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  Topic: Official Uncommonly Dense Discussion Thread< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
stevestory



Posts: 8877
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,22:54   

Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ July 06 2008,03:21)
David Springer dropped a comment into the queue on my blog wishing me a fatal disease.

What a great person.

   
stevestory



Posts: 8877
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,23:01   

FtK and Larry Fafarman are commenting at UD. There's a meeting of the minds. Will science withstand such an onslaught?

   
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,23:04   

Quote (stevestory @ July 06 2008,20:54)
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ July 06 2008,03:21)
David Springer dropped a comment into the queue on my blog wishing me a fatal disease.

What a great person.

Yeah, he's quite a mensch:

Quote
Actually it makes me feel like doing some pain experiments on PZ Myers. I don’t believe he feels pain. All the blood and screaming from my fists pounding his face to a pulp would be nothing more significant than an automobile engine leaking oil and bearings making noise from lack of lubrication. Of course I could be wrong. -ds


--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
stevestory



Posts: 8877
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,23:36   

Quote (carlsonjok @ July 06 2008,07:36)
Quote (Freelurker @ July 05 2008,23:02)
 
Quote (stevestory @ July 05 2008,19:16)
Will I shock anyone by revealing that Jerry Pournelle was an engineer? I doubt it.

If you think that defense policy analysis and operations research are engineering then you are revealing your own ignorance and you are illustrating why people should not comment on areas they don't understand.

Operations research is a staple of Industrial Engineering undergraduate programs.  At least it was when I was an IE student 20 years ago.

I probably exaggerated a bit in calling him an engineer. He has a degree in engineering, and has done work in Operations Research, but perhaps I erred. Mea culpa.

   
stevestory



Posts: 8877
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,23:36   

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ July 07 2008,00:04)
Quote (stevestory @ July 06 2008,20:54)
 
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ July 06 2008,03:21)
David Springer dropped a comment into the queue on my blog wishing me a fatal disease.

What a great person.

Yeah, he's quite a mensch:

 
Quote
Actually it makes me feel like doing some pain experiments on PZ Myers. I don’t believe he feels pain. All the blood and screaming from my fists pounding his face to a pulp would be nothing more significant than an automobile engine leaking oil and bearings making noise from lack of lubrication. Of course I could be wrong. -ds

And the same guy can turn around and call us amoral.

What a world.

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 1954
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: July 06 2008,23:42   

Quote (stevestory @ July 06 2008,20:53)
Ahhh, the UD thread. Feels good to be home.

Have they got more stupid?

Hurray

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2778
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,07:18   

Quote (Dr.GH @ July 06 2008,23:42)
Have they got more stupid?

That's not really possible, is it?

Here's a nugget from Mats, on the thread where DT flails at Chris Comer for promoting secularism.  
Quote
Like Dave said previously, what would have happened if the humanist creation myth (unguided evolutionism) had been subject to scientific criticism?

Gee, I don't know. Why don't we ask the scientists?

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
midwifetoad



Posts: 3553
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,10:21   

Quote
6 July 2008
Chris Comer was shilling for CFI-Austin
DaveScot
Cool. This should be interesting when it gets to court. As I was reading the complaint it mentions Barbara Forrest’s talk was sponsored by the Austin Center for Inquiry.

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-austin

The briar patch! Anything but the briar patch!

--------------
”let’s not make a joke of ourselves.”

Pat Robertson

  
Amadan



Posts: 1244
Joined: Jan. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,12:17   

Densye

 
Quote
What happens then? Well, what happens then is being played out in Canada right now, and all across Europe. All ethical systems come under attack, and degenerate into a swamp of unfocused feelings.


Ummmmm, which Europe would that be, Denyse?
Maybe it’s the Europe being ravaged by the invading Muslim hordes we hear about on UD from time to time? (‘The Crescent v. the Croissant’, one might say...)  Are these osculospumatory fanatics the ones attacking “all ethical systems”? Including their own? Tut tut. But at least once they’ve finished their attacking, we won’t have to worry about those nasty foreign ethical systems and Sharia law etc that you and the other concerned citizens there are so concerned about.

Or maybe it’s the Europe that has so undermined its sense of ethics that it unanimously supports a legal system for trying war criminals? Imagine stooping that low!

