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Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 29 2008,23:16    Quote (Jkrebs @ April 29 2008,22:46) bfast offers this here:   Quote If there is a genetic twiddler that, using foresight, has guided the development of life from amoeba to man, even if the twiddler periodically injected huge chunks of data, if the twiddler twiddled with an existing species to get the new one, rather than creating ex-nihlo, then we have UCD. This is exactly why many Christians who have taken the time to learn about ID reject it as bad theology (as well as bad science) - because it reduces God to a "genetic twiddler."  Thanks to bfast for both the candor and the nicely descriptive term. Not very omnipotent / omniscient if you have to twiddle.. -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

uriel Posts: 22 Joined: Dec. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,02:27    [quote=podzolboy,April 29 2008,19:26] Quote (Richardthughes @ April 29 2008,18:13) ID PREDICTS: ASS BURGERS? http://www.uncommondescent.com/expelle....-264051     Quote 23 PannenbergOmega 04/29/2008 5:59 pm I don’t think Aspergers is an evolutionary defect nor a birth defect, the result of industrial pollution. Personally I think the mind of an “Aspergian” may be tapped into a higher reality. What the hell!  Having family members that are affected by both autism and aspergers I cannot believe that comment. What higher reality would that be-the one where my family member is beating his head against the floor or my cousin bullied for years at school and in public because he was different-oh yeah life must be better on that higher plain of reality-whatever the hell that means.  What a load of transcendental clown crap Seconded. As someone who had to no option but to watch, impotent and helpless, for years on end, while my cousin pounded the plaster out of a corner with his head because something none of could ever hope to understand was slightly out of place- only the most ignorant, unreflective, and unsympathetic observer could possibly equate any form of autism with "tapping into a higher reality."  Reality isn't "Rainman," no matter how much you'd like those sanitized talking pictures to be true. At best, its coping with a more uncontrollable form of hell. Suggesting otherwise is worse than bad taste- it's taking advantage of other people misery.

Reciprocating Bill Posts: 4265 Joined: Oct. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,02:53    Quote (Richardthughes @ April 30 2008,00:16) Quote (Jkrebs @ April 29 2008,22:46) bfast offers this here:     Quote If there is a genetic twiddler that, using foresight, has guided the development of life from amoeba to man, even if the twiddler periodically injected huge chunks of data, if the twiddler twiddled with an existing species to get the new one, rather than creating ex-nihlo, then we have UCD. This is exactly why many Christians who have taken the time to learn about ID reject it as bad theology (as well as bad science) - because it reduces God to a "genetic twiddler."  Thanks to bfast for both the candor and the nicely descriptive term. Not very omnipotent / omniscient if you have to twiddle.. "Descent with meddling." -------------- Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be. "The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace "Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down." - Barry Arrington

Quack Posts: 1961 Joined: May 2007 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,03:48    Quote (Richardthughes @ April 29 2008,23:16) Quote (Jkrebs @ April 29 2008,22:46) bfast offers this here:     Quote If there is a genetic twiddler that, using foresight, has guided the development of life from amoeba to man, even if the twiddler periodically injected huge chunks of data, if the twiddler twiddled with an existing species to get the new one, rather than creating ex-nihlo, then we have UCD. This is exactly why many Christians who have taken the time to learn about ID reject it as bad theology (as well as bad science) - because it reduces God to a "genetic twiddler."  Thanks to bfast for both the candor and the nicely descriptive term. Not very omnipotent / omniscient if you have to twiddle.. Quote Quote (Jkrebs @ April 29 2008,22:46) bfast offers this here:     Quote If there is a genetic twiddler that, using foresight, has guided the development of life from amoeba to man, even if the twiddler periodically injected huge chunks of data, if the twiddler twiddled with an existing species to get the new one, rather than creating ex-nihlo, then we have UCD. This is exactly why many Christians who have taken the time to learn about ID reject it as bad theology (as well as bad science) - because it reduces God to a "genetic twiddler."  Thanks to bfast for both the candor and the nicely descriptive term. Not very omnipotent / omniscient if you have to twiddle.. Dawkins got it right; the twiddler must be ET. -------------- Rocks have no biology.               Robert Byers.

