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  Topic: A Separate Thread for Gary Gaulin, As big as the poop that does not look< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Tony M Nyphot



Posts: 491
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 26 2015,17:47   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 26 2015,16:34)
         
Quote (Texas Teach @ April 26 2015,17:22)
           
Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 26 2015,17:12)
A theory is an explanation for how something works.

Period...

That doesn't even match the definition you just quoted.  You really are just impotently flailing about aren't you?

Wikipedia is known for favoring what the anti-ID movement wants for embellishments, which in turn end up part of NSTA policy and definitions even though they are being deceptively used by political hacks who use them to take the definition out of context.

Okay then, let's use the definition of a scientific theory and subsequent appraisal of Gary Gaulin's 40+ pages of mangled-English provided by a person Gary Gaulin has identified as a "cognitive science expert":

Scientific theories         
Quote
demand a coherent logical argument supported by pertinent evidence and [are] ideally consistent with the known scientific laws/theories in order [to view] a theory as scientific...You [GARY] singularly fail in this regard and hence I consider your effort unscientific.


--------------
"I, OTOH, am an underachiever...I either pee my pants or faint dead away..." FTK

"You could always wrap fresh fish in the paper you publish it on, though, and sell that." - Field Man on how to find value in Gary Gaulin's real-science "theory"

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 26 2015,17:48   

Quote (N.Wells @ April 26 2015,17:29)
Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 26 2015,17:26)
To also define police detective and historical theories only the following two words of additional information need to be added:

A theory is an explanation for how something works (or happened).


Well, so much for  
Quote
Period.
 That didn't last long.

If you go with "some aspect of the natural world" you can avoid the awkward expression of "how something works (or happened)", and you could also cover "or emerges" for free.

In only two words the definition went from strictly "scientific theory" to theories regularly worked on in crime drama TV shows and many others.

How well substantiated a theory is is not a requirement. If it were then String Theory would have never existed. Now that String Theory is best known as another failed theory it's still a "Theory" too.

The embellishments you believe are vital, are actually nonsense.

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
Jim_Wynne



Posts: 1208
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 26 2015,18:57   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 26 2015,17:34)
Quote (Texas Teach @ April 26 2015,17:22)
Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 26 2015,17:12)
A theory is an explanation for how something works.

Period...

That doesn't even match the definition you just quoted.  You really are just impotently flailing about aren't you?

Wikipedia is known for favoring what the anti-ID movement wants for embellishments, which in turn end up part of NSTA policy and definitions even though they are being deceptively used by political hacks who use them to take the definition out of context.

Gary, the English language is full of nuance--subtle differences in shades or meanings of words.  Because of this, context is important in determining what people mean by what they say.   "Theory" has a number of different meanings.  Some of them are easily confused with "hypothesis."  Because you use English like a blunt instrument, these subtle differences are lost upon you and you just go lumbering forth in your confused state.  Nowhere is clarity of meaning more important than in science.  Again, because your understanding of English grammar, punctuation, syntax and usage is abysmal, you ofter misuse common words and phrases.  You are demonstrably unfit to argue about any of this.

In the context of your "work," if we were charitable we might say you have a hypothesis.  You most definitely don't have a theory.  You have been told this by knowledgeable people everywhere you've gone.  Nonetheless, what you call your "work" is not nearly as important as the content of it.  Leave us not confuse the container for the thing contained.   Unfortunately, the content is unintelligible.

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Evolution is not about laws but about randomness on happanchance.--Robert Byers, at PT

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 26 2015,20:51   

Quote (Jim_Wynne @ April 26 2015,18:57)
In the context of your "work," if we were charitable we might say you have a hypothesis.  You most definitely don't have a theory.  You have been told this by knowledgeable people everywhere you've gone.

You are either trolling, or you're trying to get in on the action of Tony M Nyphot quoting you as a science expert too. Just say what they want to hear and you're in good with the in-crowd, in this toilet of a forum. Oh what an honor that is, not.

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
Texas Teach



Posts: 2084
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 26 2015,21:08   

If Gary had anything resembling a real scientific theory he'd be burying us under all his evidence.  He wouldn't care what it was called because he'd have the data to back it up.

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"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
Tony M Nyphot



Posts: 491
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 26 2015,23:08   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 26 2015,19:51)
               
Quote (Jim_Wynne @ April 26 2015,18:57)
In the context of your "work," if we were charitable we might say you have a hypothesis.  You most definitely don't have a theory.  You have been told this by knowledgeable people everywhere you've gone.

