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  Topic: Biological Information: New Perspectives, The Springer Book Flap< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
snorkild



Posts: 30
Joined: Sep. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 02 2012,07:32   

I can't find the book on Springer's homepage. Do I lack searching skills?

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wimp

  
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 02 2012,22:53   

While the book is still not available Tom English raises an eyebrow at Springer series editor Janusz Kacprzyk.

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"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Bob O'H



Posts: 1964
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 03 2012,02:37   

Quote (snorkild @ April 02 2012,07:32)
I can't find the book on Springer's homepage. Do I lack searching skills?

Not really, they took it down once a few people pointed out to them the editors were IDists/creationists

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ID theorists don’t postulate a designer for their arguments. - Crandaddy
There is no connection between a peppered moth, natural selection, and religion that I can see. - FtK

   
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 09 2012,00:59   

More from the Biological Information: New Perspectives "conference" from Bob Marks' wife's Christmas 2011 greetings:  
Quote
Cornell University: Next we drove to Cornell University where Bob was part of a conference called Biological Information – New Perspectives. Bob was a coorganizer
along with famous ID people like William Dembski (The Design Inference and No Free Lunch), Michael Behe (Darwin’s Black Box and The Edge of Evolution), John Sanford (Genetic Entropy & the Mystery of the Genome) and Bruce Gordon (The Nature of  Nature). The proceedings of the conference will be published in 2012. Bob thought the conference was a grand success. Bob’s Ph.D. advisor, John Walkup, also came.
John and his wife Pat are full time with Campus Crusade’s professor ministry in the Bay Area focusing on Stanford, Berkeley and San Jose State. Two of Bob’s graduate students, Winston Ewert and George Montañez, were also there so we got a wonderful three generation picture.
On page 3 of the pdf you will find that picture of Marks, Walkup, Ewert and Montañez at the conference in front of some poster.
She also mentions the other not as secret ID conference (Berlinski's daughter reported on it) held in Italy 2011  
Quote
Winston Ewert went to Italy with Bob. (I wish I could have gone, but I wanted to see Tristan more that Italy.) In Italy, Bob met Greg Chaitin who is a founder of algorithmic information theory and Chaitin’s number. Bob
and Winston were both very excited to meet him. David Berlinski (The Devil’s Delusion) and Steve Myer (Signature in the Cell) were also there. After the conference, Bob was interviewed by Berlinski’s daughter for the Ricochet blog. The interview is on YouTube.


Edited by sparc on April 09 2012,01:06

--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Doc Bill



Posts: 1005
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 09 2012,07:54   

Wow, almost makes them seem human.  Almost.

And that's what they want you to think.

  
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 10 2012,22:58   

During another discussion of the Biological Information: New Perspectives "conference" John Colliers reported on the 2007 ‘Wistar Retrospective Symposium’:
Quote
A few years ago I was sucked into a conference run by the Discovery Institute. Some the ID people were sincere and perhaps naive. One had done their PhD at Cambridge, and another at Northwestern, under David Hull, my own mentor. I was a bit annoyed at finding I had been duped, but was pleased to renew friendships with Dan Brooks, Bob Ulanowicz, Bruce Weber and some others, as well as meeting Gunther Wagner and Steve Chaitin, and hearing Stuart Kauffman's confusion once again about spontaneous self-organization (Prigogine style self organizing systems) and movement to a minimal energy point.

Michael Behe was there, and we talked. He is a nice guy, unlike the cads at the Discovery Institute. I had refereed a paper of his responding to criticism in Philosophy of Science. Since the criticism was both wrong and poorly argued, I thought he must have his say (as did the other reviewer, a prominent philosopher of biology whose name I am pledged not to reveal). A warning to those attacking ID: these people are much brighter than your garden variety creationists, and do be careful that you know what you are talking about, or else you guarantee them a refereed publication. In this case the original paper should never have been published.

Behe conveniently missed my talk in which I mentioned recent work showed that rotary "motors" in bacteria resulted from just two mutations, contrary to Behe's argument that they are too complicated for evolution to produce. I also showed how Rosen's non-reducibility argument applied to the resulting network, which Chaiting remarked was the clearest expression of the idea he had seen. So the meeting was worthwhile. But I still resent being duped.

cross posted at Panda's Thumb

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"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Bob O'H



Posts: 1964
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2012,04:47   

I guess I'm not the only one to sign up for a review cop of BI:NP, so a few of us have probably got an email saying that our online review copy is reserved for us:

Quote
Some time ago you reserved an electronic book review copy of "Biological Information: New Perspectives", 978-3-642-28453-3 for you. We are sorry to inform you that this book is not yet available online, but is being reserved for you. You will be informed by email as soon as online access is available.

