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  Topic: Uncommonly Dense Thread 2, general discussion of Dembski's site< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,13:38   

Quote (dheddle @ July 28 2008,11:29)
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ July 28 2008,13:21)
This one can't be blamed on Darwin

Are you sure? I am rather more optimistic that this law of nature*:

Every group of note will be named by someone as culpable for any given heinous act.

will not be violated.

* OK, OK, it's only a theory.

Not so fast, bub. Show me some peer-reviewed work on this 'theory', and we'll talk. :angry:

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"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,13:48   

Quote (Richardthughes @ July 28 2008,10:36)
Sorry Bob; too much Genetics, not enough Genesis.

Nah, it's just that the Dr.++ is twitchy about getting his cafeteria access back. He doesn't want anyone spoiling his chances of re-establishing the Polanyi Center at the table next to the checkout line.

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I’m referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I’m not an evolutionist, I’m a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 2564
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,13:48   

Quote (carlsonjok @ July 28 2008,12:57)
   
Quote (Richardthughes @ July 28 2008,12:55)
Bob. Bob O'h. Called that because of the way he makes birds exhale with pleasant surprise.

I thought this went out in the Sixties?

Hey, that's me doing Real Science! :angry:

OK, actually I'm taking a break to drink a cup of coffee from a plastic harry Potter mug, whilst sat on Birdshit Island.  But we were doing sciency stuff that day.

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It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

   
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:00   

figured it would be you to bring that up tarden.

just down the road from the kid here, but I was out of town.  i do not know that man!!!

'liberal views' of the church, as an explanation, has given way to the revelation that Adkisson's ex-wife attended the church.  he was clearly mentally ill and had threatened to kill his wife and himself a few years before.

if you feel like mining a thick seam of tard, the comments here will satisfy.  +2 points if you can figure out who I am.

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
sparc



Posts: 2088
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:03   

I'm afraid this will not show up:
Quote
sparc

07/28/2008

1:17 pm
Your comment is awaiting moderation.

   
Quote
Bob O’H is no longer with this forum.


It will indeed help the discussion of biology that the last biologist has been banninated from this “forum”. E.g., PAV discussing a paper

   
Quote
without having access to the entire paper


--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:10   

Quote (sparc @ July 28 2008,14:03)
I'm afraid this will not show up:
 
Quote
sparc

07/28/2008

1:17 pm
Your comment is awaiting moderation.

     
Quote
Bob O’H is no longer with this forum.


It will indeed help the discussion of biology that the last biologist has been banninated from this “forum”. E.g., PAV discussing a paper

     
Quote
without having access to the entire paper

Arf. Come on Davetard, let's hear your two penneth. We know you and Bob used to kiss with tongues.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Maya



Posts: 702
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:10   

Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ July 28 2008,14:00)
if you feel like mining a thick seam of tard, the comments here will satisfy.  +2 points if you can figure out who I am.

I guess none of the above.  You're just pretending to have a sock puppet because you know the gutless wonder DaveScot reads every word here (since mere mention of his name gives him the same funny feelings as those National Geographic pictures) and you hope to send him on a banning binge.

I'm in that thread too, Dave.  Really.

  
Maya



Posts: 702
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:12   

Quote (Maya @ July 28 2008,14:10)

Darn, should've checked the link first.  Who here every links anywhere but UD?

  
Chayanov



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:21   

Quote
Yes, I will concede that ID and IC are Creationist ideas.  What I do wish for is more science from them to prove Darwin wrong and that God is indeed the First, and I might add, only Creator.


As has been explained ad nauseum, this is precisely why ID isn't science: you've already concluded that Darwin is wrong and God is the creator of everything, and now you want to find some sort of evidence you can shoehorn in to support your foregone conclusion. Religion fits that description, but not science.

I won't even comment on a belief system that requires science to confirm one's faith.

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Help! Marxist literary critics are following me!

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:23   

Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,July 28 2008,12:00)
figured it would be you to bring that up tarden.

just down the road from the kid here, but I was out of town.  i do not know that man!!!

'liberal views' of the church, as an explanation, has given way to the revelation that Adkisson's ex-wife attended the church.  he was clearly mentally ill and had threatened to kill his wife and himself a few years before.

if you feel like mining a thick seam of tard, the comments here will satisfy.  +2 points if you can figure out who I am.

