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  Topic: Conservapedia and Evolution, The same-old, same-old< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Wesley R. Elsberry



Posts: 4470
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 05 2007,03:08   

"Theory of Evolution" on Conservapedia

Over on Pharyngula, Conservapedia booster "Peter Moore" is asking for just one error to be shown in the page. But the page is a farrago of error, a veritable mishmash of every sort of misused quotation and credulous reporting of antievolutionist error. The page, though, seems to eschew taking any stance of its own that could potentially evaluated with regard to independent evidence.

Quote

Nebraska man was made famous by Henry Osborn of the American Museum of Natural History. Nebraska man turned out to be nothing more than a single pig-like tooth.


The original description was based upon two teeth. What the sidebar text above fails to note is what Osborn did next...

Quote

H.F. Osborn was involved in the original description of Hesperopithecus, which took place in 1922. Osborn organized expeditions to find more evidence. Those expeditions took place in 1925 and 1926, and they found much more evidence -- their "hominid" was really an extinct peccary. A retraction of the hominid claim resulted, which was published in Science in 1927.

Note the dates of your correspondent's references: all within the period when Hesperopithecus was considered to be valid. No references arguing validity for Hesperopithecus are given after 1927. Again, this is a great example of the self-correcting nature of science -- mistakes are corrected, not worshipped.


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"You can't teach an old dogma new tricks." - Dorothy Parker

    
Richard Simons



Posts: 425
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 05 2007,08:12   

Two things struck me about that page. First, it never actually gives a clear explanation of what the theory of evolution consists of.

Secondly, it is carefully phrased to try to avoid actually lying. However, much is misleading and there are numerous uncritical quotes of people who were telling untruths.

But never let it be said that Conservapedia does not correct itself. For example,
Quote (Conservapedia @ 15 March 2007)
The frog is a marine amphibian that hops. Some science classes dissect frogs, which is cruel to the animals involved. Voltaire did experiments on frogs circa 1766, in which he discovered that frogs hear with their legs. Also, a leg will kick if it is hit with an electrical shock, which is the scientific basis behind the reflex tests now common in doctorsí offices. Thus frogs contributed to our knowledge of Godís natural world.

has been changed to
Quote (Conservapedia @ 5 November 2007)
Frogs have often been the subject of scientific experiment, whether in high school science class dissections or Voltaire's 1766 experiments, in which he discovered that frogs hear with their legs. The discovery that a frog's leg will kick if an electrical shock is applied to it was the scientific basis behind the reflex tests now common in doctors' offices.


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All sweeping statements are wrong.

  
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 05 2007,09:17   

How did Voltaire discover frogs hear with their legs? Did he train a frog to jump on command, cut it's legs off and then noted that when it failed to jump on command conclude this was because the frog was deaf?

;-)

Louis

(I'm pretty sure Voltaire did not do this, but it would be the sort of reasoning used in Conservapedia)

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Bye.

  
J-Dog



Posts: 4361
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 05 2007,11:30   

Quote (Louis @ Nov. 05 2007,09:17)
How did Voltaire discover frogs hear with their legs? Did he train a frog to jump on command, cut it's legs off and then noted that when it failed to jump on command conclude this was because the frog was deaf?

;-)

Louis

(I'm pretty sure Voltaire did not do this, but it would be the sort of reasoning used in Conservapedia)





Louis - Through exhaustive research, I was able to locate this early Dagueratype which depicts Voltaire getting ready to experiment and hear what Kermitus Americanus will have to say about missing his ears on his legs.

BTW - †This in no way implies any steotypical comments about Jeannot's ancestory or the French in General, and I am not advocating the creation of a new thread to be called: †"My Favorite Frog Leg Recipes"

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Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
Richard Simons



Posts: 425
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 05 2007,17:51   

Quote (Louis @ Nov. 05 2007,09:17)
How did Voltaire discover frogs hear with their legs? Did he train a frog to jump on command, cut it's legs off and then noted that when it failed to jump on command conclude this was because the frog was deaf?

Galvani noticed the effect of electricity on frogs' legs, Volta provided an explanation. Voltaire seems to have had nothing to do with frogs (except possibly at the dinner table). Although grasshoppers hear with their back legs, a frog's eardrum is the large round circle just behind its eye. And the connection with the reflex test is remote.

Other than that, it's OK (they were right to remove the bit about them being marine).

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All sweeping statements are wrong.

  
Mr_Christopher



Posts: 1238
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 05 2007,18:04   

I knew conservapedia was going to hell in a handbasket the day they removed this picture:


That pic used to be on the evolution page and proved dinos and people lived together in harmony.

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Uncommon Descent is a moral cesspool, a festering intellectual ghetto that intoxicates and degrades its inhabitants - Stephen Matheson

  
J-Dog



Posts: 4361
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 05 2007,18:55   

Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Nov. 05 2007,18:04)
I knew conservapedia was going to hell in a handbasket the day they removed this picture:


That pic used to be on the evolution page and proved dinos and people lived together in harmony.