Of course, it could be the Europe that so diminished its citizens’ sense of personal responsibility that that reliable indicator of a man’s right to do as he damn well thinks he should, the murder rate, lags shamefully behind that of the Only Remaining Christian Nation?

Actually, it might just be the Europe where the majority of schoolchildren attend church-sponsored or other non-secular schools. After all, you’ve made it very clear what a vicious attack on ethical systems it would be if the US was to do the same.

But, on reflection, I don’t think you mean any of those Europes.

What you really meant was Yurrp , a place inhabited by knock-kneed, lily-livered pinko navel-gazing crypto-fascist commie atheist faggots who are just waiting for Chuck Norris to come over and kick their asses into shape the next time they screw up. You know, the real place, not somewhere that exists in some idiot echo chamber.

For God’s sake woman, sell that brain on EBay: it’s in perfect unused condition. You’ll make a fortune, and be able to retire from ‘writing’.
Pleease. . .

--------------
"People are always looking for natural selection to generate random mutations" - Densye  4-4-2011
JoeG BTW dumbass- some variations help ensure reproductive fitness so they cannot be random wrt it.

   
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,12:54   

Quote (Amadan @ July 07 2008,10:17)
Densye

     
Quote
What happens then? Well, what happens then is being played out in Canada right now, and all across Europe. All ethical systems come under attack, and degenerate into a swamp of unfocused feelings.


Ummmmm, which Europe would that be, Denyse?
Maybe it’s the Europe being ravaged by the invading Muslim hordes we hear about on UD from time to time? (‘The Crescent v. the Croissant’, one might say...)  Are these osculospumatory fanatics the ones attacking “all ethical systems”? Including their own? Tut tut. But at least once they’ve finished their attacking, we won’t have to worry about those nasty foreign ethical systems and Sharia law etc that you and the other concerned citizens there are so concerned about.

Or maybe it’s the Europe that has so undermined its sense of ethics that it unanimously supports a legal system for trying war criminals? Imagine stooping that low!

Of course, it could be the Europe that so diminished its citizens’ sense of personal responsibility that that reliable indicator of a man’s right to do as he damn well thinks he should, the murder rate, lags shamefully behind that of the Only Remaining Christian Nation?

Actually, it might just be the Europe where the majority of schoolchildren attend church-sponsored or other non-secular schools. After all, you’ve made it very clear what a vicious attack on ethical systems it would be if the US was to do the same.

But, on reflection, I don’t think you mean any of those Europes.

What you really meant was Yurrp , a place inhabited by knock-kneed, lily-livered pinko navel-gazing crypto-fascist commie atheist faggots who are just waiting for Chuck Norris to come over and kick their asses into shape the next time they screw up. You know, the real place, not somewhere that exists in some idiot echo chamber.

I once read a comment from a wingnut somewhere that the only reason Europeans and Canadians claimed to like their medical systems was because their commie homo atheist Islamofascist culture had so demoralized them that they no longer had the energy to protest against national healthcare. It's remarkable the elaborate mythologies rightwingers spin about the rest of the world.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,12:55   

Quote (midwifetoad @ July 07 2008,08:21)
Quote
6 July 2008
Chris Comer was shilling for CFI-Austin
DaveScot
Cool. This should be interesting when it gets to court. As I was reading the complaint it mentions Barbara Forrest’s talk was sponsored by the Austin Center for Inquiry.

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-austin

The briar patch! Anything but the briar patch!

If Dave "we own that now, too" Scot is confident about the course of the lawsuit, Chris Comer should have nothing to worry about.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
Henry J



Posts: 4046
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,14:12   

Quote (stevestory @ July 06 2008,22:01)
FtK and Larry Fafarman are commenting at UD. There's a meeting of the minds. Will science withstand such an onslaught?

Depends on how hungry the piranha are...

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2778
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,14:17   

News Flash! Man bites backward-walking shaved dog!  DT schools Densye on the use of a common English word.  
Quote
Denyse

Definition of the word “faith” in the American Heritage Dictionary

.2. Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence.

Bible definition of faith (KJV):

Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Dictionary and bible seem to pretty much agree on it.


