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Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 18 2007,23:30   

Quote
Furthermore, Americans score essentially equal or much higher than Eurupeans in answering questions about science correctly with the sole exception of “humans evolved from animals”. The funny thing is that Americans might be right and the test is wrong in that regard as it’s nowhere near proven that humans evolved by chance from animals - after all, Americans get more right answers everywhere else.


When all's said and done, Dave's an idiot. "Essentially equal or much higher "?

No.

Okay, let's go down the line. 9 graphs with EU entries.

In 5 of them Europeans do better than Americans. I.e., in graphs 1, 2, & 4 in the left column, and in graphs 4 & 5 in the second column.

In 1 of them, the scores are essentially equal: #2 in the 2nd column.

In only three, do Americans score significantly higher than Europeans: #3 in the 1st column, & #1 & #3 in the second.

So Americans fail to do better than Europeans in 6 out of 9. Two thirds.

Europeans do BETTER than Americans in 5 out of 9. 55%.

So what statistic does Stinky Old Uncle Dave take away from this?

"Americans score essentially equal or much higher than Eurupeans [sic]"

"Americans get more right answers everywhere else."

Gee, Dave, how do Americans rank in accurately reading graphs? Dumbshit.

Quote
Never mind that a year ago David was flaming UD commenters who denied common descent.  


I think Uncle Dave is dropping hints that he's sliding toward being a straight Creationist. I guess he figured being an IDer wasn't wingnutty enough, and no one was taking him seriously as Mister Scientist anyway.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 18 2007,23:36   

Arden! *looks at watch* You're late!
I never see you and DaveTards post at the same time..

Hmmm... are you supertard?

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Arden Chatfield



Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 18 2007,23:43   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 18 2007,23:36)
Arden! *looks at watch* You're late!
I never see you and DaveTards post at the same time..

Hmmm... are you supertard?

I was in the same place as your mom last night, if you know what I mean and I think you do. Homo. -dt  :angry:

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

  
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,03:03   

scordova said
   
Quote
The reason part of the discussion moved here was that PandasThumb is incredibly slow in displaying long discussions (as you saw yourself).

When ever I visit, I tend to generate a swarm of nasty comments, and then their system just gets bogged down trying to display all the vitriol.

sure that's the reason sal, i'm sure it is.....
jpark320 follows up with    
Quote
I applaud you Sal,

I just went over there and saw the merciless (and logically weak) attacks they made on you.

Keep it up.

logically weak is sal's forte!
DS cannot read a graph! Classic Tard!
And the book is back!


another day, another $$$.  
Quote
PS Two books relevant to this discussion by ID proponents are Genetic Entropy by respected Cornell geneticist John Sanford.

edit: Just spotted this Jem from Sal:
Quote


Dave,

One might look at the number of enrollments in biology curriculums and their correlation with the ascendancy of ID. My cursory look suggests a correlation. It demonstrates Brian Alters was wrong about ID’s effect on science.

Sal

ascendancy? Perhaps in bizzaro land, BUT NOT IN THIS REALITY SAL!
Quote
ascendancy–noun
the state of being in the ascendant; governing or controlling influence; domination.
n.   Superiority or decisive advantage; domination
the state that exists when one person or group has power over another;

might want to check what the words mean next time you use then Sal! ascendancy! LOL

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
Altabin



Posts: 308
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,03:50   

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Jan. 19 2007,10:03)

God, the cover-illustrations on these ID books.  Why not just put on a big f3cking sticker saying "Self-published"?

--------------

  
nuytsia



Posts: 131
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,04:01   

[quote=phonon,Jan. 18 2007,17:12][/quote]
 
Quote
Wolves were bred to become almost all the domestic dog breeds we see today.


Actually Darren Naish had an interesting post on this subject in October. Controversial origins of domestic dogs
Things might not be that black and white. Well worth a read.

edit:

Quote (GCT @ Jan. 18 2007,20:48)
No way!  Eden had plants made of meat for the carnivores?  That would have been soooooooo cool.


