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Antievolution.org Discussion Board > From the Panda's Thumb > After the Bar Closes... > Uncommonly Dense Thread 4

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midwifetoad Posts: 4003 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,15:41    Quote The concepts that he writes about however... Such as the concept that a red plastic ball spontaneously coming into existence is somehow equivalent to a ribosome spontaneously coming into existence? How is that relevant to ID? What is he arguing for or against? -------------- Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

Freddie Posts: 371 Joined: Oct. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,15:55    Quote (midwifetoad @ Aug. 24 2012,13:45) Upright continues (same link as above, plus 1).         Quote Through an interesting turn of events, I was given the opportunity to have an audience with a physicist that many would consider an authority on these specific topics. I can say this with some confidence because his peers have already honored him as such more than once. There is no need in asking for his name because (#1) I do not have his permission to give it and (#2) I wouldn’t anyway. This man is an ardent materialist who was kind enough to review the larger argument I am making here and give me his response to it. I have no intentions of dragging him out to be slaughtered by the ideologues whom have already shown what they will do to anyone who would stain themselves by agreeing with an ID proponent. It’s not going to happen. The reason I bring this up is because I do intend on sharing the first line of his response. ... blah, blah, blah ,,, And in contrast, here is the first line in the response from a physicist motivated by evidence, without the emotional requirement to belittle and berate any perceived lesser person who holds a different opinion:         Quote    I agree with everything you say, although I often use different terms. I try to stick with the vocabulary of physics as much as possible. This is just one example of the arbitrariness … Perhaps someone can translate this into something meaningful. Happy to help: >>I agree with everything you say, "Please don't bother me right now I am in the middle of something" >>although I often use different terms. "What the fuck are you talking about?" >>I try to stick with the vocabulary of physics as much as possible. "Whatever it is you are trying to tell me you are not making any sense at all.  You might as well be spouting Vogon poetry." >>This is just one example of the arbitrariness … "I'm going to start just saying random stuff back at you so you think i'm agreeing with you, then you'll hopefully go away and not bug me any more.  I come to parties to let my hair down, so please cut the metaphysical bollocks and stop blocking my route to the bar ... " -------------- Joe: Most criticisims of ID stem from ignorance and jealousy. Joe: As for the authors of the books in the Bible, well the OT was authored by Moses and the NT was authored by various people. Byers: The eskimo would not need hairy hair growth as hair, I say, is for keeping people dry. Not warm.

Henry J Posts: 5786 Joined: Mar. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,16:22    Quote (Soapy Sam @ Aug. 24 2012,13:59) I'd be fractionally more impressed if he had a pet molecular biologist. What do physicists really know about biochem? Organic molecules are made from atoms, which are made of electrons, protons, and neutrons, and the later two are made of up quarks and down quarks. What more do they need to know?

Soapy Sam Posts: 659 Joined: Jan. 2012 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,16:36    Quote (Henry J @ Aug. 24 2012,16:22) Quote (Soapy Sam @ Aug. 24 2012,13:59) I'd be fractionally more impressed if he had a pet molecular biologist. What do physicists really know about biochem? Organic molecules are made from atoms, which are made of electrons, protons, and neutrons, and the later two are made of up quarks and down quarks. What more do they need to know?  :p ... nope, I guess that covers everything! -------------- SoapySam is a pathetic asswiper. Joe G BTW, when you make little jabs like “I thought basic logic was one thing UDers could handle,” you come off looking especially silly when you turn out to be wrong. - Barry Arrington

Tracy P. Hamilton Posts: 1239 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,16:43    Quote (REC @ Aug. 24 2012,10:19) Quote (sparc @ Aug. 24 2012,01:41) Quote UD News away till October 30 August 23, 2012 Posted by News under Adminstrative, Intelligent Design Needing to finish up a manuscript for Christian Darwinism (Broadman and Holman, 2014), a book co-authored with Bill Dembski, the News desk needs to focus, focus, focus. Deja vu:     Quote New book announcement: William A. Dembski and Denyse O’Leary slam “Christian Darwinism” in forthcoming book August 6, 2010 Posted by O'Leary under Intelligent Design In Christian Darwinism: Why Theistic Evolution Fails As Science and Theology (Broadman and Holman, November 2011), mathematician Dembski and journalist O’Leary address a powerful new trend to accommodate Christianity with atheist materialism, via acceptance of Darwinian (“survival of the fittest”) evolution. Hey look...Dr. Dr. is on the author's page along with Chuck Norris and Ollie North: Link Also brought to you by B&H- pre-filled, hermetically sealed communion cups of grape juice with a little wafer on top. I can't think of a greater perversion of the symbol of the COMMUNAL sharing of wine and breaking of bread. COMMUNAL, as in COMMUNIST?! -------------- "Following what I just wrote about fitness, you’re taking refuge in what we see in the world."  PaV "The simple equation F = MA leads to the concept of four-dimensional space." GilDodgen "We have no brain, I don't, for thinking." Robert Byers

