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  Topic: Uncommonly Dense Thread 3, The Beast Marches On...< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Tracy P. Hamilton



Posts: 1239
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,15:17   

Quote (Seversky @ April 16 2011,12:04)
DeNews O'Leary gives another example, if any were needed, of the depths to which she is prepared to sink in order to spin a straightforward science story into anti-evolutionary propaganda.

The post in question refers to an article in Nature News (14 April 2011) about research into the genetics of the peppered moth:

       
Quote
Ilik Saccheri, an evolutionary biologist at the University of Liverpool, UK, and his colleagues have used molecular genetics to show that one mutation from a single ancestor causes increased dark pigment, called melanism, in the typically light-coloured moth. Their results are published today in Science1

The spin is applied by implying that this research in some way further discredits Bernard Kettlewell's research into industrial melanism in the peppered moth.  This  is supported by inserting a lengthy quote which, at first glance, might appear to be from the Nature News piece.  No other source is quoted.  In fact it comes from this article from the so-called Center for Science and Culture written by the notorious Jonathan Wells published 30 September 2002.

As with kairosfocus's omission of the final sentence of the infamous Lewontin quote, however, the final paragraph of the Nature piece is not included:

       
Quote
A greater understanding of the peppered moth's genetics will "complete the package" of research on "the best example of adaptation involving natural selection that we have", says Bruce Grant, a retired population geneticist from the College of William and Mary in Williamsburg, Virginia.



It must be Densey's IDea of providing context, having all of the text be an ideologue's opinion that basically says Nuh-uh!

--------------
"Following what I just wrote about fitness, you’re taking refuge in what we see in the world."  PaV

"The simple equation F = MA leads to the concept of four-dimensional space." GilDodgen

"We have no brain, I don't, for thinking." Robert Byers

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11110
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,15:40   

Irony meters off, folks:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-377544

Quote
233

kairosfocus

04/16/2011

2:14 am
IDC:

Please. No strawmannish or red herring antics with semantics....


Tell us about semi pseudo quasi latching weasels, Gordon.  ;)

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
sparc



Posts: 2000
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,16:00   

Quote (Richardthughes @ April 16 2011,13:47)
Quote (Freddie @ April 16 2011,13:31)
Onlookers!  This is why KF is never, ever usually given the floor at UD.  They must be desperate to have allowed him to post and he is certainly making the most of his chance to wield the gavel ...

NewsFlash

OP ~ 1770 words
#Posts in Thread = 19
#Of Posts in Thread by KF = 14
#Words in Posts from Commenters other than KF ~ 250
#Words in Posts from KF ~ 8100

Death by 1000 words ... though sadly no Lewontin reference yet.

CSI calculations from KF - 0.

i.e. no signs of intelligence in that post

--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 11110
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,16:02   

http://www.googlefight.com/index.p....tricity

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
utidjian



Posts: 185
Joined: Oct. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,16:04   

Quote (Badger3k @ April 16 2011,15:04)
Quote (utidjian @ April 16 2011,11:14)
Man that whole idcurious vs Joseph/JoeG thing on "electricity 'hates' water" is just one big facepalm.

I think I will ask Joseph since electricity hates water why does water make electricity? Why does water make more of what hates it?

(gotta keep pumping the comedy gold :D)

-DU-

Stockholm syndrome?

If electricity hates water, why does water let it go through it so easily?

Working on it....

more later.

-DU-

--------------
Being laughed at doesn't mean you're progressing along some line. It probably just means you're saying some stupid shit -stevestory

  
noncarborundum



Posts: 320
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,16:16   

Quote (OgreMkV @ April 16 2011,10:56)
 
Quote (sparc @ April 16 2011,10:29)
Oh no! Just the other day I've told my students that the founder of our institute had proven that mutations are random and appear independent of selection (Luria, S. E., Delbrück, M.: Mutations of bacteria from virus sensitivity to virus resistance. Genetics 28, 491 (1943)) and that he received the Nobel Prize for this work in 1969. I am afraid that I will not be able to continue teaching them on Monday after Jonathan Bartlett demonstrated the opposite and destroyed all what I thaught knew about genetics with a single post at UD. Since the time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God has come near I shall repent, and believe in the good news. BTW - if mutations aren't random why should we continue treating cancer?

