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Zachriel



Posts: 2593
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 11 2009,10:13   

Quote (afarensis @ Sep. 10 2009,21:45)
In light of the recent paper - and fuss- on the appendix this paper is topical. Relaxed selection in the wild here is the abstract:
Quote
Natural populations often experience the weakening or removal of a source of selection that had been important in the maintenance of one or more traits. Here we refer to these situations as relaxed selection, and review recent studies that explore the effects of such changes on traits in their ecological contexts. In a few systems, such as the loss of armor in stickleback, the genetic, developmental and ecological bases of trait evolution are being discovered. These results yield insights into whether and how fast a trait is reduced or lost under relaxed selection. We provide a prospectus and a framework for understanding relaxed selection and trait loss in natural populations. We also examine its implications for applied issues, such as antibiotic resistance and the success of invasive species.


It is a really fascinating paper that I strongly recommend. I'll be doing a post on it - hopefully this weekend. For those who don't have access a pdf can be found here.

Excellent paper. Thanks.

I noticed they cited some obscure scientist; Darwin, C. (1859) The Origin of Species.

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There is only one Tard. The Tard is One.

   
mammuthus



Posts: 13
Joined: June 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 11 2009,10:33   

Quote (sledgehammer @ Aug. 28 2009,12:12)
Deer mice of the Sand hills in Nebraska have recently (in the last 4000 years) evolved a new, lighter color coat, that better matches their environment.

New coat color? Pfft.  Micro-evolution. No big deal.

Not so fast there, Poindexter.  The color change is a manifestation of a brand new gene, Agouti, that developed in around 8000 generations.


It's a really great paper.  I suspect the response from creationists will be similar to their response to another Hoekstra paper:

http://www.oeb.harvard.edu/faculty/hoekstra/PDFs/HoekstraSCI2006.pdf

to which Georgia Purdom argued:

Quote
From a creationist perspective, this research provides us with yet another example of a beneficial outcome of a mutation in a given environment allowing an organism a selectable advantage. Mutations lead to loss of information, and while the organism may be more well suited for its current environment, it may have lost the ability to adapt to other environments. The mutation described in this Science paper does not address the origin of the melanin gene or pigmentation, only the loss of them, thus it is not relevant to the discussion of molecules-to-man evolution.


http://www.answersingenesis.org/article....ptation

  
afarensis



Posts: 1002
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 11 2009,19:04   

Quote (Zachriel @ Sep. 11 2009,10:13)
Quote (afarensis @ Sep. 10 2009,21:45)
In light of the recent paper - and fuss- on the appendix this paper is topical. Relaxed selection in the wild here is the abstract:
 
Quote
Natural populations often experience the weakening or removal of a source of selection that had been important in the maintenance of one or more traits. Here we refer to these situations as relaxed selection, and review recent studies that explore the effects of such changes on traits in their ecological contexts. In a few systems, such as the loss of armor in stickleback, the genetic, developmental and ecological bases of trait evolution are being discovered. These results yield insights into whether and how fast a trait is reduced or lost under relaxed selection. We provide a prospectus and a framework for understanding relaxed selection and trait loss in natural populations. We also examine its implications for applied issues, such as antibiotic resistance and the success of invasive species.


It is a really fascinating paper that I strongly recommend. I'll be doing a post on it - hopefully this weekend. For those who don't have access a pdf can be found here.

Excellent paper. Thanks.

I noticed they cited some obscure scientist; Darwin, C. (1859) The Origin of Species.

One of the parts that caught my attention was in the section on constitutive costs where they discuss insecticide resistance in mosquitoes and the Ace.I gene. I've been tracking down some of the literature on the subject and, leaving aside the health implications, there is an interesting story about how evolution works...

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Church burning ebola boy

FTK: I Didn't answer your questions because it beats the hell out of me.

PaV: I suppose for me to be pried away from what I do to focus long and hard on that particular problem would take, quite honestly, hundreds of thousands of dollars to begin to pique my interest.

   
keiths



Posts: 2040
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 14 2009,20:32   

Snake with clawed foot found in China

How thoughtful of the Designer to give snakes a latent ability to grow clawed feet!