You're this guy, right?

Quote
Posted by mmhartz on July 28, 2008 at 10:43 a.m.

It's interesting that the church requests prayers. My question is, "To whom, or what, should we be praying?" According to the church's website, they don't believe in a singular, all-powerful deity, as do followers of Jesus Christ. So if you pray to someone other than the creator of the universe, what really are you expecting to happen?

As a clarification, religion by its definition is following a set of rules. Rules will always mess you up. Christianity is NOT a religion--it is a relationship with Jesus Christ, who died on the cross to pay the penalty for our sins. Christians aren't perfect and never claim to be, but they are forgiven.

Reply to this post
(Suggest removal)


--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:35   

Quote (Maya @ July 28 2008,14:12)
[quote=Maya,July 28 2008,14:10][/quote]
Darn, should've checked the link first.  Who here every links anywhere but UD?

haha.  life's too short to sockpuppet UD.  at least, these days.

Arden, think 'great speckled bird'.

what a bunch of dumbasses on the knoxville news sentinel blog.

i heard an internet genius recently claim that 'the knoxville news sentinel is peopled by incompetent douchebags'.  i am beginning to concur.

[matter meets antimatter, poof, fizzle]

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
sparc



Posts: 2088
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:50   

Granville Sewell
Quote
Although I have posted on this article before, I don’t think Wolf-Ekkehard Loennig and Heinz-Albert Becker’s Nature Encyclopedia of Life Sciences article on carnivorous plants has received the attention it merits.

I'm afraid this will be another comment that won't show up at UD:
Quote
You can learn from Lönnig how to make ID popular:

1. Create (sic!) your own publishing house (Naturwissenschaftlicher Verlag Köln) but don’t mention it’s your creature.

2. Publish your ID work there (you are author, reviewer and editor)

3. Cite your own books massively.

However, unlike Lönnig you should make sure that the address of your publishing house is different from your private address.


--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Chayanov



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:57   

Code Sample
However, unlike Lönnig you should make sure that the address of your publishing house is different from your private address.


How about a "suite" at The UPS Store?

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Help! Marxist literary critics are following me!

  
carlsonjok



Posts: 3326
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,14:58   

Quote (Richardthughes @ July 28 2008,14:10)
Arf. Come on Davetard, let's hear your two penneth. We know you and Bob used to kiss with tongues.

Yeah, but Bob (to his credit) used Arden's tongue.

--------------
It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

  
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,15:11   

Quote (carlsonjok @ July 28 2008,20:58)
Quote (Richardthughes @ July 28 2008,14:10)
Arf. Come on Davetard, let's hear your two penneth. We know you and Bob used to kiss with tongues.

Yeah, but Bob (to his credit) used Arden's tongue.

Is that thing still out on loan?

Louis

--------------
Bye.

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,15:23   

Quote (carlsonjok @ July 28 2008,12:58)
 
Quote (Richardthughes @ July 28 2008,14:10)
Arf. Come on Davetard, let's hear your two penneth. We know you and Bob used to kiss with tongues.

Yeah, but Bob (to his credit) used Arden's tongue.

I didn't see your mother complaining about my tongue.

 
Quote
Is that thing still out on loan?


Your wife could answer that question better than I could.

PS: Louis, don't you listen to Carlson, your wife dresses very well. And quickly, too, I may add.

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"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
carlsonjok



Posts: 3326
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,15:28   

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ July 28 2008,15:23)
PS: Louis, don't you listen to Carlson, your wife dresses very well. And quickly, too, I may add.

I have to say that is true. Omar the Tentmaker is a rising start in the Prêt-à-Porter market.

--------------
It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

  
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,17:13   

GilDigan is amazed that Fox News would publish OOL "nonsense". Heck, Fox has a whole Evolution and Paleontology site! Three cheers for our fact based network!

ps - how do I link directly to a UD comment, like all the cool kids?