You are either trolling, or you're trying to get in on the action of Tony M Nyphot quoting you as a science expert too. Just say what they want to hear and you're in good with the in-crowd, in this toilet of a forum. Oh what an honor that is, not.

No Gary, I wouldn't quote Jim Wynne as a science expert as he has not identified himself as one.

The person I quoted was one you identified as a "cognitive science expert" from a forum you have repeatedly linked to and where you have indicated your "theory" has been "long known" and is "doing well". You introduced and linked to the expert with criteria for a scientific theory. Your "theory" failed to meet that criteria.

You chose the definition of a scientific theory from Wikipedia as your standard. When it was shown your "theory" failed to meet that standard, you then proceeded to sling mud Wikipedia's way.

You have presented your "theory" at a large number of forums asking for review. Everywhere you go, you are told you do not have a scientific theory. (Can you link us to a site that does so?)

Each of the sites you have linked to fail to confirm your "theory" as being scientific. Many commenters at multiple locations (including AtBC) have given constructive criticism to improve your not-a-theory only to be met with juvenile mudslinging, name-calling, smear campaigns, invective and defamation from you.

Even your treasured kurzweilai.net that you proudly tout as being "a forum where cognitive science experts who actually program cognitive systems are present" recognizes your "theory" for the delusional bluster that it is.

You hilariously resort to a kiddie program definition of "hypothesis" in a desperate search for credibility.

I'll help you out...here's a definition for Scientific Theory whose criteria your "theory" meets:

             
Quote
Scientific Theory (So Gary Gaulin can be a Real-Scientist)

Incoherent, unsupported, untestable twaddle featuring delusional ramblings in tortured English, here. And with borrowed, relabeled circuit diagrams you can post and post and repost, over and over, again and again, to prove it's real-science. Oh...and a totally unrelated animation of an insect (with a hippocampus!1!11) coded in the very high-level, computer-programmer worshipped language of Visual Basic. Here.


It's K-12 simple. I'm not sure it will be accepted as a valid definition though.

[ETA: Forgot how important it was to have an foraging insect animation for testing purposes of a real-science theory. Virtual -> Visual]

--------------
"I, OTOH, am an underachiever...I either pee my pants or faint dead away..." FTK

"You could always wrap fresh fish in the paper you publish it on, though, and sell that." - Field Man on how to find value in Gary Gaulin's real-science "theory"

  
N.Wells



Posts: 1836
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 26 2015,23:42   

Quote
in this toilet of a forum

And yet you refuse to leave.  I think that makes you a floater.

  
ChemiCat



Posts: 532
Joined: Nov. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,03:59   

Quote
If Gary had anything resembling a real scientific theory he'd be burying us under all his evidence.  He wouldn't care what it was called because he'd have the data to back it up.


Even simpler Gaulin could define his terminology in his own way and give us a clue as to what he wants his mangled English to mean.

To start he could define his usage of "intelligence" "best guess" and the other scientific terminology he renders useless in his "theory".

Once he has done this he can give us some way of testing his "theory".

I won't hold my breath waiting as he still has to justify "molecular intelligence".

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,17:26   

This Kurzweil AI thread has important information on something else happening in cognitive science, which is good news for the models and theory:

Memories May Not Live in Neurons’ Synapses

A spine that travels around using senses to decide which way to go is just another mobile ID Lab critter, but at the cellular intelligence level. It's possible that they have antennae too. I expect that modeling it any other way will have drawbacks like being less biologically accurate or slower running code.

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,17:30   

Quote (ChemiCat @ April 27 2015,03:59)
Once he has done this he can give us some way of testing his "theory".

Just do what I do to test the model.

What programming language do you normally use?

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,17:42   

Quote
As they wait for incoming signals, dendrites continually produce tiny flexible filaments called filopodia. These poke out from the surface of the dendrite and wave about in the region between the cells searching for axons. At the same time, biologists think that the axons secrete chemicals of an unknown nature that attract the filopodia.

http://medicalxpress.com/news.......es.html

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,19:04   

Quote (N.Wells @ April 26 2015,23:42)
Quote
in this toilet of a forum

And yet you refuse to leave.  I think that makes you a floater.

I'm more like the shit to disturb you that gets written all over your stalls and keeps coming back again. An academic form of marking a territory, by peeing on it. Science loves when it gets messy like that, so don't blame me for having to.