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And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number.  -- Joe G

Please stop putting words into my mouth that don’t belong there and thoughts into my mind that don’t belong there. -- KF

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 10064
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 15 2009,10:33   

IDiots wont like this one:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/09/090914172644.htm

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"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5374
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 15 2009,16:26   

Quote (keiths @ Sep. 14 2009,21:32)
Snake with clawed foot found in China

How thoughtful of the Designer to give snakes a latent ability to grow clawed feet!

Apparently, the snake kind lost a bunch of FSCI sometime before the Garden of Eden. But now they've found it again?




...or something.

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Lou FCD is still in school, so we should only count him as a baby biologist. -carlsonjok -deprecated
I think I might love you. Don't tell Deadman -Wolfhound

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Richardthughes



Posts: 10064
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 15 2009,16:29   

Quote (Lou FCD @ Sep. 15 2009,16:26)
Quote (keiths @ Sep. 14 2009,21:32)
Snake with clawed foot found in China

How thoughtful of the Designer to give snakes a latent ability to grow clawed feet!

Apparently, the snake kind lost a bunch of FSCI sometime before the Garden of Eden. But now they've found it again?




...or something.

It's the snake that put its foot in its mouth in the garden of eden, obviously.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
khan



Posts: 1479
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 15 2009,16:31   

Adam blamed Eve.
Eve blamed the snake.
And the snake didn't have a leg to stand on.

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"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

  
jeannot



Posts: 1200
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 16 2009,04:17   

This week in PNAS:

The reducible complexity of a mitochondrial molecular machine

  Abigail Clements, Dejan Bursac, Xenia Gatsos, Andrew J. Perry, Srgjan Civciristov, Nermin Celik, Vladimir A. Likic, Sebastian Poggio, Christine Jacobs-Wagnerd, Richard A. Strugnell and Trevor Lithgow

Quote
Molecular machines drive essential biological processes, with the component parts of these machines each contributing a partial function or structural element. Mitochondria are organelles of eukaryotic cells, and depend for their biogenesis on a set of molecular machines for protein transport. How these molecular machines evolved is a fundamental question. Mitochondria were derived from an ?-proteobacterial endosymbiont, and we identified in ?-proteobacteria the component parts of a mitochondrial protein transport machine. In bacteria, the components are found in the inner membrane, topologically equivalent to the mitochondrial proteins. Although the bacterial proteins function in simple assemblies, relatively little mutation would be required to convert them to function as a protein transport machine. This analysis of protein transport provides a blueprint for the evolution of cellular machinery in general.


They even quote Behe. Waiting for his rebutal.

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 1956
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 17 2009,06:20   

This is one to wave at the Design Detectors:

Quote
Were crocodiles responsible for the stones we call tools?

Patrick Dempsey


Sir

Could Nature have been unknowingly publishing papers for the past 80 years about crocodilian gastroliths (stomach stones) instead of stones concluded to be 2.5-million-year-old hominid tools? This possibility could cast doubt, for example, on the nature of the Oldowan specimens described by Michael Haslam and colleagues in their Review of primate archaeology (Nature 460, 339–344; 2009).

Palaeontologists use a simple eyeball test to distinguish stone tools from gastroliths. If a specimen has wear marks on its outer surface but none on its inner surfaces, this indicates that the stone has been grinding away in some prehistoric stomach or other and is a gastrolith. But wear on both inner and outer surfaces indicates that it has been used for some sort of pounding or battering and can confidently be considered a tool. A quick look at the three Oldowan specimens reveals wear on only the extended surfaces, so they should be considered as gastroliths, not tools.

Identification of the Oldowan specimens as tools is based on the fact that the soft relict sands of Olduvai Gorge contain no natural stones of their own, so any stone found there must have been moved from distant river beds by some unknown animal transporter — concluded by high science to be Homo habilis. But crocodiles have the curious habit of swallowing rocks: these account for 1% of their body weight, so for a 1-tonne crocodile that's 10 kg of stones in its stomach at all times. Surprisingly, science has never even considered the crocodile as transporter.

Crocodiles and hippos have always lived happily together. Hippo herds would naturally trample riverside gravel stones into the shape of Oldowan cutting tools, quantities of which the crocodile would then swallow and transport to other places.

