Antievolution.org - Antievolution.org Discussion Board -Topic::Official Uncommonly Dense Discussion Thread

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,05:50

Quote (Bob O'H @ Sep. 27 2006,10:26)

Quote (Richardthughes @ Sep. 27 2006,09:38)

Quote

There are currently 3 users and 7 guests online.
Online users
admin
oleary
Alan Fox

Same ol' same ol'!

That gave me an evil idea. �Alas, the usernames are not case sensitive, so I couldn't have Admin as a username. �But Administrator wasn't taken. �:-)

Any suggestions for what to do? �I don't want to make a total mess, but some gentle fun could be had.

Bob

Oh, the fun that could be had with
Jesus*is*Lord
First cause
Peer Review
Pseudoscience
Puff_of_smoke
Dell_Millionaire

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Bob O'H

Posts: 2564
Joined: Oct. 2005

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,06:20

Ha ha!! I got banned first from overwhelmingevidence.com first! Administator has been removed.

Na-na di na-naa!

Slightly more seriously, I'm sure the idea can be used later: telling DaveTard "you're outta here" or something.

Bob

--------------
It is fun to dip into the various threads to watch cluelessness at work in the hands of the confident exponent. - Soapy Sam (so say we all)

Jim_Wynne

Posts: 1208
Joined: June 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,06:21

Quote (argystokes @ Sep. 26 2006,19:56)

From OE:

Quote

My name is Samuel Chen and I am a student at the Honors College at Baylor University in Waco, Texas (though I am from Pennsylvania). I direct the Intelligent Design Undergraduate Research Center (www.idurc.org) and am a representative of the Access Research Network (www.arn.org) and a member of the Intelligent Design Evolution Awareness Center (www.ideacenter.org).

They have a research center? �Full of undergraduates? �I wonder who the head PI is?

I queried Brother Chen about the nature of his "Research Center" here a while back. The inimitable Joe G's ("Joseph" when posting at UD) comments under the post are also tardilicious.

--------------
Evolution is not about laws but about randomness on happanchance.--Robert Byers, at PT

Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,07:26

Quote (N.Wells @ Sep. 26 2006,23:21)

<sarcasm on> Boy, that new blog reminds me of those early days full of heady excitement when the only people who accepted relativity were Einstein and the small bunch of Swiss high school kids who formed his fan club. Do you remember how, using nothing more than logic, simple rhetoric, and the occasional fib, they worked their ideas into high-school physics classes and thereby convinced the entire scientific establishment to change their operating paradigm? That was truly one of the great moments of intellectual history, so can you imagine how thrilled I feel to be around for the start of something even greater. Or not.

Think how much easier it would be for the IDists to convince people of their ideas if they would just lay out a bunch of supporting evidence. I can't imagine why they don't do that.

You should have seen Einstein work a fax machine. Relativity only beat Newtonism because of his relentless, decade long, $15 million dollar PR campaign.

k.e

Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,07:44

Bob O'H

Quote

Ha ha!! �I got banned first from overwhelmingevidence.com first! �Administator has been removed.

Another phyrric victory, at least you got to see your name up there.

My one and only post to UD under the name Vajrachchedika (The diamond cutter) never saw the light of day, maybe that was testing their glass ego's beyond melting point.

Anyway they missed out the first two lines for their title.

Once upon a time in a land far far away there was overwhelming evidence......

--------------
The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,07:57

Quote (Jim_Wynne @ Sep. 27 2006,11:21)

�

Quote (argystokes @ Sep. 26 2006,19:56)

From OE:
� �

Quote

My name is Samuel Chen and I am a student at the Honors College at Baylor University in Waco, Texas (though I am from Pennsylvania). I direct the Intelligent Design Undergraduate Research Center (www.idurc.org) and am a representative of the Access Research Network (www.arn.org) and a member of the Intelligent Design Evolution Awareness Center (www.ideacenter.org).

They have a research center? �Full of undergraduates? �I wonder who the head PI is?

I queried Brother Chen about the nature of his "Research Center" here a while back.

I recommend you keep asking him. But I agree, I doubt his 'research center' is anything more than a dorm room with an internet connection.

I see that Mr. Chen has a double major in philosophy and political science. With such credentials, he should fit into the Intelligent Design movement quite nicely.

Baylor? I wonder if his 'Research Center' has tried to erect a memorial to Dembski's martyrdom?

