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  Topic: Official Uncommonly Dense Discussion Thread< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Zachriel



Posts: 2723
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,09:25   

Quote (Hermagoras @ Sep. 03 2007,09:03)
Zachriel, you beat me to it! ?

Jovian days are only about 10 hours long.



(Our comments are somewhat different. Yours is intended to persuade. Mine merely laments the short attention span of IDers.)

--------------

You never step on the same tard twice—for it's not the same tard and you're not the same person.

   
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,09:55   

Give up and go home people, bornagain77 has disproved "Darwinism"
Quote
Darwin hypothesized the existence of a moth with a foot-long proboscis (nose), to reach the tiny pool of nectar at the bottom of the spur. Darwin?s theory was supposedly given a major boost because of this prediction. Excuse me for being underwhelmed by his prediction. It is exceedingly simple minded to think his well educated prediction validated Darwinism scientifically. It is also simple minded to think that a few al mutations of DNA are to accomplish the exceedingly complex rearrangement of protein molecules, both the flower and the moth have needed for such specialized pollination.

...
Quote
These are but a few examples of Intelligent Design found in orchids. So yes this is a very interesting line of research, I believe Many books could be written describing such integrated and fascinating relationships found in nature.

There is loads more if you can stand it.

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
k.e



Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,10:23   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Sep. 03 2007,17:55)
Give up and go home people, bornagain77 has disproved "Darwinism"
 
Quote
Darwin hypothesized the existence of a moth with a foot-long proboscis (nose), to reach the tiny pool of nectar at the bottom of the spur. Darwin?s theory was supposedly given a major boost because of this prediction. Excuse me for being underwhelmed by his prediction. It is exceedingly simple minded to think his well educated prediction validated Darwinism scientifically. It is also simple minded to think that a few al mutations of DNA are to accomplish the exceedingly complex rearrangement of protein molecules, both the flower and the moth have needed for such specialized pollination.

...  
Quote
These are but a few examples of Intelligent Design found in orchids. So yes this is a very interesting line of research, I believe Many books could be written describing such integrated and fascinating relationships found in nature.

There is loads more if you can stand it.

Oh boy, stand back everyone DEAD MAN WALKING.

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The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

   
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,10:32   

Form a Line people, there is plenty of Tard to go round!

Joseph says:  
Quote
Does anyone even know what gene or genes is responsible for the vision system? No.


ScienceDaily Notes:
 
Quote
Boston, MA Harvard Medical School researchers have discovered nearly all the genes responsible for vision, which could help in diagnosing and treating blinding diseases. Macular degeneration alone affects twenty-five percent of people over age 75. The discovery of the full set of photoreceptor genes expressed in the retinal cells, which was made in mice, could also lead to new methods for preserving and restoring the vision of those affected.


--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,10:38   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Sep. 03 2007,10:32)
Form a Line people, there is plenty of Tard to go round!

Joseph says: ?  
Quote
Does anyone even know what gene or genes is responsible for the vision system? No.


ScienceDaily Notes:
?
Quote
Boston, MA Harvard Medical School researchers have discovered nearly all the genes responsible for vision, which could help in diagnosing and treating blinding diseases. Macular degeneration alone affects twenty-five percent of people over age 75. The discovery of the full set of photoreceptor genes expressed in the retinal cells, which was made in mice, could also lead to new methods for preserving and restoring the vision of those affected.

It's even sweeter that the ScienceDaily reference is almost six years old.

Joseph probably got that factoid from Behe.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
k.e



Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,10:52   

Quote
It's even sweeter that the ScienceDaily reference is almost six years old.

Joseph probably got that factoid from Behe.


But ....but .....but all those books in Dover were dealt with by Behe.


I SAW HIM WAVE HIS ARM!!!!HOMOS.

--------------
The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,11:45   

BarryA, top legal mind:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-135463

Quote
7

BarryA

09/03/2007

10:36 am
It was an obvious parady from the first line (the salutation). Who really believes that a university president would address a letter to ?Dear Botnick?? At the very least one would expect him to say ?Dear Mr. Botnick.?

8

Jack Krebs

09/03/2007

10:58 am
The letter did start with Dr. Mr. Botnik.

