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Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,13:32    Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 10 2007,13:30) There's French people reading this and that didn't stop Richard.  ??? HAR HAR. FRENCHIES CAN'T READ! I'M NOT DESCENDED FROM A MONKEY, BUT THEY MIGHT BE! -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

carlsonjok Posts: 3326 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,13:34    Quote (Richardthughes @ Sep. 10 2007,13:21) Quick, to the informatics lab, Tardman! We should be able to see this extra, targeted protection, then...? Umm, Richard, we've already dealt with the informatics lab. I'm surprised you don't remember, as that is clearly you wielding the hammer sans pants. -------------- It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

factician Posts: 77 Joined: Aug. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,13:39    Quote (Richardthughes @ Sep. 10 2007,13:21) DaveTard: http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-136660 Quote 16 DaveScot 09/10/2007 1:17 pm Bob An obvious question arises - why doesn’t an organism degrade before its terminal point? Observation has revealed great variation in the level of protection and repair of genetic code both from one organism to the next and from one stretch of code to the next in the same organism. From an engineering perspective it’s trivial to protect some memory regions better than others. It’s all a matter of how much protection you need and how much overhead you’re willing to use to protect it. Code that needs to be maintained without error for geologic timespans gets better error detection/correction applied to it. Quick, to the informatics lab, Tardman! We should be able to see this extra, targeted protection, then...? Wow, I read that, and the stupid just burns.  It's just sad when they say cute stuff like that.  If you could only remove the blinders, he might actually be able to understand some fairly simple evolutionary biology... -------------- conspiracyfactory.blogspot.com

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,13:56    Davetard gets dangerously close to make predictions. Id doesn't do that... until they come in confirmed. -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,14:06    Denyse gets all more whiny: http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-136664 ID Predicts... Dembski's next post will about about Baylor. -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Albatrossity2 Posts: 2780 Joined: Mar. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,14:09    I just got the PDF version of Michael Sherman's opus re the "Universal Genome", touted by DaveTard as being in support of front-loading. If anyone wants a copy, PM me and I'll get it to you. It does seem that this went through some sort of review process (submitted 4/5/07, accepted 6/6/07), but a quick read does also indicate that the reviewers weren't paying much attention. There are many instances of appalling English grammar, typos, etc. I also have a new avatar, designed by my son. It is supposed to be a "Dire Penguin", but shrinking it down doesn't let you appreciate all of its intelligently designed features. Go here if you want to look at the full version. -------------- Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind Has been obligated from the beginning To create an ordered universe As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.                         - Pattiann Rogers

Erasmus, FCD Posts: 6349 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,14:17    HAR HAR THIS IS YOU VIOLATING TEH SLOT -------------- You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

Altabin Posts: 308 Joined: Sep. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,14:28    I'm bewildered by the new tactics on UD. First, as someone's already noted, Dave admits:   Quote In all fairness to nbogard (who is now being moderated) anyone who thinks a design inference is warranted is in some sense a creationist. The argument I think hinges on conflating “creationist” with biblical creationist. One can be the former without being the latter. Then Patrick weighs in:   Quote Even before I read what Dave wrote I was thinking the same thing. But I went to several dictionary websites and most conflate “creationist” with “biblical creationist”. Even this definition which doesn’t explicitly reference “God” or the “Bible”… “the doctrine that matter and all things were created, substantially as they now exist, by an omnipotent Creator, and not gradually evolved or developed.” …would rule out someone like Behe. In principle I don’t mind being labeled a creationist. The problem is that it causes confusion since it doesn’t recognize the significant distinctions. But, but, I thought ID was not creationism.  In fact, I thought it was not creationism.  In my foolishness, I even persuaded myself that ID  was not creationism at all.  In fact, I even thought that Michael Behe and William Dembski had both said that "ID is not creationism." Clearly I was mistaken. (So what gives?  Are they embracing their secret creationist selves?) --------------

Venus Mousetrap Posts: 201 Joined: Aug. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,14:37    Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Sep. 10 2007,14:17) HAR HAR THIS IS YOU VIOLATING TEH SLOT ... damn you. I need a new keyboard now. One without coffee on it.