The crocodile lives and dies at the water's edge. So far, all East African Oldowan specimens have come from the same waterside environments where crocodiles are known to have dwelt. Millions, perhaps trillions, of transported crocodile stomach stones must remain where the old crocodiles left them, deep in relict East African sediments, though none has ever been reported.


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ID theorists don’t postulate a designer for their arguments. - Crandaddy
There is no connection between a peppered moth, natural selection, and religion that I can see. - FtK

   
afarensis



Posts: 1002
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 17 2009,18:53   

Quote (Bob O'H @ Sep. 17 2009,06:20)
This is one to wave at the Design Detectors:

 
Quote
Were crocodiles responsible for the stones we call tools?

Patrick Dempsey


Sir

Could Nature have been unknowingly publishing papers for the past 80 years about crocodilian gastroliths (stomach stones) instead of stones concluded to be 2.5-million-year-old hominid tools? This possibility could cast doubt, for example, on the nature of the Oldowan specimens described by Michael Haslam and colleagues in their Review of primate archaeology (Nature 460, 339–344; 2009).

Palaeontologists use a simple eyeball test to distinguish stone tools from gastroliths. If a specimen has wear marks on its outer surface but none on its inner surfaces, this indicates that the stone has been grinding away in some prehistoric stomach or other and is a gastrolith. But wear on both inner and outer surfaces indicates that it has been used for some sort of pounding or battering and can confidently be considered a tool. A quick look at the three Oldowan specimens reveals wear on only the extended surfaces, so they should be considered as gastroliths, not tools.

Identification of the Oldowan specimens as tools is based on the fact that the soft relict sands of Olduvai Gorge contain no natural stones of their own, so any stone found there must have been moved from distant river beds by some unknown animal transporter — concluded by high science to be Homo habilis. But crocodiles have the curious habit of swallowing rocks: these account for 1% of their body weight, so for a 1-tonne crocodile that's 10 kg of stones in its stomach at all times. Surprisingly, science has never even considered the crocodile as transporter.

Crocodiles and hippos have always lived happily together. Hippo herds would naturally trample riverside gravel stones into the shape of Oldowan cutting tools, quantities of which the crocodile would then swallow and transport to other places.

The crocodile lives and dies at the water's edge. So far, all East African Oldowan specimens have come from the same waterside environments where crocodiles are known to have dwelt. Millions, perhaps trillions, of transported crocodile stomach stones must remain where the old crocodiles left them, deep in relict East African sediments, though none has ever been reported.

Is that the entire piece or is there more? Any idea how nature chooses items for the Correspondence section? I ask because if this was peer reviewed someone goofed....

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Church burning ebola boy

FTK: I Didn't answer your questions because it beats the hell out of me.

PaV: I suppose for me to be pried away from what I do to focus long and hard on that particular problem would take, quite honestly, hundreds of thousands of dollars to begin to pique my interest.

   
Lou FCD



Posts: 5374
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 17 2009,20:23   

Gene Therapy Gives Monkeys Color Vision at Science.

Quote
By Gisela Telis
ScienceNOW Daily News
16 September 2009
Squirrel monkeys can now see your true colors, thanks to gene therapy. Researchers have given the colorblind primates full color vision as adults by injecting their eyes with a human gene. The result raises questions about how the brain understands color, and it could eventually lead to gene-therapy treatments for colorblindness and other visual disorders in humans.

In the world of squirrel monkeys, seeing colors is for girls. Whereas some females enjoy full color vision, males of the South American genus see only blues and yellows (see picture). They lack a gene that allows color-sensitive cells in the eye, called cones, to distinguish red and green from gray--the same distinction that confounds most colorblind humans.


More at the link.

