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  Topic: FL Debate Peanut Gallery, Keep it Clean!< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Stanton



Posts: 266
Joined: Jan. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 22 2009,20:06   

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 22 2009,18:05)
Quote (Stanton @ Sep. 22 2009,15:38)
Yes, especially since FL thinks that carnivores, old age and parasites are terrible, evil and cruel, but divinely mandated genocide, murder and child rape are perfectly acceptable.

And not believing in Jesus means you have no moral compass and are capable of the worst atrocities (e.g., genocide, murder and child rape).

Did I guess right?

Of course: the fear of God's hateful, all-consuming wrath is what allegedly keeps people turning into hyper-sexual God-hating, anti-social deviants who obsess about how to apply evolutionary biology towards inappropriate behavior.

On the other hand, using the excuse that you're either doing it for God, or that God told you to do it is a blank check to do whatever you want, be it lying, slandering, manipulating, bullying or murder.  I mean, granted, Jesus made a big song and dance about how He will deny salvation to anyone who does any evil in His name, but, if you say you're doing whatever it is for God and or Jesus, who gives a withering fig over what He said?

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,08:31   

wow, off topic in THIS thread

go away

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
oldmanintheskydidntdoit



Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,08:48   

It's some sort of spam-bot.

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I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger’s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

  
Quack



Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,11:13   

Quote
So, for Christians, a key decision must be made.  Will you choose to believe the Bible and believe in the Global Noahic Flood?  Or will you disbelieve the Bible and abandon the entire Flood story period

That’s only the beginning, the whole bible stinks – and it reeks of symbolic language too.

But that’s beyond FL, I am afraid. Sorry, your loss.

Besides all the myths and symbols, much is of course also just tribal memories from probably long before writing was invented. We know that tribes without a written language have rich oral traditions. We are dealing with people deep down into the past, in a world very different from what we know, and where mankind’s collective mind was far less developed than ours.  

I mean cultural development, not phylogenetic development.

But let’s make a simple test.  Isaiah 37:36 reports that in one night, “Then the angel of the LORD went forth, and smote in the camp of the Assyrians a hundred and fourscore and five thousand: and when they arose early in the morning, behold, they were all dead corpses.”

You believe that? I believe you do, and nothing can make you change your mind about that.

You most likely will shove that before you like you do with Noah and hope you never will stumble your precious toes on the growing pile before you.

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
              Robert Byers.

  
Amadan



Posts: 1337
Joined: Jan. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,12:19   

Quack, you're being very unfair.

The Bible is perfect and literally true in all things. Except when it gets a bit metaphorical, or when there were copying errors. Fortunately, we have Floyd to tell us where these things are.

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"People are always looking for natural selection to generate random mutations" - Densye  4-4-2011
JoeG BTW dumbass- some variations help ensure reproductive fitness so they cannot be random wrt it.

   
Lou FCD



Posts: 5455
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,13:01   



Spam comment deleted.

Quote
Garbage?, by wok on Flickr.


--------------
“Why do creationists have such a hard time with commas?

Linky“. ~ Steve Story, Legend

   
SLP



Posts: 136
Joined: Dec. 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,13:12   

Quote (Amadan @ Sep. 23 2009,12:19)
Quack, you're being very unfair.

The Bible is perfect and literally true in all things. Except when it gets a bit metaphorical, or when there were copying errors. Fortunately, we have Floyd to tell us where these things are.

And I suppose that it is just a coincidence that the parts that are errors (so much for a literally 100% true bible, eh?) are the embarrassing parts and the metaphorical parts are the parts that are so silly that claiming them as literally true would be to demonstrate a profound stupidity.

  
JohnW



Posts: 3217
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,13:48   

Quote (SLP @ Sep. 23 2009,11:12)
Quote (Amadan @ Sep. 23 2009,12:19)
Quack, you're being very unfair.

The Bible is perfect and literally true in all things. Except when it gets a bit metaphorical, or when there were copying errors. Fortunately, we have Floyd to tell us where these things are.

And I suppose that it is just a coincidence that the parts that are errors (so much for a literally 100% true bible, eh?) are the embarrassing parts and the metaphorical parts are the parts that are so silly that claiming them as literally true would be to demonstrate a profound stupidity.