midwifetoad Posts: 4003 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,18:08    One cup two guys? -------------- Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

midwifetoad Posts: 4003 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,18:22    Barry has baited another yes/no bannation trap. Has someone already tripped the wire? -------------- Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

Zachriel Posts: 2723 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,18:36    Quote Barry Arrington: I asked our materialist friends whether it is self-evidently true that torturing young children for fun is morally evil in all places at all times even if everyone believes otherwise for whatever reason. Some consider playing with their food to be de rigueur. Edited by Zachriel on Aug. 24 2012,18:38 -------------- You never step on the same tard twice—for it's not the same tard and you're not the same person.

REC Posts: 638 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,21:01    "torturing young children for fun is morally evil" Note the qualifier from the righteous Barry: for fun. For profit? eh.....Barry? Wtf man. Why the qualifier? Or is the qualifier because maybe your God occasionally demands it: Genesis 22:1-12, Judges 11:30-39, Numbers 31:16-18, (I Samuel 15:2-3, Isaiah 13:15-16, Deuteronomy 2:34, Deuteronomy 3:6-7, Exodus 12:29-30, 2 Kings 2:23-24,  Deuteronomy 13:6-10...

k.e.. Posts: 5432 Joined: May 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,21:11    Quote (midwifetoad @ Aug. 24 2012,21:45) Upright continues (same link as above, plus 1). Quote Through an interesting turn of events, I was given the opportunity to have an audience with a physicist that many would consider an authority on these specific topics. I can say this with some confidence because his peers have already honored him as such more than once. There is no need in asking for his name because (#1) I do not have his permission to give it and (#2) I wouldn’t anyway. This man is an ardent materialist who was kind enough to review the larger argument I am making here and give me his response to it. I have no intentions of dragging him out to be slaughtered by the ideologues whom have already shown what they will do to anyone who would stain themselves by agreeing with an ID proponent. It’s not going to happen. The reason I bring this up is because I do intend on sharing the first line of his response. ... blah, blah, blah ,,, And in contrast, here is the first line in the response from a physicist motivated by evidence, without the emotional requirement to belittle and berate any perceived lesser person who holds a different opinion: Quote    I agree with everything you say, although I often use different terms. I try to stick with the vocabulary of physics as much as possible. This is just one example of the arbitrariness … Perhaps someone can translate this into something meaningful. Quote    I agree with everything you say, although I often use different terms. I try to stick with the vocabulary of physics as much as possible. This is just one example of the arbitrariness … hahahahahahahahaha CRACKPOT ALERT! -------------- "I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit "ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus "I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

NormOlsen Posts: 104 Joined: Nov. 2011 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 24 2012,22:18    Quote (REC @ Aug. 24 2012,21:01) "torturing young children for fun is morally evil" Note the qualifier from the righteous Barry: for fun. For profit? eh.....Barry? Wtf man. Why the qualifier? Or is the qualifier because maybe your God occasionally demands it: Genesis 22:1-12, Judges 11:30-39, Numbers 31:16-18, (I Samuel 15:2-3, Isaiah 13:15-16, Deuteronomy 2:34, Deuteronomy 3:6-7, Exodus 12:29-30, 2 Kings 2:23-24,  Deuteronomy 13:6-10... Blech. I miss DeNews already if more Barry is what we have to look forward to in her absence. But where are the clowns? Quick, send in the clowns. Don't bother, they're here.