BWE Posts: 1902 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,04:07    Quote (Richardthughes @ April 29 2008,23:16) Quote (Jkrebs @ April 29 2008,22:46) bfast offers this here:   Quote If there is a genetic twiddler that, using foresight, has guided the development of life from amoeba to man, even if the twiddler periodically injected huge chunks of data, if the twiddler twiddled with an existing species to get the new one, rather than creating ex-nihlo, then we have UCD. This is exactly why many Christians who have taken the time to learn about ID reject it as bad theology (as well as bad science) - because it reduces God to a "genetic twiddler."  Thanks to bfast for both the candor and the nicely descriptive term. Not very omnipotent / omniscient if you have to twiddle.. But if capable of twiddling, certainly not impotent or insentient. -------------- Who said that ev'ry wish would be heard and answered When wished on the morning star Somebody thought of that, and someone believed it Look what it's done so far The Daily Wingnut

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,04:32    Blowhard Kairosfocus is asked: Quote I’m interested in how one goes about investigating the non-material? Kairos responds: Quote Every time you think logically, mathematically, propositionally or morally, you are “investigating the non-material.” For that matter, every time you are exercising conscious verbalised choice, like in communicating the above, you are doing something that is patently vastly beyond the reach of matter + energy acting under the influence of chance + necessity only on the gamut of the cosmos. Tard Er, so that's all clear now. -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Erasmus, FCD Posts: 6349 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,07:12    old man that reads like a conversation between shaggy and scoob. just add "like, every time you think logically, mathematically, propositionally, hungrily or morally, you are so totally like investigating non-material, man.  Zoinks!!! for that matter, man, every time you are exercising conscious verbalised choice, man, like in communicating the above, bro you are doing something that is totally, like patentedly and even way more vastly far out beyond like GULP!!! matter OR energy, man, acting under the piddly old influence of chance + necessity only in the gamut of the cosmos, man. ETFSS (Edited To Fix Shaggy Speak) Hey lou i see you peekin at me down there.  i've been changing my knickers -------------- You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

Lou FCD Posts: 5455 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,07:18    Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,April 30 2008,08:12) old man that reads like a conversation between shaggy and scoob. just add "like, every time...non-material, man". then "Zoinks, for that matter..." "...something that is totally, like patentedly and even way more vastly far out beyond like GULP!  matter OR energy, dude, acting..." "...the gamut of the cosmos, man..."   Quote Jinkies!  Like every time you think logically, mathematically, propositionally or morally, you are “investigating the non-material,” man! Zoinks, for that matter, every time you are exercising conscious verbalised choice, like in communicating the above, you are doing something that is totally, like patently and even vastly far out beyond like GULP! PYGMIES + DWARFS  ?? dude, acting under the influence of chance + necessity only on the gamut of the cosmos, man. Like, pass the doob, Scoob. Edited by Lou FCD on April 30 2008,08:20 -------------- “Why do creationists have such a hard time with commas? Linky“. ~ Steve Story, Legend

Erasmus, FCD Posts: 6349 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,09:57    I CAN HAZ STEGONAGRAHPHOSAURUS INFERNCE? tard Quote Thus I think we need prouder american citizens that are willing to go to bat for their Faith. We don’t need ridiculous excuses for why we can’t force the soulless dead in christ materialists to give in. -------------- You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

Erasmus, FCD Posts: 6349 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,10:22    Quote Jus a pass tru . . . GEM of TKI PS: Compare the above to the always linked, in order, from sections A - D, then onward to E. jus pass on tru den der -------------- You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

Albatrossity2 Posts: 2780 Joined: Mar. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,10:24    D'tard gives his opinion on "positive evidence for design". Quote The positive evidence for ID: 1) intelligent agents produce complex code driven machinery 2) intelligent agents exist in the universe today Not to be outdone, "congregate" chimes in with something a bit more scientific. Quote Possible positive evidence for intelligent design: tools, factories, blueprints, footprints of designer, ruins of designer’s house, landing strip for alien designer’s spacecraft, crashed spacecraft from designer being chased by design gone out of control. Newspaper dated June 30, 20,008, left behind by time traveling designer. -------------- Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind Has been obligated from the beginning To create an ordered universe As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.                         - Pattiann Rogers

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,10:31    DaveTard is such a nonce. Analogy is evidence? That means shuttlecocks are birds, ovens are suns, waterfalls are designed by god for showering porposes... Unless Dave means everything we know is designed is designed, which I'd agree with... -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Erasmus, FCD Posts: 6349 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,10:45    yeah and that means balls are really balls.   check out THIS Tard Just for a whiff Quote All in all, the Ben Steins, David Aikmans, Vox Days, Alvin Plantingas, Alister McGraths, John Lennoxs, Jonathan Wells, William Dembskis, Michael Behes, Phillip Johnsons, Duane Gishs, Andrew Snellings, Hugh Ross’, and David Berlinskis of the world are more than an equal match to any and all bricks and barbs thrown at a Creator and His created order dripping in orderly arrangement.  But then this is indeed the precise meaning of Cosmos (Gk, orderly arrangement)! -------------- You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