Richardthughes Posts: 11178 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,14:39    Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Sep. 10 2007,14:17) HAR HAR THIS IS YOU VIOLATING TEH SLOT POTW? -------------- "Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield "You magnificent bastard! " : Louis "ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard "I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932 "...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

factician Posts: 77 Joined: Aug. 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,14:52    Denyse quivered: Quote They wouldn’t care if he won a Nobel Prize. It would be a huge embarrassment. Look, it’s this simple, guys: They don’t want Marks around if there is any chance that he can demonstrate that Darwin was wrong. Here come the black helicopters Denyse.  They're just trying to protect the Darwinism and the NWO! Her cup of crazy spilleth over... -------------- conspiracyfactory.blogspot.com

Rob Posts: 154 Joined: July 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,15:45    Quote (factician @ Sep. 10 2007,14:52) Denyse quivered:     Quote They wouldn’t care if he won a Nobel Prize. It would be a huge embarrassment. Look, it’s this simple, guys: They don’t want Marks around if there is any chance that he can demonstrate that Darwin was wrong. Yeah, universities hate it when their professors win Nobel Prizes for successfully overturning established theories.  After Einstein disproved aspects of classical physics, no university in the world wanted him, and he had to settle for that backwater diploma mill, Princeton. -------------- -- Rob, the fartist formerly known as 2ndclass

carlsonjok Posts: 3326 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,15:56    Quote (Rob @ Sep. 10 2007,15:45)     Quote (factician @ Sep. 10 2007,14:52) Denyse quivered:           Quote They wouldn’t care if he won a Nobel Prize. It would be a huge embarrassment. Look, it’s this simple, guys: They don’t want Marks around if there is any chance that he can demonstrate that Darwin was wrong. Yeah, universities hate it when their professors win Nobel Prizes for successfully overturning established theories.  After Einstein disproved aspects of classical physics, no university in the world wanted him, and he had to settle for that backwater diploma mill, Princeton. Well, duh.  I mean Princeton is the one place in New Jersey with a worse reputation than Newark.  Look at the reprobates that hang out there: ISCID William Dembski, Executive Director 66 Witherspoon Street, Suite 1800 Princeton, NJ 08542 -------------- It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

JohnW Posts: 3217 Joined: Aug. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,16:20    Quote (carlsonjok @ Sep. 10 2007,13:56) Quote (Rob @ Sep. 10 2007,15:45)       Quote (factician @ Sep. 10 2007,14:52) Denyse quivered:           Quote They wouldn’t care if he won a Nobel Prize. It would be a huge embarrassment. Look, it’s this simple, guys: They don’t want Marks around if there is any chance that he can demonstrate that Darwin was wrong. Yeah, universities hate it when their professors win Nobel Prizes for successfully overturning established theories.  After Einstein disproved aspects of classical physics, no university in the world wanted him, and he had to settle for that backwater diploma mill, Princeton. Well, duh.  I mean Princeton is the one place in New Jersey with a worse reputation than Newark.  Look at the reprobates that hang out there: ISCID William Dembski, Executive Director 66 Witherspoon Street, Suite 1800 Princeton, NJ 08542 I would have thought Dr Dr Dembski would drive a newer Jag than that.  Must be time for another Templeton grant. -------------- Math is just a language of reality. Its a waste of time to know it. - Robert Byers There isn't any probability that the letter d is in the word "mathematics"...  The correct answer would be "not even 0" - JoeG

steve_h Posts: 544 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,16:32    Dembski notes that it's OK to publish emails sent to you, if the sender also sent copies to some other people     Quote It started with Benjamin Kelley, dean of engineering and computer science at Baylor, sending Prof. Marks the following email (I share it here since Dean Kelley copied others at Baylor and had no compunction about embarrassing Prof. Marks with it) I don't know who those other people are (maybe they were the sort of person one might expect to be copied: personel dept, Sysadmins etc, not just people Marks had been trying to impress socially or whom Baylor employed to mock thier employees in public), so I won't get into that side too much, but this post did remind me of something from last year. In December 2006, Dembski sent an email to Dawkins and copied to all of the people he featured in ID's greatest work to date, the flash fart animation. Dawkins reproduced it on his web site and Demsbki got all self righteous about it.  He used it as an excuse to publish a previous (2006) email sent by Dawkins to Dembski (alone) and thereafter they both printed each others emails (according to DDD - I don't often read Dawkins site), but with Demsbki complaining about the fact that Dawkins was now doing the same thing as himself. I'm not sure if Dembski is now saying that Dawkins was right all along to publish his first multiple-recipient email and Dembski was just being melodramatic, or whether he still thinks it was wrong, but is using one person's immoral behaviour towards him as an excuse to act immorally towards someone else. http://www.uncommondescent.com/just-fo....lment-i http://www.uncommondescent.com/culture....s-crime