Clearly they haven't yet decided to ditch the book: my guess is that no decision has been made yet and this is just administrative.

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ID theorists don’t postulate a designer for their arguments. - Crandaddy
There is no connection between a peppered moth, natural selection, and religion that I can see. - FtK

   
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 28 2012,23:59   

I wonder if Springer doesn't have access to Google. It seems quite likely that most of the volume's content has been published before. Thus, critical in depth reviews that are likely to cover most of each of its chapters are already available on the web. E.g., since the announcement of BI:NP Tom English pointed out the fallacy at the core of Dembski's and Marks' active information and Bob Lloyd shredded Sewell's second law musings.
OTOH, Springer is currently experiencing what happens if they don't fulfill the demands of the DI and they may be afraid of additional censorship allegations however unsubstantiated they may be.

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"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Bob O'H



Posts: 1964
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 29 2012,04:08   

I think that would be the job of reviewers, not Springer per se. But I'm sure they were careful about who they asked to review the book this time.

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ID theorists don’t postulate a designer for their arguments. - Crandaddy
There is no connection between a peppered moth, natural selection, and religion that I can see. - FtK

   
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 28 2012,01:32   

Today (here in Germany we have August 28 already) it is 150 days that BI:NP's scheduled publishing date passed.

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"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2012,22:59   

Limiting Google searches for „Biological Information: New Perspectives“ to one week usually leaves us with links to a single web site, TrueFreethinker, which is one of the most bizarre pages  I have encountered. This week self-described Agentinean-American Messianic Jew Mariano Grinbank who was mentioned earlier in this thread posted about the devil and rock  music here and here.
Another highlight.

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"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Kattarina98



Posts: 1255
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 23 2012,04:10   

Granville Sewell takes scientific discussion to new heights: He has published a YouTube video in which he tells the sad story of "How the Scientific Consensus is Maintained".

Some minutes into the video, he tells his viewers about    
Quote
a 2011Cornell University symposium entitled Biological Information - New Perspectives. .

And later, he repeats this misinformation. By the way, although ID friends were present,    
Quote
... I don't recall that Intelligent Design was ever mentioned in the talks ...


Then he whines about the Elsevier's Applied Mathematics Letters affair (mean David vun Kannon! waaah!) and the Springer affair.

Next: Nasty Bob Lloyd attacked him in the Mathematical Intelligencer in March 2012, and Sewell's letter to the editor was rejected - unfair!

Then, he boringly reads out that letter as published in EN&V.

Last complaint: American Journal of Physics  rejected his paper, too; it's a conspiracy, surely?

That's the content of 15 minutes of whining, comments are disabled, of course, as they are on UD where he announced the video.

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Barry Arrington is a bitch.

  
Glen Davidson



Posts: 752
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 23 2012,10:10   

Or in other words, the scientific consensus is maintained by keeping bad creationist arguments and self-plagiarism out of journals tasked with doing exactly that.

Oh yeah, the jerk whining about censorship isn't even allowing UD's selective commenting to occur in response to his post.  Cry another river about not having any right to reply, hypocrite.

Glen Davidson

--------------
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p....p

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of coincidence---ID philosophy

   
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 23 2012,12:07   

Quote (Kattarina98 @ Nov. 23 2012,04:10)
Granville Sewell takes scientific discussion to new heights: He has published a YouTube video in which he tells the sad story of "How the Scientific Consensus is Maintained".

Some minutes into the video, he tells his viewers about    
Quote
a 2011Cornell University symposium entitled Biological Information - New Perspectives. .

And later, he repeats this misinformation. By the way, although ID friends were present,    
Quote
... I don't recall that Intelligent Design was ever mentioned in the talks ...


Then he whines about the Elsevier's Applied Mathematics Letters affair (mean David vun Kannon! waaah!) and the Springer affair.

Next: Nasty Bob Lloyd attacked him in the Mathematical Intelligencer in March 2012, and Sewell's letter to the editor was rejected - unfair!

Then, he boringly reads out that letter as published in EN&V.