Floyd claims the global flood is literally true, and not metaphorical.   Which is so silly that it demonstrates a profound stupidity.

--------------
Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers

There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,16:07   

i have some very close family who are teaching their kids this crap about a boatload of animals, right now.  because they took their kids to the creation amusement park where they were told that biologists are the root of all evil, i have opened my big mouth.

i have found that some folks can't hear "the flood as described in genesis never happened" as anything but "Jesus didn't die on the cross for your sins".  Just because I agree with that conclusion doesn't mean that it follows from the initial premise about the flood.

people gonna do what people gonna do.  and that is, succintly, "Be Stupid".

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,16:29   

Some are born ignorant

Some achieve ignorance

Some have ignorance thrust upon them

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"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
olegt



Posts: 1405
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 23 2009,21:00   

Floyd on the main thread:  
Quote
Anyway, I'm looking for ANY evolutionist---be they as religious as the Pope or as atheist as Dawkins---to step up to the plate and specifically reconcile or resolve these specific Big Five Incompatibilities between evolution and Christianity.


Isn't that the responsibility of theologians?

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If you are not:
Galapagos Finch
please Logout »

  
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 24 2009,13:59   

Can't restrain myself any longer:

http://eddirt.frozenreality.co.uk/index.php?id=408







--------------
"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2780
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 24 2009,14:48   

Floyd

Is this you in the video?

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Dale_Husband



Posts: 118
Joined: April 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 24 2009,18:11   

http://talkorigins.org/indexcc/CA/CA602.html

Claim CA602:
Evolution is atheistic.
Source:
Morris, Henry M. 1985. Scientific Creationism. Green Forest, AR: Master Books, p. 215.
Response:
1. For a claim that is so obviously false, it gets repeated surprisingly often. Evolution does not require a God, but it does not rule one out either. In that respect, it is no different from almost all other fields of interest. Evolution is no more atheistic than biochemistry, farming, engineering, plumbing, art, law, and so forth.


2. Many, perhaps most, evolutionists are not atheists. If you take the claim seriously, you must claim that the following people are atheists, to give just a few examples:


Sir Ronald Fisher -- the most distinguished theoretical biologist in the history of evolutionary thought. He was also a Christian (a member of the Church of England) and a conservative whose social views were somewhere to the right of Louis XIV.
Pope John Paul II -- a social conservative.
Pierre Teilhard de Chardin -- a paleontologist and priest who taught that God guided evolution.
President Jimmy Carter -- a devout and active Southern Baptist.

More than 10,000 clergy have signed a statement saying, in part, "We the undersigned, Christian clergy from many different traditions, believe that the timeless truths of the Bible and the discoveries of modern science may comfortably coexist. We believe that the theory of evolution is a foundational scientific truth, one that has stood up to rigorous scrutiny and upon which much of human knowledge and achievement rests." (Clergy Letter Project 2005)


3. Anyone worried about atheism should be more concerned about creationism. Creationism can lead to a crisis of faith when people discover that its claims are false and its tactics frequently dishonest. This has led some people to abandon religion altogether (Greene n.d.). It has led others to a qualitatively different understanding of Christianity (Morton 2000).


4. By saying that only one religious interpretation is correct and universal, creationism typically is a rejection of every other religious interpretation. For example, young-earth creationists reject the religious interpretation that the universe is more than 10,000 years old (Sarfati 2004), and design theorists reject the idea that God has guided evolution (Dembski 1996). For people whose beliefs about God differ from those of a creationist, that creationism might just as well be atheistic.

--------------
If you need a man-made book to beleive in a God who is said to have created the universe, of what value is your faith? You might as well worship an idol.

   
Quack



Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 26 2009,05:48   

Quote
Besides, given that evolution is incompatible with Christianity

That's been established now, by whom?

Wasn't the purpose of this 'debate' just to establish that? Seems to me the issue is still open? Wouldn't we need some consensus about what evolution is, and which version of Christianity it is incompatible with?

Let's vote on it!

