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JAM



Posts: 503
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 29 2010,13:24   

There's good fun with M. Holcumbrink and Richard Kepler here.

Dick, who has an MA in anthropology (I suspect an "exit" one after flunking the qualifying exam), is in a froth because I've pointed out that Stephen Meyer lied about the nature of peptidyl transferase and lied in an intertwining way about the RNA World hypothesis to make the former lie go down more palatably.

What really has Dick going is that I'm making them look for the relevant data themselves, so they can't dismiss what I tell them using the genetic fallacy.

They're afraid to look for the truth, so please join in the taunting and give them hints, but please don't hand the answers to them on a platter or the fun will be over.

I propose this as a general strategy to deal with denialism, because what underlies denialism is not faith, but fear and a lack of faith.

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 29 2010,13:28   

I'd love to join in, but the link doesn't work for me.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 29 2010,13:31   

this might be it

http://tinyurl.com/322wbkr

Quote
We never asked for hints and don't want them. We want straight-shooter answers instead of hauteur, pomposity, and poorly stated puzzles. You're obviously not that kind of person; you're evasive and rude. Meyer did not display such in his book. He does not deserve your ridicule, but you apparently do! He was factual and direct, non-evasive. Maybe he was inaccurate or mistaken, and we have given you a fair hearing about this. But if so, it was innocent, though you couldn't know, because your accusations of Meyer have been based on suspicions to a significant degree and you have been proudly malevolent.


teh crazy it is.

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
JAM



Posts: 503
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 29 2010,14:28   

That's it. Fixed my link.

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 29 2010,15:06   

Quote (JAM @ Sep. 29 2010,14:28)
That's it. Fixed my link.

And I joined it! That's some weapons-grade stupid you found over there...

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
JAM



Posts: 503
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 29 2010,17:47   

I've been trolling with Meyer's lies in several groups there.

After Dick gets exhausted there, we should invite him to visit. He loves to write...

  
JohnW



Posts: 2197
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 29 2010,18:15   

Oooh, now you're in for it!
Quote
You called me an expletive. You called me Dick, meaning the male reproductive organ. You switched from Richard abruptly for effect and it was without question done with malicious intent. My knick name is not Dick. I have only been called that name derisively perhaps ten times in my life, and never in the last fifteen years. I will not retaliate by returning more of the same to you in this column, but you can be certain that I will I not take this act lightly.

This surely deserves some sort of award, which means henceforth you should refer to him as "Prize Dick".

--------------
Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it.
- Robert Byers

  
Badger3k



Posts: 861
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 30 2010,00:27   

Quote (JohnW @ Sep. 29 2010,18:15)
Oooh, now you're in for it!
Quote
You called me an expletive. You called me Dick, meaning the male reproductive organ. You switched from Richard abruptly for effect and it was without question done with malicious intent. My knick name is not Dick. I have only been called that name derisively perhaps ten times in my life, and never in the last fifteen years. I will not retaliate by returning more of the same to you in this column, but you can be certain that I will I not take this act lightly.

This surely deserves some sort of award, which means henceforth you should refer to him as "Prize Dick".

His "knick name"?  Either he is not a native speaker of English, or he just likes basketball.  Nicknames like his should not be abused.  He shouldn't swallow that insult!  I can see his red-headed anger, and he's gonna spew!

If he's sick, can he be "Spotted Dick"?

--------------
"Just think if every species had a different genetic code We would have to eat other humans to survive.." : Joe G

  
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 30 2010,11:02   

Well, I dropped a somewhat broader hint regarding peptidyltransferase. I hope you won't mind.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 30 2010,11:37   

Quote (Dr.GH @ Sep. 30 2010,11:02)
Well, I dropped a somewhat broader hint regarding peptidyltransferase. I hope you won't mind.

It would have to be several light-years broad before that IDiot gets it...

This is truly a classic exchange.

1) Incurious creationist swallows absolute bald-faced lies emitted by some orifice of a DI Fellow.

2) Lies are noted by scientist, but not explicitly pointed out, asking creationist to find them if he/she is truly interested in the evidence.

3) Creationist, who learned no biology in school and lots of pseudoscience in church, flounders at this task.

4) Mocking ensues from scientists.

5) Creationist initiates discussion of religion, morals and ethics rather than talk about the evidence.

6) Lather, rinse, repeat.

This whole thing is exactly like a discussion with FtK or StephenB or BA^77. And FtK wonders why one would be reluctant to discuss religion in a conversation that started out as a discussion of science.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Doc Bill



Posts: 1000
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 30 2010,12:51   

I found  THIS at Beliefnet, believe it or not, and it seems to be a reasonable summary of the "argument" going on over at Amazon.

Meyer has to know his entire thesis of Too Complex Therefore Oogity Boogity was wrong from the outset because the research and the smoking gun, p-transferase, were right there in front of him.

Pay no attention to that RNA, er, man, behind the curtain!  Nice one, Meyer.

  
Sealawr



Posts: 54
Joined: Feb. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 30 2010,14:45   

SHHH...the Belifenet review dismantling Meyer was written by a PhD physicist.  Even intelligent Christians, by and large, don't buy the DI B.S.

--------------
DS: "The explantory filter is as robust as the data that is used with it."
David Klinghoffer: ""I'm an IDiot"

  
JAM



Posts: 503
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 30 2010,15:18   

Quote (Doc Bill @ Sep. 30 2010,11:51)
I found  THIS at Beliefnet, believe it or not, and it seems to be a reasonable summary of the "argument" going on over at Amazon.

No, Doc, that's not my point at all. My point is far more simple, and it's about simple, incontrovertible facts.