--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
tsig



Posts: 320
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,14:19   

Quote (stevestory @ July 05 2008,18:16)
Will I shock anyone by revealing that Jerry Pournelle was an engineer? I doubt it. And he appears to be an idiot when it comes to science:

Quote
Pournelle has expressed support for several viewpoints that differ from the general scientific consensus. These include skepticism on a significant human contribution to global warming and on evolution, and he has advocated research to directly investigate Peter Duesberg's controversial views on the cause of AIDS. Pournelle has also commented on possible links between race and IQ (as evident in Lucifer's Hammer and The Burning City). He emphasizes that in some cases, particularly when the effects of wrong decisions could be disastrous, contrarian research by competent researchers is valuable as insurance.

Although claiming not to be a proponent of Intelligent design, he argues (in opposition to many critics) that it can generate falsifiable hypotheses that contribute to the understanding of evolution. He regards proposals to teach Intelligent Design in public schools as less damaging to education than the expert-dominated, centralized educational systems he sees as a prerequisite for banning such proposals. Pournelle has made several references in his blog to Hoyle's fallacy as an argument against Darwinian evolution.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki....c_views

I have three engineering degrees but always made a living as and electrician. Nobody argues with an electrician about power on an outlet.

  
Amadan



Posts: 1244
Joined: Jan. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,14:29   

Quote (tsig @ July 07 2008,14:19)
 Nobody argues with an electrician about power on an outlet.

... except St Krispin of the Extended Digit, patron saint of carbonised life forms.

--------------
"People are always looking for natural selection to generate random mutations" - Densye  4-4-2011
JoeG BTW dumbass- some variations help ensure reproductive fitness so they cannot be random wrt it.

   
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4238
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,14:51   

DS puts the smackdab on Jack Krebs:
 
Quote
13
DaveScot
07/07/2008
10:57 am
Jack

The day someone in your camp uses the definition of Intelligent Design in our sidebar here is the day I’ll worry about your hypocritical self recommending I take a definition of secular humanism from secular humanists.

Pssst. Dave! Over here.

*furtive glance*

There IS no definition of ID on your side bar.

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
utidjian



Posts: 185
Joined: Oct. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,15:12   

Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ July 07 2008,14:51)
DS puts the smackdab on Jack Krebs:
   
Quote
13
DaveScot
07/07/2008
10:57 am
Jack

The day someone in your camp uses the definition of Intelligent Design in our sidebar here is the day I’ll worry about your hypocritical self recommending I take a definition of secular humanism from secular humanists.

Pssst. Dave! Over here.

*furtive glance*

There IS no definition of ID on your side bar.

reciprocatingbill:

I just posted that I couldn't find one there (at UD). I looked for it earlier. But now it IS there. Under "Friends of Descent" header about 3 entries down.

-DU-

--------------
Being laughed at doesn't mean you're progressing along some line. It probably just means you're saying some stupid shit -stevestory

  
midwifetoad



Posts: 3553
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,15:23   

Quote
In a broader sense, Intelligent Design is simply the science of design detection — how to recognize patterns arranged by an intelligent cause for a purpose.


That was easy. I wonder when they'll get around to providing an example of detection.

--------------
”let’s not make a joke of ourselves.”

Pat Robertson

  
Henry J



Posts: 4046
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,15:37   

Quote
design detection — how to recognize patterns arranged by an intelligent cause for a purpose.


Oh, so then their method requires knowing the purpose of the presumed intelligence, and then looking for patterns that would be apt to satisfy that purpose?

(Or am I reading into it something what ain't there? :) )

  
Reed



Posts: 274
Joined: Feb. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,15:46   

Quote (Henry J @ July 07 2008,13:37)
   
Quote
design detection — how to recognize patterns arranged by an intelligent cause for a purpose.


Oh, so then their method requires knowing the purpose of the presumed intelligence, and then looking for patterns that would be apt to satisfy that purpose?

(Or am I reading into it something what ain't there? :) )

But don't forget, the designer moves in mysterious ways, which mere mortals such as ourselves cannot possibly comprehend!  ;)  (see typical ID response to the "bad design" argument)

  
Chayanov



Posts: 289
Joined: Dec. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,17:00   

"We know it has a purpose because it was designed. We know it was designed because it has a purpose."

--------------
Help! Marxist literary critics are following me!

  
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4238
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,17:04   

Quote (utidjian @ July 07 2008,16:12)
reciprocatingbill:

I just posted that I couldn't find one there (at UD). I looked for it earlier. But now it IS there. Under "Friends of Descent" header about 3 entries down.