9

Jack Krebs

09/03/2007

10:58 am
Oops - I meant ?Dear Mr. Botnik?



I move for a "bad trial thingy!"

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,12:09   



I know reading comprehension is low at UD, but for flips sake!
PT has a copy of the original thread
http://www.pandasthumb.org/archives/2007/09/dembskibaylor_s.html

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
Stephen Elliott



Posts: 1776
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,12:17   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Sep. 03 2007,12:09)


I know reading comprehension is low at UD, but for flips sake!
PT has a copy of the original thread
http://www.pandasthumb.org/archives/2007/09/dembskibaylor_s.html

FGS. So what? You know ID doesn't go into "pathetic levels of detail" such as being accurate.

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,12:40   

Interesting, UD seems to be completely inaccessible right now. They must be frantically scrambling to delete all the embarrassing stuff Dembski's posted about Lilley and Bayor.  :p

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"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,12:42   

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 03 2007,12:40)
They must be frantically scrambling to delete all the embarrassing stuff

If that's the case it'll come back with an empty page ;)

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
Stephen Elliott



Posts: 1776
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,12:48   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Sep. 03 2007,12:42)
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 03 2007,12:40)
They must be frantically scrambling to delete all the embarrassing stuff

If that's the case it'll come back with an empty page ;)

That is bloody funny (and pretty accurate).They are not having a good time right now. Although I expect some of their regular commentators are oblivious.

  
Wesley R. Elsberry



Posts: 4991
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,13:09   

Have they given up on blaming their technical difficulties on me yet?

--------------
"You can't teach an old dogma new tricks." - Dorothy Parker

    
Hermagoras



Posts: 1260
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,13:18   

scordova
stands up:

Quote
My third loose end which I would like to tie up is that I would like to apologize to Ms. Smith if I have said anything that may be construed as an accusation of dishonesty on her part. Some concern has been expressed that any suggestion of dishonesty could be damaging to her career and I do not wish to damage Ms. Smith?s career as I?m in a similar boat as her. I vigorously disagree with her on various matters, but this should not imply that I am accusing her of lying or dishonesty. Perhaps I made some ill-tempered remarks, but it was not my intent to accuse her of lying or dishonesty. I simply disagree and at times was very irritated?.


I told scordova in emails that I would publicly laud him if he did this, and I have, on my blog.  This is the decent thing to do, and I'm not going to say anything against it.  

(There's a lot of other stuff in the post, but this is a rare moment.)

--------------
"I am not currently proving that objective morality is true. I did that a long time ago and you missed it." -- StephenB

http://paralepsis.blogspot.com/....pot.com

   
Stephen Elliott



Posts: 1776
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,13:27   

Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Sep. 03 2007,13:09)
Have they given up on blaming their technical difficulties on me yet?

Given their record on honesty and integrity Wes, do you really care? To be atacked on UD could be considered a badge of honour. You are in good company.

  
Stephen Elliott



Posts: 1776
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,13:41   

Quote (Hermagoras @ Sep. 03 2007,13:18)
scordova
stands up:

?
Quote
My third loose end which I would like to tie up is that I would like to apologize to Ms. Smith if I have said anything that may be construed as an accusation of dishonesty on her part. Some concern has been expressed that any suggestion of dishonesty could be damaging to her career and I do not wish to damage Ms. Smith?s career as I?m in a similar boat as her. I vigorously disagree with her on various matters, but this should not imply that I am accusing her of lying or dishonesty. Perhaps I made some ill-tempered remarks, but it was not my intent to accuse her of lying or dishonesty. I simply disagree and at times was very irritated?.


I told scordova in emails that I would publicly laud him if he did this, and I have, on my blog. ?This is the decent thing to do, and I'm not going to say anything against it. ?

(There's a lot of other stuff in the post, but this is a rare moment.)

I thought that apology was rather restrained. Maybe the fact that Sal has been accepted by Johns Hopkins university for a part time masters degree course in aplied physics has something to do with it. Don't know for certain of course but I am suspicious.

Seems that Sal is in a dilema. Not only has he accused Dr. Smith of dishonesty when any neutral observer can see Sal was the dishonest one, but he has also recently done something similar to a person at Johns Hopkins who is in a position of authority.

