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Kattarina98 Posts: 1267 Joined: Sep. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 13 2012,02:35    Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 12 2012,22:37) I have not been able to keep up with everything plus being sick, let along the Coppafeelie case. I hope you are fine now. -------------- Barry Arrington is a bitch.

Kattarina98 Posts: 1267 Joined: Sep. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 13 2012,04:02    Quote (The whole truth @ Mar. 12 2012,21:01) I'm wondering if someone would be willing to create a thread about the Coppedge case? There's an article on Yahoo News about it here. Over at PT you can discuss Coppedge to your heart's delight: link -------------- Barry Arrington is a bitch.

Kristine Posts: 3061 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 13 2012,10:52    Quote (The whole truth @ Mar. 13 2012,01:22) I've been keeping up with the case on other sites but when I saw that Yahoo News article and wanted to bring it to the attention of people here I realized that there isn't a thread devoted to the case. I wasn't sure where to post about it and didn't want to clutter up the wrong thread. I just thought it might be a good idea to have a thread where posts about that case could be placed. I'll leave it up to the powers that be here. I'm just being grouchy - of course a thread can be devoted to it. This is the place for it! But these &$%#@ lawsuits are just becoming just like the moment in your childhood that you realized that both "The Road Runner" and "Scooby Doo" always had the same ending. -------------- Which came first: the shimmy, or the hip? AtBC Poet Laureate "I happen to think that this prerequisite criterion of empirical evidence is itself not empirical." - Clive "Damn you. This means a trip to the library. Again." -- fnxtr

Henry J Posts: 5786 Joined: Mar. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 13 2012,12:09    I don't remember a coyote falling off a cliff in Scooby Doo...

The whole truth Posts: 1554 Joined: Jan. 2012 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 13 2012,12:23    Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 13 2012,08:52) Quote (The whole truth @ Mar. 13 2012,01:22) I've been keeping up with the case on other sites but when I saw that Yahoo News article and wanted to bring it to the attention of people here I realized that there isn't a thread devoted to the case. I wasn't sure where to post about it and didn't want to clutter up the wrong thread. I just thought it might be a good idea to have a thread where posts about that case could be placed. I'll leave it up to the powers that be here. :) I'm just being grouchy - of course a thread can be devoted to it. This is the place for it! But these &$%#@ lawsuits are just becoming just like the moment in your childhood that you realized that both "The Road Runner" and "Scooby Doo" always had the same ending. :p I understand. :) I'd prefer that the lawsuit weren't even happening and that all of the IDiots would just STFU and leave science alone. -------------- Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. - Jesus in Matthew 10:34 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. -Jesus in Luke 19:27

Occam's Toothbrush Posts: 555 Joined: April 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 13 2012,12:35    Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 13 2012,11:52)   Quote (The whole truth @ Mar. 13 2012,01:22) I've been keeping up with the case on other sites but when I saw that Yahoo News article and wanted to bring it to the attention of people here I realized that there isn't a thread devoted to the case. I wasn't sure where to post about it and didn't want to clutter up the wrong thread. I just thought it might be a good idea to have a thread where posts about that case could be placed. I'll leave it up to the powers that be here. :) I'm just being grouchy - of course a thread can be devoted to it. This is the place for it! But these &$%#@ lawsuits are just becoming just like the moment in your childhood that you realized that both "The Road Runner" and "Scooby Doo" always had the same ending. :p Did you ever see the episode of Gilligan's Island where the castaways almost got off the island, but Gilligan did something idiotic and screwed it up? -------------- "Molecular stuff seems to me not to be biology as much as it is a more atomic element of life" --Creo nut Robert Byers ------ "You need your arrogant ass kicked, and I would LOVE to be the guy who does it. Where do you live?" --Anger Management Problem Concern Troll "Kris"

Henry J Posts: 5786 Joined: Mar. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 13 2012,13:47    What percentage of the episodes had that theme?

