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Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 23 2009,13:41   

Quote (carlsonjok @ Mar. 23 2009,11:43)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 23 2009,11:36)
Joe is an IDist, so that would be censorship. RB is a rational, so he's just asking for it.

No, Richard, you are wrong. Clive has a transcendental, objective moral code that would not allow such inconsistent treatment.

and that code appears to involve a secret taste for full frontal butt nekkid man hugs.

anyone know how to get in touch with Jive Clive Turkey?  I have no puppets but sweet jumped up Esther Naomi and Ruth I would love to see that stuff get linked on UD.

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 23 2009,15:28   

:(

Quote
Joe G said...
Richie Clive doesn't like bad language on the blog he moderates nor any bad language towards its contributors.

I am sure he is OK with me dealing with the trash in my way on my blog.

As for re-opening- Nope you have already proven to be a total asshole on that one.

However I will open a new thread discussing how to measure- MEASURE- information in a designed object.

That said seeing that you think a baseball and a cake can arise without information I am sure you will butcher any/ all efforts put forth.

It's what you do.

It's all you do.

It is all you have.

Ya see if you had something to support your position you would have brought it up in the threads I have dealing with biology.

Yet your comments are noticeably absent- pretty much like your mind.

AtBC:

Another tired Baby Crying.

4:04 PM


--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Kristine



Posts: 3061
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 23 2009,16:06   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 23 2009,15:28)
:(

     
Quote
Joe G said...
Richie Clive doesn't like bad language on the blog he moderates nor any bad language towards its contributors.

I am sure he is OK with me dealing with the trash in my way on my blog.

As for re-opening- Nope you have already proven to be a total asshole on that one.

However I will open a new thread discussing how to measure- MEASURE- information in a designed object.

That said seeing that you think a baseball and a cake can arise without information I am sure you will butcher any/ all efforts put forth.

It's what you do.

It's all you do.

It is all you have.

Ya see if you had something to support your position you would have brought it up in the threads I have dealing with biology.

Yet your comments are noticeably absent- pretty much like your mind.

AtBC:

Another tired Baby Crying.

4:04 PM

Change "bits" to "bytes" and Answer the Banned Comment, Joseph!

--------------
Which came first: the shimmy, or the hip?

AtBC Poet Laureate

"I happen to think that this prerequisite criterion of empirical evidence is itself not empirical." - Clive

"Damn you. This means a trip to the library. Again." -- fnxtr

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 23 2009,16:13   

Who is John Galt Joe G? Own up!

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Hermagoras



Posts: 1260
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 23 2009,16:38   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 23 2009,16:13)
Who is John Galt Joe G? Own up!

If Joe G would Go Galt, we'd all be better off.

--------------
"I am not currently proving that objective morality is true. I did that a long time ago and you missed it." -- StephenB

http://paralepsis.blogspot.com/....pot.com

   
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4265
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 23 2009,18:15   

Quote (carlsonjok @ Mar. 23 2009,12:33)
I mean, there is no question that Reciprocating Bill could be snarky when referencing UD...

God, I hope not.

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
Richard Simons



Posts: 425
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 23 2009,18:51   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 23 2009,08:55)
Joe has measured the CSI of a cake. NOT!

http://intelligentreasoning.blogspot.com/2008....1061841

 
Quote
At 7:48 AM,  Joe G said…

Measuring the CSI of a cake:

Given the following recipe:

• 1 cup cornmeal
• 3 cups all-purpose flour
• 1 1/3 cups white sugar
• 2 tablespoons baking powder
• 1 teaspoon salt
• 2/3 cup vegetable oil
• 1/3 cup melted butter
• 2 tablespoons honey
• 4 eggs, beaten
• 2 1/2 cups whole milk
• Preheat oven to 350 degrees F (175 degrees C), and grease a 9x13 inch baking dish.
• Stir together the cornmeal, flour, sugar, baking powder, and salt in a mixing bowl. Pour in the vegetable oil, melted butter, honey, beaten eggs, and milk, and stir just to moisten.
• Pour the batter into the prepared baking dish and bake in the preheated oven for 45 minutes, until the top of the cornbread starts to brown and show cracks.

A simple character count reveals there are over 650 characters.

Therefor the minimum information that cake will contain is just over 650 bits if each character is a bit.

Interesting that changing the language of a description alters the CSI of an object.

