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  Topic: AF Dave's UPDATED Creator God Hypothesis, Creation/Evolution Debate< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
stevestory



Posts: 8870
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,12:50   

I have an hypothesis about what makes AFDave seem so obviously dumber than his creationist pals. First off, he's a YEC. Even some ID supporters are embarrassed by their YEC peers. Most importantly, he has a relentlessly cheery tone. Many ID supporters do not. Davetard, Donald M, Dembksi, Larry, these guys are very clearly bitter and upset. We evolutionists ascribe this anger and bitterness to an awareness on the part of the creationist to how harrassed and bedeviled they are by the evidence and by scientists. In doing so, we credit them with an awareness of the situation. When AFDave comes along and lacks this bad attitude, we say, 'Wow, this guy doesn't even know enough, to know how boned he is'.

   
ericmurphy



Posts: 2460
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,12:56   

Quote (stevestory @ July 07 2006,17:50)
'Wow, this guy doesn't even know enough, to know how boned he is'.

Man, even the Black Knight seemed to be kind of, you know, cranky. There's something a little creepy about a guy like AFDave, lying there in a pool of his own blood, entrails spilling onto the ground, with a grin on his face saying, "Wow! YeeHAH! I'm having a blast beating you guys up!"

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2006 MVD award for most dogged defense of scientific sanity

"Atheism is a religion the same way NOT collecting stamps is a hobby." —Scott Adams

  
Diogenes



Posts: 80
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,13:00   

Since dave will be away on vacation I thought I'd take a crack at the open question list:

Quote

Currently Unanswered Questions from the last 5 "Pages"        

(1)  How is the dendrochronology for Catal Huyuk wrong?


Have you ever been to Catal Huyuk?  Are there even trees around Catal Huyuk?  Even if their are you weren't there when they were planted, this proves nothing.

Quote

(2) Who do you think had syphilis on the ark?


Noah was a drunk, and Ham apparently thinks drunk people are funny, so both seem like likely candidated, but it's apparent from the bible that women are the root of evil, so my theory is it was one of the wives.  Given that Ham ends up being cursed by god i'm going to go with Ham's wife as the likely culprit.

Quote

(3) If Noah and his little group were the only humans left, can you calculate for me the average number of children each female would have to have in order to achieve the population levels we have today...in 4,356 years?? Include infant mortality and other standard factors, Dave. People **DiD** die back then, didn't they?


If we assume roughly 20 years between generations, and a flood date 4500 years ago we end up with 225 generations to go from 4 mated pairs to 6 billion people (we'll ignore the nephillim for now, since I don't count half-angels as people).  If we take the 225th root of 6 billion we end up with 1.10524472, which means...something important I'm sure.  If we assume 25% of those born don't live long enough to spawn, and each pair has 4 children born (or attempted to be born), then each generation increases the population by 50%.  1.5 ^ 225 = 4.17381588 × 10^39.  Throw in some war, famine, and pestilence and 6 billion sounds about right.

Quote

(4) How much water was involved in the flood, Dave?  Estimate of the amount of water that was underground, and how deep was it? Was it spread uniformly under the crust, or was it in localised (and deep) reservoirs?


According to wikipedia Mt. Ararat is 5,137 meters above sea level, and the bible says it was covered in water.  The mean radius of the earth is 6,372,797 meters.  So the volume of water needed to cover the mountain should be (4/3 * pi * (6,372,797+5,137)^3) - (4/3 * pi * 6,372,797^3).  This is 2.62375 x 10^18 cubic meters of water.

The floodgates of heaven were opened as well as the springs of the deep.  The single city of New Jerusalem in heaven is 2.7 billion cubic miles in size, so I would guess there's more water in heaven than under the earth, so this whole line of questioning is moot.