Texas Teach Posts: 2084 Joined: April 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 13 2012,21:31    Quote (Henry J @ Mar. 13 2012,13:47) What percentage of the episodes had that theme? :p About the same percentage as the amount of ID that's creationism. -------------- "Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr "I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

fnxtr Posts: 3504 Joined: June 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 13 2012,23:38    New avatar. That is all. As you were. -------------- "[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory "Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,01:41    Maths Q for teh_smart_ones Does anyone have the formulas for converting z scores (SDs) to cumulative probability percentages and vice verse? Thanks! -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

sledgehammer Posts: 533 Joined: Sep. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,01:55    Not sure what "z scores" are , but for normal (Gaussian) distributions, that would be errfc(sigma) (error function) where sigma is std dev. -------------- The majority of the stupid is invincible and guaranteed for all time. The terror of their tyranny is alleviated by their lack of consistency. -A. Einstein  (H/T, JAD) If evolution is true, you could not know that it's true because your brain is nothing but chemicals. ?Think about that. -K. Hovind

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,02:09    Quote (sledgehammer @ Mar. 14 2012,01:55) Not sure what "z scores" are , but for normal (Gaussian) distributions, that would be errfc(sigma) (error function) where sigma is std dev. Normal / guassian / bell http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki....les.gif I need an equation with only 1 input to give the corresponding output. Thanks! -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

socle Posts: 322 Joined: July 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,02:18    Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 14 2012,02:09) Normal / guassian / bell http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki.......les.gif I need an equation with only 1 input to give the corresponding output. Thanks! Rich, There is a formula---Phi(x) would be the probability of getting a z-score of less than x, assuming a standard normal distribution: (Stolen from the wikipedia page on the Normal Distribution)

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,02:23    Quote (socle @ Mar. 14 2012,02:18) Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 14 2012,02:09) Normal / guassian / bell http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki.......les.gif I need an equation with only 1 input to give the corresponding output. Thanks! Rich, There is a formula---Phi(x) would be the probability of getting a z-score of less than x, assuming a standard normal distribution: (Stolen from the wikipedia page on the Normal Distribution) I saw that.. but it has more than just 'x' in it. Could anyone step through it for 2 standard deviations, for example? -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

socle Posts: 322 Joined: July 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,09:16    Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 14 2012,02:23)   Quote (socle @ Mar. 14 2012,02:18)   Rich, There is a formula---Phi(x) would be the probability of getting a z-score of less than x, assuming a standard normal distribution: (Stolen from the wikipedia page on the Normal Distribution) I saw that.. but it has more than just 'x' in it. Could anyone step through it for 2 standard deviations, for example? Hi Rich, I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for, but you can use wolframalpha to evaluate the integral.  The url below shows that the calculation that about 95% of the values drawn from a normal distribution have z-scores between -2 and 2. There unfortunately isn't any way to convert the integral to a simple formula involving elementary functions.   http://tinyurl.com/7n5a9ee....7n5a9ee

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,09:25    Thanks guys - I'm going to expand on this a bit, which might help. first - I know it can be done programmatically, because I see computers do it. The problem is actually a bit ID relevant, as in not by chance. I'm looking at a call center type set up - we call folks of information, which they give us with various degrees of accuracy. what I'm trying to do is to pull in history of that person into the data entry tool, and check the new data vs the old data set to see if its reasonable. Standard deviations seem a good way to do this. Some thoughts: o Bad data in the history may exist o small data set gives disperse and less robust SD / confidence o Two types of error - transcription (bad typing) and people giving wrong data -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,09:29    And I should add - getting the SDs is easy. And we could flag > |2SD] as a potential error / outlier no problem. Just wondered if there was an easy way to convert it to <|0.025%| or whatever. -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Bob O'H Posts: 2564 Joined: Oct. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,09:43    If you're flagging, just used a fixed value, so you only need to calculate it once. e.g. there's a 5% chance of being outside 2 SDs (well, 1.96), and 1% chance of being outside 2.6 SDs. -------------- It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,09:54    Quote (Bob O'H @ Mar. 14 2012,09:43) If you're flagging, just used a fixed value, so you only need to calculate it once. e.g. there's a 5% chance of being outside 2 SDs (well, 1.96), and 1% chance of being outside 2.6 SDs. That's sort of the path we're going down. Probably over-engineering it before. That being said, It annoyed me I couldn't programmatically code for > an arbitrary % Maybe Joe G can help? -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Erasmus, FCD Posts: 6349 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,10:13    fuck no he is in the field now,  dragonfly nymphs are in 5th instars and starting to play, HARDCORE.   also, tick emergence season is ON.  motherfucker aint got time to do no maths for you unless you pay him, IOW Ya See your normal distribution is based on accidents IOW deviations from the mean with random errors drawn from distribution with mean = 0 IOW nature, operating freely, cannot produce a gamma distribution with any particular shape parameters Edited by Erasmus, FCD on Mar. 14 2012,11:15 -------------- You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