Yep! Sausage trees. You also have breadfruits, which goes to prove that the sausage sandwich is god's chosen food. Sadly there doesn't appear to be a brown sauce tree, so god was close but no cigar.

Quote
Oh, and I guess a plant being eaten doesn't count as something dying?  I think the tard just overflowed, better go get the plunger.


Yes and I suspect eating insects wasn't sinful either. What were anteaters eating? Tree sap? And what about swallows and martins?

   
Zachriel



Posts: 2723
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,07:14   

ludwig (#11)  
Quote
A random mutation shows up with a given probability per organism, so the same fraction of the population will bear the mutation regardless of how large the population is.

DaveScot (#12)      
Quote
That’s so hopelessy wrong I hardly know where to begin. I think you need to find a different blog.

It's not so much DaveScot's profound ignorance, but his bullying threats.

--------------

You never step on the same tard twice—for it's not the same tard and you're not the same person.

   
Zachriel



Posts: 2723
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,07:26   

And a bit of irony from scordova, a.k.a. Sal (#4)
Quote
The reason part of the discussion moved here was that PandasThumb is incredibly slow in displaying long discussions (as you saw yourself).


--------------

You never step on the same tard twice—for it's not the same tard and you're not the same person.

   
Mike PSS



Posts: 428
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,07:55   

Didn't we have this same go-around with AFDave recently?
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1974

I think caligula should ask if Sal understands alleles.

If the UD trend continues they might as well invite Bro.Randy from teens-4-christ to start commenting.  I'm sure his insights will help Sal with the ID arguments too.
Quote (Bro.Randy @ Jan 11 2007, 08:45 PM)
When God created the stars, He could have created them with their light already in place. I am not God, and I cannot explain how He did it. I can say, however, that whenever science disagrees with the Bible, the scientist is wrong or has misunderstood something.

At least Bro.Randy is humble and admits he's not god.  :)

  
jujuquisp



Posts: 129
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,08:00   

New Tardative posted!!!
Quote


13

DaveScot

01/19/2007

4:44 am

El Klone

"Although I agree with the point of your post, that greater acceptance of ID can be considered an indicator of scientific literacy, your assessment of the NSF statistic was not quite right."

Point taken. However, if you add up the percentages for the US for each of the 9 literacy questions excluding evolution then take the average, and do the same for EU, the U.S. comes out slightly higher.

So it IS essentially equal with a slight U.S. lead if all 9 questions are given equal weight. Keep in mind if we consider the opener a valid question and add that into the equation “Is astrology science?” then the U.S. gets a wider lead in the average.

I would guess I unconsciously weighted the questions differently such that being way more right about Astrology not being science is better than being a little more right about continental drift. Or that being way more right about the nature of radioactivity and antibiotics is more important than being a little more right about sperm determining the sex of a child or the center of the earth being very hot. The relative importance of the questions biased my conclusion.


DaveTard, you are simply unbelievable.  Learn how to read graphs properly and quit LYING.  You are a blatant LIAR and are a DISGRACE.  You have NO credibility except amongst the DEMBSKIISTS.  Your explanations to any rational person are ABSURD and PATHETIC.  You make me NAUSEOUS.

  
franky172



Posts: 160
Joined: Jan. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,08:25   

<b>Patrick</b> Has chosen to respond to my post here: http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1968.

Since I've been banned from the thread for explaining how biologists use the word "random", I'm forced to reply here.

<b>Patrick</b>
<i>As in, there are no intermediates? If so, thanks for making my point for me.</i>

Yes.  This is what I've stated elsewhere re: the sparsity of the english language as a the number of letters in a word gets large.  What exactly do you believe that this shows?

I'll repeat my previous question: Do we agree that the results indicate a 10^6 fold performance increase for blind darwininian search over exhaustive searches?

  
k.e



Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,08:25   

Quote (jujuquisp @ Jan. 19 2007,08:00)
New Tardative posted!!!
 
