,08:59   

Quote
stcordova August 15, 2017 at 8:40 am
Robert Byers:
Quote

Southeners always were a morally better people then the ‘africans” in the south.

That’s a reprehensible thing to say.

You say a lot of dumb crap. In fact it some of the stuff you say is so over the top idiotic, I thought you were a Darwinist pretending to be creationist.

I’ve let some of the dumb crap you say go because you’re a creationist and usually on my side of the issues, but this is over the top.
linky

   
stevestory



Posts: 10371
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 16 2017,09:02   

The slavedrivers were morally better than the slaves.


   
stevestory



Posts: 10371
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 16 2017,09:06   

phoodoo's gettin all racist too.

Quote
phoodoo: Look Sal, I am sure there are a lot of dark skinned people like you that actually work hard and don’t rape white girls.There must be.But frankly, I don’t like my tax dollars going to them, just because they have never been caught stealing cars in east L.A.

Do you know we send 300 million dollars in aid every year south of the border, so those deadbeats can use that money to buy avocados and then sneak through the desert like rattlesnakes to come steal American jobs and suck off America’s tit?

I notice you didn’t mention anything about border security when you said where you want your tax dollars going.And when your cousins come here to sell burritos, who is going to teach them English, you expect the government to do that?Aren’t there enough Americans who want to get into colleges now as it is, we gotta let those who didn’t help build America take those spots?

When is enough enough Sal?


I thought it was us darwinists who were the initiators of racism?


Edited by stevestory on Aug. 16 2017,10:07

   
Tony M Nyphot



Posts: 370
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 16 2017,09:54   

Quote
Mung August 16, 2017 at 3:22 am
keiths: I’m willing to bet that this thread will devolve into an exercise in word weaseling by Mung. It appears to be headed that way already.

I’ll donate $100.00 to charity if you define cumulative selection. 🙂


I don't see where Mung indicates it has to be an accurate or accepted definition of cumulative selection, so any old definition should work.

As Mung routinely holds people to their written words, will someone please post some sort of definition, hold him to his written words, ask him to stay true to his words, and pay up?

--------------
"I, OTOH, am an underachiever...I either pee my pants or faint dead away..." FTK

"You could always wrap fresh fish in the paper you publish it on, though, and sell that." - Field Man on how to find value in Gary Gaulin's real-science "theory"

  
Henry J



Posts: 4730
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 16 2017,13:37   

Cumulative selection - is that where the gene pool accumulates variations that enhance a useful feature or ability?

  
JohnW



Posts: 2825
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 16 2017,14:29   

Quote (stevestory @ Aug. 16 2017,07:02)
The slavedrivers were morally better than the slaves.


Of course.  That's why god rewarded them by letting them have slaves.

--------------
Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers

There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

  
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