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
Jim_Wynne



Posts: 1208
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,19:06   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 27 2015,17:30)
Quote (ChemiCat @ April 27 2015,03:59)
Once he has done this he can give us some way of testing his "theory".

Just do what I do to test the model.

What programming language do you normally use?

Do you not understand the difference between running your program and testing a theory hypothesis? Really? When you run your program you're testing the code, not what the program is supposed to represent.  The code is not the "theory." The map is not the territory.

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Evolution is not about laws but about randomness on happanchance.--Robert Byers, at PT

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,19:35   

Quote (Jim_Wynne @ April 27 2015,19:06)
Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 27 2015,17:30)
Quote (ChemiCat @ April 27 2015,03:59)
Once he has done this he can give us some way of testing his "theory".

Just do what I do to test the model.

What programming language do you normally use?

Do you not understand the difference between running your program and testing a theory hypothesis? Really? When you run your program you're testing the code, not what the program is supposed to represent.  The code is not the "theory." The map is not the territory.

Please explain how you would go about testing the ability of the computer model and its theory to accurately model brains, neurons, genomes and other processes that science has not even explained half of yet.

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
fnxtr



Posts: 3504
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,19:45   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 27 2015,17:35)
Quote (Jim_Wynne @ April 27 2015,19:06)
Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 27 2015,17:30)
 
Quote (ChemiCat @ April 27 2015,03:59)
Once he has done this he can give us some way of testing his "theory".

Just do what I do to test the model.

What programming language do you normally use?

Do you not understand the difference between running your program and testing a theory hypothesis? Really? When you run your program you're testing the code, not what the program is supposed to represent.  The code is not the "theory." The map is not the territory.

Please explain how you would go about testing the ability of the computer model and its theory to accurately model brains, neurons, genomes and other processes that science has not even explained half of yet.

So you finally admit you have no clue what you're doing. Thanks for that.

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"[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory

"Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,20:08   

Quote (fnxtr @ April 27 2015,19:45)
Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 27 2015,17:35)
 
Quote (Jim_Wynne @ April 27 2015,19:06)
 
Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 27 2015,17:30)
   
Quote (ChemiCat @ April 27 2015,03:59)
Once he has done this he can give us some way of testing his "theory".

Just do what I do to test the model.

What programming language do you normally use?

Do you not understand the difference between running your program and testing a theory hypothesis? Really? When you run your program you're testing the code, not what the program is supposed to represent.  The code is not the "theory." The map is not the territory.

Please explain how you would go about testing the ability of the computer model and its theory to accurately model brains, neurons, genomes and other processes that science has not even explained half of yet.

So you finally admit you have no clue what you're doing. Thanks for that.

Consider me to be as dumb as a turd and I need you to show me how to test this computer model and its theory of operation for how well it can model things that very few people even know about yet:


http://www.planetsourcecode.com/vb....n....ngWId=1

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
N.Wells



Posts: 1836
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,21:11   

Quote
Consider me to be as dumb as a turd and I need you to show me how to test this computer model and its theory of operation for how well it can model things that very few people even know about yet:


A theory of operation is not yet a theory of operation if it needs testing.  A theory of operation is not a scientific theory: it is an explanation of how a device should operate so that people can better understand how it works and how to fix it if something goes wrong.  You have more or less provided a theory of operation for your computer program via explanatory text and comment lines in your program.

In terms of testing computer models, they need to be ground-truthed, to make sure that they represent reality as closely as possible.  Since insects don't have hippocampi, yours doesn't represent reality very well.  Since your model doesn't deal with reproduction over generations or any organisms simpler than insects, it doesn't address the emergence of intelligence and doesn't say anything about evolutionary processes, contrary to your assertions.  Since no intelligent design is involved other than you doing programming, it doesn't actually say anything about intelligent design.  More specifically, one tests a computer model by inputting a diversity of real numbers for various parameters (typically varying just one at a time) chosen to match some known natural or experimental situations, crank out some results, and compare them to the actual results in the real or experimental situation.  Since you lack both operational definitions and real-world quantitative data, we can't do this.  Thus, this part is not especially promising.

However, what you really meant to ask was how are you supposed to test the set/morass of ideas that you call a theory (but which is not yet any kind of a theory, particularly not a scientific one) about the emergence of intelligence, molecular intelligence, cellular intelligence, the Cambrian explosion, etc., etc., etc., etc., etc.

The steps to do this are:
Step 1) Provide clear and logical dictionary-type definitions for all terms to be used in nonstandard ways.  If these include controversial claims, provide supporting evidence that those claims are justified.