Bob O'H Posts: 2564 Joined: Oct. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,10:46    Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ April 30 2008,09:57) I CAN HAZ STEGONAGRAHPHOSAURUS INFERNCE? tard   Quote Thus I think we need prouder american citizens that are willing to go to bat for their Faith. We don’t need ridiculous excuses for why we can’t force the soulless dead in christ materialists to give in. At least one person has too much time on their hands. -------------- It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

slpage Posts: 349 Joined: June 2004 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,10:56    Quote (Richardthughes @ April 30 2008,10:31) DaveTard is such a nonce. Analogy is evidence? That means shuttlecocks are birds, ovens are suns, waterfalls are designed by god for showering porposes... Unless Dave means everything we know is designed is designed, which I'd agree with... ??? IDcreationists have been using analogies as evidence for years and years. But try to tell them that analogies are nto evidence, and they accuse of 'elitism' or some such douchery.

Leftfield Posts: 107 Joined: Nov. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,10:57    Quote (Richardthughes @ April 29 2008,23:16)  Not very omnipotent / omniscient if you have to twiddle.. Isn't the whole Bible one long story of twiddling, interrupted only by occasional meddling? Well, except for the first two chapters, maybe . . . -------------- Speaking for myself, I have long been confused . . .-Denyse O'Leary

J-Dog Posts: 4402 Joined: Dec. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,11:25    Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ April 30 2008,09:57) I CAN HAZ STEGONAGRAHPHOSAURUS INFERNCE? tard   Quote Thus I think we need prouder american citizens that are willing to go to bat for their Faith. We don’t need ridiculous excuses for why we can’t force the soulless dead in christ materialists to give in. Beautiful post. I feel bad though, because my puppet is still stuck in moderation, and he had some similar sentiments to express.  If only they didn't expel people over there... -------------- Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10 Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08 UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

Kristine Posts: 3061 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,12:05    Quote (BWE @ April 30 2008,03:07) Quote (Richardthughes @ April 29 2008,23:16)   Quote (Jkrebs @ April 29 2008,22:46) bfast offers this here:     Quote If there is a genetic twiddler that, using foresight, has guided the development of life from amoeba to man, even if the twiddler periodically injected huge chunks of data, if the twiddler twiddled with an existing species to get the new one, rather than creating ex-nihlo, then we have UCD. This is exactly why many Christians who have taken the time to learn about ID reject it as bad theology (as well as bad science) - because it reduces God to a "genetic twiddler."  Thanks to bfast for both the candor and the nicely descriptive term. Not very omnipotent / omniscient if you have to twiddle.. But if capable of twiddling, certainly not impotent or insentient. Can't one go blind from that? -------------- Which came first: the shimmy, or the hip? AtBC Poet Laureate "I happen to think that this prerequisite criterion of empirical evidence is itself not empirical." - Clive "Damn you. This means a trip to the library. Again." -- fnxtr

midwifetoad Posts: 4003 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,12:36    Quote Descent with meddling. I'm going to remember that one. Original citation? -------------- Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,12:40    There god, is not a very magnificent god. Certainly less magnificent than the TE god, who created a puzzle of such intricacy that unfolded so epically... -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

JohnW Posts: 3217 Joined: Aug. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,12:44    Quote (Kristine @ April 30 2008,10:05) Quote (BWE @ April 30 2008,03:07)   Quote (Richardthughes @ April 29 2008,23:16)     Quote (Jkrebs @ April 29 2008,22:46) bfast offers this here:       Quote If there is a genetic twiddler that, using foresight, has guided the development of life from amoeba to man, even if the twiddler periodically injected huge chunks of data, if the twiddler twiddled with an existing species to get the new one, rather than creating ex-nihlo, then we have UCD. This is exactly why many Christians who have taken the time to learn about ID reject it as bad theology (as well as bad science) - because it reduces God to a "genetic twiddler."  Thanks to bfast for both the candor and the nicely descriptive term. Not very omnipotent / omniscient if you have to twiddle.. But if capable of twiddling, certainly not impotent or insentient. Can't one go blind from that? :) Twiddling with different species can give you a nasty dose of the (ahem) "flu".  Just ask Louis. -------------- Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

Reciprocating Bill Posts: 4265 Joined: Oct. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,12:48    Quote (midwifetoad @ April 30 2008,13:36) Quote Descent with meddling. I'm going to remember that one. Original citation? Yes indeedy. In fact, that was the second post of my brief career at UD. -------------- Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be. "The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace "Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down." - Barry Arrington