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Lou FCD is still in school, so we should only count him as a baby biologist. -carlsonjok -deprecated
I think I might love you. Don't tell Deadman -Wolfhound

Work-friendly photography
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Lou FCD



Posts: 5374
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 17 2009,20:28   

Googling Food Webs: Can an Eigenvector Measure Species' Importance for Coextinctions? in PLoS Computational Biology:

Quote
Stefano Allesina1*, Mercedes Pascual2,3,4

1 National Center for Ecological Analysis and Synthesis, Santa Barbara, California, United States of America, 2 Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology, University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan, United States of America, 3 Santa Fe Institute, Santa Fe, New Mexico, United States of America, 4 Howard Hughes Medical Institute

Abstract

A major challenge in ecology is forecasting the effects of species' extinctions, a pressing problem given current human impacts on the planet. Consequences of species losses such as secondary extinctions are difficult to forecast because species are not isolated, but interact instead in a complex network of ecological relationships. Because of their mutual dependence, the loss of a single species can cascade in multiple coextinctions. Here we show that an algorithm adapted from the one Google uses to rank web-pages can order species according to their importance for coextinctions, providing the sequence of losses that results in the fastest collapse of the network. Moreover, we use the algorithm to bridge the gap between qualitative (who eats whom) and quantitative (at what rate) descriptions of food webs. We show that our simple algorithm finds the best possible solution for the problem of assigning importance from the perspective of secondary extinctions in all analyzed networks. Our approach relies on network structure, but applies regardless of the specific dynamical model of species' interactions, because it identifies the subset of coextinctions common to all possible models, those that will happen with certainty given the complete loss of prey of a given predator. Results show that previous measures of importance based on the concept of “hubs” or number of connections, as well as centrality measures, do not identify the most effective extinction sequence. The proposed algorithm provides a basis for further developments in the analysis of extinction risk in ecosystems.


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Lou FCD is still in school, so we should only count him as a baby biologist. -carlsonjok -deprecated
I think I might love you. Don't tell Deadman -Wolfhound

Work-friendly photography
NSFW photography

   
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 17 2009,21:34   

Science 4 September 2009:
Vol. 325. no. 5945, pp. 1269 - 1272
DOI: 10.1126/science.1176960

Differential Sensitivity to Human Communication in Dogs, Wolves, and Human Infants
József Topál,1,* György Gergely,2 Ágnes Erdhegyi,3 Gergely Csibra,2 Ádám Miklósi3


Quote
Ten-month-old infants persistently search for a hidden object at its initial hiding place even after observing it being hidden at another location. Recent evidence suggests that communicative cues from the experimenter contribute to the emergence of this perseverative search error. We replicated these results with dogs (Canis familiaris), who also commit more search errors in ostensive-communicative (in 75% of the total trials) than in noncommunicative (39%) or nonsocial (17%) hiding contexts. However, comparative investigations suggest that communicative signals serve different functions for dogs and infants, whereas human-reared wolves (Canis lupus) do not show doglike context-dependent differences of search errors. We propose that shared sensitivity to human communicative signals stems from convergent social evolution of the Homo and the Canis genera.


that shit is BAD ASS

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You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
qetzal



Posts: 308
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 18 2009,13:56   

Remember the PNAS paper that argued that caterpillars and butterflies used to be different species? Jeannot first linked it here.

Turns out PNAS is changing their submission policies so that papers like this can no longer avoid standard peer review. See this post at Sandwalk for more details.

  
jeannot



Posts: 1200
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 18 2009,16:50   

I was just reading the story.
There's a link to a Sci Am article discussing the caterpillar paper. As expected, it didn't go unnoticed and it appears that Margulis's reputation is already affected.

I still find hard to believe that the paper was not rejected by the editorial board at PNAS, as comprises respectable researchers like Futuyma, Ayala, etc.

  
qetzal



Posts: 308
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 18 2009,17:17   

I think they couldn't reject it as long as Margulis could submit two favorable reviews. I don't have access to the Science article, but Larry Moran at Sandwalk quotes it as saying the following:

Quote
He {Williamson} also says he knows that Margulis sent his paper to a half-dozen academy reviewers. Williamson says that he thinks they were all positive reviews, but Margulis told Scientific American last week that she canvassed six or seven reviewers to find the two positive reviews necessary to push the paper through.


Sounds like their hands were tied under their existing policies, which is no doubt why they're changing them.

  
jeannot



Posts: 1200
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 21 2009,10:25   

Larry Moran comments on the story.
http://sandwalk.blogspot.com/2009....od.html

  
ppb



Posts: 325
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 24 2009,09:34   

This is from Pharyngula.  It is a bit dated, but very entertaining and informative.  Julia Child makes primordial soup.