Quote

(5) How did those tracks get in the coconino sandstone in the midst of a raging flood that deposited billions MORE tons of sediment on top of the sandstone? Sandstone can't "dry" in the middle of a flood that continues to deposit layers under a "water canopy", Dave. Nor would those animals survive UNDERWATER, nor would their tracks survive the pressure of the layers above on the wet sandstone during the "flood year"


LOL

Quote

(6) Layers should have SOME animals in them jumbled up *everywhere* dave. There should be dinos with modern rhinos, with deinotheriums and giant sloths, with Devonian amphibians...yet we don't see that. "Hydraulic sorting" won't do, Dave..or claims that mammals are "more mobile"--  this is utter nonsense. Why are certain species of animals (fossilized trilobites) found in the lowermost layers, while others of the same approximate size and shape (fossilized clams) can be found at the top layers, even at the top of Mt. Everest? Did the clams outrun the trilobites in the race uphill from the flood waters?


Earthquakes and volcanoes moved everything around.

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(7) Where did all that sediment come from? (Hint: it didn't wash down from the mountains) Where did it go?


Why not?  The sediment probably came from where it always comes....somewhere else.

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(8) Where did all that water in your ‘global flood run-off’---run off to?


The oceans, before that they were empty as it didn't rain before the flood (which is why there were no rainbows).

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(9) Explain the presence of eolian and evaporite deposits between fluvial or marine deposits, carbonate and dolomite deposits, coal, and why there are clear cycles of regression and transgression present in the rock record allowing for things like sequence stratigraphy to be done.


I don't think that's even english, you're just making stuff up now.

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(10) Why are large shale formations consistently oxidized and red while others are consistently black and unoxidized?


Because God likes many colors.

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(11) How did the Mile-High cliffs of the Grand Canyon harden enough in ONE YEAR so that they didn't SLUMP under the weight of the deposits over them?


A miracle!  More proof of God's tremendous power.

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(12) If there was extensive volcanic activity following the flood, why are there no large ash layers or igneous layers in the upper Canyon stratigraphy showing it?


Probably alot of tornadoes and hurricanes as well, the layers got spread out all over the place.

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(13) Explain PRECISELY  how the incised meanders, oxbows and the steep sides of the Grand Canyon were formed, given that these meanders are not in Mississipian-type soils, but through rock, including the igneous/metamorphic base schist,granite & basalt? (obviously , that is not "soft ")    


Uh....Dave....little help here.....

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(15) You said that there was only one land mass before the Flood, correct? this would mean that Africa and North America moved away from each other at the rate of 1 kilometer per HOUR per the Morris/Austin scenarios, Dave. What would that heat do? Where did that energy go? Why do we still have ANY oceans?


What happened to question 14?

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(16) Why on earth do you want living dinosaurs in your timeline at the end of the flood ? When did they die out?


Everyone likes dinosaurs.  Plus there had to be something for all the single pair of animals to eat otherwise all the good ones that God really loved would have starved.  I'm sure Noah was nice and chopped up some of the larger dinosaurs for things like lions that wouldn't really have had a chance of taking down a t-rex.

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(17)Why don't we see evidence of fast sea-floor spreading paleomagnetically? Remember, Africa and the Americas have to be FLYING away from each other at the rate of 1 kilometer PER HOUR


This is really just a rephrasing of question 15.  Already answered.

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(18)Why don't we see evidence of your massive flood and "tsunamis" in the deep-sea cores?


More lies, how do these mythical deep-sea cores tell us anything about tsunamis.

Quote

(19)Why don't we see evidence of your massive volcanic activity, and carbon dioxide levels and HEAT in the ice cores?


Evidence of heat in the ice cores?  Heat...in ice cores....you're obviously smoking crack if you think you can learn anything about carbon dioxide or heat from ice.

Quote

(20)Why don't we see disruption of the varves?


What the #### is a varve?  Well if I don't understand something it obviously isn't very good evidence.

Having thus refruted your pathetic list of questions I expect all of y'all to convert and come to church on sunday (and I mean a christian church, not one of those that worship weird gods with 6 arms and stuff).

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:)

  
stevestory



Posts: 8870
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,13:20   

Diogenes, you are hereby awarded the Distinguished Medal of Somethingorother, for work in the field of creationist impersonation. You totally nailed it with that pseudoAFDave comment.