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,12:56    Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ April 30 2008,12:48) Quote (midwifetoad @ April 30 2008,13:36) Quote Descent with meddling. I'm going to remember that one. Original citation? Yes indeedy. In fact, that was the second post of my brief career at UD. You were a bit too focused in your quest, Bill. ID is about nebulous sophistry. We know it WAS designed, but we don't know how, or by who, or when, or why. -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

J-Dog Posts: 4402 Joined: Dec. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,12:58    Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ April 30 2008,12:48) Quote (midwifetoad @ April 30 2008,13:36) Quote Descent with meddling. I'm going to remember that one. Original citation? Yes indeedy. In fact, that was the second post of my brief career at UD. And didn't "pants loading" come out of that memorable thread also?  That was awesome... -------------- Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10 Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08 UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

carlsonjok Posts: 3326 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,12:58    Quote (Richardthughes @ April 30 2008,12:56) You were a bit too focused in your quest, Bill. ID is about nebulous sophistry. We know it WAS designed, but we don't know how, or by who, or when, or why. Wink, wink. Know what I mean? -------------- It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

didymos Posts: 1828 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,13:39    Man, Farfarman is a complete moonbat (I'm reclaiming the term.  I don't feel all that empowered though).  He foams:   Quote Larry Fafarman 04/29/2008 6:14 pm There is no question that the Dover decision has had an intimidating effect on legislatures and school boards that want to include or allow criticism of evolution in the school curricula. There is no question that the Dover decision has had an intimidating effect on legislatures and school boards that want to include or allow criticism of evolution in the school curricula religiously motivated vacuous pseudoscience in Biology classrooms.  Except of course, it apparently hasn't because you dickWADs keep trying.  Perseverance and tenacity aren't necessarily virtues, you know? In the wrong context, it can get you arrested, or as here, mocked as an economical form of entertainment for others.   Quote Politicians are especially fearful of a backlash from tightwad taxpayers over the potential legal costs of a lawsuit. I'm not buying the "politicians are afraid to waste money" excuse, Lar.   Quote I cannot recall any other instance in American history where an unreviewed opinion of a single judge has had such a great influence. Dude, for someone who claims mad legal skills (and also probably nunchuck skills, bow-hunting skills, computer hacking skills) you really seem to not understand how federal courts and precedents work. Quote The Darwinists are wrongly applying the name ID to all criticisms of evolution in an attempt to get maximum mileage from the Dover decision. Well, whoever these "Darwinists" are, they should stop that.  All the other people who speak well of the Dover decision, however, recognize that ID is but the latest branch on the phylogenetic tree of creationism with a dash of endosymbiotic agnostic cranks thrown in.  All the truly well reasoned, supported, testable, and interesting criticisms of modern evolutionary theory are called "science" and people write articles about them in things called "journals".   Quote specs said,    Yikes. House bill sponsor Alan Hays was quoted as saying:    “Find for me where a fly turned into a monkey or a monkey turned into a man.” He was probably thinking of the science-fiction movie “The Fly,” where a man was turned into a fly as a result of a botched teleportation experiment. Larry, that doesn't really make the statement any less moronic.  Stop helping. <snip more of Larry helping. cut for time> -------------- I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

didymos Posts: 1828 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,13:51    Stone proves pretends ID has evidence: Quote A positive evidence for ID aside from artificial selection/selective breeding, genetic engineering, and the upcoming event of the first synthetic microbe? Get your own science. Intellectual kleptomania doesn't count. -------------- I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,14:07    Evidence for god ... men have rulers therefore nature has a ruler.... *sigh* -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Venus Mousetrap Posts: 201 Joined: Aug. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,15:31    aaarg why am I even bothering. Defintions are so fluid there, it's like swimming in piss. And I would know. no, wait.

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: April 30 2008,16:59    UD shows its true colours... http://www.uncommondescent.com/creatio....degrees read the whole sorry thing. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institute_for_Creation_Research Quote A 2004 episode of Penn and Teller's television program Bullshit! broadcast video taken of the ICR spokesperson, Duane Gish, stating "neither creation nor evolution are scientific theories. Evolution is no more scientific than creation", and that the Grand Canyon was created in as little as a few days due to the Biblical flood in Genesis. Eugenie Scott of the National Center for Science Education responded, "the Grand Canyon consists of granite and shale and really hard stuff - about 5,000 feet of it. You're not going to cut this very hard rock with just a bunch of water flowing through it at one time." -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

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