--------------
I’m referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I’m not an evolutionist, I’m a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
dogdidit



Posts: 315
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,17:26   

Quote (dvunkannon @ July 28 2008,17:13)
GilDigan is amazed that Fox News would publish OOL "nonsense". Heck, Fox has a whole Evolution and Paleontology site! Three cheers for our fact based network!

ps - how do I link directly to a UD comment, like all the cool kids?

The numeral at the top left of each UD post is a permalink.

--------------
"Humans carry plants and animals all over the globe, thus introducing them to places they could never have reached on their own. That certainly increases biodiversity." - D'OL

  
Alan Fox



Posts: 1556
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,17:36   

Quote (dvunkannon @ July 28 2008,12:13)
GilDigan is amazed that Fox News would publish OOL "nonsense". Heck, Fox has a whole Evolution and Paleontology site! Three cheers for our fact based network!

ps - how do I link directly to a UD comment, like all the cool kids?

Here's an example.

I wonder how many geneticists will answer the call?

  
J-Dog



Posts: 4402
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,18:13   

Quote (Alan Fox @ July 28 2008,17:36)
]
Here's an example.

I wonder how many geneticists will answer the call?

Ha!  I followed your link...
I wonder how many will respond to the ad for the book about Sumerian Astronomers on the same page?

--------------
Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,19:22   

Quote (dheddle @ July 28 2008,11:46)
Quote (Richardthughes @ July 28 2008,10:03)
Are there any scientists left at UD?

I am reminded of a hilarious (I think by accident, not design) quote from JAD after a round of DaveScot banninations. He wrote something along the lines of "Is anyone still here?" It was just perfect. (I can't find it--Recip Bill?)

Even from UD's "pathologically predisposed to perceiving persecution" perspective Bob O'H's dismissal seems just about the least defensible bannination they have performed, at least in my recollection.

On a related but different topic, I think F2XL is a near perfect amalgam of arrogance and ignorance. He is now my favorite UD commenter. The boy was born for the job. His comment after Lilley's firing:

The douche had it coming

is UD at its finest.

Quote
# We apologise again for the fault in the subtitles. Those
responsible for sacking the people who have just been sacked
have been sacked.


Salvador had that same spirit. But he's apparently also banned from UD.

The directors of the firm hired to continue the credits after the other people had been sacked, wish it to be known that they have just been sacked.

   
lcd



Posts: 137
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,20:00   

Well, my God does not need any defending.  What is at issue is telling kids, mine especially, tales that are "just so".  Like what I've seen, Evolution needs to be believed.  That is not science.  I know that I'm going to get hung out to dry, but I think it takes more to believe that things combined just so than to say, and I'll say it again, God did it.

What I am not happy to say that I see no science in the ID movement.  In ID I do see things that can be used to make some believe in LGMs running around in the Universe.  The ID movement tries to cover its tracks, but to do so, I am reminded of Matthew 26:34.

Good night all,


Ed

  
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4265
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,20:07   

Quote (lcd @ July 28 2008,21:00)
Well, my God does not need any defending.  What is at issue is telling kids, mine especially, tales that are "just so".  Like what I've seen, Evolution needs to be believed.  That is not science.  I know that I'm going to get hung out to dry, but I think it takes more to believe that things combined just so than to say, and I'll say it again, God did it.

Hung out to dry? Around here we throw you into an autoclave.

Ready?

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,20:14   

Quote (Richardthughes @ July 28 2008,13:32)
Quote (dheddle @ July 28 2008,10:46)
Quote (Richardthughes @ July 28 2008,10:03)
Are there any scientists left at UD?

I am reminded of a hilarious (I think by accident, not design) quote from JAD after a round of DaveScot banninations. He wrote something along the lines of "Is anyone still here?" It was just perfect. (I can't find it--Recip Bill?)

Even from UD's "pathologically predisposed to perceiving persecution" perspective Bob O'H's dismissal seems just about the least defensible bannination they have performed, at least in my recollection.

On a related but different topic, I think F2XL is a near perfect amalgam of arrogance and ignorance. He is now my favorite UD commenter. The boy was born for the job. His comment after Lilley's firing:

The douche had it coming

is UD at its finest.

Comment has gone...