PM me if you'd like the answer. I don't want to give it away here either.

  
Doc Bill



Posts: 1000
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 01 2010,18:10   

Oh, I got the point from the get go.  What I provided for the moron on Amazon was more hints.

I thought my musical analogy was particularly nifty since most analogies involve sports or cars.  However, I think the moron knows the jig is up.  He's already talking about having to flounce because his hair needs washing.  Typical response for the defeated.

Well done, all, for hammering on one point.  Creationists hate that.  However, never, never let them off the mat.  Keep them on subject and eventually they will run away.

  
Doc Bill



Posts: 1000
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 01 2010,18:48   

Sorry to spoil your fun, Jam, but Richard has flounced.  Gone missing.  Taken a kip.  AWOL.

Could it be my musical analogy?  If so I'll use it more!!

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 02 2010,08:12   

Yay! Uptight Bi-tard has joined the fun!

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
sparc



Posts: 1671
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 02 2010,08:58   

sorry, removed content because this was the wrong thread

--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 08 2010,05:51   

There's been some progress (Richard Kepler and M Holcumbrink seem to have vacated the scene) and some regress (Uptight Bi-Tard is there) on this Amazon thread.

UB is going on about "meaningful information", and, when pressed for a definition, said that it "refers to or is correlated according to some system with certain physical or conceptual entities". Bafflegab. I'm pretty sure that he is misrepresenting Shannon information as well. But I am a mere biologist, so if somebody better versed in information theory wants to whack-a-mole, head on over there.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
JAM



Posts: 503
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 09 2010,11:07   

Should we invite Kepler over here? He's clearly a compulsive liar and therefore might be fun...

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 09 2010,11:16   

Quote (JAM @ Oct. 09 2010,11:07)
Should we invite Kepler over here? He's clearly a compulsive liar and therefore might be fun...

He's a long-winded, pedantic liar who seems more wrapped up in the sociological and rhetorical aspects of the "debate" than in the science. In fact, he is scientifically illiterate, it seems.

Fun...

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
JAM



Posts: 503
Joined: July 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 09 2010,11:44   

Even funnier, he claims to have been a professional editor but doesn't know the difference between "eminent" and "imminent."

But you didn't answer my question—should we invite him here?

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 09 2010,13:05   

Quote (JAM @ Oct. 09 2010,11:44)
Even funnier, he claims to have been a professional editor but doesn't know the difference between "eminent" and "imminent."

But you didn't answer my question—should we invite him here?

Sure! He's a variant of the IDolator kind that we have had visit here before - the scientifically ignorant, verbose, pontificating, more-interested-in-meta-discussion-than-actual-discussion. He kinda reminds me of Donald M at UD.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 09 2010,17:48   

Man. M. Holcumbrink is a good'un too!

Quote
Cells ARE machines, and they are machines that are controlled by SOFTWARE! You will assign intelligent causation to the least bit of scrawling on cave walls, but you won't do the same for the software that controls the cybernetic activity of the cell?

linky

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 12 2010,09:04   

It's gotten pretty quiet over there. I guess Kepler had an aneurysm and is slumped over his spittle-flecked keyboard in Japan, Holcumbrink doesn't like it when you point out that he is a liar, and Uptight Bi-Tard is still off somewhere trying to calculate "meaningful information".

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 12 2010,10:17   

Sweet! Uptight and Holcumbrink are arguing about free will on UD, and BA^77 piles on as well. Poor Holcumbrink has no port in this storm, even though he tries to suck up to Uptight.
 
Quote
Upright, good to hear from you! I’m at my wits end with those other guys. Maybe I’ll just hang out here for a while where the people seem to be more sensible (most of them anyway).


--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 24 2010,08:30   

Claims that the EF can be used to detect design are now being made on that thread. I've (as OM) asked for an example, but so far no examples have been forthcoming. What a surprise. The excuses are laughable.

Quote
In summary, you went straight from my post to a your own request for information from me on the EF to satisfy your own sick curiousity. You replied without even responding to my argument at all. You evaded it totally. A complete distraction and an attack on a straw-man. First, you answered your own question by saying what I no doubt will do (go silent), then accused IDers of ALWAYS doing the same- highlighting your class bigotry. After that, you personally interpreted the reason for such hypothetical actions only to your own idiosyncratic satisfaction, and than pined over what I would say next in turn.



Quote
You didn't get or discuss anything out of my post but the personal mental distraction ensuing from your own personal fixation on a perceived need to disprove a personal prejudice of yours (specifically, your idiosyncratically determined list of needs for information proving the utility of the EF). When I referred to Dembski's filter, I alleged that you did not have the intellectual sophistication to interpret M's reference to statistics as a reference to it. And that's why you criticized M: You were incapable of understanding his succinct point!

Your ability to comprehend ID arguments appears routinely to be inept and highly distracted by your own self-aggrandizement. Other evolutionists can understand and respond to points made about them. Only you can't.

I am not here to placate you who do not respond to critiques except with distractions. You completely discarded my points and substituted your own concerns- repeatedly. These were not requests for clarification. They were your own idiosyncratic points. I take it to be your modus operandi.

I will get you references on Dembski's EF, which you already have, liar! And the EF wasn't written to satisfy your dogmatic, prejudiced, malicious, hypocritical, idiosyncratic, circular-reasoned, childish views about what is science and what isn't. You have chosen to not address my points at all; what collateral do you have to offer to get your own addressed? A taunt?