--------------
All sweeping statements are wrong.

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 23 2009,21:39   

Quote
Interesting that changing the language of a description alters the CSI of an object.


Well, maybe CSI is a an attribute that can only be measured relative to that of something else?

No wait, that won't work, since in one language A might have the longer description but in another B might be the harder to describe.

Never mind.

Henry

  
Kristine



Posts: 3061
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 23 2009,23:26   

What if you bake a baseball in the cake...?

--------------
Which came first: the shimmy, or the hip?

AtBC Poet Laureate

"I happen to think that this prerequisite criterion of empirical evidence is itself not empirical." - Clive

"Damn you. This means a trip to the library. Again." -- fnxtr

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,00:02   

What if before you bake the cake, you use the flour to spell out METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL.  When you mix it all back up again where does the information go?

How much more information is in that sweater NOW, compared to the sweater that he took off the rack and brought home from the christian ministries junk store?  

is there more information in the arrowhead a feller found this afternoon on the river bank, or one that some dude carves on his backporch with a dremel tool and sells to tourists?  because I wanna know.

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,00:09   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 23 2009,19:11)
https://www.blogger.com/comment....&page=1

 
Quote
Joe G said...
I only close comments when ignorant asshole licking pukes refuse to understand the points made and continue to act like child molesting woman beaters.

And as I said losers always laugh at things they cannot understand.

That is why you and your ilk are referred to as the Anti-thought Biting Cockroaches

11:59 AM

<sniffle> <boo hoo hoo>



What a TARD.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,00:26   

Hey Joe you want a spliff?

Quote
However I will open a new thread discussing how to measure- MEASURE- information in a designed object.


Yeah right,

So what should we bring ?



or



or


Quick everyone TO JOE'S LAB....




--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,07:03   

Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 23 2009,18:02)
Quote (JonF @ Mar. 23 2009,11:37)
   
Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 23 2009,11:12)
Cross-post - Joe, this is respectfully meant.
       
Quote
Joe, excuse me. 665 characters including spaces do not add up to 665 bits of information in this context. Yes, until recently a character in computer programming took a bit of information storage (it's a little more now, due to formatting). No, that is not how one measures the information of this recipe.

It can have no more than 665 bits of information, but we are talking about memory storage here. One measures the information of a string in nits or nats (or nepits), in other words, in terms of entropy, expressed by the average number of bits needed for storage or communication.

I think you can now see that there is much redundancy in this recipe. Spaces are certainly redundancy. What are the other examples?

Don't assume that everyone at AtBC is a man, please.

Um, until recently a character in computer storage took a byte (eight bits). Nowadays many programs store each character in two bytes, using Unicode, which allows many more characters (e.g. Arabic, ...). Neither scheme stores formatting.

Of course, it's even worse for Joe. He forgot to define what a cup is, what a degree F is, what corn meal is, what flour is, what a minute is, ... all that is information required to make cornbread.

Oops, you're right, it's byte (gaaa). Thank you. As for the formatting, I got that from some professor... Eek. *Blush* Oh well, if one never says anything stupid, one doesn't learn anything. :)

Crikey! I must be the smartest person alive!

;-)

Louis

--------------
Bye.

  
Spottedwind



Posts: 83
Joined: Aug. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,07:09   

Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 23 2009,13:02)
Oops, you're right, it's byte (gaaa). Thank you. As for the formatting, I got that from some professor... Eek. *Blush* Oh well, if one never says anything stupid, one doesn't learn anything. :)

Don't you know how this works Kristine?

You are supposed to deny, deflect, and dissemble about any supposed mistake.  You didn't even lash out.

Tsk, tsk, tsk...you'll never make it at UD.  :angry:

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,08:43   

More from the demented cheerleader:

http://intelligentreasoning.blogspot.com/2009....ed.html

Quote
Measuring Information/ specified complexity
When discussing information some people want to know how much information does something contain?

If it is something straight-forward such as a definition, we can count the number of bits in that definition to find out how much information it contains.

For example:

aardvark: a large burrowing nocturnal mammal (Orycteropus afer) of sub-Saharan Africa that has a long snout, extensible tongue, powerful claws, large ears, and heavy tail and feeds especially on termites and ants


A simple character count reveals 202 characters which translates into 1010 bits of information/ specified complexity..