Step 2) Provide operational definitions so that we know what you are measuring and can measure it for ourselves

Step 3) Describe your ideas clearly so that everyone can understand them.

Step 4) Set up some specific mutually exclusive hypotheses that relate logically to things that your ideas explain in ways that are different from explanations offered by competing theories, and make some predictions that are entailed in them, and make equivalent but measurably different predictions that are derived from the competing theory or theories, and collect some new evidence that can determine which prediction was correct, and therefore which explanation is better.  Unfortunately, I am both unwilling and unable to help you with step 4, because you haven't yet completed steps 1 through 3.  This means that (a) in many cases I remain unsure what the heck you are talking about, (b) in many other cases I'm pretty sure what you are saying and you seem to be wrong, so until you gin up some evidence that demonstrates that you have something worthwhile, there doesn't seem to be anything worth bothering about, ( c) in lots of cases you are making claims that don't have anything to do with your model, so again there is nothing to test yet, at least in terms of the model.  

In short, what you have is far from ready for testing.

  
N.Wells



Posts: 1836
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,21:40   

In climate models, you model all the physical interactions as best you can from fundamental chemical and physical processes, balancing mass and energy, while paying attention to fluxes, volumes of reservoirs and sinks, and so on and so forth.  You feed in all the basic data and best estimate for a known region for a given time interval, say the American SW (topography, available moisture sources, incoming radiation, etc.) and you match results to data from all available meteorological stations, data like lake levels, stream flows, snow pack depths, etc., etc.  You tweak all this until your model is capable of correctly reproducing the actual data.  

Generally, you make this as fundamental as possible, rather than "as simple as possible" because reality is not simple, but fundamentals avoid fudges and false simplications and proxies.

Once you've got that accomplished, you are ready to test the model.  First, you will likely put in parameters for a different time interval with different weather (say, drought years, or very wet years, El Nino conditions, or some such), and you will test whether your program predicts results that match meteorological and climatic data for that new period.  Then you try some other conditions.  Then you expand your program to cover adjacent areas to see if it still works.  If all of that holds up, then you can start playing with hypothetical inputs to see what happens, for example during an ice age.

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,22:14   

Quote (N.Wells @ April 27 2015,21:40)
In climate models, you model all the physical interactions as best you can from fundamental chemical and physical processes, balancing mass and energy, while paying attention to fluxes, volumes of reservoirs and sinks, and so on and so forth.  You feed in all the basic data and best estimate for a known region for a given time interval, say the American SW (topography, available moisture sources, incoming radiation, etc.) and you match results to data from all available meteorological stations, data like lake levels, stream flows, snow pack depths, etc., etc.  You tweak all this until your model is capable of correctly reproducing the actual data.  

Generally, you make this as fundamental as possible, rather than "as simple as possible" because reality is not simple, but fundamentals avoid fudges and false simplications and proxies.

Once you've got that accomplished, you are ready to test the model.  First, you will likely put in parameters for a different time interval with different weather (say, drought years, or very wet years, El Nino conditions, or some such), and you will test whether your program predicts results that match meteorological and climatic data for that new period.  Then you try some other conditions.  Then you expand your program to cover adjacent areas to see if it still works.  If all of that holds up, then you can start playing with hypothetical inputs to see what happens, for example during an ice age.

The ID Lab's shock-zone arena to help compare behavior of the model against the real thing is from the paper and video by Eduard Kelemen and André A.Fenton (2010)
Dynamic Grouping of Hippocampal Neural Activity During Cognitive Control of Two Spatial Frames.
PLoS Biol 8(6): e1000403. doi:10.1371/journal.pbio.1000403

http://www.plosbiology.org/article....1000403

Video only:
http://www.plosbiology.org/article....03.s014

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
Tony M Nyphot



Posts: 491
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 27 2015,23:59   

Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 27 2015,18:04)
I'm more like the shit...that...keeps coming back

Quote (GaryGaulin @ April 27 2015,19:08)
Consider me to be as dumb as a turd


Really no need to ask 462 pages later...

--------------
"I, OTOH, am an underachiever...I either pee my pants or faint dead away..." FTK

"You could always wrap fresh fish in the paper you publish it on, though, and sell that." - Field Man on how to find value in Gary Gaulin's real-science "theory"

  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,01:39   

Quote (N.Wells @ April 27 2015,21:11)
A theory of operation is not yet a theory of operation if it needs testing.  