Look at the dates on the EF. How many years will you give us and Demski to apply his EF into a full-blown peer-reviewed article published in a scientific journal people of your ilk won't permit? Oh, you will require the full loaf before you yield an inch. I don't think you even give a 'specific', hypocrite! I responded about EF, which you so much as said I wouldn't, liar! The truth is it is just never to your satisfaction. Just like Meyer did with other evolutionist hypocrities in the Smithsonian article! The trouble is: Evolutionists can never see their own li(v)es or each others'.


http://tinyurl.com/3a5hxf7

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4230
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 24 2010,08:52   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Oct. 24 2010,09:30)
Claims that the EF can be used to detect design are now being made on that thread. I've (as OM) asked for an example, but so far no examples have been forthcoming. What a surprise. The excuses are laughable.
* snippage *

I think you're misunderstanding the intent of "explanatory filter." The purpose of the explanatory filter is to detect and deflect all requests for coherent demonstrations of the explanatory filter.

As can be seen in your quoted examples, it works beautifully.

It wasn't easy, but I've obtained a photo of the original Explanatory Filter. It's been a bit neglected of late.



--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 10062
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 24 2010,12:08   

Also, didn't thetempleton foundation want to fund their "science", but couldn't find any?

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 24 2010,12:17   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 24 2010,12:08)
Also, didn't thetempleton foundation want to fund their "science", but couldn't find any?

I've pointed that out several times now. But you know how it is, the filter just snips those points out. At the very least there's been no response to that specific point.

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
SLP



Posts: 136
Joined: Dec. 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 27 2010,17:44   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Oct. 08 2010,05:51)
There's been some progress (Richard Kepler and M Holcumbrink seem to have vacated the scene) and some regress (Uptight Bi-Tard is there) on this Amazon thread.

UB is going on about "meaningful information", and, when pressed for a definition, said that it "refers to or is correlated according to some system with certain physical or conceptual entities". Bafflegab. I'm pretty sure that he is misrepresenting Shannon information as well. But I am a mere biologist, so if somebody better versed in information theory wants to whack-a-mole, head on over there.

Looks like upright was too busy proof-texting to read all the relevant words:

"Frequently the messages have meaning; that is they refer to or are correlated according to some system with certain physical or conceptual entities."


Messages are not in and of themselves information.

  
SLP



Posts: 136
Joined: Dec. 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 27 2010,18:22   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Oct. 09 2010,11:16)
Quote (JAM @ Oct. 09 2010,11:07)
Should we invite Kepler over here? He's clearly a compulsive liar and therefore might be fun...

He's a long-winded, pedantic liar who seems more wrapped up in the sociological and rhetorical aspects of the "debate" than in the science. In fact, he is scientifically illiterate, it seems.

Fun...

Sounds like so many ID advocates...

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 02 2010,21:07   

I've invited a guy from my thread on Amazon's SitC review to join in over here.

I doubt he will.  He seems to want a big audience, not logical science.  But it's an offer.  I made some predictions regarding this on the thread... we'll see if he has the stuff to come here.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 08 2010,13:30   

Richard Kepler, the last IDiot standing on the Amazon thread about Meyer's wretched book, loses it. You can practically see the saliva spattering onto his keyboard.
Quote
What you refer to as (your) truth, I call bigotry. Of what use is discussing anything with a highly opinionated poster who is concerned only with others addressing merely the matters of his own convenience, prejudices and malice? You just provide opponents with labels and distracting statements, and not arguments. And you call that science. I think it is merely a display of intransigence.

Once again- I am not your valet or lackey to feed your rhetorically pompous, narrow-minded, diverting and dissuasive practices. I'll comment on what I choose to, just as you are doing. Once again, I think your actions betray the colors (flag) flown proudly by hypocrites.


--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
J-Dog



Posts: 4360
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 08 2010,14:52   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Nov. 08 2010,13:30)
Richard Kepler, the last IDiot standing on the Amazon thread about Meyer's wretched book, loses it. You can practically see the saliva spattering onto his keyboard.
 
Quote
What you refer to as (your) truth, I call bigotry. Of what use is discussing anything with a highly opinionated poster who is concerned only with others addressing merely the matters of his own convenience, prejudices and malice? You just provide opponents with labels and distracting statements, and not arguments. And you call that science. I think it is merely a display of intransigence.

Once again- I am not your valet or lackey to feed your rhetorically pompous, narrow-minded, diverting and dissuasive practices. I'll comment on what I choose to, just as you are doing. Once again, I think your actions betray the colors (flag) flown proudly by hypocrites.

Whoa!  It looks to me like a solid case of pot-calling -kettle - black! :)

And if he were REALLY SERIOUS ABOUT DEFENDING ID / XTIANITY HE HAS GOT TO LEARN HOW TO USE THE DAMN CAP LOCK!!!111

--------------
Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 14 2010,15:32   

OK, I dropped an Amazon.com review of "Signature." I expect that the fundies will try to bury it in "unhelpful" votes. So do not restrain from using the "helpful" vote button.

Click Here

Edited by Dr.GH on Nov. 14 2010,13:33

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Doc Bill



Posts: 1000
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 14 2010,15:42   

I think I was Number 1  !

I'm Number 1!  I'm Number 1!

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 15 2010,06:44   

Quote (Dr.GH @ Nov. 14 2010,15:32)
OK, I dropped an Amazon.com review of "Signature." I expect that the fundies will try to bury it in "unhelpful" votes. So do not restrain from using the "helpful" vote button.

Click Here

Thanks, Gary. I've brought your review to the attention of the two IDiots still arguing on the Amazon thread devoted to Meyer's wretched book One is an engineer, the other says that he was trained as an anthropologist, so maybe they will add some comments to your review page!

