Badger3k
Posts: 861 Joined: Mar. 2008
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Quote (Cubist @ June 04 2012,12:11) | Quote (The whole truth @ June 04 2012,05:44) | WHY would PZ Meyers or anyone else take such a NON-incident and blow it so far out of proportion? |
Answer: It's not the "non-incident". Rather, it's the massive and continuing shitstorm that descended upon RW after she made the simple, calm, and (to any reasonably sane & non-sexist person) reasonable assertion "Guys, don't do that" about an incident in which she had good reason to feel creeped out. |
Well, whether she meant it that way or not, apparently people felt that she was demanding that people obey her, which ruffled feathers of men and women. While there were some assholes originally (there always will be, so why anybody was surprised I have no idea), even the people who were saying that she didn't speak for them (the women responding to her) were tarred and feathered with the MRA/mysoginist/gender-traitor/etc labels, told to shove porcupines up tender places, edited, censored, banned, and more. Debate was impossible because RW could do no wrong and spoke for everyone. Quote | Quote | Even IF it did occur... |
Yes, yes, "bitches lie." |
No, merely that the tale kept getting bigger and bigger, and more intricate, just like all other tales we see in history. They just grow into things a bit hard to swallow. The original story sounds entirely plausible, but when all the rest were added in - Rebecca's problem that seemed to develop and disappear fast - the one where she can't remember/ID faces so she knew this guy was at the talk and bar how? - it sounds suspiciously like a political move. Altering the tale to counter arguments or make it worse than it was.
Quote | Quote | And what is RW's agenda in making a public stink about something SO trivial, even IF it did actually happen? |
Again: It's not the original "non-incident", it's the shitstorm that followed. To begin with, all RW said was "Guys, don't do that"; if you think that is "raising a public stink", there's something wrong with your standards re: what constitutes a "public stink". |
This I have to agree with...to a point. The original point was trivial and not a stink, but when it blew up...virtually everything was a public stink over the further arguments, and the original points (both hers and her lack of professionalism when speaking) went to the curb.
Quote | Quote | ... there are bigger fish to fry than some allegedly ill-mannered guy in an elevator or protecting Rebecca Watson's fragile (or demanding?) sensibilities. |
Yes, there are "bigger fish to fry". Some people think that a massive and continuing outpouring of abusive remarks, up to and including rape threats and beyond, constitutes just such a "bigger fish"; other people don't seem to think said outpouring is even worth noticing. Go figure. |
Quote (cubist <!--QuoteBegin--The whole truth @ June 04 2012+05:44) | WHY would PZ Meyers or anyone else take such a NON-incident and blow it so far out of proportion? |
Answer: It's [i--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (cubist Quote (The whole truth @ June 04 2012 @ 05:44) | WHY would PZ Meyers or anyone else take such a NON-incident and blow it so far out of proportion? |
Answer: It's [i)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->not[/i] the "non-incident". Rather, it's the massive and continuing shitstorm that descended upon RW after she made the simple, calm, and (to any reasonably sane & non-sexist person) reasonable assertion "Guys, don't do that" about an incident in which she had good reason to feel creeped out.[/quote]
Well, whether she meant it that way or not, apparently people felt that she was demanding that people obey her, which ruffled feathers of men and women. While there were some assholes originally (there always will be, so why anybody was surprised I have no idea), even the people who were saying that she didn't speak for them (the women responding to her) were tarred and feathered with the MRA/mysoginist/gender-traitor/etc labels, told to shove porcupines up tender places, edited, censored, banned, and more. Debate was impossible because RW could do no wrong and spoke for everyone. Quote | Quote | Even IF it did occur... |
Yes, yes, "bitches lie." |
No, merely that the tale kept getting bigger and bigger, and more intricate, just like all other tales we see in history. They just grow into things a bit hard to swallow. The original story sounds entirely plausible, but when all the rest were added in - Rebecca's problem that seemed to develop and disappear fast - the one where she can't remember/ID faces so she knew this guy was at the talk and bar how? - it sounds suspiciously like a political move. Altering the tale to counter arguments or make it worse than it was.
Quote | Quote | And what is RW's agenda in making a public stink about something SO trivial, even IF it did actually happen? |
Again: It's not the original "non-incident", it's the shitstorm that followed. To begin with, all RW said was "Guys, don't do that"; if you think that is "raising a public stink", there's something wrong with your standards re: what constitutes a "public stink". |
This I have to agree with...to a point. The original point was trivial and not a stink, but when it blew up...virtually everything was a public stink over the further arguments, and the original points (both hers and her lack of professionalism when speaking) went to the curb.
Quote | Quote | ... there are bigger fish to fry than some allegedly ill-mannered guy in an elevator or protecting Rebecca Watson's fragile (or demanding?) sensibilities. |
Yes, there are "bigger fish to fry". Some people think that a massive and continuing outpouring of abusive remarks, up to and including rape threats and beyond, constitutes just such a "bigger fish"; other people don't seem to think said outpouring is even worth noticing. Go figure. |
If internet trolls are considered the standard for people in society, then I think we have far bigger fish than people think. If people saying mean things on the internet is the worst problem you have, then you're lucky. I think that's the point TWT is trying to make (I may be wrong, correct me if I am). There is a problem with sexism (and all the other -isms) in society, but I still am skeptical about how big it is and what might be the best way to correct that (and that affects both sides - some people just need to grow thicker skins if they want to live in the real world).
I do wonder if anyone knows of any study that can show a relationship between online interactions and real world? Do the trolls on YouTube act that way in real life, or only do it from the safety of their computer? Do they say those things because they mean it or because they want to cause a flamewar? Just curious.
ETA: I tried to quote parts, but really blew it and am not sure why, so my apologies for a messed up post.
-------------- "Just think if every species had a different genetic code We would have to eat other humans to survive.." : Joe G
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