A well tested model can provide a theory of operation that in turn provides an operational definition based upon the systematics of the system (including biological) needing to be operationally defined.


It is far better to have a tentative operational definition than mislead yourself into believing that you have one that can has been fully tested, ground truthed, whatever.

At the moment all of the "ANN" models that I know of are being antiquated by new discoveries, which only have the model and I very excited! It is proving to have been a very good thing that I did NOT model neural networks that way.

The model that's still testing out to work great for all in biology is now more or less the only model left standing. And it's ready-made for critter-like filaments called filopodia that wave about in the region between the cells in search of axons (and similar behaviors including long migrations).

Quote (N.Wells @ April 27 2015,21:11)
A theory of operation is not a scientific theory: it is an explanation of how a device should operate so that people can better understand how it works and how to fix it if something goes wrong.  You have more or less provided a theory of operation for your computer program via explanatory text and comment lines in your program.


A theory of operation (for a model of a system) becomes very scientific when the "system" or "systems" being explained are biological systems that scientists now more than ever need better models for. LOL!!!

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The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
ChemiCat



Posts: 532
Joined: Nov. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,03:56   

Quote
Just do what I do to test the model.


How can I alter the parameters of your "model" to check that what YOU are programming is founded on reality? Especially when your "insect" has an hypothalamus?

Quote
It is far better to have a tentative operational definition than mislead yourself into believing that you have one that can has been fully tested, ground truthed, whatever.


So it is safe to work on an electrical circuit before unplugging it from the mains?

Gaulin, the only time you've been correct was when you called your "theory" and "model" the shit on the bathroom wall.

  
N.Wells



Posts: 1836
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,06:43   

I said:
     
Quote (N.Wells @ April 27 2015,21:11)
A theory of operation is not yet a theory of operation if it needs testing.  


You said (not me)      
Quote

A well tested model can provide a theory of operation that in turn provides an operational definition based upon the systematics of the system (including biological) needing to be operationally defined.

Theories of operation are explanations of the workings of designed systems.  Again, it's not Darwin's Theory of Operation of Evolution, even if it explains how evolution works.

A model that is not based on good operational definitions cannot be "well tested": you are getting the cart before the horse here.


     
Quote
It is far better to have a tentative operational definition than mislead yourself into believing that you have one that can has been fully tested, ground truthed, whatever.
Well, yes, of course, but if your operational definitions aren't nailed down, then by definition you really don't know what you are doing, so your model cannot be well-grounded.

     
Quote
At the moment all of the "ANN" models that I know of are being antiquated by new discoveries, which only have the model and I very excited! It is proving to have been a very good thing that I did NOT model neural networks that way.

The model that's still testing out to work great for all in biology is now more or less the only model left standing.
Let's take the first two sentences as true (except for the bit about "which only have the model and I very excited", which I still can't parse).  That just means that modelling these things is premature, at least in terms of either learning about the systems or assuming that any model can be true, because we don't know enough about them.  (It might well be valuable to try a model to learn more accurately how much you don't yet know, but yours is not capable of providing information like that, because everything about it is too ill-defined.)  The survival of your model means nothing, because it is in the categories of "not yet tested",  probably "not even wrong", and certainly "ignored by everyone in the business".


     
Quote
A theory of operation (for a model of a system) becomes very scientific when the "system" or "systems" being explained are biological systems that scientists now more than ever need better models for. LOL!!!

Again, you are operating under a misunderstanding about theories of operation.

  
NoName



Posts: 2729
Joined: Mar. 2013

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,08:02   

All these years, all these pages, and Gary still can't distinguish map from territory, nor "I do this and that happens" from an explanation.

For all your pretentious preening and posturing, Gary, we all know, even you, that you have no explanation, no 'theory', no relationship between your software and the real world it purports to 'model', and, most damning of all, not one single convert to your perverse perspective even after 8+ years of whoring your delusions around the internet.

Not. One. Single. Supporter.
Not. One. Single. Person. Agrees. With. You.

Your biography should be titled "Life as an Epic Failure".

  
Tony M Nyphot



Posts: 491
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,10:08   

Quote (NoName @ April 28 2015,07:02)
Your biography should be titled "Life as an Epic Failure".

Gary has already written the first line, though per his habit of stealing from expert literature, it's not original:

"Call me Ishmael dumb as a turd."