Last complaint: American Journal of Physics  rejected his paper, too; it's a conspiracy, surely?

That's the content of 15 minutes of whining, comments are disabled, of course, as they are on UD where he announced the video.

Thanks for the link and the summary. I don't have the nerve to listen to the whole thing.

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"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Kattarina98



Posts: 1255
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 23 2012,12:40   

Over at The Skeptical Zone, there is a new post about the video.

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Barry Arrington is a bitch.

  
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 05 2012,22:20   

According to buecher.de Springer says that "Biological Information: New Perspectives" will not be published:    
Quote
Erscheint nicht laut Verlag




Velbrück, a second online book dealer says the same



So does Lehmanns the biggest German book dealer for science books although in other words:    
Quote
Titel wird leider nicht erscheinen




Looks like Demski has to update his CV/resume which still says:
Quote
BOOKS

in preparation

Biological Information: New Perspectives (co-edited with Robert J. Marks II, John Sanford, Michael Behe, and Bruce Gordon). Under contract with Springer Verlag.


edited to correct link to the third image

Edited by sparc on Dec. 05 2012,22:39

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"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 05 2012,23:11   

Springer seems to have dismissed BI:NP for quite some time already:
According to Lehmanns BI:NP was planned as #38 of the Springer series Intelligent Systems Reference Library which is now occupied by the Handbook of Optimization. According to Amazon the later has already been published on August 19, 2012.

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"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Glen Davidson



Posts: 752
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 05 2012,23:16   

And the Fourth Reich wins!

At least if you believe the high thin whine of outraged incompetence.

Glen Davidson

--------------
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p....p

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of coincidence---ID philosophy

   
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 06 2012,21:56   

The news has spread at theoplogy web and triggered some predictable reaction. After the book had been described as    
Quote
fraudulently misrepresenting itself as work from Cornell University
Jorge got mad:    
Quote
It was NOT "fraudulently misrepresented", you lying piece of recycled trash. Every title had been submitted to Springer months BEFORE the Symposium. This included authors, abstracts ... etc. Springer approved all materials submitted to them prior to the event and agreed to publish.

What happened was something entirely different than your lying reporting.
It is essentially another example of intellectual censorship based on religious ideology, not on science... another example of EXPELLED.

I certainly am not expecting for you - sick carcass that you are - to comprehend nor accept any of this.

Jorge


--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 07 2012,01:49   

Granville Sewell's recent whining about the Biological Information: New Perspectives desaster can be read as if he already knew then that Springer abonded the publication of the proceedings:  
Quote
Since AML still refused to publish my accepted article I went ahead and presented it at the May 2011 Cornell symposium as originally planned and submitted a revised version for inclusion in the proceedings. Nearly a year later in March 2012 the proceedings had been peer reviewed and type set and the book was ready to be printed in accordance with the signed publication agreement with Springer were like. But once again a[???] Darwinist discovered that Springer was about to publish the proceedings and pressured the publisher into delaying and re-considering publication. According to this article these critics admitted not knowing anything about the contents of the proceedings they just noticed that the editors were known intelligent design supporters and based on this alone brought pressure on Springer to withdraw the book. In fact, although the editors and most of the participants were ID-friendly I don’t recall that intelligent design was ever mentioned in the talks though most were critical of Darwinism’s ability to explain the development of biological information. Although this time the protests were not directed specifically against my writing, the protesters didn’t know what was in the book, remember, for a second time my article had been peer reviewed and accepted and close to publication when people who had no reason to be involved in the editorial process succeeded, at least temporarily, in suppressing it. As of today seven later the Amazon.com page for these proceedings still says “sign up to be notified when this item becomes available”. Here is the Amazon.com description of the conference:  
Quote
In the spring of 2011, a diverse group of scientists gathered at Cornell University to discuss their research into the nature and origin of biological information. […]Several clear themes emerged from these research papers: 1) Information is indispensable to our understanding of what life is. 2) Biological information is more than the material structures that embody it. 3) Conventional chemical and evolutionary mechanisms seem insufficient to fully explain the labyrinth of information that is life.
There you are, you know more about the proceedings than those who demanded it the publisher withdraw the book in March.
(all emphasis mine, links added)

Edited by sparc on Dec. 07 2012,01:51

--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
damitall



Posts: 322
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 07 2012,03:54   

Quote (sparc @ Dec. 06 2012,21:56)
The news has spread at theoplogy web and triggered some predictable reaction. After the book had been described as    
Quote
fraudulently misrepresenting itself as work from Cornell University
Jorge got mad:    
Quote
It was NOT "fraudulently misrepresented", you lying piece of recycled trash. Every title had been submitted to Springer months BEFORE the Symposium. This included authors, abstracts ... etc. Springer approved all materials submitted to them prior to the event and agreed to publish.