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,01:12    Kiros Focus' defense of censsorship: http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-431147 Quote 35 kairosfocusAugust 25, 2012 at 12:02 am Mung: One, where it is credible that we are not playing around where crocodiles lurk and where the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low. In simpler terms, if objectors would simply be willing to address issues on the merits of fact and logic, with a modicum of common decency and broughtupcy, we could have a serious discussion. The comments boxes of UD are open for just that, but over time consistently we find abusive objectors, evasive/distractive objectors and enablers for abusive and evasive/distractive objectors. That is beginning to look to me very much like the warrant is not on the side of the objectors, and deep down they know it but are clinging to an ideological position for reasons that cannot be put up in polite and serious company. Which reminds me a lot of the Marxists I had to deal with at the turn of the 80?s. Ten years to go, if the timelines are truly parallel (and providing someone shows up for a high-noon showdown and refuses to back off under intimidation and mud-slinging etc), then. That is part of why it is so important that here be places like UD etc where the issues can be dealt with on a level playing field basis, where those with the manners and attitudes of a swamp predator are not welcome. KF Because calling folks "those with the manners and attitudes of a swamp predator" exhibits "address issues on the merits of fact and logic, with a modicum of common decency ". Mullings, you're just a cowardly pulpit bully unable to carry himself in a public forum. -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Freddie Posts: 371 Joined: Oct. 2009 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,02:23    Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 25 2012,01:12) Kiros Focus' defense of censsorship:     Quote 35 kairosfocusAugust 25, 2012 at 12:02 am Mung: <snip> The comments boxes of UD are open for just that, but over time consistently we find abusive objectors, evasive/distractive objectors and enablers for abusive and evasive/distractive objectors. <snip> KF Because calling folks "those with the manners and attitudes of a swamp predator" exhibits "address issues on the merits of fact and logic, with a modicum of common decency ". Mullings, you're just a cowardly pulpit bully unable to carry himself in a public forum. Reminds me of something:       Quote [Jimmy is explaining to Reggie what kinds of people his secret army will be against] Jimmy Anderson: Wreckers of law and order. Communists, Maoists, Trotskyists, neo-Trotskyists, crypto-Trotskyists, union leaders, Communist union leaders, atheists, agnostics, long-haired weirdos, short-haired weirdos, vandals, hooligans, football supporters, namby-pamby probation officers, rapists, papists, papist rapists, foreign surgeons - headshrinkers, who ought to be locked up, Wedgwood Benn, keg bitter, punk rock, glue-sniffers, "Play For Today", Clive Jenkins, Roy Jenkins, Up Jenkins, up everybody's, Chinese restaurants - why do you think Windsor Castle is ringed with Chinese restaurants? Reginald Perrin: You realise the sort of people you're going to attract, don't you, Jimmy? Thugs, bully-boys, psychopaths, sacked policemen, security guards, sacked security guards, racialists, Paki-bashers, queer-bashers, Chink-bashers, anybody-bashers, rear Admirals, queer admirals, Vice Admirals, fascists, neo-fascists, crypto-fascists, loyalists, neo-loyalists, crypto-loyalists. Jimmy Anderson: Do you think so? I thought support might be difficult. Reggie -------------- Joe: Most criticisims of ID stem from ignorance and jealousy. Joe: As for the authors of the books in the Bible, well the OT was authored by Moses and the NT was authored by various people. Byers: The eskimo would not need hairy hair growth as hair, I say, is for keeping people dry. Not warm.

Soapy Sam Posts: 659 Joined: Jan. 2012 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,03:53    Quote (midwifetoad @ Aug. 24 2012,18:22) Barry has baited another yes/no bannation trap. Has someone already tripped the wire? I see several of Barry's allies have disappointed him in their answers. But wait ... Captain Objective-Morality WJM:     Quote Materialists, start your equivocation engines! Smug professionally-equivocating libertarian free-willers, give us a clue as to how we can reliably determine the truth or falsehood of purported communications from Objective Morality HQ re: What We Should Abhor! -------------- SoapySam is a pathetic asswiper. Joe G BTW, when you make little jabs like “I thought basic logic was one thing UDers could handle,” you come off looking especially silly when you turn out to be wrong. - Barry Arrington

Seversky Posts: 442 Joined: June 2010 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,04:04    Best way to answer Bully's challenge is with another: "Come out here and say that!"