--------------
"I, OTOH, am an underachiever...I either pee my pants or faint dead away..." FTK

"You could always wrap fresh fish in the paper you publish it on, though, and sell that." - Field Man on how to find value in Gary Gaulin's real-science "theory"

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,10:09   

This is kinda like what Gary's program would be, if Gary wasn't a clueless lunatic: Evolution Lab

   
N.Wells



Posts: 1836
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,10:09   

So, Gary, in the Kurzweil thread that you found so valuable,
http://www.kurzweilai.net/forums.....ynapses :
  - one person thinks that insects don't have brains and claims to have been bitten by a wasp (and to have had a detailed conversation with its fellows),
  - another thinks that epigenetic retention of a change in the activation level of a single neuron means that cloning an organism from a single cell could mean preservation of the parent organism's entire personality,
  - a third person screws up converting milliseconds to seconds.  
  - and yet another person has trouble distinguishing science fiction from reality, asking "What about those people whose damaged brain parts, like hippocampus, were replaced by computers? Were those computers built on bad theory?"

You may want to exercise a little quality control regarding your sources of inspiration.  :)

  
Woodbine



Posts: 1218
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,11:10   

Quote (N.Wells @ April 28 2015,16:09)
So, Gary, in the Kurzweil thread that you found so valuable,
http://www.kurzweilai.net/forums.....ynapses :
  - one person thinks that insects don't have brains and claims to have been bitten by a wasp (and to have had a detailed conversation with its fellows)......

Can't leave it languishing over there, it's too good.....


  
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,19:20   

Quote (N.Wells @ April 28 2015,06:43)
I said:
           
Quote (N.Wells @ April 27 2015,21:11)
A theory of operation is not yet a theory of operation if it needs testing.  


You said (not me)          
Quote

A well tested model can provide a theory of operation that in turn provides an operational definition based upon the systematics of the system (including biological) needing to be operationally defined.

Theories of operation are explanations of the workings of designed systems.  Again, it's not Darwin's Theory of Operation of Evolution, even if it explains how evolution works.


Please spare us your anti-ID related embellishments to already accepted definitions. The word "designed" is not found (and does not belong) in the following:

 
Quote

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki.......eration

A theory of operation is a description of how a device or system should work. It is often included in documentation, especially maintenance/service documentation, or a user manual. It aids troubleshooting by providing the troubleshooter with a mental model of how the system is supposed to work. The troubleshooter can then more easily identify discrepancies, to aid diagnosis of problem.


It's not my fault that Charles Darwin only had a simple outside view of a complex intelligent system (that causes speciation) and did not have enough detail for a working model of it. If he did then he would have possibly like me have reached a point where the model would require a theory of operation (to explain how it works).

Talking on and on about fate having a way of selecting for or against given traits quickly gets very scientifically boring. Others before Charles Darwin knew about that anyway.

 
Quote (N.Wells @ April 28 2015,06:43)

           
Quote
A theory of operation (for a model of a system) becomes very scientific when the "system" or "systems" being explained are biological systems that scientists now more than ever need better models for. LOL!!!

Again, you are operating under a misunderstanding about theories of operation.


I ended up going well beyond the explanatory power that you are used to and from that experience I gained a better understand why a theory of operation or "how it works" is such a useful standard procedure to follow. The writing of needed theory became real easy. It's then like I'm used to from electronic datasheets and my having to explain novel circuits I found by experimentation. Comments inside the source code ".frm" files also all add up to a step by step for how the system works.

In my opinion I'm simply following a very useful systems biology approach, you will just have to get used to.

--------------
The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
GaryGaulin



Posts: 5385
Joined: Oct. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2015,20:30   

Quote (Woodbine @ April 28 2015,11:10)
Quote (N.Wells @ April 28 2015,16:09)
So, Gary, in the Kurzweil thread that you found so valuable,
http://www.kurzweilai.net/forums.....ynapses :
  - one person thinks that insects don't have brains and claims to have been bitten by a wasp (and to have had a detailed conversation with its fellows)......

Can't leave it languishing over there, it's too good.....


Semantics aside, I get their point about insects having body language and ways of nosily (even painfully) communicating their control-freak intentions to us in a way that we actually do right away figure out that they are saying "get out of our territory" to us. A wasp living aside human families while taking advantage of their outdoor barbecue food and whatever else opportunity offered might have at least some sense of when the human might be communicating their intentions to squash them, like they did to so many other bugs that they might have seen the humans squish.

I found that to be an excellent story. An example of why the Kurzweil AI forum is scientifically unique.

--------------
The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

   
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