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Richardthughes

Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,07:58

The Housetard opines:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1654

Quote

Because Europe has abandoned her belief in heavenly rewards she is increasingly focused on the material rewards of the earthly world. Children are a financial burden and adults can live higher on the hog without them...

You've won me over with your groovy brand of agnosticism, Dave.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

k.e

Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,08:05

Quote attributed to Alpha Designo Tard by the highly reputable RH

Quote

Children are a financial burden and adults can live higher on the hog without them...

ah...does 'Bad Seed' Davetard have kids?

...and ....does he know they are the by product of 'heavenly rewards'.

--------------
The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,08:05

Quote (Richardthughes @ Sep. 27 2006,12:58)

The Housetard opines:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1654

Quote

Because Europe has abandoned her belief in heavenly rewards she is increasingly focused on the material rewards of the earthly world. Children are a financial burden and adults can live higher on the hog without them...

You've won me over with your groovy brand of agnosticism, Dave.

So, uh, having a big family means you're more likely to get into heaven?

What?

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

oldmanintheskydidntdoit

Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,08:12

Quote

Overwhelming Evidence is a site where high school students can network and communicate their views on intelligent design and evolution.

it's kinda creepy if you ask me. As you know there's loads of middle aged blokes writing the articles.

And when is the last time you overheard a student saying "So when are Behe and Dembski coming out with new books?"?

Where is the evidence hinted at by the site title, anybody got a link?

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger�s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,08:51

hehehehehe

Quote

�Why Darwinism Is Doomed�
by William Dembski on September 27th, 2006 � 4 Comments

Leave it to Jonathan Wells to tell it like it is:

Quote

. . . The truth is Darwinism is not a scientific theory, but a materialistic creation myth masquerading as science. It is first and foremost a weapon against religion � especially traditional Christianity. Evidence is brought in afterwards, as window dressing.

This is becoming increasingly obvious to the American people, who are not the ignorant backwoods religious dogmatists that Darwinists make them out to be. Darwinists insult the intelligence of American taxpayers and at the same time depend on them for support. This is an inherently unstable situation, and it cannot last. . . .

Quote

Carl Sachs // Sep 27th 2006 at 1:05 pm

Jonathan Wells is right � there�s nothing like an exciting new discovery to show that the theoretical framework which motivated it is hopelessly flawed. Even a child could see that.

It�s obvious that the Darwinists over at Pharyngula are running scared � they�re so scared that they�re boasting about how they�re not scared, and everyone knows that means that they really are. Clearly.

Unfortunately for Dr. Wells, it�s not clear what he�s going to do once Darwinism is over and done with. Could it be that it�s not, and that his repeated pronouncements of its impending demise are his way of being sure he continue to make a quick buck off of the gullible and self-deceived?

Obviously, that�s impossible � not even worthy of the consideration it took for me to write it.

No, it�s clear to all people of reason that in a few years, Darwin will be to biology what Marx is to economics, and the shining city on the hill will bring truth and goodness to all places of darkness, ignorance, and decadence � such as France, Germany, and the Netherlands. Then the terrible and savage tyranny inspired by Voltaire, Kant, and Spinoza shall finally be vanquished!

Oh, what a glorious day that will be . . .

Comment by Carl Sachs � September 27, 2006 @ 1:05 pm

Jim_Wynne

Posts: 1208
Joined: June 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,08:58

Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Sep. 27 2006,13:12)

Quote

Where is the evidence hinted at by the site title...?

Never mind where the evidence is. It's overwhelming. I'm pretty sure Behe knows where it is. But we don't need your pathetic level of detail. Understand?

--------------
Evolution is not about laws but about randomness on happanchance.--Robert Byers, at PT

k.e

Posts: 1948
Joined: Mar. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,09:11

Quote

.......and the shining city on the hill will bring truth and goodness to all places of darkness, ignorance, and decadence � such as France, Germany, and the Netherlands. Then the terrible and savage tyranny inspired by Voltaire, Kant, and Spinoza shall finally be vanquished!

Oh the terrible, terrible rapture, oh the rapture (slobber)..limps to operating table...Igor bring me the brains in that jar over there ....and stand by to throw the switch ....
but first a ~~prayer~~ a savage tyranical Yanky imperialist Jerimiad.....forget the Middle East...lets bomb Western Europe back to the dark ages and we can have all the Oil to ourselves....Bwhahahahahahahahaha.