Occam's Aftershave Posts: 5287 Joined: Feb. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,08:42    Quote (Seversky @ Aug. 25 2012,04:04) Best way to answer Bully's challenge is with another: "Come out here and say that!" Wonder if Bully is going to give us another round of "answer the question the way I demand or be banned!"? -------------- "CO2 can't re-emit any trapped heat unless all the molecules point the right way" "All the evidence supports Creation baraminology" "If it required a mind, planning and design, it isn't materialistic." "Jews and Christians are Muslims." - Joke "Sharon" Gallien, world's dumbest YEC.

CeilingCat Posts: 2363 Joined: Dec. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,08:55    Barry's Self Evident Truth Thread   Quote All attempts to evade the question or change the subject (such as bringing up specious discussions of obscure Old Testament texts) will be ruthlessly deleted, so don’t waste our time trying to put them in the combox.   Don't be specious and bring up OUR moral failings.  It's not immoral when God orders it.

k.e.. Posts: 5432 Joined: May 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,09:30    Quote (Freddie @ Aug. 25 2012,10:23) Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 25 2012,01:12) Kiros Focus' defense of censsorship:       Quote 35 kairosfocusAugust 25, 2012 at 12:02 am Mung: <snip> The comments boxes of UD are open for just that, but over time consistently we find abusive objectors, evasive/distractive objectors and enablers for abusive and evasive/distractive objectors. <snip> KF Because calling folks "those with the manners and attitudes of a swamp predator" exhibits "address issues on the merits of fact and logic, with a modicum of common decency ". Mullings, you're just a cowardly pulpit bully unable to carry himself in a public forum. Reminds me of something:         Quote [Jimmy is explaining to Reggie what kinds of people his secret army will be against] Jimmy Anderson: Wreckers of law and order. Communists, Maoists, Trotskyists, neo-Trotskyists, crypto-Trotskyists, union leaders, Communist union leaders, atheists, agnostics, long-haired weirdos, short-haired weirdos, vandals, hooligans, football supporters, namby-pamby probation officers, rapists, papists, papist rapists, foreign surgeons - headshrinkers, who ought to be locked up, Wedgwood Benn, keg bitter, punk rock, glue-sniffers, "Play For Today", Clive Jenkins, Roy Jenkins, Up Jenkins, up everybody's, Chinese restaurants - why do you think Windsor Castle is ringed with Chinese restaurants? Reginald Perrin: You realise the sort of people you're going to attract, don't you, Jimmy? Thugs, bully-boys, psychopaths, sacked policemen, security guards, sacked security guards, racialists, Paki-bashers, queer-bashers, Chink-bashers, anybody-bashers, rear Admirals, queer admirals, Vice Admirals, fascists, neo-fascists, crypto-fascists, loyalists, neo-loyalists, crypto-loyalists. Jimmy Anderson: Do you think so? I thought support might be difficult. Reggie heheheh one of the all time great pommy comedies -------------- "I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit "ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus "I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

midwifetoad Posts: 4003 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,10:03    Who is this "we" that keeps finding unworthy commenters? Surely it isn't KF, who has no influence at all on who gets banned. -------------- Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

keiths Posts: 2195 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,10:58    Gil Dodgen: Quote On the other hand, we must continue the fight. You never know whom you might reach. My Christian friend Dave Pounds once prayed for me and introduced me to both Christianity and the ID movement when I was an atheist, and look at what that led to! Bless you, Gil.  You just scared more people away from ID and Christianity than Dawkins could ever hope to. Edited by keiths on Aug. 25 2012,08:59 -------------- And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number. -- Joe G Please stop putting words into my mouth that don't belong there and thoughts into my mind that don't belong there. -- KF

fnxtr Posts: 3504 Joined: June 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,11:02    <Beavis> Huh-huh. He said "taint". Huh-huh. </Beavis> -------------- "[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory "Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night."  Joe G

keiths Posts: 2195 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,11:23    Sal posts Sandra Harding's infamous "Newton's rape manual" quote, and then writes: Quote And this is the same Sandra Harding that A+ Atheist Ophelia Benson enthusiastically supports to teach science! Quote Ah-a. Sandra Harding has a new book – and it does look like a corker. Happily, people are taking note, and adding it to their science studies course outlines as required reading. Splendid….Great. Study of science that is more politically engaged. Great idea. Return of Sandra Harding by Ophelia Benson If philosophical Darwinism has friends like Ophelia Benson and Sandra Harding, they don’t need enemies. Hey Sal, you dumbass, why don't you actually read Benson's post?  She's mocking Harding, not agreeing with her. Benson's post concludes, re Harding: Quote One of the most important and influential [writers], alas – that’s why she made an extended guest appearance in Why Truth Matters: because she is indeed, however incredible it may seem, influential. Christ.  Like Gil, Sal is a walking advertisement for why you don't want to be an IDer. -------------- And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number. -- Joe G Please stop putting words into my mouth that don't belong there and thoughts into my mind that don't belong there. -- KF