-DU-

You're right. A quick check of the google cache shows that it was there all along. I stand corrected.

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
Freelurker



Posts: 80
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2008,18:36   

In previous comments here I have taken positions that (1) engineers and scientists are natural allies in the ID debate and (2) the pro-science side is the one that should be making comparisons between engineering, science, and ID.
Anyone who would like to see more support for these positions can read my comments here: The Missing Link in ... [Note: I'm a commenter there, not the poster.]

--------------
Invoking intelligent design in science is like invoking gremlins in engineering. [after Mark Isaak.]
All models are wrong, some models are useful. - George E. P. Box

  
Amadan



Posts: 1244
Joined: Jan. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2008,05:35   

***UPDATE***

I now realise that this is the Europe Denyse had in mind.

Quite right, Densye, ethical systems under attack everywhere you go. Deepest, heartfelt and humblest apologies.

Actually, that's an idea: the Knocknagoshel Apology Festival . . .

--------------
"People are always looking for natural selection to generate random mutations" - Densye  4-4-2011
JoeG BTW dumbass- some variations help ensure reproductive fitness so they cannot be random wrt it.

   
BWE



Posts: 1896
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2008,06:00   

Quote (Amadan @ July 08 2008,05:35)
***UPDATE***

I now realise that this is the Europe Denyse had in mind.

Quite right, Densye, ethical systems under attack everywhere you go. Deepest, heartfelt and humblest apologies.

Actually, that's an idea: the Knocknagoshel Apology Festival . . .

holy shit amadan! Astounding.
Quote
Phallus-kissers are rewarded with ash-streaks on their face, which presumably absolves them from having to go through the procedure again, unless of course they would like to.


--------------
Who said that ev'ry wish would be heard and answered
When wished on the morning star
Somebody thought of that, and someone believed it
Look what it's done so far

The Daily Wingnut

   
Reciprocating Bill



Posts: 4238
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2008,06:35   

Quote (Amadan @ July 08 2008,06:35)
***UPDATE***

I now realise that this is the Europe Denyse had in mind.

Quite right, Densye, ethical systems under attack everywhere you go. Deepest, heartfelt and humblest apologies.

Actually, that's an idea: the Knocknagoshel Apology Festival . . .

Where people actually engage in rectatorical contests (speaking from their rectums), then issue knockpologies.

(That sounds strangely familiar).

--------------
Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.

"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you."
- David Foster Wallace

"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down."
- Barry Arrington

  
carlsonjok



Posts: 3324
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2008,07:12   

Dave points and laughs at those icky gays having sex on a beach in Massachusetts.  His post is not all that noteworthy except that it calls to mind this little comment by Dave about his beach escapades.

--------------
It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

  
BWE



Posts: 1896
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2008,07:41   

Quote (carlsonjok @ July 08 2008,07:12)
Dave points and laughs at those icky gays having sex on a beach in Massachusetts.  His post is not all that noteworthy except that it calls to mind this little comment by Dave about his beach escapades.

Reminds me of the old scoutmaster line:

If you were amping and woke up with dried goop all over your face and a dollar in your sleeping bag, would you tell anyone?



No?




Wanna go camping?

--------------
Who said that ev'ry wish would be heard and answered
When wished on the morning star
Somebody thought of that, and someone believed it
Look what it's done so far

The Daily Wingnut

   
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2008,07:47   

Quote (carlsonjok @ July 08 2008,07:12)
Dave points and laughs at those icky gays having sex on a beach in Massachusetts.  His post is not all that noteworthy except that it calls to mind this little comment by Dave about his beach escapades.

jilted love is sour wine fer shore.  pore dave had to waddle back to the motel and then didn't get a call for lunch.  probably cried into his cheezy poofs all during breakfast.

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
carlsonjok



Posts: 3324
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2008,13:04   

John Templeton passed away today.
Quote
In 1987, he established the John Templeton Foundation to fund projects that could reconcile religion and science. The Pennsylvania-based nonprofit has an estimated endowment of US$1.5 billion and awards some US$70 million in annual grants.


One wonders if WmAD will eulogize him. What with getting a cool $100K from them back in 1999 to write "Being as Communion: The Science and Metaphysics of Information", it would be a gracious gesture.

--------------
It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

  
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