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 20 2010,14:55   

Another Amazon discussion

Brent seems to have moved over here and is asserting all the things that he got hammered on in the other thread.  I'd appreciate a read through of my latest reply (disecting what is wrong with his statement)

Thanks

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 20 2010,21:55   

Looked fine to me.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 20 2010,22:10   

I did nitpick on a later one.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 21 2010,23:33   

Well, my critical review got buried off the book's main page again.

Creationists are far better organized.

It also helps to "down vote" the creationist's five star reviews.

Edited by Dr.GH on Nov. 21 2010,21:35

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 03 2010,12:11   

Well, my review got buried again. The key would seem to be also "down voting" the creationist's five star reviews.

It is a good thing that science doesn't work by votes.

BTW, Tim Beazley wrote a very good review. His has 16 (helpful) of 29 (total) votes. We should try to bring it to the front.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 06 2010,22:26   

Well, the favorable/unfavorable votes have been swung back to the creationists, "56 of 77 people found the following review helpful:"

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Robin



Posts: 1427
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 07 2010,08:54   

Quote (Dr.GH @ Dec. 06 2010,22:26)

Quote
Well, the favorable/unfavorable votes have been swung back to the creationists, "56 of 77 people found the following review helpful:"


Sorry Dr. GH but you aren't going to get David Marshall's counts down. I think he spends every waking moment on Amazon putting in reviews for religions/philosophical quackery and just pumps up his own numbers.

Reading the comments to his review is really quite fun though. :)

--------------
we IDists rule in design for the flagellum and cilium largely because they do look designed.  Bilbo

The only reason you reject Thor is because, like a cushion, you bear the imprint of the biggest arse that sat on you. Louis

  
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 07 2010,22:27   

Richard Kepler seems to have given up the argument. (Maybe he was run over by a bus)?

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 07 2010,22:28   

Quote (Robin @ Dec. 07 2010,06:54)
Sorry Dr. GH but you aren't going to get David Marshall's counts down. I think he spends every waking moment on Amazon putting in reviews for religions/philosophical quackery and just pumps up his own numbers.

Reading the comments to his review is really quite fun though. :)

David Marshall is quite the creationist tool.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 08 2010,05:55   

Quote (Dr.GH @ Dec. 07 2010,22:27)
Richard Kepler seems to have given up the argument. (Maybe he was run over by a bus)?

Richard probably hasn't given up; he sporadically takes breaks of a couple of days at a time and then comes back with his standard wall of noise comments.

In on of his earlier comments he mentioned that he is living in Japan (just like UDiot vjtorley). Maybe he got some bad fugu fish. That would be an ironic way to go for a creationist...

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 23 2010,11:28   

Kepler seems to be the bastard child of Gordo and Phyllis Schlafly. His latest screed is about 1800 words, all of which is devoted to excoriating me personally, and none of which is devoted to answering questions or providing evidence for ID.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 24 2010,01:02   

And my critical review is buried again.

Do vote against the creationist 5 star reviews as well as for the scientist's 1 star reviews.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: May 24 2011,14:53   

Currently having fun with "Grimmy" in the SitC reviews. He posted his response to my review as his review, and I'm pursuing his poo flinging.

My review, Dr GH's review have both been buried.

BTW, BM Ward on Amazon is CanuckianYankee on UD.

--------------
I’m referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I’m not an evolutionist, I’m a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: May 25 2011,08:51   

The Amazon.com discussion forums (esp. History, Religion, and Science) have recently been purged of almost all pro-science, and liberal commenters. At the same time, rabid religious-right creationists, and antisemitic neofascists are still posting.

I protested this to the Amazon.com customer relations people as often as I could, by mail, and phone, but to no avail. I have stopped buying any goods from Amazon.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: May 25 2011,09:50   

Quote (Dr.GH @ May 25 2011,09:51)
The Amazon.com discussion forums (esp. History, Religion, and Science) have recently been purged of almost all pro-science, and liberal commenters. At the same time, rabid religious-right creationists, and antisemitic neofascists are still posting.

I protested this to the Amazon.com customer relations people as often as I could, by mail, and phone, but to no avail. I have stopped buying any goods from Amazon.

Purged as in banninated?

--------------
I’m referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I’m not an evolutionist, I’m a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: May 25 2011,10:15   

Quote (dvunkannon @ May 25 2011,07:50)
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 25 2011,09:51)
The Amazon.com discussion forums (esp. History, Religion, and Science) have recently been purged of almost all pro-science, and liberal commenters. At the same time, rabid religious-right creationists, and antisemitic neofascists are still posting.

I protested this to the Amazon.com customer relations people as often as I could, by mail, and phone, but to no avail. I have stopped buying any goods from Amazon.

Purged as in banninated?

Yep.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: May 25 2011,10:20   

Quote (Dr.GH @ May 25 2011,10:15)
Quote (dvunkannon @ May 25 2011,07:50)
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 25 2011,09:51)
The Amazon.com discussion forums (esp. History, Religion, and Science) have recently been purged of almost all pro-science, and liberal commenters. At the same time, rabid religious-right creationists, and antisemitic neofascists are still posting.

I protested this to the Amazon.com customer relations people as often as I could, by mail, and phone, but to no avail. I have stopped buying any goods from Amazon.

Purged as in banninated?

Yep.

That's odd.  I mean, I'm still posting.  Are there actually missing posts and banned users?

Or is it just that creobots are flooding Amazon and Amazon doesn't care?