Amadan Posts: 1337 Joined: Jan. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,10:17    The Scientific Method and the Technological Method distinguished: -------------- "People are always looking for natural selection to generate random mutations" - Densye  4-4-2011 JoeG BTW dumbass- some variations help ensure reproductive fitness so they cannot be random wrt it.

Schroedinger's Dog Posts: 1692 Joined: Jan. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,10:27    LOL: Priest hooligans Sorry, in French. A few keywords should help find an english article, but I'm one lazy bastard today... -------------- "Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G "I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis "The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

Henry J Posts: 5786 Joined: Mar. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,10:52    Quote (Amadan @ Mar. 14 2012,09:17) The Scientific Method and the Technological Method distinguished: Now that smarts!

Kristine Posts: 3061 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 14 2012,16:33    Quote (Kattarina98 @ Mar. 13 2012,02:35) Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 12 2012,22:37) I have not been able to keep up with everything plus being sick, let along the Coppafeelie case. I hope you are fine now. Thank you, dear! I'll feel a lot better if they let me on the base Friday for Michele Obama's visit! OMG (so to speak), I have just been hired as an archivist there - oh please, oh puh-lease let me meet her! -------------- Which came first: the shimmy, or the hip? AtBC Poet Laureate "I happen to think that this prerequisite criterion of empirical evidence is itself not empirical." - Clive "Damn you. This means a trip to the library. Again." -- fnxtr

Schroedinger's Dog Posts: 1692 Joined: Jan. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 16 2012,12:32    Louis, where the fuck are you?!? *stomps feet* -------------- "Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G "I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis "The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

Timothy McDougald Posts: 1036 Joined: Dec. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 16 2012,12:56    Quote (Schroedinger's Dog @ Mar. 16 2012,12:32) Louis, where the fuck are you?!? *stomps feet* Oh, Oh, I know what will get him back. A good rousing game of Mornington Crescent and someone giving a speech about how it is still true to say that the sun never sets on the British Empire! Oh, and Arden's mum. -------------- Church burning ebola boy FTK: I Didn't answer your questions because it beats the hell out of me. PaV: I suppose for me to be pried away from what I do to focus long and hard on that particular problem would take, quite honestly, hundreds of thousands of dollars to begin to pique my interest.

fnxtr Posts: 3504 Joined: June 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 17 2012,01:12    Quote (afarensis @ Mar. 16 2012,10:56) Quote (Schroedinger's Dog @ Mar. 16 2012,12:32) Louis, where the fuck are you?!? *stomps feet* Oh, Oh, I know what will get him back. A good rousing game of Mornington Crescent and someone giving a speech about how it is still true to say that the sun never sets on the British Empire! Oh, and Arden's mum. I bet a dull, boring, wrongly-executed game of Mornington Crescent would get him here even faster. -------------- "[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory "Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

Kattarina98 Posts: 1267 Joined: Sep. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 17 2012,03:10    Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 14 2012,16:33) I'll feel a lot better if they let me on the base Friday for Michele Obama's visit! OMG (so to speak), I have just been hired as an archivist there - oh please, oh puh-lease let me meet her! :) Did you meet her? And if you did, I'd like to know every tiny detail, please. -------------- Barry Arrington is a bitch.

Amadan Posts: 1337 Joined: Jan. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 17 2012,08:54    Beannachtaí na Féile Pádraig oraibh! -------------- "People are always looking for natural selection to generate random mutations" - Densye  4-4-2011 JoeG BTW dumbass- some variations help ensure reproductive fitness so they cannot be random wrt it.

noncarborundum Posts: 320 Joined: Jan. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Mar. 17 2012,09:07    -------------- "The . . . um . . . okay, I was genetically selected for blue eyes.  I know there are brown eyes, because I've observed them, but I can't do it.  Okay?  So . . . um . . . coz that's real genetic selection, not the nonsense Giberson and the others are talking about." - DO'L

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