Did you read the paper where they sequenced some cancers (prostrate I think) and found something like 200 major chromosomal mutations and several thousand point mutations.

You'd be prostrate too if you had that many mutations.

--------------
"The . . . um . . . okay, I was genetically selected for blue eyes.  I know there are brown eyes, because I've observed them, but I can't do it.  Okay?  So . . . um . . . coz that's real genetic selection, not the nonsense Giberson and the others are talking about." - DO'L

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 2264
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,16:16   

Quote (keiths @ April 16 2011,00:01)
Could someone explain to me why Denyse titled her book "Faith @ Science" instead of "Faith & Science"?  I've wondered for years.

It's her email address: Faith@Science.con

The .con boom started in the early 90s, but the bubble burst in 2005, thanks to the breathtaking inanity of those involved.

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It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

   
utidjian



Posts: 185
Joined: Oct. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,16:45   

Just trying to see how far Joseph is going to drag his not even wrong statement about water and electricity.
LINKY

To which I replied in (almost) KFian scale:
LINKY

Be interesting to see how deeply stupid Joseph is.... my guess is very very deep. I am mainly hoping for some sig worthy tardisms.

-DU-

--------------
Being laughed at doesn't mean you're progressing along some line. It probably just means you're saying some stupid shit -stevestory

  
didymos



Posts: 1828
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,17:25   

I think I know the source of Joe's ideas about water and electricity's acrimonious rivalry:



--------------
I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron
Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

  
didymos



Posts: 1828
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,17:33   

Gordon summarizes everything he's ever written on UD:
Quote
DESIGN . . .


Bonus: the post immediately prior mentions "Lewontin-Sagan a priori materialist blinkers".

--------------
I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron
Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

  
REC



Posts: 638
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 16 2011,23:54   

F Me!

Headline:

Quote
Galaxy started forming stars only 2 million years after the Big Bang?

News


Quoted text:
Quote
We have discovered a distant galaxy that began forming stars just 200 million years after the Big Bang.


Accuracy in reporting

BTW, what's with all the 'earlier than previously know' stories.....do they think they're working there way down to 6000 years (or 60, given O'Leary's precision reporting)?

  
paragwinn



Posts: 539
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,00:09   

Quote (utidjian @ April 16 2011,16:45)
Just trying to see how far Joseph is going to drag his not even wrong statement about water and electricity.
LINKY

To which I replied in (almost) KFian scale:
LINKY

Be interesting to see how deeply stupid Joseph is.... my guess is very very deep. I am mainly hoping for some sig worthy tardisms.

-DU-

crossposted at UD:
 
Quote
274

paragwinn
04/16/2011
11:04 pm

Joseph @ 238:
“Why aren’t power grids under water?”

might want to check this out:
http://tinyurl.com/3oyxadv

and:
http://tinyurl.com/3t6rsab


just for the fun of it

utidjian: your 2nd linky isnt ending up at a comment. in moderation?

--------------
All women build up a resistance [to male condescension]. Apparently, ID did not predict that. -Kristine 4-19-11
F/Ns to F/Ns to F/Ns etc. The whole thing is F/N ridiculous -Seversky on KF footnote fetish 8-20-11
Sigh. Really Bill? - Barry Arrington

  
didymos



Posts: 1828
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,02:02   

Clivebaby on The Designer:
Quote
idcurious,

Quote
If the intelligent designer did not require an intelligent designer, why does life?


This can be answered only if we knew whether the intelligent designer required design, which we cannot say, but life, we can definitely say requires design.


Is the Designer non-living then Clive?  For that matter, are you?  Because you certainly come off as though you're completely fucking brain dead.