   
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,14:07   

**Tugs frantically at Diogenes' face** WHY.. won't this ...MASK come...OFF!!!!?!?!?! I KNOW it's YOU, DAVE!!!!!

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AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
stevestory



Posts: 8870
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,14:56   

are you a quack?

By my brief reading, AFDave scores on 2, 4, 7, 8, 10, 12, 16, 17, 18, 21, 22, and 23.

   
ericmurphy



Posts: 2460
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,15:53   

Quote (Diogenes @ July 07 2006,18:00)
Since dave will be away on vacation I thought I'd take a crack at the open question list:


Currently Unanswered Questions from the last 5 "Pages"  etc.

Wow. You've managed to produce more—and better—answers in a matter of minutes than AF Dave has managed to produce in three weeks.

And seriously, I doubt Dave's answers (assuming he ever, ever comes up with any) are any more grounded in reality than yours are.

Congrats all around.

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2006 MVD award for most dogged defense of scientific sanity

"Atheism is a religion the same way NOT collecting stamps is a hobby." —Scott Adams

  
ericmurphy



Posts: 2460
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,16:05   

Quote (stevestory @ July 07 2006,19:56)
are you a quack?

Bill should definitely read this link. I recommend cross-posting it to the "Geocentrism" thread.

The fact that, unlike most of the people the author is talking about, Bill seems to know some math doesn't seem to be helping him.

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2006 MVD award for most dogged defense of scientific sanity

"Atheism is a religion the same way NOT collecting stamps is a hobby." —Scott Adams

  
Henry J



Posts: 4041
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,19:26   

Re "answer" to 15: "What happened to question 14?"
Re "answer" to 17: "This is really just a rephrasing of question 15.  Already answered."

:D  :p  :D

  
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,19:48   

Ah, scheisse. Okay, question 14 is buried under the Coconinos for future generations to discover and wonder at.  :p

And by the way, the correct AirHead answer to #(7) "Where did all that sediment come from?"  is --
The same place socks go to.

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it. D@mn Darweenians.

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AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
ericmurphy



Posts: 2460
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 07 2006,20:40   

Quote (Henry J @ July 08 2006,00:26)
Re "answer" to 15: "What happened to question 14?"
Re "answer" to 17: "This is really just a rephrasing of question 15.  Already answered."

I don't know if this was intentional or not (actually, I'm sure it was), but it's an absolutely brilliant parody of Dave's "debating" style.

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2006 MVD award for most dogged defense of scientific sanity

"Atheism is a religion the same way NOT collecting stamps is a hobby." —Scott Adams

  
Faid



Posts: 1143
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2006,09:02   

Hey, does anyone still have dave's pic? It's down for some reason, and I can't remember exactly, but I think that the two angles looked different somehow. Were they actually from the same formation?

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A look into DAVE HAWKINS' sense of honesty:

"The truth is that ALL mutations REDUCE information"

"...mutations can add information to a genome.  And remember, I have never said that this is not possible."

  
Faid



Posts: 1143
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2006,14:34   

Quote (stevestory @ July 07 2006,19:56)
are you a quack?

By my brief reading, AFDave scores on 2, 4, 7, 8, 10, 12, 16, 17, 18, 21, 22, and 23.

Also 3, 5, 11, 13 ("one half of a lousy percent?"), 14 (with 11, the whole 'flud' argument), 15 ("did you buy the books already?"), 24, 25 and 26 (oh I know he doesn't say it, but boy does he think it... remember that gross "truck jumping the lane and crashing your skull" attempt of a 'joke'?)

--------------
A look into DAVE HAWKINS' sense of honesty:

"The truth is that ALL mutations REDUCE information"

"...mutations can add information to a genome.  And remember, I have never said that this is not possible."

  
Occam's Aftershave



Posts: 1476
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2006,17:45   

Off topic for deadman_932

Hey DM, since you seem to be the most knowledgeable here on Native American anthropology - what's the latest inside dope on Kennewick man?