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: May 25 2011,14:03   

Quote (OgreMkV @ May 25 2011,08:20)
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 25 2011,10:15)
 
Quote (dvunkannon @ May 25 2011,07:50)
 
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 25 2011,09:51)
The Amazon.com discussion forums (esp. History, Religion, and Science) have recently been purged of almost all pro-science, and liberal commenters. At the same time, rabid religious-right creationists, and antisemitic neofascists are still posting.

I protested this to the Amazon.com customer relations people as often as I could, by mail, and phone, but to no avail. I have stopped buying any goods from Amazon.

Purged as in banninated?

Yep.

That's odd.  I mean, I'm still posting.  Are there actually missing posts and banned users?

Or is it just that creobots are flooding Amazon and Amazon doesn't care?

When Amazon bans someone they disappear, their posts disappear, and all threads they started disappear. You might not notice unless you were looking for the thread you had posted in, or the comment you just wrote to a now missing thread.

Edited by Dr.GH on May 25 2011,12:05

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: June 27 2011,23:07   

Richard Kepler, the prolix IDiot who makes Gordon E. Mullings sound like a Hemingway character, has posted three long but vacuous comments on the Amazon forum discussing Meyer's odious tome "Signature in the Cell". In my last comment a week or so ago I told him that he could have the last word, and he has managed to blurt out about 6000 words so far. More amusingly, he edits them every few hours, even though there is no evidence that anyone has been reading them except for him.

I've no intention to answer any of these; he has proven over and over that he won't bother to stay on topic and off the personal insults. But it would be fine with me if some of you clicked on the link above, read his rants, and voted his latest three comments as "unhelpful" if you think that they might just be that. A few more negative votes and they will be hidden from the view of anyone who blunders onto that site.

Which would, of course, evoke more spittle-laden screen loads of drivel from him. At least it would keep him out of trouble...

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Ptaylor



Posts: 877
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 27 2011,23:51   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ June 28 2011,16:07)
I've no intention to answer any of these; he has proven over and over that he won't bother to stay on topic and off the personal insults. But it would be fine with me if some of you clicked on the link above, read his rants, and voted his latest three comments as "unhelpful" if you think that they might just be that. A few more negative votes and they will be hidden from the view of anyone who blunders onto that site.

I've already been doing that for the past few weeks. I also get a sense of deep personal satisfaction when seeing
Quote
[Customers don't think this post adds to the discussion. Show post anyway.]

...by opening the comment, voting downwards, and closing it again.

--------------
“To surrender to ignorance and call it God has always been premature, and it remains premature today.” - Isaac Asimov

"Grow up, assface" - Joe G., grown up ID spokesperson, Sandwalk, April 2014

  
clamboy



Posts: 155
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 28 2011,00:41   

Albatrossity2, how are YOUR EARS after all that YELLING that TENDED to come WITHOUT WARNING???

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: June 28 2011,06:46   

Quote (clamboy @ June 28 2011,00:41)
Albatrossity2, how are YOUR EARS after all that YELLING that TENDED to come WITHOUT WARNING???

My ears are fine, but my sides hurt from all the chuckling that comes from reading his well-groomed screeds. He really thinks he is a clever fellow. But he's just an IDiot.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Kristine



Posts: 3037
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 28 2011,19:47   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ June 28 2011,06:46)
Quote (clamboy @ June 28 2011,00:41)
Albatrossity2, how are YOUR EARS after all that YELLING that TENDED to come WITHOUT WARNING???

My ears are fine, but my sides hurt from all the chuckling that comes from reading his well-groomed screeds. He really thinks he is a clever fellow. But he's just an IDiot.

WHAT? :D Jebus, but you guys have strong stomachs.

Amazon.com comments used to be useful. I know one library worker who actually used them instead of the library's catalog to help patrons. Now, thanks to the IDiots, they're about as useful as the Black Dahlia forums.  :angry:

--------------
Which came first: the shimmy, or the hip?

AtBC Poet Laureate

"I happen to think that this prerequisite criterion of empirical evidence is itself not empirical." - Clive

"Damn you. This means a trip to the library. Again." -- fnxtr

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: June 28 2011,20:28   

Quote (Kristine @ June 28 2011,19:47)
WHAT? :D Jebus, but you guys have strong stomachs.

Amazon.com comments used to be useful. I know one library worker who actually used them instead of the library's catalog to help patrons. Now, thanks to the IDiots, they're about as useful as the Black Dahlia forums.  :angry:

Dunno about the Black Dahlia forums, but yeah, the Amazon forums are a cesspool of idiocy. And this one is gold-plated in that regard!

Kepler has now moved from the looooong posts, which he edited 5-10 times each while waiting for anyone to pay attention to them, to a shorter format. Maybe he thinks that this will make it more onerous to tag his comments as unhelpful.

Or maybe he's off his meds.

At any rate, stop over there anytime and chime in, or vote. It's about the same level of discourse as JoeG's blog, without the heavy-handed moderation, of course.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: June 29 2011,18:08   

I think we broke him.  He is definitely off his medications.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: June 30 2011,06:26   

Quote (OgreMkV @ June 29 2011,18:08)
I think we broke him.  He is definitely off his medications.

Yes, he doesn't seem to have the attention span that he had before. Short incoherent outbursts of invective rather than the page-fillers he used to generate.

I've given up trying to be civil to him; there is no evidence that he will ever respond in kind. Mockery, pure and simple, is going to be my approach for a while.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2011,22:08   

More hilarity at Amazon!

Kepler flagged one of my comments as "abuse" when I called him a liar (which was, actually, a truthful statement about his behavior). That triggered the deletion of my comment. A query to the Amazon nanny brought a response that I was not following the guidelines governing civil discussions, which was also true. After months of being called a hypocrite, a bigot, and unscientific I finally decided to treat Kepler like he was treating me, with an abundance of disrespect. When I responded to the nanny that Kepler was much more uncivil in that thread, multiple comments (mine and Kepler's) were deleted. Now the comment thread looks like a UD thread; with many gaps in the discussion and many mysteries.