I actually invited F2XL over here a few weeks ago, on the basis that while he was wrong and arrogant, he didn't come across as a crackhead commenting from a public library terminal, like many at UD do. He declined, saying that UD was a fair forum. He pointed to Bob O'H as evidence. Now that Bob O'H's gone and his own comment was disappeared, maybe he'll start to get the message.

   
Venus Mousetrap



Posts: 201
Joined: Aug. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,20:29   

Quote (lcd @ July 28 2008,20:00)
Well, my God does not need any defending.  What is at issue is telling kids, mine especially, tales that are "just so".  Like what I've seen, Evolution needs to be believed.  That is not science.  I know that I'm going to get hung out to dry, but I think it takes more to believe that things combined just so than to say, and I'll say it again, God did it.

What I am not happy to say that I see no science in the ID movement.  In ID I do see things that can be used to make some believe in LGMs running around in the Universe.  The ID movement tries to cover its tracks, but to do so, I am reminded of Matthew 26:34.

Good night all,


Ed

The problem is, you likely don't understand the science, so you can't 'believe' in it. It's like the creationists who use their own ignorance as evidence against evolution (eg. Behe with 'I haven't read any papers which disprove me', the ID movement in general with 'I can't understand this therefore design')

I was arguing with a man from the Edinburgh Creation Group who believes that because he's made a model of the moon's orbit using a 2D model of simple Newtonian gravity, he's proven the Moon couldn't have formed (you can find this masterpiece at the Edinburgh Creation Group website). He apparently hasn't heard of angular momentum, many-body systems, precession, or relativity, all of which and more are essential to model planet formation and orbits, and when I told him of these, he said 'show me a model which works then!'.

Of course, I'm not a scientist. I can't. Even if I did, what would it mean to him? If he doesn't understand it, how can he accept the truth or falsity of it?

The same question goes to you. How can you accept evolution? Do you know what exactly evolution scientists do? How they make trees of relatedness? How they model natural selection? How important natural selection is? (the last one, even scientists don't know exactly).

  
bystander



Posts: 301
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,22:07   

It is also that LCD has bought into it has to be God or Evolution false debate.
I'm an atheist now but I went to a Catholic school and we had no problem with science. Jesus talked in parables so why couldn't God have talked in parables when He inspired the OT. We were taught that Genesis was written to highlight origins and the nature of free will and sin rather than to try an be a science textbook. If you were God and had to teach stuff to a tribe with attention deficit order (Moses was gone for 5 minutes and already they were worshiping a golden calf), would you tell them that the universe is 12 billions years old and they evolved from monkeys or would you teach them morals and what happens when they don't follow orders.

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,22:15   

Quote
but I think it takes more to believe that things combined just so than to say, and I'll say it again, God did it.


What reason is there to believe that "things combined just so" and "God is responsible for it all" to be mutually exlusive of each other? What could prevent a God from combining things?

Quote
What is at issue is telling kids, mine especially, tales that are "just so".


What is telling them that 100,000 scientists are incompetent at their jobs, if that isn't a "just so" story?

Henry

  
1of63



Posts: 126
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,22:45   

[quote=lcd,July 28 2008,20:00][/quote]
Quote
Well, my God does not need any defending.

Well, no, if God exists he needs defending like a T Rex needed a bodyguard.
Quote
What is at issue is telling kids, mine especially, tales that are "just so".

You mean like talking snakes, sticks that turn into snakes, people turned into pillars of salt, worldwide floods, Arks that must have been like the TARDIS - bigger on the inside than the outside - in order to carry all those animals...  
Quote
Like what I've seen, Evolution needs to be believed.  That is not science.

There's a difference between believing something because there's evidence and believing something when there isn't.  One is rational, the other is faith.
Quote
I know that I'm going to get hung out to dry, but I think it takes more to believe that things combined just so than to say, and I'll say it again, God did it.

Say it all you like, believe it all you like.  If it makes you happy, that's fine.  Doesn't make it true, though.

--------------
I set expectations at zero, and FL limbos right under them. - Tracy P. Hamilton

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 28 2008,23:06   

Quote
What is at issue is telling kids, mine especially, tales that are "just so".


I've asked many Creationists this, and never gotten a coherent answer: how is saying "the Biblical account of creation is true because the Bible says so" not a 'just-so story'?

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
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