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,13:30    UD is mad at atheism at the moment. Are those atheists stopping you detecting design, dimbulbs? -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Bob O'H Posts: 2564 Joined: Oct. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,13:43    Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 25 2012,13:30) UD is mad at atheism at the moment. Are those atheists stopping you detecting design, dimbulbs? Well, I'm trying to. I squirt in some anti-CSI tonic into their experiments when they're not looking. -------------- It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

REC Posts: 638 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,14:57    Quote (CeilingCat @ Aug. 25 2012,08:55) Barry's Self Evident Truth Thread   Quote All attempts to evade the question or change the subject (such as bringing up specious discussions of obscure Old Testament texts) will be ruthlessly deleted, so don’t waste our time trying to put them in the combox.   Don't be specious and bring up OUR moral failings.  It's not immoral when God orders it. (such as bringing up specious discussions of obscure Old Testament texts) What qualifies calling part of the inspired word of God obscure Barry? What distinguishes those passages from ones Christians want hung on courthouse walls or persecute gays with?

keiths Posts: 2195 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,17:04    Quote (keiths @ Aug. 25 2012,09:23) Sal posts Sandra Harding's infamous "Newton's rape manual" quote, and then writes: Quote And this is the same Sandra Harding that A+ Atheist Ophelia Benson enthusiastically supports to teach science! Quote Ah-a. Sandra Harding has a new book – and it does look like a corker. Happily, people are taking note, and adding it to their science studies course outlines as required reading. Splendid….Great. Study of science that is more politically engaged. Great idea. Return of Sandra Harding by Ophelia Benson If philosophical Darwinism has friends like Ophelia Benson and Sandra Harding, they don’t need enemies. Hey Sal, you dumbass, why don't you actually read Benson's post?  She's mocking Harding, not agreeing with her. Benson's post concludes, re Harding: Quote One of the most important and influential [writers], alas – that’s why she made an extended guest appearance in Why Truth Matters: because she is indeed, however incredible it may seem, influential. Christ.  Like Gil, Sal is a walking advertisement for why you don't want to be an IDer. Benson drops in at UD: Quote I hate to tell you but you completely misunderstood me – I was being sarcastic. I don’t admire the work of Sandra Harding at all. I wrote about it in the book Why Truth Matters, very critically. Paul Gross is a friend of mine, and (with Norman Levitt) the origin of my view of Harding (see their book Higher Superstition). Sal responds in full smarm: Quote Ophelia, Thank you for responding and setting the record straight on my misunderstanding of what you wrote. Good luck with your A+ movement. It stands to reason that someone capable of writing this with a straight face... Quote The ID community, in terms of its leadership, make very few technical errors and almost no major errors in terms of basic science. ...would be utterly unable to detect sarcasm in someone else's writing. -------------- And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number. -- Joe G Please stop putting words into my mouth that don't belong there and thoughts into my mind that don't belong there. -- KF

midwifetoad Posts: 4003 Joined: Mar. 2008 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,18:38    I wish more authors would drop in and set things straight. -------------- Any version of ID consistent with all the evidence is indistinguishable from evolution.

CeilingCat Posts: 2363 Joined: Dec. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,21:43    Keiths: "Benson drops in at UD:" Illustrating the growing reach and influence of Uncommon Descent.   UD's Impact rating must be going through the roof as an ever-increasing number of people learn that they have to keep an eye on it (or at least have their lawyers do it) to spot lies, slander and the stupidest and most elementary misunderstandings of their work being broadcast to the more retarded parts of the world as fact.

CeilingCat Posts: 2363 Joined: Dec. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,21:49    Oh yeah, Special Note to Sal: That blue-haired lady looks pretty damn desirable compared to any portrait of DeNews I've ever seen.

eigenstate Posts: 78 Joined: Nov. 2011 (Permalink) Posted: Aug. 25 2012,22:05    So, Barry said this today on UD: Quote Maus, a coward forfeits his right to be taken seriously. That is all.

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