Last I read, in 2004 the scientific community was granted the legal right to study the remains.  I see where the East Benton County Museum in Kennewick, Wash., opened a Kennewick Man exhibit in Jan. of this year.

Are any of the Northwest tribe still fighting legal battles, or (hopefully) was a good compromise reached for all?  Has anyone done a facial reconstruction of the skull?  Any further results from any DNA testing?

Thanks for any info you might have.

- OA

ETA:  Scratch the facial reconstruction question.  I just found the Tom McClelland site here.  Cool stuff!

http://www.tom-mcclelland.com/360KennewickMan.htm

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JoeG: And by eating the cake you are consuming the information- some stays with you and the rest is waste.

  
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 08 2006,18:50   

The DNA...well, it was agreed that Yale, UC Davis and Michigan would try to see if they could get any DNA from the bones, but no samples were found that could be amplified or otherwise analyzed.  http://www.cr.nps.gov/archeology/kennewick/tuross_kolman.htm

The remains are still at the Burke Museum in Washington, the Umatilla still want to press for reburial, but they're not exactly rich -- so the 4 tribes involved  declined a SCOTUS appeal.... and so far, I don't think anyone's tried to get DNA from the dental material. It's as bad as the Floresensis stuff  ???

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AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
Faid



Posts: 1143
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 09 2006,13:06   

Davey come back
Any kind of fool could see
There was nothing
That made any sense about you

Davey come back
You can blame it all on AiG
We were wrong
And it's just no fun without you

We were wrong
And it's just no fuuuuuun....

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A look into DAVE HAWKINS' sense of honesty:

"The truth is that ALL mutations REDUCE information"

"...mutations can add information to a genome.  And remember, I have never said that this is not possible."

  
JonF



Posts: 571
Joined: Feb. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 11 2006,14:20   

Quote (afdave @ July 03 2006,07:02)
"Much study has been devoted to the subject of the mechanics of meandering rivers, since it inbolbes engineering problems of considerable importance.  In particular, extensive model tests have demonstrated that the phenomenon of meandering is associated only with non-resistant banks." [***** Did you hear that?  NON-RESISTANT BANKS *****] (Joseph F. Friedkin: [i]"A Laboratory Study of the Meanderings of Alluvial Rivers," Vicksburg, U.S. Waterways Experiment Station, Mississippi River Commission, 1945.) (Quoted in TGF, p.154)  

Bottom line here:  DEEP CUT MEANDERS = SOFT RIVER BEDS = GLOBAL FLOOD RUNOFF.  You simply don't get this type of incised meanders in solid rock eroded over millions of years.  Sorry!  Long Agers lose!

"Meanders", Davie-doodles.  Not "incised meanders".  Whiffed agin.  Deep cut meanders with steep sides = erosion of hard rock = long age.

  
JonF



Posts: 571
Joined: Feb. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 11 2006,14:27   

Quote (afdave @ July 05 2006,07:15)
You asked me about incised meanders IN ROCK and I gave you a study about incised meanders IN SOFT MUD.  

Here's the deal ... I assumed (wrongly) that you guys understand that the Grand Canyon WAS SOFT MUD during the Flood Period ... silly me ... of course you don't understand that ... you don't believe the Flood happened.

OK, so let's try this again ...

1) Creationist theory says that the sedimentary layers of the Canyon were formed during the Inundation Phase of the Flood.
2) The canyons were cut during the Receding Phase of the Flood, upon breakage of natural dams and the subsequent release of large volumes of water
3) The canyons were cut very rapidly because the sediments were still soft

Nope, Davie-pie.  The walls are too steep.  Erosion of soft rock yields approximately 45 degree wals.  Erosion of hard rock yields 80-90 degree walls.  The Grand Canyon walls are 80-90 degrees.  The Grand Canyon and its meanders were not cut in soft sediments

  
JonF



Posts: 571
Joined: Feb. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 11 2006,14:33   

Quote (afdave @ July 05 2006,10:17)
Quote
How did the Mile-High cliffs of the Grand Canyon harden enough in ONE YEAR so that they didn't SLUMP under the weight of the deposits over them?
I would guess it happened much the same way as the Toutle River canyon at Mt Saint Helens.