His web behaviour may just be about to impact on his real life.

All very interesting. Of course over on UD Sal has claimed it is due to a Darwinian conspiracy that he feels a need to modify his behavour.

Not really any genuine remorse as far as I can see

  
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4265
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,14:06   

Uncommonly Denyse reported upon her correspondent with DeWitt vis dog breeding. She concluded thusly:
Quote
Hmmm. We hear plenty about Darwin?s natural selection, but almost nothing about neoteny. And, to the extent that Dawkins was counting on our ignorance of neoteny, why SHOULD he bother to read Edge of Evolution before discouraging others from reading it?

Denyse, dear, we hear almost nothing about neoteny because we are utterly ignorant of the literature of the field we critique with such confidence. Our ignorance of neoteny is part of a larger ignorance. We are, for example, ignorant of the work of an obscure writer named Stephen Jay Gould, who wrote a book in 1977 entitled "Ontogeny and Phylogeny," the thesis of which was that evolutionary modifications of developmental plans, including heterochrony and neoteny, were important in evolution, particularly human evolution:

"I believe that human beings are "essentially" neotenous, not because I can enumerate a list of important paedomorphic features, but because a general, temporal retardation of development has clearly characterized human evolution. This retardation established a matrix within which all trends in the evolution of human morphology must be assessed...This mechanism was utilized again and again in human evolution because retarded development carried a set of potential consequences with it: prolongation of fetal growth rates leading to larger sizes and the retention of juvenile proportions. Is not such a system the proximate cause of evolutionary increase of the human brain?" (p. 365, emphasis in the original.)

Gould's work anticipated evolutionary-developmental biology (evo-devo), and was immeasurably influential. Sean Carroll in Endless Forms Most Beautiful:

"Such was the setting in the 1970s when voices for the reunion of embryology and evolutionary biology made themselves heard. Most notable was that of Stephen Jay Gould, whose book Ontogeny and Phylogeny revived discussion of the ways in which the modification of development may influence evolution...Gould's book and his many subsequent writings reexamined the "big picture" in evolutionary biology and underscored the major questions that remained unsolved. He planted seeds in more than a few impressionable young scientists, myself included." (p. 7-8)

(I will say, Denyse, that "counting upon your ignorance" does seem a sensible strategy.)

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,14:24   

Quote
We hear plenty about Darwin's natural selection, but almost nothing about neoteny.


In fairness to Denyse, by 'we' I assume she meant herself and her cat.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,15:31   

Quote

Matt, could you pull up pages 99 to 100 and highlight our favorite passage? That was the passage we spent some time on yesterday, " 5intelligent design means that various forms of life began abruptly through an intelligent agency, with their distinctive features already intact, fish with fins and scales, birds with feathers, beaks, and wings, etc." You said a few things about this passage. One is you don't like it so much.


I wonder, has any reason ever been given as to why an intelligent designer would be limited to "abrupt"?

-----------

Quote
What's more, its [HIV] mutation rate is 10,000 times greater than that of most other organisms.


Is that number accurate? And is it per unit time or per generation? How does it compare to other viruses?

Also, does it include mutations that didn't work out (i.e., a lineage that died), or just the ones that were retained?

Henry

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,16:07   

Special Guest Tard:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-135492


Casey Luskin!

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2780
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,16:12   

And even more bizarrely, Grandma Tard posts something for Dr. Dr. Dembski!

Have his posting privileges been revoked?

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Hermagoras



Posts: 1260
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,16:14   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Sep. 03 2007,16:12)
And even more bizarrely, [URL=http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/backgrounder-to-robert-markss-lab-shutdown-baylor-revokes-dembskis-research-fellowship-200


6/]Grandma Tard posts something for Dr. Dr. Dembski![/URL]

Have his posting privileges been revoked?

He asked Botnik to fork over the keys to the office. Later, he remembered that he was Botnik.  D'oh!  

Actually, I imagine he's on the phone with Robert Marks, apologizing for being such a tool.

--------------
"I am not currently proving that objective morality is true. I did that a long time ago and you missed it." -- StephenB

http://paralepsis.blogspot.com/....pot.com

   
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,16:41   

Quote
Jehu
09/03/2007
3:32 pm
Truth has no fear of research. These cowards sold Bill Dembski out because they love status and influence in this world more than they love truth. So much for the teachings of Christ and all that.