What happened was something entirely different than your lying reporting.
It is essentially another example of intellectual censorship based on religious ideology, not on science... another example of EXPELLED.

I certainly am not expecting for you - sick carcass that you are - to comprehend nor accept any of this.

Jorge

I haven't looked at TWeb for some time, but IIRC, Jorge is permanently irate.

It's his ground state.

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 07 2012,09:06   

Quote (damitall @ Dec. 07 2012,04:54)
Quote (sparc @ Dec. 06 2012,21:56)
The news has spread at theoplogy web and triggered some predictable reaction. After the book had been described as      
Quote
fraudulently misrepresenting itself as work from Cornell University
Jorge got mad:      
Quote
It was NOT "fraudulently misrepresented", you lying piece of recycled trash. Every title had been submitted to Springer months BEFORE the Symposium. This included authors, abstracts ... etc. Springer approved all materials submitted to them prior to the event and agreed to publish.

What happened was something entirely different than your lying reporting.
It is essentially another example of intellectual censorship based on religious ideology, not on science... another example of EXPELLED.

I certainly am not expecting for you - sick carcass that you are - to comprehend nor accept any of this.

Jorge

I haven't looked at TWeb for some time, but IIRC, Jorge is permanently irate.

It's his ground state.

those are the best kinds of tard.  permarage

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You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
midwifetoad



Posts: 3553
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 07 2012,10:27   

Jorge is an anagram for r JoeG. Any similarities in style?

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”let’s not make a joke of ourselves.”

Pat Robertson

  
Jim_Wynne



Posts: 1006
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 07 2012,10:38   

Dembski still hasn't produced the book he was supposed to write to fulfill his Templeton grant obligation from 12 years ago.

ETA: He presently lists Being as Communion as "long overdue" on his CV.  :O

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Evolution is not about laws but about randomness on happanchance.--Robert Byers, at PT

  
Henry J



Posts: 4039
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 07 2012,22:38   

Quote
I haven't looked at TWeb for some time, but IIRC, Jorge is permanently irate.

It's his ground state.

So his parents grounded him?

Henry

  
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 09 2012,02:56   

While Amazon.com and many other US sites still list BI:NP as available or in print UK pickabook states:
 
Quote
We believe that this item is permanently unavailable, and so we cannot source it.



South-Africa's Red Pepper Books says it more directly:  
Quote
Availability: Cancelled



--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
The whole truth



Posts: 979
Joined: Jan. 2012

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 09 2012,03:24   

sparc, thanks for the updates. It appears that Springer isn't going to publish BI:NP. The IDiots are probably looking for another publisher, and I can't help but wonder if they're considering or planning a lawsuit against Springer. Even if they have no chance of winning such a suit they might push it anyway just to get as much 'Expelled' publicity as they can milk from it.

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Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. - Jesus in Matthew 10:34

But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. -Jesus in Luke 19:27

   
sparc



Posts: 1686
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 09 2012,11:37   

Wesley Brewer has removed the four articles planned to be part of the BI:NP proceedings from his webpage. According to Google cache they were still present on November 19, 2012:



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"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
fusilier



Posts: 208
Joined: Feb. 2003

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 09 2012,13:25   

Quote (midwifetoad @ Dec. 07 2012,11:27)
Jorge is an anagram for r JoeG. Any similarities in style?

Don't think so.

Jorge once said his eyes were opened by Kent Hovind videos - and he's a fundigelical Christian.

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fusilier
James 2:24

  
fnxtr



Posts: 2109
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 09 2012,15:04   

Quote (The whole truth @ Dec. 09 2012,01:24)
Even if they have no chance of winning such a suit they might push it anyway just to get as much 'Expelled' publicity as they can milk from it.

If only the movie had been called "Expressed" there'd have been a pun in there somewhere.

Hardly worth it.

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"But it's disturbing to think someone actually thinks creationism -- having put it's hand on the hot stove every day for the last 400 years -- will get a different result tomorrow." -- midwifetoad

  
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