Now what do we do when all we have is an object?

One way of figuring out how much information it contains is to figure out how (the simplest way) to make it.

Then you write down the procedure without wasting words/ characters and count those bits.

That will give you an idea of the minimal information it contains.

I say that because all the information that goes into making something is therefor contained by it.

And if you already have the instructions and want to measure the information?

Again just count the bits in the instructions.

For example a cake would, at a minimum, contain all the information in the recipe.

Have you ever had to assemble something?

The object you assembled would, at a minimum, contain all the information in the assembly instructions.

Let the Richie Retardo arm flailing begin... (I will see you tomorrow)


--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,08:52   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 24 2009,08:43)
More from the demented cheerleader:

http://intelligentreasoning.blogspot.com/2009....ed.html

Quote
Measuring Information/ specified complexity
When discussing information some people want to know how much information does something contain?

If it is something straight-forward such as a definition, we can count the number of bits in that definition to find out how much information it contains.

For example:

aardvark: a large burrowing nocturnal mammal (Orycteropus afer) of sub-Saharan Africa that has a long snout, extensible tongue, powerful claws, large ears, and heavy tail and feeds especially on termites and ants


A simple character count reveals 202 characters which translates into 1010 bits of information/ specified complexity..

Now what do we do when all we have is an object?

One way of figuring out how much information it contains is to figure out how (the simplest way) to make it.

Then you write down the procedure without wasting words/ characters and count those bits.

That will give you an idea of the minimal information it contains.

I say that because all the information that goes into making something is therefor contained by it.

And if you already have the instructions and want to measure the information?

Again just count the bits in the instructions.

For example a cake would, at a minimum, contain all the information in the recipe.

Have you ever had to assemble something?

The object you assembled would, at a minimum, contain all the information in the assembly instructions.

Let the Richie Retardo arm flailing begin... (I will see you tomorrow)



what an idiot.  he is going to run with this like he did being a muslim.

that means if you shave your initials into an aardvark it contains more information than an unshaven aardvark.

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,08:54   

I propose 'Cakeboy' from here on in..

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
George



Posts: 316
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,09:08   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 24 2009,08:43)
More from the demented cheerleader:

http://intelligentreasoning.blogspot.com/2009....ed.html

 
Quote
Measuring Information/ specified complexity
When discussing information some people want to know how much information does something contain?

If it is something straight-forward such as a definition, we can count the number of bits in that definition to find out how much information it contains.

For example:

aardvark: a large burrowing nocturnal mammal (Orycteropus afer) of sub-Saharan Africa that has a long snout, extensible tongue, powerful claws, large ears, and heavy tail and feeds especially on termites and ants


A simple character count reveals 202 characters which translates into 1010 bits of information/ specified complexity..


From http://dictionary.reference.com/

human:  a human being.  

13 characters with spaces

Sphagnum: any soft moss of the genus Sphagnum, occurring chiefly in bogs, used for potting and packing plants, for dressing wounds, etc.

126 characters with spaces

Therefore moss is more intelligently designed than man.  At least some men.

  
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,09:22   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 24 2009,14:54)
I propose 'Cakeboy' from here on in..

Seconded.

Louis

--------------
Bye.

  
Amadan



Posts: 1337
Joined: Jan. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,09:34   

I've seen ravens that had less Poe about them.

I mean, "count the letters in the dictionary"?

But hang on! A picture is worth 10^3 words. And a 'word' is (if I remember correctly, someone with a brain will put me right if I'm not) 32 bits. 'Two bits' means 25 US cents. So if I take a photo of a quarter-dollar, its FCSI is [(32/2)*10^3] = 16000 bits = $4000.00

Not a bad return on a quarter, especially in these impoverished [End-]times.

--------------
"People are always looking for natural selection to generate random mutations" - Densye  4-4-2011
JoeG BTW dumbass- some variations help ensure reproductive fitness so they cannot be random wrt it.

   
Quack



Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,09:44   

Aardvark

How many bits, or bytes? Or slabs?

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
              Robert Byers.

  
Kristine



Posts: 3061
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,10:24   

Can someone tell me how he arrived at 1010?

--------------
Which came first: the shimmy, or the hip?