When Kepler comes back, he will be asked about why he seems to be able to dish it out, but not take it. Turnabout was not fair play in his playbook!

Again, if folks here want to wander over there and vote on the helpfulness (or not) of his comments, it would be appreciated. He can't talk about science at all, but he sure can complain when people use his tactics on him!

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: July 09 2011,23:27   

Amazon.com launched an all-out attack on rational and liberal comments several months ago.

I have found that Barnes and Noble does just as well at providing our book, DVD, and CD needs, and at generally lower prices for new products (including CA sales tax). Since Amazon also refuses to pay sales tax in California, I say be damned and good riddance.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 10 2011,13:46   

Quote (Dr.GH @ July 09 2011,23:27)
Amazon.com launched an all-out attack on rational and liberal comments several months ago.

I have found that Barnes and Noble does just as well at providing our book, DVD, and CD needs, and at generally lower prices for new products (including CA sales tax). Since Amazon also refuses to pay sales tax in California, I say be damned and good riddance.

Well, to be fair, they deleted a large number of the IDiot's comments as well. And my comments did technically violate the Amazon guidelines about civility. After months of being abused by Richard, I decided that abuse was the only thing he understood, so I reciprocated. It is pathetic that he can dish it out, for months, but a week or so of being the target of abuse made him snap and report me to the nannies. Apparently IDiots never feel comfortable in a situation where true give-and-take is allowed.

So I don't have any legitimate complaint about Amazon's deletion of my comments; they can legitimately claim to be following their guidelines. Kepler, however, is a hypocritical chicken-shit, through and through, for his actions.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 11 2011,11:42   

This is truly a masterpiece of the genre - Tard Evasionary Tactics, or How to make sure that it is impossible to get a rational discussion even started.

I've been trying to get Kepler to tell us what HE thinks the topic of the thread should be. So I wrote:
 
Quote
Nobody said "ID has to offer an alternative assertion". But libraries and booksellers do have to classify books and group them with similar books, and there are very good reasons for that. It helps when you don't engage in the construction of strawman arguments. And if you only "reject" statements without offering counter -arguments and/or evidence, you aren't interested in intellectually honest discourse. So I expect rejection to be accompanied by something logical or evidentiary. How about you?

Now to the assertion in the title. We'll go really slowly so that I can get your agreement or disagreement with some baseline ideas before I defend that proposition.

Can you agree that this is a book (Signature in the Cell: DNA and the Evidence for Intelligent Design) about intelligent design?


He replied:
 
Quote
1) You judged: "And if you only "reject" statements without offering counter -arguments and/or evidence, you aren't interested in intellectually honest discourse."

2) Then demanded: "So I expect rejection to be accompanied by something logical or evidentiary."

3) Then asked: "How about you?"

I've already presented my views concerning 1). They appear in marked contrast and direct opposition to your own. And you just cast mine away from your consideration purposes. You jumped from talking about the classification of books within limited or circumscribed ranges of choice (I assume) to calling it a strawman argument, with no explanation or support intermediate to them. I generally don't accept such arguments on the basis of structural and logical grounds.

If you label arguments you don't agree with as strawman arguments out of hand (the most critical possibility here), isn't your rationale for not discussing evolution in this column thus a straw man argument and intellectually dishonest, too? Yet you've stood firm on that one. Why shouldn't I remain firm about this discussion considering the merits and shortcomings and the defense or failure of only one assertion alone-the title that drew us in- and not a group of alternatives to it?

There is no comparison of alternatives that is even mentioned in the title. And I think because of that, you haven't let evolution become available for official discussion purposes at all here. No, I think we should leave all other library classification categories out of the discussion. Only religion and its widely recognized synonyms should be considered for categories for listing the book; that's all the title suggested here. It mandated only one possibility for listing purposes, anyway. Thus the assertion should stand or fall on its own merits.

"Intellectually honest discourse" has many and varied definitions. Am I interested in it? Well, that is a multilevel question. It's a highly subjective category that I see often abused and most often applied only by fiat and in a judgmental, unsupported fashion by evolutionists. And I don't think intellectual honesty or straw man arguments bear directly on the issues of whether we should discuss this thread's title or open discussions up additionally to hypothetical alternatives to it. I see them as concerns that are extraneous to this matter. How do you define interest (as you put it) in this connection?

Actually, I see these issues as relative, not absolute matters for discussion. Your apparent tendency to short-cut communications by referring to them in absolute terms and concluding their validity by fiat is a big hindrance to any intellectual, free-exchange of ideas, from my perspective.

In reply to 2) and 3): Logical and evidentiary rationales alone are too constraining in my view. They are highly subjective categories, too; too much so to get hamstrung in from the first. It also looks to me to be an excuse to reject other types of criticism, eg., structural, grammatical, literary, historical, rhetorical, methodological, and theoretical criticism- outright. No, we'll have to leave the issue of what types of rejection/criticism to accept open-ended I think, too.

You also said: "Can you agree that this is a book (Signature in the Cell: DNA and the Evidence for Intelligent Design) about intelligent design?"

"About"? What do you mean by that little preposition? If you don't know that explicitly and precisely when asking, then I can't even begin to address, much less answer correctly, your question. And how to you intend to wield/wave "it's about ID" around in the future in order to open up discussions beyond what is stated in the title? We just had a big battle over 'about'! That's my greatest concern ... i.e., about it.