I'm too tired and bored to even say the obvious thing here.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
hooligans



Posts: 114
Joined: Jan. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,16:46   

Quote
And even more bizarrely, Grandma Tard posts something for Dr. Dr. Dembski!

Have his posting privileges been revoked?


Beat me to the unusual observation. I was wondering . . . is there no end to the various posting pseudonymes Dembski uses to create TARD? Must he post under the guise "Galapago Finch" when producing unhumorous TARD? Must he post under teh name "Botnik" when creating spiteful TARD?

  
jeannot



Posts: 1201
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,16:47   

Quote (Henry J @ Sep. 03 2007,15:31)
Quote

Matt, could you pull up pages 99 to 100 and highlight our favorite passage? That was the passage we spent some time on yesterday, " 5intelligent design means that various forms of life began abruptly through an intelligent agency, with their distinctive features already intact, fish with fins and scales, birds with feathers, beaks, and wings, etc." You said a few things about this passage. One is you don't like it so much.


I wonder, has any reason ever been given as to why an intelligent designer would be limited to "abrupt"?

-----------

Quote
What's more, its [HIV] mutation rate is 10,000 times greater than that of most other organisms.


Is that number accurate? And is it per unit time or per generation? How does it compare to other viruses?

Also, does it include mutations that didn't work out (i.e., a lineage that died), or just the ones that were retained?

Henry

Typically, mutation rates are estimated per nucleotide per generation whatever effect they have.

  
Hermagoras



Posts: 1260
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,17:01   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Sep. 03 2007,16:07)
Special Guest Tard:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-135492


Casey Luskin!

What a a repulsive comment by Luskin.  Rehearse your bogus conclusions as though they are proven, and then throw in an irrelevant quote-mine of your opponent in the service of character assassination.  (Click on the link Luskin provides and you'll see precisely why ERV hates missionaries.)  Followed by kairosfocus, in usual righteous mode:    
Quote
#36 Casey, thanks for your last response, which is (such as all the other you have written) very clear end precise. Concerning the kind of language used by the other side I begin to supect that it is not a matter of discussion anymore but of behavior analysis.
Sickening.

--------------
"I am not currently proving that objective morality is true. I did that a long time ago and you missed it." -- StephenB

http://paralepsis.blogspot.com/....pot.com

   
bystander



Posts: 301
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,17:02   

It would be interesting to see what Baylor have to say about what happened. Wow the chip on Dembski's shoulder will be huge after this.

  
ERV



Posts: 329
Joined: Sep. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,17:31   

Okay, I cant take it anymore-- I have to register to vent here :P

So, SAL isnt going to post anymore, he just passes the torch to Casey.  Casey is too dumb to notice that his insults arent insults:

1-- Yeah, I hate Falwell.  I grew up in a small town, ALL of my gay friends admitted to me at one point or another that they were suicidal.... because of Falwells/Haggards/etc etc culture of hate.  But how many kids dont have someone safe to talk to?  How many gay kids blow their face off, strangle themselves, poison themselves, because of True Christian hate?  Damn straight, the happiest day of my life would be the day that whole clan drove off a cliff.

2-- So... Its 'good' that missionaries lie to people?  A lie that causes a slow painful death?  A lie that kills children?  Casey Luskin thinks its okay to tell people condoms dont prevent HIV transmission?

May they never stop digging :)

  
GCT



Posts: 1001
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,17:37   

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 03 2007,17:41)
Quote
Jehu
09/03/2007
3:32 pm
Truth has no fear of research. These cowards sold Bill Dembski out because they love status and influence in this world more than they love truth. So much for the teachings of Christ and all that.


I'm too tired and bored to even say the obvious thing here.

What?  That Jehu obviously can't smell truth?

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2780
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 03 2007,17:39   

Welcome, ERV

Even though I will never be able to face cottage cheese again, I do appreciate your willingness to call out the liars and point out the lies.

As for Luskin, I think you got all of it right except for this statement: "Casey Luskin thinks..."

No evidence of that, really.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
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