Quote


13

DaveScot

01/19/2007

4:44 am

El Klone

"Although I agree with the point of your post, that greater acceptance of ID can be considered an indicator of scientific literacy, your assessment of the NSF statistic was not quite right."

Point taken. However, if you add up the percentages for the US for each of the 9 literacy questions excluding evolution then take the average, and do the same for EU, the U.S. comes out slightly higher.

So it IS essentially equal with a slight U.S. lead if all 9 questions are given equal weight. Keep in mind if we consider the opener a valid question and add that into the equation “Is astrology science?” then the U.S. gets a wider lead in the average.

I would guess I unconsciously weighted the questions differently such that being way more right about Astrology not being science is better than being a little more right about continental drift. Or that being way more right about the nature of radioactivity and antibiotics is more important than being a little more right about sperm determining the sex of a child or the center of the earth being very hot. The relative importance of the questions biased my conclusion.


DaveTard, you are simply unbelievable.  Learn how to read graphs properly and quit LYING.  You are a blatant LIAR and are a DISGRACE.  You have NO credibility except amongst the DEMBSKIISTS.  Your explanations to any rational person are ABSURD and PATHETIC.  You make me NAUSEOUS.

And you know what juju?
He knows it and loves it.
He is irrelevant except to himself.

Wasn't it Flaubert who said "If you want to feel rich surround yourself with poor people"

excuse me while I translate that for DT


"If you want to feel smart DT surround yourself with stupid people"

Flaubert also said     “Language is a cracked kettle on which we beat out tunes for bears to dance to, while all the time we long to move the stars to pity.”

I see my sig changing soon.

--------------
The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

   
Mike PSS



Posts: 428
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,09:31   

Quote (jujuquisp @ Jan. 19 2007,09:00)
New Tardative posted!!!
 
Quote


13

DaveScot

01/19/2007

4:44 am

El Klone

"Although I agree with the point of your post, that greater acceptance of ID can be considered an indicator of scientific literacy, your assessment of the NSF statistic was not quite right."

Point taken. However, if you add up the percentages for the US for each of the 9 literacy questions excluding evolution then take the average, and do the same for EU, the U.S. comes out slightly higher.

So it IS essentially equal with a slight U.S. lead if all 9 questions are given equal weight. Keep in mind if we consider the opener a valid question and add that into the equation “Is astrology science?” then the U.S. gets a wider lead in the average.

I would guess I unconsciously weighted the questions differently such that being way more right about Astrology not being science is better than being a little more right about continental drift. Or that being way more right about the nature of radioactivity and antibiotics is more important than being a little more right about sperm determining the sex of a child or the center of the earth being very hot. The relative importance of the questions biased my conclusion.


DaveTard, you are simply unbelievable.  Learn how to read graphs properly and quit LYING.  You are a blatant LIAR and are a DISGRACE.  You have NO credibility except amongst the DEMBSKIISTS.  Your explanations to any rational person are ABSURD and PATHETIC.  You make me NAUSEOUS.

Good find batboy.

I think DaveTard is in Six Sigma Black Belt the way he manipulates those statistics to make his coherent point.

I wonder if Dembski, the PhD mathametician and owner of the blog, approves of this type of analysis?

  
slpage



Posts: 349
Joined: June 2004

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,09:34   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 18 2007,15:24)
Sal Adds:

 
Quote
3

scordova

01/18/2007

4:17 pm
The only ones not qualified to evaluate evolutionary claims objectively are evolutionary biologists. They have a nasty reputation of resisting criticism from other fields.

In contrast, I can’t imagine physicians and engineers resisting criticism from any of the hard science or math. I can’t imagine physicists and chemists and computer scientists telling mathematicians to buzz off. That is unheard of!

Evolutionary biologists seem to have a regular habit of resisting valid criticism from other scientific disciplines….




So what happened here them Sal?

Among Cordova's many other problems - his dishonesty,his basic incompetence, etc. - is his inability to tell the difference between valid criticisms and the uninformed bilge tossed out by creationists with math, law, engineering, etc. degrees.