I do think the question of whether Meyer's book is an ID book is a legitimate one if discussed only in the form of historical/background. I am just doubtful you would leave it as a historical note. I think you would use it as an excuse or lever to bring in many other ID issues for discussion purposes, i.e., ones that are not mentioned directly in the book.


In other words, he wants to reject arguments on just his say-so (logic and evidence are "too constraining"), he wants to discuss the meaning of the word "about", he thinks that a discussion of a desire for "intellectually honest discourse" is "multilevel", and a book with "Evidence for Intelligent Design" may or may not be a book about ID.

I think I need some of whatever he is smoking...

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: July 16 2011,15:38   

Oberon is back on the Amazon discussion thread.

Amazon

You can go back a page to pick up where he returns... and read the last few vomit dumps of Richard.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: July 16 2011,16:34   

Quote (OgreMkV @ July 16 2011,13:38)
Oberon is back on the Amazon discussion thread.

Amazon

You can go back a page to pick up where he returns... and read the last few vomit dumps of Richard.

The fact that Oberon is quote mining me is rather inviting. The sentence he has misquoted is, "Creationists like to present this as a profound mystery that is supposed to "prove" that they are correct."
http://stonesnbones.blogspot.com/2008/12/origin-of-life-outline.html


tch tch tch.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Texas Teach



Posts: 985
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 18 2011,17:24   

In case there's anyone here who doesn't read there too, Jerry Coyne posted a link to the review for King James Bible at Amazon.  Apparently the reality-based community got there early and often.

--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 02 2011,16:39   

Ricahrd Kepler seems to be broken, again. Or he is off plotting his revenge against those evil evolutionists who keep pointing out that he is just a broken record. A couple of his recent posts have five votes against, and one more on each of them will put them in the category where Amazon hides them from view automatically.

I think he and Joe need to get together. Joe could bake him a cake and Richard could teach Joe how to spell. Win-win!

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 05 2011,08:45   

Joe must read this thread. He's shown up on the amazon discussion, full of bluster and insults, per usual. Maybe Richard will report him for abuse!

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1691
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 05 2011,08:54   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Aug. 05 2011,14:45)
Joe must read this thread. He's shown up on the amazon discussion, full of bluster and insults, per usual. Maybe Richard will report him for abuse!

Joe, over there:

Quote
Unfortunately for you medicine doesn't have anything to do with the theory of evolution.

Why do evos have to lie all the time?


BWAHAHAHA.. wait, what?!?

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 05 2011,09:49   

It is some comfort to know that the overwheming majority of creationists are really very stupid.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Tony M Nyphot



Posts: 212
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 05 2011,16:32   

Quote (Dr.GH @ Aug. 05 2011,08:49)
It is some comfort to know that the overwheming majority of creationists are really very stupid.

That's a minimal "some" my good Dr.

I find it discomforting there are so many very stupid people who endeavor to have everyone join them on the far left of the bell curve.

I have been following Dave's efforts at Amazon. I'm immensely curious about Kepler's motivations and purpose for being so utterly insane.

And I continue to marvel at the unfathomable depths of the abyss that resides in Joe Gallien's skull.

--------------
"I, OTOH, am an underachiever...I either pee my pants or faint dead away..." FTK

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 10062
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(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 05 2011,16:40   

Quote
Joseph Gallien says:
[Deleted by Amazon 5 hours ago]


--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 05 2011,16:42   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 05 2011,16:40)
Quote
Joseph Gallien says:
[Deleted by Amazon 5 hours ago]

Yeah, and after a few more posts little Joey bailed. If he can't call people evotards and cowards and liars, he runs out of gas pretty fast!

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 10062
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 05 2011,16:48   



--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 05 2011,16:58   

Whoops! Spoke too soon. Little Joey has returned with another spittle-flecked comment about medicine and the theory of evolution.

What an egnoramus!

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 05 2011,20:09   

Joe continues to be the best evidence against ID that exists.

I doubt there are any lurkers left, but it should be interesting.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 31 2011,06:05   

Poor Richard. I quit responding to his comments a while back, when it became even more obvious that he would merely deny, vigorously and at length, the shellacking he was getting. But I just looked at the thread, and he is getting even more pathetic. The last three posts are his, they've been up for a couple of days without any response from anybody. So he continues to edit them, talking to himself essentially.

I'd love to get him and KF in the same room and see which one ran out of gas first.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 31 2011,06:37   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Aug. 31 2011,12:05)
Poor Richard. I quit responding to his comments a while back, when it became even more obvious that he would merely deny, vigorously and at length, the shellacking he was getting. But I just looked at the thread, and he is getting even more pathetic. The last three posts are his, they've been up for a couple of days without any response from anybody. So he continues to edit them, talking to himself essentially.

I'd love to get him and KF in the same room and see which one ran out of gas first.

You...you..you've single-handedly solved the energy crisis!

Now if only we could do something about their emissions....

Louis

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Bye.

