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Antievolution.org Discussion Board > From the Panda's Thumb > After the Bar Closes... > The Guts/Nelson Alonso Thread

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Frostman Posts: 29 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,05:48    Hello Nelson Alonso aka Guts, You are digging yourself in deeper.  After being exposed for the scumbag that you are, out of desperation you come here to throw out random accusations and nonsense in sad attempt to distract from the recent stinging proof of your scumbaggery. Quote Quote In fact anon9 sent a coded message to the site administrator, Guts, saying that he was Frostman. In fact, I received no such "coded message". I did receive an e-mail from Frostman posing as JackT, who was using proxies to try to prove that he was not anon9/frostman, but still begged me to lift the ban. That is awesome.  Quote-mining from the quote-mining advocate.  Well at least it is consistent: after your steadfast defense of Bradford's out-of-context quoting, you engage in it yourself.  Here is the full quote, fool. Quote In fact anon9 sent a coded message to the site administrator, Guts, saying that he was Frostman.  anon9 said that Nelson Alonso was unethical, not Guts.  My posts here do not mention Nelson.  Only Frostman would know that Nelson Alonso is Guts, as revealed in the following correspondence where he changes his name in mid-stream. The coded message was that I called you Nelson Alonso, not Guts.  I assumed you would notice the use of your own name and immediately realize it was Frostman.  Alas, I forgot to apply the common knowledge that you are very, very stupid. Please continue digging yourself further into this hole of yours, Nelson.  Each comment you make here gets you deeper.  It is quite gratifying to watch.

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,05:48    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,05:45) The EF? lol again, you are completely ignorant of my position. The EF is as much of a joke as the assertion that steve can argue scientific topics. No doubt that's why you said   Quote Guts: Thats not a false positive wrt Dembski’s method, a false positive refers to using Dembski’s methodology to determine whether something is designed, and finding out it actually evolved. http://www.pandasthumb.org/archives/2005/05/telic-thoughts.html Changed your mind in the fact of evidence have you? I guess there's hope yet. -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Alan Fox Posts: 1556 Joined: Aug. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,05:48    Quote You don't get edit till you have shown you can be trusted not to go back and delete your own comments when they become an embarrassment to you. Joseph Heller would have been proud

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,05:48    Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ July 06 2008,05:47) Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,05:44)   Quote (Alan Fox @ July 06 2008,05:42)   Quote I'm going to show you that you are weak in terms of intellectual debate. Would a separate thread be appropriate, (assuming there are going to be more than a couple of comments)? No no, no seperate thread, come at me here. What do you mean? On the one hand you are saying "I don't debate people who don't know my position" and on the other you are saying "you are too intellectually challenged to debate me" Both cannot be true. Still, in your world, perhaps they can both be true and that's how you and people like you make your way in the world. I never said "I don't debate people who don't know my position" Why are you lying? I just said it was interesting, given the existence of this thread, that people don't know my position.

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,05:52    Frostman, Isn't it batshit insane, to refer to yourself in the third person. I truly think that you need psychological help, and if you e-mail me again, I can refer you to some experts that can help you. I can post the relevant comment you left if you "blacked out" because of your "problem" and can't remember. It's also interesting that you said you "sent me" a coded message, I received no such message. Why are you lying? The reason is obvious.

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,05:52    Guts: Quote No it doesn't, it just makes the EF fallible, and not perfect, like most sciences. If the EF detects an object as designed, and but we find out it actually evolved, then you can say that it's not reliable. But that hasn't happened yet. Pointing to the possibility that it might happen doesn't render it useless at all. hahah -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,05:57    Yes to people who are psycho that would be funny, don't blame me.

dnmlthr Posts: 565 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:01    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,11:57) Yes to people who are psycho that would be funny, don't blame me. Well, since you seem to have changed your position, I think it would be a good thing if you could define your position as it currently stands, in order to get rid of any misconceptions. -------------- Guess what? I don't give a flying f*ck how "science works" - Ftk

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:02    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,05:57) Yes to people who are psycho that would be funny, don't blame me. And so it begins. I must say Guts, I think this is the fastest ever transition from "challenge to debate" to "ignoring awkward comments" we've ever had. Grats. -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:03    Quote (dnmlthr @ July 06 2008,06:01) Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,11:57) Yes to people who are psycho that would be funny, don't blame me. Well, since you seem to have changed your position, I think it would be a good thing if you could define your position as it currently stands, in order to get rid of any misconceptions. How in the world could you know I changed my position if you don't even know it? Bizarre.