Any old garbage, Sally old boy, is NOT in fact a valid criticism.

Like, for example, using "toy examples" (Cordova's actual words) of strings of only 8 characters to "prove" that "time erases hierarchies."  Why, amazingly, Cordova was able to "prove" this by using his amazing 8-character string, "mutating" one character each generation, and in only 8 generations, he 'erased' the 'molecular' hierarchy that did not even exist in the first place...

What a 'tard.

  
Zachriel



Posts: 2723
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,09:54   

Quote (slpage @ Jan. 19 2007,09:34)
Like, for example, using "toy examples" (Cordova's actual words) of strings of only 8 characters to "prove" that "time erases hierarchies."  Why, amazingly, Cordova was able to "prove" this by using his amazing 8-character string, "mutating" one character each generation, and in only 8 generations, he 'erased' the 'molecular' hierarchy that did not even exist in the first place...

I looked for that, but could not find it. Do you have a link?

By the way, if you like toy hierarchies, I have devised a simple experiment along those lines, Zachriel's Nest of Letters. Even with just a few letters, Zachriel's Nest of Letters shows how neutral evolution can result in easily discernable nested hierarchies after several generations. It also shows when we might be able to predict the existence of intermediaries and the possible limitations of reconstructing the history of such a descent.

--------------

You never step on the same tard twice—for it's not the same tard and you're not the same person.

   
slpage



Posts: 349
Joined: June 2004

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,09:57   

Quote (Faid @ Jan. 18 2007,17:58)
Quote (jujuquisp @ Jan. 18 2007,16:47)
Being an anesthesiologist and dealing with these guys on a daily basis, orthopods usually are recruited from the best and the brightest in med school but they are FAR from the brightest docs in the OR.  We frequently joke in the OR about their neanderthalic qualities and exchange stories on a regular basis regarding their complete idiocy in dealing with matters outside of bones.  I had a friggin orthopod consult me on a patient with a serum potassium of 3.4 (normally 3.5 to 5.0) once at 6pm.  I told him to go read a textbook and deal with it himself.  I also told him not to consult me at 6pm unless it was an emergency.  I could go on and on about orthopods but I think I'll desist.  It is one of the reasons I am looking for a different hospital---too many orthopods here.  Dr. Cook needs to keep quiet about issues he knows nothing about before he further reinforces the medical stereotype of orthopods.

That hurt, jujuquisp. As a fellow orthopod (although, technically, I need 18 more months and a succesful exam to call myself that), that really hurt.

...And the fact that it's, more or less, absolutely true in many cases, didn't help ease the pain. :(


Soooo, Dr. Cook: Palmaris Longus?

Palmaris longus....

Wow - when I was in grad school, we did clinical correlation exercises with the medical students and one of the activities we did was to interview real patients who would describe their deficits and our job was to try to diagnose their problems (from an anatomical and physiological standpoint).  
Long story short, one fellow had gone in for carpal tunnel surgery and his surgeon snipped his median nerve thinking it was his palmaris longus tendon...

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,09:58   

DaveTard sez:

Quote
Yet Dr. Gorski, also a surgeon, somehow believes himself qualified to evaluate evolutionary claims made by other medical doctors. Spare me.


Dr Gorskis Says to Dacook the ID interloper..

http://scienceblogs.com/insolen....-319769


Quote
Also, if Dr. Cook wants to learn about the genetics of limb development and evolution, he needs to do some reading about homeobox genes, particularly the HOX cluster. HOX genes are highly conserved and regulation of their temporospatial expression is a major determinant of body plans in organisms ranging from invertebrates (Drosophila) to humans.

Some articles:

Holland et al., Hox Genes and Chordate Evolution. Dev. Biol. 173:382-395 (1996)

Pearson et al., Modulating HOX gene functions during animal body patterning. Nature Rev. Genet. 6:893-904 (2005).