--------------
I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron
Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

  
sparc



Posts: 2000
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,03:53   

Quote (OgreMkV @ April 16 2011,10:56)
Quote (sparc @ April 16 2011,10:29)
Oh no! Just the other day I've told my students that the founder of our institute had proven that mutations are random and appear independent of selection (Luria, S. E., Delbrück, M.: Mutations of bacteria from virus sensitivity to virus resistance. Genetics 28, 491 (1943)) and that he received the Nobel Prize for this work in 1969. I am afraid that I will not be able to continue teaching them on Monday after Jonathan Bartlett demonstrated the opposite and destroyed all what I thaught knew about genetics with a single post at UD. Since the time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God has come near I shall repent, and believe in the good news. BTW - if mutations aren't random why should we continue treating cancer?

Did you read the paper where they sequenced some cancers (prostrate I think) and found something like 200 major chromosomal mutations and several thousand point mutations.

I read about the paper but I don't have access to it in the momment. Anyway, is it really surprising to find certain mutations in a certain kind of tumor? If one of the a patient's experienced another initial mutation other cancers may may have had developed (e.g., BRCA1 in breast cancer, APC in colorectal cancer).

--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
PTET



Posts: 133
Joined: Jan. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,04:46   

idcurious has been silently banned, with some posts vanished. The UD regulars are clucking away how he's run off leaving their points unanswered. Just another day in that vacuum of intellect and integrity which is Uncommon Descent.

His life is archived here, mainly because it will annoy Clive.

Apologies to anyone who sat through it. Sorry too, Sparc, that IDC didn't get to reference the 1969 Nobel Prize. It was next on his list.

Hello again Onlookers. It's been a while since I de-lurked.

--------------
"It’s not worth the effort to prove the obvious. Ridiculous ideas don’t deserve our time.
Even the attempt to formulate ID is a generous accommodation." - ScottAndrews

   
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,05:13   

Quote (PTET @ April 17 2011,10:46)
idcurious has been silently banned, with some posts vanished. The UD regulars are clucking away how he's run off leaving their points unanswered. Just another day in that vacuum of intellect and integrity which is Uncommon Descent.

His life is archived here, mainly because it will annoy Clive.

Apologies to anyone who sat through it. Sorry too, Sparc, that IDC didn't get to reference the 1969 Nobel Prize. It was next on his list.

Hello again Onlookers. It's been a while since I de-lurked.

That was a very nice run.

Here's one to another brave fallen sock!

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
MichaelJ



Posts: 462
Joined: June 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,06:20   

Quote (REC @ April 17 2011,14:54)
F Me!

Headline:

Quote
Galaxy started forming stars only 2 million years after the Big Bang?

News


Quoted text:
Quote
We have discovered a distant galaxy that began forming stars just 200 million years after the Big Bang.


Accuracy in reporting

BTW, what's with all the 'earlier than previously know' stories.....do they think they're working there way down to 6000 years (or 60, given O'Leary's precision reporting)?

Isn't is an example of science is wrong again, therefore Jesus.

  
lkeithlu



Posts: 321
Joined: Feb. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,06:29   

Quote (PTET @ April 17 2011,04:46)
idcurious has been silently banned, with some posts vanished. The UD regulars are clucking away how he's run off leaving their points unanswered. Just another day in that vacuum of intellect and integrity which is Uncommon Descent.

His life is archived here, mainly because it will annoy Clive.

Apologies to anyone who sat through it. Sorry too, Sparc, that IDC didn't get to reference the 1969 Nobel Prize. It was next on his list.

Hello again Onlookers. It's been a while since I de-lurked.

It appears that I have been too. My last post has been in moderation now for 48 hours. Without the courtesy of an official bannination.

  
Seversky



Posts: 441
Joined: June 2010

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,08:54   

Quote (lkeithlu @ April 17 2011,06:29)
 
Quote (PTET @ April 17 2011,04:46)
idcurious has been silently banned, with some posts vanished. The UD regulars are clucking away how he's run off leaving their points unanswered. Just another day in that vacuum of intellect and integrity which is Uncommon Descent.

His life is archived here, mainly because it will annoy Clive.

Apologies to anyone who sat through it. Sorry too, Sparc, that IDC didn't get to reference the 1969 Nobel Prize. It was next on his list.

Hello again Onlookers. It's been a while since I de-lurked.

It appears that I have been too. My last post has been in moderation now for 48 hours. Without the courtesy of an official bannination.