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"[A scientific theory] describes Nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And it agrees fully with experiment. So I hope you can accept Nature as She is - absurd."
- Richard P. Feynman

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 10064
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 24 2009,15:46   

MarkCC (Good math Bad math)

Information vs meaning:

http://scienceblogs.com/goodmat....hp#more

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
sledgehammer



Posts: 530
Joined: Sep. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 25 2009,00:18   

Feathered dinosaur fossils from China

 
Quote
Exceptionally well preserved dinosaur fossils uncovered in north-eastern China display the earliest known feathers.

The creatures are all more than 150 million years old.

The new finds are indisputably older than Archaeopteryx, the oldest recognised bird discovered in Germany.

Professor Xu Xing and colleagues tell the journal Nature that this represents the final proof that dinosaurs were ancestral to birds.


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The majority of the stupid is invincible and guaranteed for all time. The terror of their tyranny is alleviated by their lack of consistency. -A. Einstein  (H/T, JAD)
If evolution is true, you could not know that it's true because your brain is nothing but chemicals. ?Think about that. -K. Hovind

  
afarensis



Posts: 1002
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 28 2009,19:37   

Some archaeology news that is very interesting. It seems the British can't figure out where the Battle of Bosworth was fought!

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Church burning ebola boy

FTK: I Didn't answer your questions because it beats the hell out of me.

PaV: I suppose for me to be pried away from what I do to focus long and hard on that particular problem would take, quite honestly, hundreds of thousands of dollars to begin to pique my interest.

   
Bob O'H



Posts: 1956
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 29 2009,03:54   

From The Loom:

The Continuing Adventures of the Blind Locksmith: You Can’t Get There From Here

Quote
Three years ago, I wrote a series of blog posts about how scientists at the University of Oregon reconstructed the 450-million-year history of a protein. ...  What was particularly elegant about the study was how the scientists recreated the ancestral protein as it existed over 400 million years ago, to see how it functioned. Then they  pinpointed the mutations that transformed the protein, shifting it from an old function to a new one.

Recently, the scientists tried to run their experiment backwards. They tried to turn the new protein back into the old one. And they failed. In that failure, they’ve discovered something important. They argue that when it comes to evolution, you can’t go home again.


IOW, the protein was latched!!!!!one!!!  Someone alert kairosfocus.

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ID theorists don’t postulate a designer for their arguments. - Crandaddy
There is no connection between a peppered moth, natural selection, and religion that I can see. - FtK

   
afarensis



Posts: 1002
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 01 2009,22:14   

Ardipithecus! you can download them all for free if you register. It's paleoanthropological heaven! I am sooo excited! OMG!OMG! Did I mention how excited I was? OMG!ZOMG!OMG! It is very cool! And did I mention how excited I am, stoked, or I would even say chuffed! Wooooohoooooooooooo!

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Church burning ebola boy

FTK: I Didn't answer your questions because it beats the hell out of me.

PaV: I suppose for me to be pried away from what I do to focus long and hard on that particular problem would take, quite honestly, hundreds of thousands of dollars to begin to pique my interest.

   
ppb



Posts: 325
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 02 2009,05:58   

Quote (afarensis @ Oct. 01 2009,23:14)
Ardipithecus! you can download them all for free if you register. It's paleoanthropological heaven! I am sooo excited! OMG!OMG! Did I mention how excited I was? OMG!ZOMG!OMG! It is very cool! And did I mention how excited I am, stoked, or I would even say chuffed! Wooooohoooooooooooo!

I can understand why you're so excited, afarensis.  She does look pretty hot!



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"[A scientific theory] describes Nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And it agrees fully with experiment. So I hope you can accept Nature as She is - absurd."
- Richard P. Feynman

  
midwifetoad



Posts: 3545
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 02 2009,13:33   

Is this news to anyone here?

http://www.sciencenews.org/view....osphere



Quote
Viruses aren’t supposed to be visible under a light microscope; they are typically far too small. But mimivirus (“mimi” for mimicking microbe) isn’t just big for a virus, it’s bigger than some bacteria. Analyses of its DNA, cataloged in 2004, revealed that it also has more genetic material than some bacteria and certainly more than any other previously seen virus. The mimivirus genome contains genes for more than 900 proteins. (In contrast, T4—which, pre-mimi, was considered a large virus—has about 77 genes.) Some of the mimivirus genes appear to be involved in processes thought to be conducted only by cellular creatures—the virus’s hosts—such as translating messenger RNA into proteins.  All in all, mimivirus seriously unsettled the world of virus research.