AtBC Poet Laureate

"I happen to think that this prerequisite criterion of empirical evidence is itself not empirical." - Clive

"Damn you. This means a trip to the library. Again." -- fnxtr

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,10:31   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 24 2009,16:43)
More from the demented cheerleader:

http://intelligentreasoning.blogspot.com/2009....ed.html

Quote
Measuring Information/ specified complexity
When discussing information some people want to know how much information does something contain?

If it is something straight-forward such as a definition, we can count the number of bits in that definition to find out how much information it contains.

For example:

aardvark: a large burrowing nocturnal mammal (Orycteropus afer) of sub-Saharan Africa that has a long snout, extensible tongue, powerful claws, large ears, and heavy tail and feeds especially on termites and ants


A simple character count reveals 202 characters which translates into 1010 bits of information/ specified complexity..

Now what do we do when all we have is an object?

One way of figuring out how much information it contains is to figure out how (the simplest way) to make it.

Then you write down the procedure without wasting words/ characters and count those bits.

That will give you an idea of the minimal information it contains.

I say that because all the information that goes into making something is therefor contained by it.

And if you already have the instructions and want to measure the information?

Again just count the bits in the instructions.

For example a cake would, at a minimum, contain all the information in the recipe.

Have you ever had to assemble something?

The object you assembled would, at a minimum, contain all the information in the assembly instructions.

Let the Richie Retardo arm flailing begin... (I will see you tomorrow)

Nup, hog snot is still smarter.

My only post to UD during the last very brief Glasnost was to KF to ask him to clarify his use of the word information.

In Information Theory there is a very definite difference between "function" and "information".

I asked Gordon Mullings / KF in which context WRT to Information Theory did his use of the word Information relate.

I later found out he was just an IT guy who worked at a race track and filled up his spare time writing letters to the editor and couldn't possibly have the foggiest notion of what I was asking him.

Joe G? Knows less.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,10:41   

Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 24 2009,09:24)
Can someone tell me how he arrived at 1010?

Well, if it was a five minute drive, and he started at 1005...

But seriously, I reckon he assumed 5 bits per character, even though that allows only one case, and no more than 6 non-letter characters.

Henry

  
k.e..



Posts: 5432
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,10:49   

Quote (Henry J @ Mar. 24 2009,18:41)
Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 24 2009,09:24)
Can someone tell me how he arrived at 1010?

Well, if it was a five minute drive, and he started at 1005...

But seriously, I reckon he assumed 5 bits per character, even though that allows only one case, and no more than 6 non-letter characters.

Henry

You could do it with 2 characters if you used a one time pad at each end of the channel.

He doesn't mention anything about error correction, channel bandwidth or encryption either.

But then Joe could just send the cake by snail mail if he really wanted to.

...psssst..... Joe put a file in it if you are sending it to your Mom. You never know she just might be able to escape...just a thought

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
Alan Fox



Posts: 1556
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,10:51   

Things must be getting slow when Joe Gallien gets top slot here.

I don't know if it might amuse anyone, but Joe was threshing around at ARN a while back. In response to my innocent question:

 
Quote
How old are you, Joe? Twelve? Do you still suffer from coulrophobia?


I got:

 
Quote
How old are YOU Alan?

YOU are the one who insists on acting like a dick.

I, for one, am sick of it.

As I said if YOU want to fight we should take it off of this board and do it.

I say that because you do not seem interested in anything else.

And you certainly don't seem interested in anything except forcing your ignorance on to others.

IOW you haven't even reached the age of 12.

Do you still suffer from penis-envy?



Link

  
Hermagoras



Posts: 1260
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,11:00   

How many times has Joe suggested physical confrontation to someone an ID or evolution board?

--------------
"I am not currently proving that objective morality is true. I did that a long time ago and you missed it." -- StephenB

http://paralepsis.blogspot.com/....pot.com

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,11:01   

Joe wants fisticuffs with everyone. And yet he's a retiree..


Bonus - look at the image I got from googling "angry old man" - its Gloppy!?



--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,11:03   

Quote (Hermagoras @ Mar. 24 2009,11:00)
How many times has Joe suggested physical confrontation to someone an ID or evolution board?

He's really really brave behind his keyboard and the anonymity of the Internet. (Just like the rest of us!  :) )

That's science should be settled - fisticuffs! Thump the controversy!

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2780
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Mar. 24 2009,11:06   

UD Today

Barry, Joe, and Granny Tard.



--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
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