Looks like JC needed a new pair of Lizard-Skin Texas Style Cowboy Boots.

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Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
ck1



Posts: 65
Joined: Oct. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 05 2007,20:11   

Quote (Richard Simons @ Nov. 05 2007,08:12)
Two things struck me about that page. First, it never actually gives a clear explanation of what the theory of evolution consists of.

Secondly, it is carefully phrased to try to avoid actually lying.

Well, now I know where afdave gets at least some of his arguments and quote-mines. †As for lies, how about this:
† † † †
Quote
The concept of naturalistic evolution differs from the concept of Theistic Evolution in that it states God does not guide the posited process of macroevolution.

or this misrepresentation of Popper's position based on personal suspicion:
† †
Quote
Popper himself has modified his position somewhat; but, disclaimers aside, I suspect that even now he does not really believe that Darwinism in its modern form is genuinely falsifiable.

The section on the fossil record consists ENTIRELY of out of context quotes and begins and ends as follows:
† † †  
Quote
Creationists can cite quotations which assert that no solid fossil evidence for the theory of evolution position exists: <snip long list of quotemines followed by a link to more "Fossil record quotes">

Also, Walt Brown as a genetics expert.

Sarfati as an expert on all sorts of things.

Scientific legitimacy based on polls.

Prominent mention of Meyer's peer-reviewed paper (and Sternberg's martyrdom.)

They cite Jerry Bergman!

And they give numerous examples in which science was wrong and the bible was right, like this one:
Quote
For example, until the 1970s the scientific consensus on how lions killed their prey was in error and the Bible turned out to be right in this matter

And, uh oh! †the article ends with pictures of Hitler AND Stalin!

Looks like somebody put a lot of effort into this. †Sad.

  
stevestory



Posts: 8878
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 05 2007,21:24   

Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Nov. 05 2007,19:04)
I knew conservapedia was going to hell in a handbasket the day they removed this picture:


That pic used to be on the evolution page and proved dinos and people lived together in harmony.

Maybe they took it down because Jesus was a hardass Republican who would be Tough on Terror and never, ever, ride sidesaddle.

   
Mr_Christopher



Posts: 1238
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 06 2007,09:35   

Quote (stevestory @ Nov. 05 2007,21:24)
Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Nov. 05 2007,19:04)
I knew conservapedia was going to hell in a handbasket the day they removed this picture:


That pic used to be on the evolution page and proved dinos and people lived together in harmony.

Maybe they took it down because Jesus was a hardass Republican who would be Tough on Terror and never, ever, ride sidesaddle.

Yeah only a gay jesus would ride side saddle while wearing lace up sandals.

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Uncommon Descent is a moral cesspool, a festering intellectual ghetto that intoxicates and degrades its inhabitants - Stephen Matheson

  
J-Dog



Posts: 4361
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 06 2007,11:04   

Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Nov. 06 2007,09:35)
Quote (stevestory @ Nov. 05 2007,21:24)
Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Nov. 05 2007,19:04)
I knew conservapedia was going to hell in a handbasket the day they removed this picture:


That pic used to be on the evolution page and proved dinos and people lived together in harmony.

Maybe they took it down because Jesus was a hardass Republican who would be Tough on Terror and never, ever, ride sidesaddle.

Yeah only a gay jesus would ride side saddle while wearing lace up sandals.

Kind of a hawt dress JC's wearing, but some one should teach him how to accessorize.  I'm recommending DaveScot over Denyse BTW...

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Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
Mr_Christopher



Posts: 1238
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 06 2007,11:45   

Being a good darwinist I have numerous gay and lesbo friends.  Maybe I should hook jeebus up with them so he can gain some fashion sense and also learn what constitutes manly footwear.  

Even a pair of ropers would be better than those lace up sandals and that flowing dress has got to go!

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Uncommon Descent is a moral cesspool, a festering intellectual ghetto that intoxicates and degrades its inhabitants - Stephen Matheson

  
carlsonjok



Posts: 3324
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Nov. 06 2007,13:04   

Quote (J-Dog @ Nov. 06 2007,11:04)
Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Nov. 06 2007,09:35)
Quote (stevestory @ Nov. 05 2007,21:24)
 
Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Nov. 05 2007,19:04)
I knew conservapedia was going to hell in a handbasket the day they removed this picture:


That pic used to be on the evolution page and proved dinos and people lived together in harmony.

Maybe they took it down because Jesus was a hardass Republican who would be Tough on Terror and never, ever, ride sidesaddle.

Yeah only a gay jesus would ride side saddle while wearing lace up sandals.

Kind of a hawt dress JC's wearing, but some one should teach him how to accessorize. †I'm recommending DaveScot over Denyse BTW...

I don't know. The alligator handbag is very haute couture!! Or so I have been told......

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It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it. †We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

  
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