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  Topic: ID-METHOD OF PROOF by R tolten, whayt the *#&% are you people kidding?< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
cichlid666



Posts: 4
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 12 2005,02:01   

I cant fathom that our president can believe this. " Astrophysicists such as stephen hawking determined that the evident starting point just before the Big Bang was something called "singularity" wich is: all the cosmos's potential mass (matter), energy, and dimentions (and time) reduced down to an infinately small point ZERO volume --- so , matter, 3-dimentional space , and time virtually did not exist before the Big bang."I am truly scared If people can accept this, wow!

  
Henry J



Posts: 4013
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 12 2005,14:48   

My understanding of the term "singularity" is that it refers to a place or condition in which our known laws of physics don't work reliably. Taking just relativity by itself, when the density of energy approaches infinity I wouldn't assume that the results (of physics equations) were realistic.

But that aside, at the density implied by stuffing galaxies into the volume of a subatomic particle, quantum effects become as important as the relativistic effects, and the unification of relativity and quantum is still a work in progress (or was the last I heard).

As for what Mr. Bush might believe or not believe, I can only guess.

Henry

  
cichlid666



Posts: 4
Joined: Aug. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Aug. 13 2005,01:59   

quantum physics to me would seem to be based a bit more on "theory" than the theory of evolution. It seems a bit ubsurd to think that we could ever reproduce the big bang, therefore it makes for a pretty darn good start to base an ID theory off of ? But lets poke fun at the theory of evolution, a theory that science has slowly, but surely started piecing together. Could it just be the simple fact that people who are so caught up in old school religion cant let go or what?

  
A heretic



Posts: 1
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 20 2005,07:08   

You think evolution and the big bang is irrational? Fine, laugh at as you feel smug knowing your loving god damns me to eternal agony me while worshipping a 2000 year old carpenter and a god who has mysteriously dissapeared as we know more about the world around us.

  
FishyFred



Posts: 43
Joined: Sep. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 20 2005,07:20   

Quote (cichlid666 @ Aug. 12 2005,07:01)
I cant fathom that our president can believe this. " Astrophysicists such as stephen hawking determined that the evident starting point just before the Big Bang was something called "singularity" wich is: all the cosmos's potential mass (matter), energy, and dimentions (and time) reduced down to an infinately small point ZERO volume --- so , matter, 3-dimentional space , and time virtually did not exist before the Big bang."I am truly scared If people can accept this, wow!

Here's the thing though. The way that it's put it is plausible enough, citing Hawking makes it credible, and 95% of Americans barely understand the concept well enough to know that the best explanation in the field going right now is a big bang.

I'm not particularly scared of this, nor am I surprised at all.

    
cogzoid



Posts: 234
Joined: Sep. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 20 2005,08:42   

Quantum theory is probably the most tested theory in science's repertoire.  This is due to the fact that quantum mechanics typically applies to small things.  Small things fit in labs.  The measurements are also simple.  The spin of an electron in the z direction is either +1/2 or -1/2, for example.  That's easy enough to measure.  But, the math is complicated and rich.  Resulting in alot of interesting and non-intuitive things that are directly testable by scientists.  The non-intuitive nature of quantum also inspires scientists to try and stump the theory.  For a long time scientists were looking for any experimental evidence that could debunk quantum theory.   Simply for the reason that it didn't jive with their every day experiences.  But, alas, quantum has ALWAYS triumphed.  I would suggest that you find another, less tested theory to try and debunk.  And if you start with appealing to one's "common sense" you're destined for failure.

By the way, don't confuse Quantum with General Relativity.  They are completely different beasts.

-Dan

  
TheMissingLink



Posts: 19
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 20 2005,08:50   

Quote (cichlid666 @ Aug. 12 2005,07:01)
I cant fathom that our president can believe this. " Astrophysicists such as stephen hawking determined that the evident starting point just before the Big Bang was something called "singularity" wich is: all the cosmos's potential mass (matter), energy, and dimentions (and time) reduced down to an infinately small point ZERO volume --- so , matter, 3-dimentional space , and time virtually did not exist before the Big bang."I am truly scared If people can accept this, wow!

I wish I could understand why so many people refuse to accept so much of science these days. When you break your leg and go the hospital what do you say when the doctor wants to xray you? "Ooooh no, doc, there's no way you can get a PICTURE just by pointing that thing at me! Next thing you know, you'll be sticking some needle in me to prevent the flu! But I know it's all just a conspiracy to make me think man comes from monkeys, and I won't have it! Call my pastor and have him prey for me instead!"

Yeah, so, it's not the point BEFORE the big bang that's the singularity. It's actually the smallest instant after the big bang (and before) where the laws of physics break down (unless you buy into string theory, in which case everything is peachy!;).

Also, you're not quite on target when you say the cosmos's mass (and energy) is ... zero volume. We know from Einstein's E=MC^2 that mass and energy are interchangable - we can convert mass to energy (i.e., atomic bombs). But interestingly, and even Einstein didn't realize the potential of this, energy can be converted to matter! This is what happened during the big bang. An unimaginable amount of energy (zero volume!;) exloded and began to forge sub-atomic particles, which eventually formed atoms ... etc, etc ... which eventually formed monkeys, which eventually formed man! (ha ha - couldn't resist).

  
cogzoid



Posts: 234
Joined: Sep. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 20 2005,08:59   

Don't forget Helium!

  
Henry J



Posts: 4013
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 20 2005,11:14   

Helium - the Alpha of the periodic table.

It's a gas.

  
sir_toejam



Posts: 846
Joined: April 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 20 2005,12:22   

lol. very witty, wilde.

  
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