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
              Robert Byers.

  
dochocson



Posts: 62
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 26 2009,17:00   

Quote (Quack @ Sep. 26 2009,03:48)
Quote
Besides, given that evolution is incompatible with Christianity

That's been established now, by whom?

Wasn't the purpose of this 'debate' just to establish that? Seems to me the issue is still open? Wouldn't we need some consensus about what evolution is, and which version of Christianity it is incompatible with?

Let's vote on it!

Why, FL established it, silly. Cuz he's like right and stuff, you know?

--------------
All bleeding stops...eventually.

  
sledgehammer



Posts: 533
Joined: Sep. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 26 2009,17:46   

Can we all agree that we have established, beyond a reasonable doubt, that evolution, as defined by FloydLee (as well as geology, paleontology, astronomy, biology, and probably all of science) is incompatible with FloydLee's personal version of Christianity?

I'm magnanimously willing to concede this.  Any disagreements on this point? This discussion has become quite tedious, IMHO.  Is it time to move on?

--------------
The majority of the stupid is invincible and guaranteed for all time. The terror of their tyranny is alleviated by their lack of consistency. -A. Einstein  (H/T, JAD)
If evolution is true, you could not know that it's true because your brain is nothing but chemicals. ?Think about that. -K. Hovind

  
Stanton



Posts: 266
Joined: Jan. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 26 2009,18:04   

Quote (sledgehammer @ Sep. 26 2009,17:46)
Can we all agree that we have established, beyond a reasonable doubt, that evolution, as defined by FloydLee (as well as geology, paleontology, astronomy, biology, and probably all of science) is incompatible with FloydLee's personal version of Christianity?

I'm magnanimously willing to concede this.  Any disagreements on this point? This discussion has become quite tedious, IMHO.  Is it time to move on?

Actually, evolution as anyone, scientists, the Pope, or even Jesus, defines it is incompatible with FL's personal interpretation of Christianity.

And then there's how FL refuses to admit that his personal reasons for claiming evolution is incompatible with Christianity would not only excommunicate the Pope and the majority of Christians, but render all other sciences incompatible with Christianity, too.

Those, and FL conflates his own personal view and opinof Christianity, along with his own personal view on literally anything with fact and or mainstream opinion.

And yes, it's time we should move on.

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 26 2009,19:11   

But move on to what? His next proposed topic was Biblical perspective on biology, IIRC.

And once we've counted the legs on an insect, checked the digestive organs of rabbits (or whatever species that was), checked bats for feathers, and listened to snakes and donkeys not talk, what else is there?

Henry

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 26 2009,21:09   

c'mon we just got this fleshlight chew toy, let's not give it to the neighbor kids just yet.

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
Stanton



Posts: 266
Joined: Jan. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 26 2009,21:30   

Quote (Henry J @ Sep. 26 2009,19:11)
But move on to what? His next proposed topic was Biblical perspective on biology, IIRC.

And once we've counted the legs on an insect, checked the digestive organs of rabbits (or whatever species that was), checked bats for feathers, and listened to snakes and donkeys not talk, what else is there?

Henry

Once FL demonstrates to us how demanding that we revert back to a Biblical perspective on Biology in this modern day and time would not only drive a stake through the heart of science, but of modern medicine (what with the Bible shaming the ill and suffering who lack the faith to trust God to instantly and miraculously heal them), too, he's going to tell us how Intelligent Design is hunkydory to teach in science classrooms instead of actual science.

And we all remember FL's non-schtick about the "three planks," right?

  
Keelyn



Posts: 40
Joined: Feb. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 26 2009,22:09   

Well, he (FL) must be sick again - he hasn't posted much the last couple of days. I should clarify; by "sick" I mean physical illness - mental illness has never been a show stopper for him. I hope that's not being too cruel.  :)

--------------
This isn't right. This isn't even wrong. -- Wolfgang Pauli

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story. -- Mark Twain

  
Quack



Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 27 2009,04:28   

I wonder, if we would just concede that yes FL dearie, your five incompatibilities are all true, what would the next step be? Remake the UN a theocratic assembly? Ambassadors from the Vatican and all Christian churches, Shiite and Sunni Muslims, Buddhist's, Shinto, Hindu, Jainism, Parsi, Sikh, Baha'i, I guess we'd even have to have Confucianism ... ohmygod. FL, please resolve our dilemma, you are the key to all the world's problems, you know what and where the key is?