Arden Chatfield Posts: 6657 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,16:44    Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Sep. 10 2007,14:17) HAR HAR THIS IS YOU VIOLATING TEH SLOT Oh my God... look at the title... He's written Titus and Andronicus! -------------- "Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Rob Posts: 154 Joined: July 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,17:01    O'Leary:   Quote What does Bob Marks want? He wants the right to run computer simulations at Baylor that might (possibly) reduce confidence in Darwinian evolution. Has Baylor ever told Marks what simulations he can and cannot run on their computers?  Of course not.  He could be simulating a light saber battle with Darth Vader for all they care. Denyse and several others are trying to exploit this incident by making it seem that the Darwinian establishment is shutting down ID's attempts at research.  But Baylor isn't slowing anyone down by saying, "Publish this stuff on your own server, not ours."  Whether or not Baylor has behaved poorly in principle, IDists can't add this to their list of excuses for not doing research. -------------- -- Rob, the fartist formerly known as 2ndclass

Rob Posts: 154 Joined: July 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,17:13    I don't know what to make of this.  Tom English, a Dembski debunker and a member of the banned, is now an affiliate of the Evo Info Lab.  And Dembski still isn't listed. I can't tell if Dembski is really off the project or not.  As of Sept. 7, he was still saying, "Bob and I are committed to doing good work and letting the results go where they will."  But if English is in and Dembski is out, I think the lab will be legitimate.  I don't think that English will put up with having his name attached to junk pseudoresearch. This is a very surprising twist in this story. -------------- -- Rob, the fartist formerly known as 2ndclass

Arden Chatfield Posts: 6657 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,17:24    Quote (Rob @ Sep. 10 2007,17:13) I don't know what to make of this.  Tom English, a Dembski debunker and a member of the banned, is now an affiliate of the Evo Info Lab.  And Dembski still isn't listed. I can't tell if Dembski is really off the project or not.  As of Sept. 7, he was still saying, "Bob and I are committed to doing good work and letting the results go where they will."  But if English is in and Dembski is out, I think the lab will be legitimate.  I don't think that English will put up with having his name attached to junk pseudoresearch. This is a very surprising twist in this story. Maybe Marks didn't want to get dragged down into the shitter along with Dembski? Frankly, I have no idea why any scholar with a real professorship at a real university would want to be associated with Bill in any way. Bill's name recognition among creationist engineers and property managers can't possibly be worth it. -------------- "Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Reciprocating Bill Posts: 4265 Joined: Oct. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,17:26    Quote (Rob @ Sep. 10 2007,18:13) I don't know what to make of this.  Tom English, a Dembski debunker and a member of the banned, is now an affiliate of the Evo Info Lab.  And Dembski still isn't listed. I can't tell if Dembski is really off the project or not.  As of Sept. 7, he was still saying, "Bob and I are committed to doing good work and letting the results go where they will."  But if English is in and Dembski is out, I think the lab will be legitimate.  I don't think that English will put up with having his name attached to junk pseudoresearch. This is a very surprising twist in this story. Here is a verbatim transcript of a portion of a recent public exchange between Tom English and one of William Dembski's closest colleagues, speaking on Demski's behalf: Quote DaveScot 10/03/2006 5:44 am Thanks for playing, Tom. There's a lovely consolation prize waiting as you exit stage left. It's an Avida generated EQU instruction autographed by fellow chance worshipper/ professor-in-denial Richard Dawkins. -------------- Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be. "The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace "Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down." - Barry Arrington