J. Garcia-Fernandez, The genesis and evolution of homeobox gene clusters. Nature Rev. Genet, 6:881-892 (2005).

Veraksa et al., Developmental Patterning Genes and Their Conserved Functions: From Model Organisms to Humans. Mol. Genet. Metabol. 69:85-100 (2000).

There are many others. And let's not forget the role of Pax genes in eye evolution and Nkx2.5-type genes in heart patterning. The molecular basis of pattern formation and evolution is a fascinating topic.



Another ID interloper gets the fact-based-slapdown. Like guniness, both Sal and Dacook don't travel well. Better scurry back to UD ladies where Tard trumps Fact and it's always twenty to darkages o'clock.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
Glen Davidson



Posts: 1100
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,10:00   

Quote
Are we even sure he ever worked for Dell? Because, see, I just did a Google search for davetard "Dell millionnaire" (yeah, with the quotes, why?) and absolutely nothing came up.


But you misspelled "millionaire" (only one "n").  I'd say that's the problem, however when I re-ran Davetard "Dell millionaire" with the correct spelling, I still didn't get anything.  

So there's still no evidence that he's telling the truth, and it might be better to assume otherwise (the "engineer" who thinks minds violate SLOT shouldn't be trusted to get even the basics of his personal life right).

Glen D

--------------
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p....p

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of coincidence---ID philosophy

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,10:13   

Quote (Glen Davidson @ Jan. 19 2007,10:00)
Quote
Are we even sure he ever worked for Dell? Because, see, I just did a Google search for davetard "Dell millionnaire" (yeah, with the quotes, why?) and absolutely nothing came up.


But you misspelled "millionaire" (only one "n").  I'd say that's the problem, however when I re-ran Davetard "Dell millionaire" with the correct spelling, I still didn't get anything.  

So there's still no evidence that he's telling the truth, and it might be better to assume otherwise (the "engineer" who thinks minds violate SLOT shouldn't be trusted to get even the basics of his personal life right).

Glen D

DaveTard himself violates a few of the laws of nature.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
slpage



Posts: 349
Joined: June 2004

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,10:17   

Quote (Zachriel @ Jan. 19 2007,09:54)
Quote (slpage @ Jan. 19 2007,09:34)
Like, for example, using "toy examples" (Cordova's actual words) of strings of only 8 characters to "prove" that "time erases hierarchies."  Why, amazingly, Cordova was able to "prove" this by using his amazing 8-character string, "mutating" one character each generation, and in only 8 generations, he 'erased' the 'molecular' hierarchy that did not even exist in the first place...

I looked for that, but could not find it. Do you have a link?

By the way, if you like toy hierarchies, I have devised a simple experiment along those lines, Zachriel's Nest of Letters. Even with just a few letters, Zachriel's Nest of Letters shows how neutral evolution can result in easily discernable nested hierarchies after several generations. It also shows when we might be able to predict the existence of intermediaries and the possible limitations of reconstructing the history of such a descent.

Sorry - it occurred at the old KCFS board.  Sometimes he referred to 10-character strings, sometimes it was 8.  It seemed to depend on how quickly he wanted to "disprove" evolution...

See one iteration of his 'toy examples' here, where he adds a symbol ('character';) to his string each 'generation' and darned if he can't make a hierarchy out of it in short order...
On page 2 of that thread, he introduces his 8-bit string.

His cluelessness, obfuscation, incredulity, etc. are exhibited in full glory in that thread...

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,10:37   

Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Jan. 18 2007,20:16)
DaveScot does ID research, and comes up with the following:


Re "The universe began with a huge explosion."

That one's false - the big bang was not an explosion as such.

Henry

  
Steverino



Posts: 411
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,11:14   

As a Graphics Designer, Artist and Usability Specialist....the assclown known as TRoutMAC on UD makes me want to turn in my talent.

To paraphrase a quote about business customers..."Scientists shouldn't do design and designers shouldn't do science."

STFU Assclown!!!

I hope he attends the next SIGGRAPH so, I can piss in his margarita.