I believe the only workable solution would be to bestow absolute authority as ruler the world on FL. He would have the last word on all and every issue. And all the world would listen and obey.

Om . . .Peace-peace-peace.

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
              Robert Byers.

  
Quack



Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 30 2009,11:10   

Little activity in this thread? Should I post in FL's own thread instead?

I made a great post here yesterday but it was lost because  unfortunately I exited before the upload had completed.

Instead this lament will have to suffice for today:
               
Quote
Hi OM!  Gotta ask......would you be trying to ask me a question about the Flood after I stated that I wouldn't try to do a Flood discussion (because of the need to stay with thread topic).

And that, that is the problem with this thread and the reason I was very disappointed to learn that you would set the agenda.

IMHO you'd be better qualified to debate the flood than what you are attempting now, we're not anywhere near what I'd call intelligent discourse.

If and when your problems with the flood had been resolved (i.e. never) the time might be ripe for those juicy esoteric issues.

It is like, we would have to determine that angels really do exist before embarking on a debate about how many of them would fit on the tip of a needle.

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
              Robert Byers.

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Sep. 30 2009,15:07   

Apparently everybody's moved to the other thread for the "debate".

  
Quack



Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 07 2009,16:21   

Dammit, I find FL so disgusting I don't think I can bear to post at 'his' thread anymore. Even Ray Martinez is more fun; he's at least consistent in his stupidity.

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
              Robert Byers.

  
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 07 2009,19:58   

Quote (Quack @ Oct. 07 2009,16:21)
Dammit, I find FL so disgusting I don't think I can bear to post at 'his' thread anymore. Even Ray Martinez is more fun; he's at least consistent in his stupidity.

After having dealt with Ray fairly extensively at other sites ( Internet Infidels [now Freethought and Rationalism Discussion Board] http://www.freeratio.org/ ) and Talk Rational ( http://talkrational.org/ )  ...I'm pretty convinced that Ray is just flat-out insane, but yeah, consistent.

I certainly agree with the first part of your statement, too, Mr. Quack.

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AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
Tracy P. Hamilton



Posts: 1239
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 08 2009,00:30   

Quote (Quack @ Oct. 07 2009,16:21)
Dammit, I find FL so disgusting I don't think I can bear to post at 'his' thread anymore. Even Ray Martinez is more fun; he's at least consistent in his stupidity.

FL is the poster boy for why the book "The Scandal of the Evangelical Mind" has such an apt title.

(They don't use their mind.)

--------------
"Following what I just wrote about fitness, you’re taking refuge in what we see in the world."  PaV

"The simple equation F = MA leads to the concept of four-dimensional space." GilDodgen

"We have no brain, I don't, for thinking." Robert Byers

  
csadams



Posts: 124
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 12 2009,06:36   

Interesting how the "Topeka school district biology textbooks don't address specific problems with abiogenesis" virus has spread:

Quote
So why did the evolutionists censor out THIS particular 2005 Science Standard? Simply because it gave Kansas biology teachers the legal protection to tell their students about the VERY BIG problems regarding prebiotic evolution. Big problems that are NOT being specified in their pro-evolution biology textbooks. (This includes Topeka and USD 501.)


. . .  which is being used as a rallying cry . . .

Quote
THAT is why we need a change in the Kansas Science Standards. To protect the academic freedom of Kansas science teachers and to protect the science students' right to learn ALL sides of the science story. Let's teach science, NOT censorship. Let's speak up for some science-education changes in 2011 and 2012.


These comments are in response to a pro-science letter to the TCJ yesterday.

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Stand Up For REAL Science!

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 12 2009,14:35   

Funny, I thought the purpose of textbooks was to cover the stuff that is already understood fairly well. The "big problems" of prebiotic evolution is not in that category, although I rather doubt that anybody would object to a teacher saying that we don't presently have a clear understanding of what happened when back then.

Henry

  
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