Nope, Davie-dido.  The Toutle River "canyon" never hardened, and looks nothing like the Grand Canyon.  SonClad: Here's your place for Grand Canyon talk.

  
JonF



Posts: 571
Joined: Feb. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: July 11 2006,14:38   

Quote (afdave @ July 05 2006,10:55)
Schizophrenia ... gimme a break ...

Let me walk you through this ...

1) Lyell (a lawyer) comes up with Uniformitarianism
2) All the geologists buy into it ... God only knows why!
3) Now all the geologists are jumping the Uniformitarian ship
4) They have to come up with another paradigm, but they CANNOT BEAR THE THOUGHT of being associated with those "YEC Fundies"
5) So they come up with "Catastrophism" and "Episodicity" being very careful to make sure they say that they think there were MANY events like this, so as not to sound like Bible Thumpers.
6) Uniformitarianism has been rejected just as Creos predicted
7) What makes you think the MULTIPLE EVENTS will not also be rejected ??

This is what Creationists predict ... !!!

You have the typical erroneous creationist caricature idea of "uniformitarianism'.  From Why is uniformitarianim still taught?:

Quote
As a matter of fact, uniformitarianism as defined by Lyell is no longer practiced by geologists and other scientists and, in reality, ***not*** what is being taught in textbooks. Uniformitarianism, as defined by Lyell, consists of four principles:

1. uniformity of law

2. uniformity of process (actualism)

3. uniformity of rate (gradualism)

4. uniformity of state (steady-statism)

Darwin's theory of evolution directly contradicts Charles Lyell's principle 4. In the Tenth edition of his "Principles" in 1866, Lyell began to waver in his support of principle number 4 and by 1872, in the 11th edition of "Principles", Lyell had completely abandoned it. Thus, by 1872, Lyell had ceased to be a strict " uniformitarianist" as he originally defined it and conceded that uniformitarianism, as originally defined by all 4 principles wasn't a workable concept.

Since then, the major fight has been over whether principle number 3, "uniformity of rate" (gradualism), as a valid principle. This discussion was and continues to be muddied by many people, including geologists, who have repeatedly confuse gradualism with uniformitarianism as originally defined by Lyell and also confuse actualism with gradualism. Episodic geologic processes, such as meteorite impacts, eruptions of flood basalts, periods of rapid sea floor spreading as during the Cretaceous, and so forth have shown principle of gradualism to be invalid. In fact, the recognition of mass extinctions within the geologic record refuted the application of principle no. 3, gradualism, to evolutionary processes, even before Lyell died. Charles Darwin didn't accept uniformitarianism, as strictly defined by Lyell, because Darwin disputed both uniformity of rate (no. 3) and uniformity of state (no. 4) as it applied to evolution. At this point in time, the vast majority of geologists only accept 1.) uniformity of law and 2.) uniformity of process (actualism) out of Lyell's four original principles of uniformitarianism. Given that conventional geologists have currently abandoned half of the principles of uniformitarianism as propose by Lyell, it is unscientific to claim that conventional geologists of being dogmatic supporters of uniformitarianism as originally defined by Lyell. (A fun book on this topic to read is "Catastrophism" by Richard Huggett.)

There's more, that's well worth reading.

  
k.e



Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 12 2006,05:49   

Trust half a D*** to come up with a 130 year old discredited piece of wishful thinking.

Now 1/2 a D makes the plainly false rhetorical and therefore an an appeal to the truly stupid, claim by Biblical literalistists that the genealogy of the "One true word of FOG" proves (in a totally scienti-fickle sense u understand) that the age of DOF's world is around 6000 somethings, give or take, but if D divided by 2 actually did a  genealogy on every human on DOG's green rock he would find that the time line traces back to well over a 100,000 years otherwise Kane and Able would have to have had something like 500,000 children each.