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:03    So, Guts, about the EF. Currently laughable to you, but you obviously believed in it at some point (circa 2005). What lead you to the truth of the matter? -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:04    Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ July 06 2008,06:02) Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,05:57) Yes to people who are psycho that would be funny, don't blame me. And so it begins. I must say Guts, I think this is the fastest ever transition from "challenge to debate" to "ignoring awkward comments" we've ever had. Grats. Why would you say that? You don't even know my position, so it's not even possible that you could even debate me. It shows your lack of intellect really. Multiple pages of this thread, and you don't even know my position? How is that not hilarious.

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:05    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:03) Quote (dnmlthr @ July 06 2008,06:01) Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,11:57) Yes to people who are psycho that would be funny, don't blame me. Well, since you seem to have changed your position, I think it would be a good thing if you could define your position as it currently stands, in order to get rid of any misconceptions. How in the world could you know I changed my position if you don't even know it? Bizarre. I've just shown how you've changed your position on the EF. Why is it so unbelievable you might have changed your other positions in the fact of factual evidence shown why those positions were wrong? We don't know exactly where you've got to in your struggle to discard all the debris of a damaged mind, so if you can state your current position we can hold your hand while you inch towards the reality based community. -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Alan Fox Posts: 1556 Joined: Aug. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:07    Please, please, please, Guts, State your position. Thanks in advance.

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:08    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:04) Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ July 06 2008,06:02)   Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,05:57) Yes to people who are psycho that would be funny, don't blame me. And so it begins. I must say Guts, I think this is the fastest ever transition from "challenge to debate" to "ignoring awkward comments" we've ever had. Grats. Why would you say that? You don't even know my position, so it's not even possible that you could even debate me. It shows your lack of intellect really. Multiple pages of this thread, and you don't even know my position? How is that not hilarious. Guts, have I said I don't know what your position is? OK, what do you want to debate about? Shall we try that? How about "how the explanatory filter is a worthless construct that is only used to fool the less mathematical into believing that design detection has a foundation in reality when in fact it's just the math icing on a cake of nothing" -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:08    How do you know I changed my position on the EF? I actually did defend it at one point, not because I agreed with it but because it was being misrepresented but that doesn't mean I espouse it, that is a completely different issue.

Frostman Posts: 29 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:09    Nelson Alonso aka Guts: Quote It's also interesting that you said you "sent me" a coded message, I received no such message. Why are you lying? The reason is obvious. I thought I've seen thick skulls before, but yours has got to be the thickest I have ever seen.  For the third time: the coded message was that I called you Nelson Alonso, not Guts. To witness your disintegration into a flailing ball of petulant 13-year-old comments here, right now, on this forum, is so awesome, Nelson.  Please, continue, continue.

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:10    Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ July 06 2008,06:08) Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:04)   Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ July 06 2008,06:02)   Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,05:57) Yes to people who are psycho that would be funny, don't blame me. And so it begins. I must say Guts, I think this is the fastest ever transition from "challenge to debate" to "ignoring awkward comments" we've ever had. Grats. Why would you say that? You don't even know my position, so it's not even possible that you could even debate me. It shows your lack of intellect really. Multiple pages of this thread, and you don't even know my position? How is that not hilarious. Guts, have I said I don't know what your position is? OK, what do you want to debate about? Shall we try that? How about "how the explanatory filter is a worthless construct that is only used to fool the less mathematical into believing that design detection has a foundation in reality when in fact it's just the math icing on a cake of nothing" How about we debate your complete and utter Incompetence ? That seems like a good debate.