--------------
- Born right the first time.
- Asking questions is NOT the same as providing answers.
- It's all fun and games until the flying monkeys show up!

   
Mike PSS



Posts: 428
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,12:28   

Quote (slpage @ Jan. 19 2007,11:17)
Sorry - it occurred at the old KCFS board.  Sometimes he referred to 10-character strings, sometimes it was 8.  It seemed to depend on how quickly he wanted to "disprove" evolution...

See one iteration of his 'toy examples' here, where he adds a symbol ('character';) to his string each 'generation' and darned if he can't make a hierarchy out of it in short order...
On page 2 of that thread, he introduces his 8-bit string.

His cluelessness, obfuscation, incredulity, etc. are exhibited in full glory in that thread...

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!  Thanks slpage.  Good background read on Slitherring Sal.  From pre-Dover no less.

But you forget your closer.
Quote
Another unsupported assertion.

Who would have thought?

Hmmm... Let's give that a name - The Cordova maneuver*.


*The Cordova Maneuver was first used by creationist Salvador Cordova, the exact date is unknown, though it appears to have been used as early as 2004. The hallmark of the Cordova Maneuver is to reiterate an unsupported or even refuted position ad nauseum as though the position has not been addressed. Additional iterations of the claim are usually accompanied by self-aggrandizing commentary, dismissive insults directed at detractors, and weak attempts to belittle those that have rebutted the claims. It is a form of fallacious argumentation.
...
With an addendum:

A great deal of psychological projection is contained in the highly defensive posturing that accompanies the unsupported assertions.

  
Mike PSS



Posts: 428
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,12:34   

Quote (Steverino @ Jan. 19 2007,12:14)
As a Graphics Designer, Artist and Usability Specialist....the assclown known as TRoutMAC on UD makes me want to turn in my talent.

To paraphrase a quote about business customers..."Scientists shouldn't do design and designers shouldn't do science."

STFU Assclown!!!

I hope he attends the next SIGGRAPH so, I can piss in his margarita.

If TRoutMac at UD pisses you off so much then P-l-e-e-e-a-s-s-s-e don't read him over at OE.

Quote (TRoutMac @ 2007-01-19, 16:11)
Goldstein wrote:
"if ID is not relgious, why are you using an example from the Old Testament?"

If Darwinism is religiously neutral, then why shouldn't someone use an example from the Old Testament?

He, he. Gotcha. Darwinism won't allow for the possibility that the Bible might just be a legitimate historical document. It's not religiously neutral at all. This is why they seek to exclude it from discussion.

Here's another stumper for you: If ID is really a just religious view, then why would folks of many different religious persuasions, including those that would not hold the Bible as a religious authority, be interested in it?

TRoutMac
Intelligent (Graphic) Designer

http://www.overwhelmingevidence.com/oe....ent-830

I wouldn't want you to lose control of your prostate AND bowels at the same time.

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,13:53   

Quote
19 January 2007
Alternative Darwin Awards
Theodosius
Bill asked me to introduce myself, and to describe an idea that came to me recently.

I am a graduate student, working on philosophy of biology (at a university that shall remain nameless), nearing the dissertation stage.


Just the other day I was just telling myself, "Steve, you know what ID could use? Some philosophers. They have way too many biologists over there, doing experiments, and just generally understanding some basic biology. What they need are some more philosophers. Maybe a lawyer or two. Some computer technicians, maybe.  

Quote


I am sure that everyone knows about the odious “Darwin Awards.” I have been concerned about this phenomenon for some time, because they seem to be catching on with the broader public. I encounter references to them increasingly frequently among the mostly liberal crowd I hang out with. I guess this is not too surprising, as their cynicism is certainly in tune with the times and the culture.

I even had a public school teacher of my acquaintance tell me recently about a child who fell off a cliff on a school outing. She was laughing about this incident and saying that the little boy should get a Darwin Award!

Well, I had a light bulb go off recently about how to fight fire with fire—satire with satire.