Now I know in fractional D's world that is not an impossibility, but everyone should know that even though each man could theoretically impregnate every single women on earth with each ejaculation the reality is there are not enough boxes of chocolate and bottles of cheap wine that one man could accumulate in his short pre Christian life time to make that a certainty.

On the other hand (no pun intended..oh OK pun intended) if Kane was a Gene Simmonds look alike and he had a rock band and didn't wear condoms he may have been able to get it up, with a respectable frequency, producing a vast Asiatic and African offspring, but the returned rings and letters by village scribes may have shortened his romantic and thus procreatic career.

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The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

   
Occam's Aftershave



Posts: 1476
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 12 2006,06:35   

Quote
Trust half a D*** to come up with a 130 year old discredited piece of wishful thinking.

Now 1/2 a D makes the plainly false rhetorical and therefore an an appeal to the truly stupid, claim by Biblical literalistists that the genealogy of the "One true word of FOG" proves (in a totally scienti-fickle sense u understand) that the age of DOF's world is around 6000 somethings, give or take, but if D divided by 2 actually did a  genealogy on every human on DOG's green rock he would find that the time line traces back to well over a 100,000 years otherwise Kane and Able would have to have had something like 500,000 children each.

Now I know in fractional D's world that is not an impossibility, but everyone should know that even though each man could theoretically impregnate every single women on earth with each ejaculation the reality is there are not enough boxes of chocolate and bottles of cheap wine that one man could accumulate in his short pre Christian life time to make that a certainty.

On the other hand (no pun intended..oh OK pun intended) if Kane was a Gene Simmonds look alike and he had a rock band and didn't wear condoms he may have been able to get it up, with a respectable frequency, producing a vast Asiatic and African offspring, but the returned rings and letters by village scribes may have shortened his romantic and thus procreatic career.


<OA slips into loony AFDave mode>

Ha!  Just look at Wilt Chamberlain.  He claims to have slept with over 10,000 women in his day, and he didn't even live to be 900 years old like many of the patriarchs!  How many chicks do you think those old guys could have scored in 900 years?!?!  Therefore it would be possible for my Biblical population model to be correct!! You Evos can't disprove it, so it must be true!!

</loony AFDave mode>





Wow, it hurts to type stupidity like that.  Wonder how Davie manages?

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JoeG: And by eating the cake you are consuming the information- some stays with you and the rest is waste.

  
Shirley Knott



Posts: 148
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 12 2006,06:40   

It's easy -- religion is the opiate, so Dave is blissful and painfree.  Sadly, this opiate not only numbs his pain, it numbs his mind.

hugs,
Shirley Knott

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 12 2006,12:48   

An interesting tidbit that Janie Belle linked to on her website:

http://www.cnn.com/2006....ex.html

Obviously these animals are only a couple thousand years old rather than the 10-20 million years that the Atheist Liberal Scientists say they are, but I wonder whether the fanged kangaroos were on Noah's ark or whether they drowned in the Flood.

Oh Dave, come back from vacation and clear it all up for us!

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"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5377
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 13 2006,11:16   

Is this idiot scumbag still around?  I'd have thought he'd have been smart enough to go away by now.

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Lou FCD is still in school, so we should only count him as a baby biologist. -carlsonjok -deprecated
I think I might love you. Don't tell Deadman -Wolfhound

Work-friendly photography
NSFW photography

   
k.e



Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 13 2006,20:40   

Oh heal be Baaaaack. (time wounds all heals)

He's got the time and Lordee knows he needs wounding.

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The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

   
Occam's Aftershave



Posts: 1476
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 14 2006,18:22   

AirFarceDave is still in Mexico I presume.

Can't wait till he gets back so I can ask him if he visited any of the core drill locations for investigation of the Chicxulub crater or any of the many K/T layer research sites.   ;)

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JoeG: And by eating the cake you are consuming the information- some stays with you and the rest is waste.

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 14 2006,18:58   

Quote (Occam's Aftershave @ July 14 2006,23:22)
AirFarceDave is still in Mexico I presume.