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:10    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:08) How do you know I changed my position on the EF? I actually did defend it at one point, not because I agreed with it but because it was being misrepresented but that doesn't mean I espouse it, that is a completely different issue. Simple question. Does the EF, in your option, work or not? Can it be used to "detect design"? If "yes" why do you think that? If "yes" can you give us an example? If "no" can you say why you think it works without being able to give an example? -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:11    Quote (Frostman @ July 06 2008,06:09) Nelson Alonso aka Guts: Quote It's also interesting that you said you "sent me" a coded message, I received no such message. Why are you lying? The reason is obvious. I thought I've seen thick skulls before, but yours has got to be the thickest I have ever seen.  For the third time: the coded message was that I called you Nelson Alonso, not Guts. To witness your disintegration into a flailing ball of petulant 13-year-old comments here, right now, on this forum, is so awesome, Nelson.  Please, continue, continue. Frostman, you still haven't told me why you refer to yourself in the third person. Isn't that utterly insane? Do you think your mother would be proud of something like that?

dnmlthr Posts: 565 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:12    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,12:03)   Quote (dnmlthr @ July 06 2008,06:01)     Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,11:57) Yes to people who are psycho that would be funny, don't blame me. Well, since you seem to have changed your position, I think it would be a good thing if you could define your position as it currently stands, in order to get rid of any misconceptions. How in the world could you know I changed my position if you don't even know it? Bizarre. Earlier in this thread you stated   Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,11:45) The EF? lol again, you are completely ignorant of my position. The EF is as much of a joke as the assertion that steve can argue scientific topics. But in a thread on telic thoughts in 2005 you wrote the following.   Quote (Guts @ May 06 2005 on TT) PvM:   Quote These statements combined with the admission that false positives are possible make the EF useless. For example, assume that ID had presented a clear case of an EF applied to infer design, how would we know that it had not forgotten a particular hypothesis? No it doesn't, it just makes the EF fallible, and not perfect, like most sciences. If the EF detects an object as designed, and but we find out it actually evolved, then you can say that it's not reliable. But that hasn't happened yet. Pointing to the possibility that it might happen doesn't render it useless at all. How is that not changing your position? Now do you understand why there might be some confusion regarding your position? -------------- Guess what? I don't give a flying f*ck how "science works" - Ftk

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:15    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:10) How about we debate your complete and utter Incompetence ? That seems like a good debate. Lets. It simply shows how  desperate you are to avoid engaging on substantive issues. -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:15    I don't get it, I defend against falsehood, even the EF, if you're so utterly stupid that you don't get the EF, I will call you out on it. But it doesn't mean I espouse it. So i don't get your point.

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:16    Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ July 06 2008,06:15) Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:10) How about we debate your complete and utter Incompetence ? That seems like a good debate. Lets. It simply shows how  desperate you are to avoid engaging on substantive issues. You're a moron and you should realize this undisputable fact of life. Ok?

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:18    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:16) Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ July 06 2008,06:15) Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:10) How about we debate your complete and utter Incompetence ? That seems like a good debate. Lets. It simply shows how  desperate you are to avoid engaging on substantive issues. You're a moron and you should realize this undisputable fact of life. Ok? Name calling? And you wonder why people don't take you seriously? -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:19    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:15) I don't get it, I defend against falsehood, even the EF, if you're so utterly stupid that you don't get the EF, I will call you out on it. But it doesn't mean I espouse it. So i don't get your point. Defend the EF by giving us an example of it being used. I bet you can't. And further more I bet the reason you can't won't be "There is no example to give" but "you are a moron". -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:20    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:16) Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ July 06 2008,06:15) Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:10) How about we debate your complete and utter Incompetence ? That seems like a good debate. Lets. It simply shows how  desperate you are to avoid engaging on substantive issues. You're a moron and you should realize this undisputable fact of life. Ok? Oh, is this you conceding the debate? -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Guts Posts: 226 Joined: Nov. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:20    No thats me conceding that you're a retard.

oldmanintheskydidntdoit Posts: 4999 Joined: July 2006 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:24    Quote (Guts @ July 06 2008,06:20) No thats me conceding that you're a retard. You don't know you won't be able to go back and edit all this right? How you got challenged to a debate and responded like a 10 year old? It's good to know this is the best you've got. In fact, like FTK, you are the best advertisement for what "telic thoughts" do to your brain. Carry on the good work Guts, we'd be a lot worse off without your type of unthinking acceptance of such concepts as the EF. It serves to illustrate to the undecided lurkers the paucity of ideas and facts supporting your side of the "debate". Not that they know what your side is as you refuse to tell them. Sound laughable does it when you write it out? Don't blame you for not telling in that case. -------------- I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies". FTK if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand Gordon Mullings

Alan Fox Posts: 1556 Joined: Aug. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,06:24    Ah I think Nelson/Guts is attempting the debating tactic of provoking a banning, sometimes referred to as "death by Cop", I believe. This is all very illuminating, Sir. (Edited for spelling)

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