  
Glen Davidson



Posts: 752
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 31 2011,14:37   

Kepler has, um, interesting opinions:

 
Quote
These two authors are some of the most qualified and most interesting on Intelligent Design. With quantum mechanics incorporating rapid developments in the field of consciousness studies, you need to be reading current developments on information/intelligent control over biological progession upward in complexity. This means you should be reading books on Intelligent Design. If you are a person who 'wants to know' what is going on in scientific debates nowadays, you should understand and consider both sides of the ID/evolution debate. (I don't consider creationism scientific, but ID definitely is. Read the writers' qualifications, not the pundits opinions. Was Dean Kenyon's Biochemical Predestination worthless? No way!) The critics of this book read ID books to 'protect you.' You've heard that line before, haven't you -- in books like George Orwell's 1984?) These pundits want you to steer clear of ID books, but they use pompous attacks, evidently distrusting anyone's critical reading abilities but their own. Perhaps I use such arguments, too, but at least I trust your intelligence. From my experience in Asia, the American people of all age levels are ready to hear both sides of the argument. Even our high schoolers have some of the best critical thinking/analysis abilities in the world. Asia is no match for America and the West in my opinion in lay intellectual ability, and I have taught Japanese movie stars and doctors English. One of my advisors in my studies for my M.A. in Anthropology once nudged me in the direction of theistic evolution as an alternative to Darwinism. I think he was a theistic evolutionist, but no one can admit it in Academia. (Is this 1984 again?) So I for one take all this hubris as overblown hype. I don't believe all the anti-ID propaganda. Do you? Got'cha! (Please check the meaning of that out.) This is a very good and interesting book. Seriously consider reading it!


Richard's reviews

Our creationist Merkins beat the hell out of them damn dirty asians, don't you know.  Probably he figured that out because we have a bunch of dull slackers saying "God did it."  He titled the "review" thusly:  "Don't Let any Bigoted Pundit Control Your Thinking about I.D."  No, let a moronic Presbyterian control your thinking about ID.

He really is too pathetic to engage.

Glen Davidson

--------------
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p....p

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of coincidence---ID philosophy

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 31 2011,15:00   

Quote (Glen Davidson @ Aug. 31 2011,14:37)
He really is too pathetic to engage.

Yes, he is very pathetic. Too pathetic to even show up here (and we know he reads this thread), or on UD. He just squats in his own soiled corner of the internet, churning out buckets of poorly-written nonsense which he suspects might be clever. And then he endlessly edits his turgidity, especially if nobody responds to him for a day or two.

He is, hopefully, one unique baramin o' tard.

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2777
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 01 2011,07:12   

Poor Richard is circling the wagons around his "habitable zones" hypothesis, but, as always, neglecting to address the actual critiques that have been made about it.

And even though he has edited that post about a half-dozen times, it still contains gems like

I've been pouring over these hypotheses...

and

I did not mean an astronaut, and certainly not one dawning a space suit, for instance.


--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Dec. 14 2011,17:15   

Got another live ID proponent at Amazon:

More ID at Amazon

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Ptaylor



Posts: 877
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 15 2012,20:30   

Quote (OgreMkV @ Dec. 15 2011,10:15)
Got another live ID proponent at Amazon:

More ID at Amazon

After a nice long summer break I just brought myself up-to-date on that thread, but was disappointed to read the latest entry:    
Quote
B. A. Daley says:
[Deleted by Amazon on Jan 7, 2012 1:34:34 PM PST]
.
Did you catch the pre-deletion post?

--------------
“To surrender to ignorance and call it God has always been premature, and it remains premature today.” - Isaac Asimov

"Grow up, assface" - Joe G., grown up ID spokesperson, Sandwalk, April 2014

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 15 2012,21:43   

Quote (Ptaylor @ Jan. 15 2012,20:30)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Dec. 15 2011,10:15)
Got another live ID proponent at Amazon:

More ID at Amazon

After a nice long summer break I just brought myself up-to-date on that thread, but was disappointed to read the latest entry:      
Quote
B. A. Daley says:
[Deleted by Amazon on Jan 7, 2012 1:34:34 PM PST]
.
Did you catch the pre-deletion post?

No, that was while I was traveling.  All I found was the original e-mail

Quote
B. A. Daley says:

Kevin:

Any scientist worth his salt, (or saltation regarding 'Natura non facit saltum',) knows what he knows not. The more you know, the more you are aware of that which you don't know. I am fully aware of this fact. In fact, the better the scientist, the more aware he is of how much he does not know. It is an expanding universe of knowledge out there. It seems the more knowledge one takes in, the larger the universe gets.

Science is about testing hypothesis, and treating 'current' ideas as if they weren't true. No discovery has ever been made which did not challenge existing knowledge. Science, failing to do this, simply fails.

Unfortunately, you haven't been able to give me a single scientific process which doesn't study structure. In fact, if you wanted to boil science down to...


I guess he devolved in the typical rant of creationists everywhere.

He kept wanting me to admit that anything with structure had to be designed.  My dozens of examples didn't phase him.

Maybe someone with mad google-fu skills can pull up a historical weblog, but I'm not sure how.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1950
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 16 2012,10:51   

Quote (OgreMkV @ Dec. 14 2011,15:15)
Got another live ID proponent at Amazon:

More ID at Amazon

Re: your point #4,
Quote
On the other hand, I would also suggest you investigate how scientists say speciation actually occurs. There are 4-5 main forms of speciation with several variations on each one. Hint: hybridization is not one of them.


Hybridization is a rather important source of new species.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 16 2012,12:01   

Quote (Dr.GH @ Jan. 16 2012,10:51)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Dec. 14 2011,15:15)
Got another live ID proponent at Amazon:

More ID at Amazon

Re: your point #4,  
Quote
On the other hand, I would also suggest you investigate how scientists say speciation actually occurs. There are 4-5 main forms of speciation with several variations on each one. Hint: hybridization is not one of them.


Hybridization is a rather important source of new species.

Fixed.

I think the original discussion was that hybridization was the ONLY source of speciation.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
OgreMkV



Posts: 3259
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2012,11:52   

DNA_Jock was able to grab a screenshot of the offending post.



I still don't get what he's shooting for here... except making up definitions to words.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
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