Methinks they are weasels.

  
Bob O'H



Posts: 2264
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,09:08   

Moderation is often slow over the weekend, so I wouldn't worry about a long pause. Well, not yet.

--------------
It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

   
utidjian



Posts: 185
Joined: Oct. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,09:23   

Thanks paragwinn. I guess I finally tweaked someone over there enough to warrant a mod-hammer-waiting-room-whatever thing.

From he awaiting moderation room:
Quote

273

utidjian

04/16/2011

9:52 pm
Your comment is awaiting moderation.

Joseph: If you mean the links at #257 then, sure, I did read them. They do not support your claim that electricity hates water. They do not support your claim at all. They do the exact opposite. Electricity, apparently, loves water. We just may not like (even hate) it that it does.

As far as ID and religion are concerned… they sure do seem to like each other… a lot, though we may not like it that they do.


So there.

I wonder how their moderation system works over there. Must be a real PITA to keep tabs on all of it. Can you imagine what it would be like if all the moderated posts were like KFs? Do the UDders even read KFs stuff?

-DU-

--------------
Being laughed at doesn't mean you're progressing along some line. It probably just means you're saying some stupid shit -stevestory

  
J-Dog



Posts: 4402
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,10:50   

Quote
Do the UDders even read KFs stuff?


Nobody sane reads DUM of TALKY's stuff.

--------------
Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
didymos



Posts: 1828
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,11:02   

Quote (J-Dog @ April 17 2011,08:50)
Quote
Do the UDders even read KFs stuff?


Nobody sane reads DUM of TALKY's stuff.

So, you're saying they all read them then?

--------------
I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron
Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

  
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,12:02   

Quote (didymos @ April 17 2011,17:02)
Quote (J-Dog @ April 17 2011,08:50)
Quote
Do the UDders even read KFs stuff?


Nobody sane reads DUM of TALKY's stuff.

So, you're saying they all read them then?

Point well made...

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
utidjian



Posts: 185
Joined: Oct. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,18:33   

Well looks like most of my comments in that thread regarding the love-hate relationship of electricity and water have been disappearinated.

All the ID idiocy aside.... well to be fair, it is basically ALL idiocy over at UD ALL the time... but sometimes they say something that is actually true and correct. Problem is, in their determination to appear infallible and always appear to have the upper hand re: teh Scienz they forget to clean up the blatantly stupid BS such as "wet electricity" and "electricity hating water" and hundreds (thousands?) of other idiocy that creeps into their screed over the years. In their efforts to have the appearance of superiority they end up having to defend utter crap rather than police it themselves. It is exactly the wrong way to use "moderation."

-DU-

--------------
Being laughed at doesn't mean you're progressing along some line. It probably just means you're saying some stupid shit -stevestory

  
Henry J



Posts: 5014
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,19:26   

Quote
Well looks like most of my comments in that thread regarding the love-hate relationship of electricity and water have been disappearinated.

Or sublimated.

(Or would evaporated work better in this context?)

  
steve_h



Posts: 535
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,19:48   

Quote
Well looks like most of my comments in that thread regarding the love-hate relationship of electricity and water have been disappearinated.

All the ID idiocy aside.... well to be fair, it is basically ALL idiocy over at UD ALL the time... but sometimes they say something that is actually true and correct. Problem is, in their determination to appear infallible and always appear to have the upper hand re: teh Scienz they forget to clean up the blatantly stupid BS such as "wet electricity" and "electricity hating water" and hundreds (thousands?) of other idiocy that creeps into their screed over the years. In their efforts to have the appearance of superiority they end up having to defend utter crap rather than police it themselves. It is exactly the wrong way to use "moderation."

-DU-


Also, one comment by Joseph which referred to them:
Quote
Joseph
04/15/2011
11:01 am
idcurious:

Artificial selection shows that changes can happen over relatively short timeframes. You make a bald assertion that natural selection cannot effect much larges changes over millions of years.

1- The different dog breeds would not exist in the absence of artificial selection.

2- The bald assertion is saying that nature can do something given enough time

Are you telling us that every single information process in DNA is subject to some intelligent intervention?