...sorry, just lost it there for a moment.

...Dembski should forget about detecting design and try detecting insanity in the population...he could set up a website and post useless nonsense and see if it attacts absolute loonies....uh oh.

--------------
The conservative has but little to fear from the man whose reason is the servant of his passions, but let him beware of him in whom reason has become the greatest and most terrible of the passions.These are the wreckers of outworn empires and civilisations, doubters, disintegrators, deicides.Haldane

Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,10:07

From Dense O'Leary at OverwhelmingEvidence(thatWe'reWrong).com:

Quote

*For the record, I am a Catholic grandmother, born long befor the Internet. But don't let that deter you. It hasn't deterred me. I call myself a post-Darwinist, because I know that Darwin must be wrong - but that doesn't make any given alternative to Darwin right. It just means that we all need the intellectual freedom that so many wish to deny us, via courts and legislatures.

He just hasta be wrong, dammit. He just hasta.

egbooth

Posts: 17
Joined: Feb. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,10:16

Is anyone else enjoying the amazing sarcasm provided by Carl Sachs on the Wells/"Darwinism is Doomed" thread.
Why Darwinism is Doomed

Quote

�How long did the belief in and search for the philosopher�s stone prevail before being replaced, fecund a field though it had been, by modern chemistry?�

But the alchemists weren�t losing all that time, the way the Darwinists have been.

�No labwork or field work has ever supported Darwin except for trivial experiments. �

Well put � after all, it�s one thing to accept that small changes could have happened over a small amount of time, but only a fool would think that lots of changes could have happened over a lot of time.

�We love science, true science.�

And that means test-tubes and lab-coats! If there are no test-tubes and lab-coats, it�s not science; that�s obvious. Then it�s just stamp collecting in the name of a nefarious plot to destroy the human spirit.

Remember: if it�s inconsistent with truth, then it�s not science.

Comment by Carl Sachs � September 27, 2006 @ 2:37 pm

dhogaza

Posts: 525
Joined: Feb. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,10:34

I'm enjoying Carl Sachs' sarcastic posts a lot. I'm enjoying the fact that a couple of the UD regulars don't understand they're being made fun of even more ...

someotherguy

Posts: 398
Joined: Aug. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,10:37

Holy Cow! Heddle's on a roll!

Quote

I am so anachronistic. I remember those days when we settled scientific debates by actually going into the lab (you know, those places where people where the long white coats and use equipment) and doing science. I know, it does seem rather ridiculous by the methods championed here. Clearly the modern way is to write op-ed pieces or popularized books that declare victory anytime a new record that may be problematic, or at least can be cast as problematic, is added to the experimental database. In days of yore what we used to do (you�ll get a kick out of this) is to see if the current theory can explain the new data and if it could not we would either modify it or, if it was beyond saving, we would jettison it. Is that a gas or what? But I understand that since this takes time and work it is much more efficient just to accumulate short-term political mileage while we can.

--------------
Evolander in training

Altabin

Posts: 308
Joined: Sep. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,10:43

I tried to make my first ever post today to UD - it would have been the first post on the "Jonathon Wells uncovers the secret atheist conspiracy" thread. �It never appeared, nor did the polite request about its whereabouts I made an hour or so ago. �It was not nearly as scathing as Carl Sachs' recent posts - and not nearly as funny either, so it's no great loss - I just don't get their moderation policy at all. �Honestly, I think that the reason Carl's posts keep getting through is that they really can't understand the notion of irony.

--------------

Posts: 13407
Joined: Oct. 2005

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,10:58

Quote (Altabin @ Sep. 27 2006,16:43)

I tried to make my first ever post today to UD - it would have been the first post on the "Jonathon Wells uncovers the secret atheist conspiracy" thread. It never appeared, nor did the polite request about its whereabouts I made an hour or so ago. It was not nearly as scathing as Carl Sachs' recent posts - and not nearly as funny either, so it's no great loss - I just don't get their moderation policy at all. Honestly, I think that the reason Carl's posts keep getting through is that they really can't understand the notion of irony.

The moderation policy is "Ban and delete basically anyone who says anything critical, except a random 5% so it looks like an open debate. Especially ban anything which answers a challenge you made in such a way as to expose you as an uneduated dolt."