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”let’s not make a joke of ourselves.”

Pat Robertson

  
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 02 2009,17:47   

Quote (ppb @ Oct. 02 2009,03:58)
 
Quote (afarensis @ Oct. 01 2009,23:14)
Ardipithecus! you can download them all for free if you register. It's paleoanthropological heaven! I am sooo excited! OMG!OMG! Did I mention how excited I was? OMG!ZOMG!OMG! It is very cool! And did I mention how excited I am, stoked, or I would even say chuffed! Wooooohoooooooooooo!

I can understand why you're so excited, afarensis.  She does look pretty hot!

I posted an item at http://www.examiner.com/examine....schools about Ardipithecus and the crappy headlines at NatGeo and CNN. I then moved to creato-stupid questions teacher might face.

My scientific qualms are about the sesamoid bone, and the environmental determinist interpretations. The site was obviously as reconstructed- a riparian forest. However, White et al concluded that this is the environment that Ar ramidus evolved in, as opposed to some other environment. Riparian locations facilitate fossilization. What is needed prior to asserting that this is where humans evolved is some comparitive data from non-riparian environments. That is not likely to be found, certainly not when you keep looking in the same place.

(Apparently you will need to c'n'p' the URL from AtBC. The link works at other sites BTW). Well, that didn't work either.

weird.

Try from here
http://www.examiner.com/Los_Angeles-Education_and_Schools.html

Edited by Dr.GH on Oct. 02 2009,15:58

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"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
khan



Posts: 1479
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 04 2009,15:02   

Don't know if this belongs here:

3.6 million pounds of thrust

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"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

  
Henry J



Posts: 3999
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 05 2009,15:19   

Now that's what you call rocket science!

  
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 05 2009,23:32   

http://www.scielo.org.ar/cgi-bin/wxis.exe/iah/

That link gives access to papers like these:

Ramos, Victor A. (2009) Darwin at Puente del Inca: observations on the formation of the Inca's bridge and mountain building. Rev. Asoc. Geol. Argent., Mar 2009, vol.64, no.1, p.170-179. ISSN 0004-4822

Vizcaíno, Sergio F., Farińa, Richard A. and Fernicola, Juan Carlos (2009) Young Darwin and the ecology and extinction of pleistocene south american fossil mammals. Rev. Asoc. Geol. Argent., Mar 2009, vol.64, no.1, p.160-169. ISSN 0004-4822

Fernicola, Juan Carlos, Vizcaíno, Sergio F. and De Iuliis, Gerardo (2009) The fossil mammals collected by Charles Darwin in South America during his travels on board the HMS Beagle. Rev. Asoc. Geol. Argent., Mar 2009, vol.64, no.1, p.147-159.

Iriondo, Martin and Kröhling, Daniela (2009) From Buenos Aires to Santa Fe: Darwin's observations and modern knowledge. Rev. Asoc. Geol. Argent., Mar 2009, vol.64, no.1, p.109-123.

Martínez, Oscar A., Rabassa, Jorge and Coronato, Andrea (2009) Charles Darwin and the first scientific observations on the patagonian shingle formation (Rodados Patagónicos). Rev. Asoc. Geol. Argent., Mar 2009, vol.64, no.1, p.90-100.

Giambiagi, Laura, Tunik, Maisa, Ramos, Victor A. et al. (2009) The High Andean Cordillera of central Argentina and Chile along the Piuquenes Pass-Cordon del Portillo transect: Darwin's pioneering observations compared with modern geology. Rev. Asoc. Geol. Argent., Mar 2009, vol.64, no.1, p.43-54.

Aguirre-Urreta, Beatriz and Vennari, Verónica (2009) On Darwin's footsteps across the Andes: Tithonian-Neocomian fossil invertebrates from the Piuquenes pass. Rev. Asoc. Geol. Argent., Mar 2009, vol.64, no.1, p.32-42.

AND 11 OTHER QUALITY PAPERS ON DARWIN'S WORK (just click the "texto en inglés" link next to each title)

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AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
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