I was reading a book called Clockwork Garden, by Roger J. Farber (Amherst: UMass Pr, 1986). The book contains the following startling image (the passage pertains to the author’s critique of selectionism as a basis for reductionism of teleology to mechanism;


who wrote that last sentence, Jesse Jackson?

Quote
in particular, he is distinguishing true selection—which is intentional—from mere sorting), on page 16:

“Consider a swimming coach who selects her team by throwing the entire freshman class into the pool and signing up those who float.”

When I read this passage, I suddenly had this vision of a cartoon depicting this situation—as an illustration of the tender mercies of the Darwinian philosophy.

The thing is, people laugh at the Darwin Awards because they feel superior to the people being ridiculed by the awards. But perhaps, through a more subtle (and more accurate) form of satire, they could be brought to see that the human form of life stands in dedicated opposition to the “natural”, especially as conceived of in Darwinian terms.

So, what do you all think? Worthy of a T-shirt? A regular comic strip? With a little imagination, the permutations on the theme are endless . . .

Posted in Intelligent Design | 15 Comments »



Uh, so what's the point? Evolution is murderous and wasteful? Well duh. Real insightful philosopher, this guy.

   
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,14:01   

If you had to ask me for a one word description of this Salvador Cordova post, it would be 'crackhead'.

http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1974#more-1974

If Salvador keeps writing biomath columns like this, I'm afraid at some point Mark Chu-Carroll is going to flip out and just punch him in the face.

   
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,14:05   

So true Steve. They load their ranks with everyone but scientists, the closest they had at UD (JAD) is banned but Davetard now seems to be championing his PEH / Pansperimia.. until he recently got on his dog & cat show YEC kick. D*mbski can't do math, Sal can't do math.. quack quack dacook just got reamed at respectful insolence...

I'm thinking of getting some UD bingo cards made, so we can play as we read.

Phrases would be:

God
Jesus
Engineer
Darwinist
"evolution can't explain"
"just so stories"
Gaps
SloT
Peppered Moths
etc..

Folks, have you given up being 'sciency'? Is it all just culture war / fart noises now? Don't die too soon.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,14:06   

Quote
Uh, so what's the point? Evolution is murderous and wasteful? Well duh. Real insightful philosopher, this guy

Now, now, steve...what you've overlooked is Theodosius' startling and potentially world-shaking discovery that *gasp* humans have culture!
Quote
perhaps, through a more subtle (and more accurate) form of satire, they could be brought to see that the human form of life stands in dedicated opposition to the “natural”, especially as conceived of in Darwinian terms. [snip]

Worthy of a T-shirt? A regular comic strip? With a little imagination, the permutations on the theme are endless . . .

Obviously, the ID crowd will welcome this insightful Phil. O' Bio. grad student and the spectacular mental fireworks he displays in cunning and portentous fashion...no doubt heralding a new age of ID, where TroutMac designs the graphics and Theodosious supplies those reams of witty lines. I'm sure the Darweenians are quivering in fear now.

--------------
AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
Richardthughes



Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,14:08   

Quote (stevestory @ Jan. 19 2007,14:01)
If you had to ask me for a one word description of this Salvador Cordova post, it would be 'crackhead'.

http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1974#more-1974

If Salvador keeps writing biomath columns like this, I'm afraid at some point Mark Chu-Carroll is going to flip out and just punch him in the face.

Funny that he's moved it from good math / bad math to UD..almost as if he wanted to select comments / censor..

*faux shock*

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

  
stevestory



Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 19 2007,14:12   

Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 19 2007,15:08)
Quote (stevestory @ Jan. 19 2007,14:01)
If you had to ask me for a one word description of this Salvador Cordova post, it would be 'crackhead'.

http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1974#more-1974

If Salvador keeps writing biomath columns like this, I'm afraid at some point Mark Chu-Carroll is going to flip out and just punch him in the face.

Funny that he's moved it from good math / bad math to UD..almost as if he wanted to select comments / censor..

*faux shock*

oh, was that discussion a continuation of something from GM/BM?

   
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