ScaryFacts

Posts: 337
Joined: Aug. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,11:44

Quote (Altabin @ Sep. 27 2006,16:43)

I tried to make my first ever post today to UD - it would have been the first post on the "Jonathon Wells uncovers the secret atheist conspiracy" thread. �It never appeared, nor did the polite request about its whereabouts I made an hour or so ago. �It was not nearly as scathing as Carl Sachs' recent posts - and not nearly as funny either, so it's no great loss - I just don't get their moderation policy at all. �Honestly, I think that the reason Carl's posts keep getting through is that they really can't understand the notion of irony.

I was moderated on my first post--it took 10 hours or so to show up--and have been unmoderated ever since. I've only made a few posts, and I don't have the education, insight or wit of the rest of the brood here, but I'm trying.

I did get a rebuke from JAD. �Maybe that's progress.

Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,11:49

'Pathetic level of detail', etc., etc.:

Quote

What seems to be lacking to me is a complete and thorough end-to-end hypothesis (let alone theory) of the role ID has supposed to have played in abogenesis and subsequent development. In other words if you like a playback of the last 4.5 million years from an ID perspective - sure I expect some of it might be speculative, but shouldn�t it be possible to at least infer some of this by now? Perhaps this exists and I�m just not aware of it?

Frankly, it seems to me ID is currently a miscellaneous grab-bag of ideas, hypothesis and speculations but with no solid framework to hang them from. I know a lot about what ID is against but I�m often at a complete loss to know what ID is for.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,11:56

Heddle is swiftly punished for pointing out the emperor's lack of clothing:

Quote

23. William Dembski // Sep 27th 2006 at 4:51 pm

David Heddle: I don�t like your attitude. I recently booted you off a listserve that I moderate. I�m now booting you from this blog. Goodbye.

Comment by William Dembski � September 27, 2006 @ 4:51 pm

Dang, maybe we should invite him HERE? He's certainly brighter than GoP or ROB.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

argystokes

Posts: 766
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,11:58

Good god, look who's one step away from becoming a full blown CBEB:

Quote

23. William Dembski // Sep 27th 2006 at 4:51 pm

David Heddle: I don�t like your attitude. I recently booted you off a listserve that I moderate. I�m now booting you from this blog. Goodbye.

Comment by William Dembski � September 27, 2006 @ 4:51 pm

EDIT: Shemps too fast for me. My eyes!

--------------
"Why waste time learning, when ignorance is instantaneous?" -Calvin

Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,12:03

Make room, Jerry & Gil, JPark is quite the rising star in the Tard galaxy:

�

Quote

jpark320 // Sep 27th 2006 at 4:48 pm

In response to Linda Slater, but not directly at her� Is it IDers responsibility to come up with a sweeping comprehensive theory like she and many like her want?

Don�t we (for now) just want to exchange the RM + NS w/ teleology?

Too me that seems like a big enough deal and unfair to ask for way more. Once we win that, than we can go onto formulate what role ID has played in the biology.

Can someone link an article about this topic?

Comment by jpark320 � September 27, 2006 @ 4:48 pm

(my boldfacing, tho almost all of it is wonderful. Especially the 'unfair' bleat.)

Jpark will never be banned at UD.

"Once we vanquish Darwinism, then we can figure out if ID actually, like, does anything".

That thread seems to really be bringing out the, uh, 'best' in UD's commenters.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Bing

Posts: 144
Joined: Mar. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,12:33

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 27 2006,16:56)

Heddle is swiftly punished for pointing out the emperor's lack of clothing:

Quote

23. William Dembski // Sep 27th 2006 at 4:51 pm

David Heddle: I don�t like your attitude. I recently booted you off a listserve that I moderate. I�m now booting you from this blog. Goodbye.

Comment by William Dembski � September 27, 2006 @ 4:51 pm

Dang, maybe we should invite him HERE? He's certainly brighter than GoP or ROB.

But it appears his booting didn't stick. See comment #27 22 minutes later.

Quote

David Heddle // Sep 27th 2006 at 5:13 pm

Oh brother. Prevailing theories are not supplanted by mantra. .....

I predict that this comment will be deleted in its entirety very soon.

Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,12:43

Quote (Bing @ Sep. 27 2006,17:33)

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 27 2006,16:56)

Heddle is swiftly punished for pointing out the emperor's lack of clothing:

� �

Quote

23. William Dembski // Sep 27th 2006 at 4:51 pm

David Heddle: I don�t like your attitude. I recently booted you off a listserve that I moderate. I�m now booting you from this blog. Goodbye.

Comment by William Dembski � September 27, 2006 @ 4:51 pm

Dang, maybe we should invite him HERE? He's certainly brighter than GoP or ROB.

But it appears his booting didn't stick. �See comment #27 22 minutes later.

�

Quote

David Heddle �// Sep 27th 2006 at 5:13 pm

Oh brother. Prevailing theories are not supplanted by mantra. .....

I predict that this comment will be deleted in its entirety very �soon.

Then let's quote it in full here:

Quote

27. David Heddle // Sep 27th 2006 at 5:13 pm

Oh brother. Prevailing theories are not supplanted by mantra. You can say �Darwinism is doomed� a gazillion times but there is only one way ID (or anything else) will displace it as a scientific theory: when ID proposes experiments, performs them, obtains results that support the ID hypothesis, and publishes their findings. Until then it is just preaching-to-the-choir playtime. If all this energy were invested in actually doing science then, regardless of the outcome, at least something of value would have resulted.

If you really think ID is science then abandon the lecture circuits, abandon legal tactics, stop showing up on places like CSPAN, write much less for the nonscientific press and nonscientific audiences than for professional journals, stop whining about conspiracies in the funding agencies and among atheistic scientists in general, and get off your butts and do some science.

Of course, if ID is really a powerful apologetic for theism, as I think it is, then some of these activities make perfect sense�but even then they should only be done if ID is accurately portrayed as an apologetic, and not a science under siege.

Comment by David Heddle � September 27, 2006 @ 5:13 pm

I don't think it's that his banning didn't stick, it's just that no one at UD has physically added his name to the ban list yet.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Bing

Posts: 144
Joined: Mar. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,12:50

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 27 2006,17:43)

I don't think it's that his banning didn't stick, it's just that no one at UD has physically added his name to the ban list yet.

Maybe they're waiting for it to be miraculously added to the ban list, as some kind of trial by ordeal. If the name goes on the list by some supernatural means, then G*d really wanted him to be banned?

Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,12:53

Quote (Bing @ Sep. 27 2006,17:50)

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 27 2006,17:43)

I don't think it's that his banning didn't stick, it's just that no one at UD has physically added his name to the ban list yet.

Maybe they're waiting for it to be miraculously added to the ban list, as some kind of trial by ordeal. �If the name goes on the list by some supernatural means, then G*d really wanted him to be banned?

Please! We're making no claims as to the identity of whoever it is that will ban him!

It could be space aliens.

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Posts: 6657
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: Sep. 27 2006,13:01

Dang, that's the thread that keeps on givin':

Quote

I guess my other point is I find it curious that ID supporters are so keen to associate with themselves with a person who is a practicing member of the Unification church, particularly since he is quite public about how his religious aims influence his research. Of course I don�t want to commit the genetic fallacy here, but put it this way: would ID supporters be quite so keen to allow him to speak on religious matters in their pulpits at their churches?

and,

Quote

I think the difference is that a) The Unification church is a cult (not just another Christian denomination) and by some accounts a dangerous and harmful one b) Wells has himself admitted that he is pursuing his scientific career at the experience purpose of �Father�.

Here�s what Wells himself said: ��Father�s [Sun Myung Moon�s] words, my studies, and my prayers convinced me that I should devote my life to destroying Darwinism, just as many of my fellow Unificationists had already devoted their lives to destroying Marxism. When Father chose me (along with about a dozen other seminary graduates) to enter a Ph.D. program in 1978, I welcomed the opportunity to prepare myself for battle.�

Based on this there is some basis to belief that Wells�s scientific research is not based on science for science sake but is driven by a specific religious agenda. There is also some reasonably good evidence to suggest that the Unification church is not devoid of corruption and unethical practices. Of course whether Wells himself is guilty of this is another matter, but since he belongs to this instutition there is certainly reason to be wary of his ultimate motives and modus operandi.

Comment by Linda Slater � September 27, 2006 @ 5:18 pm

Linda, I don't like your attitude, you're outta here. -WD

--------------
"Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

argystokes

Posts: 766
Joined: Jan. 2006