No intervention required. Does a programmer need to intervene to run spellchecker?

Dude, you seem to be clueless about a great many things.

  
sparc



Posts: 2000
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,21:34   

Quote (REC @ April 16 2011,13:18)
 
Quote (Zachriel @ April 16 2011,12:43)
 
Quote
Gauger and Axe respond: The excuse for shrugging it off would, I expect, be that the transition we examined isn’t actually one that anyone thinks occurred in the history of life. That’s true, but it badly misses the point.

Gauger and Axe try to evolve a cat into a dog and fail. Therefore ID.

Nah, cats and dogs are WAY more related than those two enzymes (35% Identical, 56% similar).

You may be interested in this piece:
De Kraker, J.-W.; Gershenzon, J. (2011) From amino acid to glucosinolate biosynthesis: Protein sequence changes in the evolution of methylthioalkylmalate synthase in Arabidopsis. The Plant Cell 23, 38-53.
The abstract says:
 
Quote
Methylthioalkylmalate synthase (MAM) catalyzes the committed step in the side chain elongation of Met, yielding important precursors for glucosinolate biosynthesis in Arabidopsis thaliana and other Brassicaceae species. MAM is believed to have evolved from isopropylmalate synthase (IPMS), an enzyme involved in Leu biosynthesis, based on phylogenetic analyses and an overlap of catalytic abilities. Here, we investigated the changes in protein structure that have occurred during the recruitment of IPMS from amino acid to glucosinolate metabolism. The major sequence difference between IPMS and MAM is the absence of 120 amino acids at the C-terminal end of MAM that constitute a regulatory domain for Leu-mediated feedback inhibition. Truncation of this domain in Arabidopsis IPMS2 results in loss of Leu feedback inhibition and quaternary structure, two features common to MAM enzymes, plus an 8.4-fold increase in the kcat/Km for a MAM substrate. Additional exchange of two amino acids in the active site resulted in a MAM-like enzyme that had little residual IPMS activity. Hence, combination of the loss of the regulatory domain and a few additional amino acid exchanges can explain the evolution of MAM from IPMS during its recruitment from primary to secondary metabolism.
(emphasis mine)

ETA to fix link

--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
sparc



Posts: 2000
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 17 2011,22:39   

Trough a comment on the Beckwith post at PT I've learned that Behe is still posting at UD. Unfortunately, they didn't add the viewer counter to his pages and he doesn't allow comments comments. Since I couldn't find any link to his blog on the first two AtBC topic title pages and a search for "Behe" in "posts and or all topic titles" of all open forums didn't find any recent comment I got the impression that he is currently completely ignored. Even those UD News clowns don't link to his posts.

--------------
"[...] the type of information we find in living systems is beyond the creative means of purely material processes [...] Who or what is such an ultimate source of information? [...] from a theistic perspective, such an information source would presumably have to be God."

- William Dembski -

   
k.e..



Posts: 4539
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: April 18 2011,00:41   

Quote (utidjian @ April 18 2011,02:33)
Well looks like most of my comments in that thread regarding the love-hate relationship of electricity and water have been disappearinated.

All the ID idiocy aside.... well to be fair, it is basically ALL idiocy over at UD ALL the time... but sometimes they say something that is actually true and correct. Problem is, in their determination to appear infallible and always appear to have the upper hand re: teh Scienz they forget to clean up the blatantly stupid BS such as "wet electricity" and "electricity hating water" and hundreds (thousands?) of other idiocy that creeps into their screed over the years. In their efforts to have the appearance of superiority they end up having to defend utter crap rather than police it themselves. It is exactly the wrong way to use "moderation."

-DU-

IF I WAS STILL TEH BLOG TZAR OVER THERE I WOULD TAKE JOE OUT THE BACK AND PISTOL WHIP THE STUPID CUNT.

JOE MUST BE THE GIRLIEST MAN BESIDES KF FRILL CLIVE ETC. ETC.

JOE MUST NEVER HAVE DRIVEN A CAR.

IT STARTS WITH WET ELECTRICTY. d.t.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
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