Can't wait till he gets back so I can ask him if he visited any of the core drill locations for investigation of the Chicxulub crater or any of the many K/T layer research sites.   ;)

Mexico? Ugh, probably down in Chiapas or Oaxaca trying to strongarm the Indians into converting from being Catholics to being Southern Baptists. Poor guys.

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"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
afdave



Posts: 1619
Joined: April 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 16 2006,02:16   

GRAND CANYON ROCK FORMATION IDENTIFICATION TEST
The two pictures below were taken from different angles in the canyon.  Can you identify the name of the formation?  What is your explanation for how it formed?  How many years, what the composition is, did it form at the bottom of an ocean, etc.



Not too many people had comment on this rock formation while I was gone and I'm very interested in finding out your analysis of it.

CLASSIC QUOTES WORTH NOTING
Welles, Samuel Paul, “Fossils,” World Book Encyclopedia, vol. 7 (1978), p. 364. Welles was Research Associate, Museum of Paleontology, University of California, Berkeley.
 
Quote
“Scientists determine when fossils were formed by finding out the age of the rocks in which they lie.”

[NOTE: I have the 1993 version of World Book and it says essentially the same thing but adds the method for dating ... "Paleontologists determine how old a fossil is by measuring the radioactive isotopes in the rocks that contain the fossil."]


Welles, Samuel Paul, “Paleontology,” World Book Encyclopedia, vol. 15 (1978), p. 85.
 
Quote
“Paleontology (the study of fossils) is important in the study of geology. The age of rocks may be determined by the fossils found in them.”

[NOTE:  My 1993 version of World Book says exactly the same thing.]

OK, guys ... two HUGE things to note here ...

1) First, we have Circular Reasoning ... i.e. Fossil Age = Age of Rock in the "Fossil" article, and Age of Rock = Age of Fossil in the "Paleontology" article.

2) I thought sedimentary rocks could not be dated radiometrically ... Deadman told me that this is true of the GC layers that contain fossils.  But this article says  you CAN date sedimentary layers radiometrically.  What's up with that?


*********************************

Q & A
I have noted many of the questions from Deadman, JonF and others from the last few pages and will address them when I have more time on Monday ... I just got back from Mexico last night and I don't have long this morning ...

--------------
A DILEMMA FOR THE COMMITTED NATURALIST
A Hi-tech alien spaceship lands on earth ... DESIGNED.
A Hi-tech alien rotary motor found in a cell ... NOT DESIGNED.
http://afdave.wordpress.com/....ess.com

  
afdave



Posts: 1619
Joined: April 2006

(Permalink) Posted: July 16 2006,04:23   

I KNEW THERE HAD TO BE SOMEBODY OUT THERE WHO HAD A NICE FLOOD MODEL ...

HERE HE IS --  DR. WALT BROWN


From his website ... http://www.creationscience.com ...
   
Quote
Walt Brown received a Ph.D. in mechanical engineering from Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT) where he was a National Science Foundation Fellow. He has taught college courses in physics, mathematics, and computer science. Brown is a retired full colonel (Air Force), West Point graduate, and former Army ranger and paratrooper. Assignments during his 21 years in the military included: Director of Benet Research, Development, and Engineering Laboratories in Albany, New York; tenured associate professor at the U.S. Air Force Academy; and Chief of Science and Technology Studies at the Air War College. For much of his life, Walt Brown was an evolutionist, but after many years of study, he became convinced of the scientific validity of creation and a global flood. Since retiring from the military in 1980, Dr. Brown has been the Director of the Center for Scientific Creation and has worked full time in research, writing, and speaking on origins.


So now you have an overview of what I believed occurred during the Flood ...

Now our discussion of the Grand Canyon and other phenomena will make more sense within this framework ...

More on Tuesday (I'm gone again Monday) ...

--------------
A DILEMMA FOR THE COMMITTED NATURALIST
A Hi-tech alien spaceship lands on earth ... DESIGNED.
A Hi-tech alien rotary motor found in a cell ... NOT DESIGNED.
http://afdave.wordpress.com/....ess.com

  
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