argystokes Posts: 766 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,17:27    Quote (Rob @ Sep. 10 2007,15:13) I don't know what to make of this.  Tom English, a Dembski debunker and a member of the banned, is now an affiliate of the Evo Info Lab.  And Dembski still isn't listed. I can't tell if Dembski is really off the project or not.  As of Sept. 7, he was still saying, "Bob and I are committed to doing good work and letting the results go where they will."  But if English is in and Dembski is out, I think the lab will be legitimate.  I don't think that English will put up with having his name attached to junk pseudoresearch. This is a very surprising twist in this story. IIRC, there are two Tom Englishes (Toms English?), one who is an ID supporter or maybe even a DI fellow. This caused a bit of confusion when Good Tom appeared on UD last year, with Salvador being very deferential until he figured it out. -------------- "Why waste time learning, when ignorance is instantaneous?" -Calvin

carlsonjok Posts: 3326 Joined: May 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,17:30    Quote (argystokes @ Sep. 10 2007,17:27) Quote (Rob @ Sep. 10 2007,15:13) I don't know what to make of this.  Tom English, a Dembski debunker and a member of the banned, is now an affiliate of the Evo Info Lab.  And Dembski still isn't listed. I can't tell if Dembski is really off the project or not.  As of Sept. 7, he was still saying, "Bob and I are committed to doing good work and letting the results go where they will."  But if English is in and Dembski is out, I think the lab will be legitimate.  I don't think that English will put up with having his name attached to junk pseudoresearch. This is a very surprising twist in this story. IIRC, there are two Tom Englishes (Toms English?), one who is an ID supporter or maybe even a DI fellow. This caused a bit of confusion when Good Tom appeared on UD last year, with Salvador being very deferential until he figured it out. How to type your Tom English. It appears that this the Tom English that is associating with Dr. Marks is the same one that got banninated at Uncommon Descent last year. -------------- It's natural to be curious about our world, but the scientific method is just one theory about how to best understand it.  We live in a democracy, which means we should treat every theory equally. - Steven Colbert, I Am America (and So Can You!)

Reciprocating Bill Posts: 4265 Joined: Oct. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,17:53    Quote (carlsonjok @ Sep. 10 2007,18:30) It appears that this the Tom English that is associating with Dr. Marks is the same one that got banninated at Uncommon Descent last year. Definitely. I recall visiting his website while in the midst of the discussion that culminated in so many bannings (including my own). Same site linked to from the informatics site. That's the guy. -------------- Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be. "The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace "Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down." - Barry Arrington

Arden Chatfield Posts: 6657 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,18:03    Quote (Altabin @ Sep. 10 2007,14:28) I'm bewildered by the new tactics on UD. First, as someone's already noted, Dave admits:   Quote In all fairness to nbogard (who is now being moderated) anyone who thinks a design inference is warranted is in some sense a creationist. The argument I think hinges on conflating “creationist” with biblical creationist. One can be the former without being the latter. Then Patrick weighs in:   Quote Even before I read what Dave wrote I was thinking the same thing. But I went to several dictionary websites and most conflate “creationist” with “biblical creationist”. Even this definition which doesn’t explicitly reference “God” or the “Bible”… “the doctrine that matter and all things were created, substantially as they now exist, by an omnipotent Creator, and not gradually evolved or developed.” …would rule out someone like Behe. In principle I don’t mind being labeled a creationist. The problem is that it causes confusion since it doesn’t recognize the significant distinctions. But, but, I thought ID was not creationism.  In fact, I thought it was not creationism.  In my foolishness, I even persuaded myself that ID  was not creationism at all.  In fact, I even thought that Michael Behe and William Dembski had both said that "ID is not creationism." Clearly I was mistaken. (So what gives?  Are they embracing their secret creationist selves?) Insofar as I can make sense of it, their position seems to be that Intelligent Design is the same as creationism, but not the same as Creationism. -------------- "Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Hermagoras Posts: 1260 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,19:10    Tom English is also a poet.  And he's not shabby:     Quote Feast of Scraps Aboard the dreadnought Manifest Destiny there’s a feast of scraps beneath the table for any person with the nobility of a dog. I howl from below and dodge the jackboots I sense an EIL allegory. -------------- "I am not currently proving that objective morality is true. I did that a long time ago and you missed it." -- StephenB http://paralepsis.blogspot.com/....pot.com

N.Wells Posts: 1836 Joined: Oct. 2005 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,19:11    Carlsonjok, Great picture of suite 1800.  Perhaps that explains why Dembski was so eager to gain the use of a broom closet at Baylor.

Hermagoras Posts: 1260 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,19:12    Umm. . . . holy crap! Quote Do you think the younger races have more information for skin color than the younger races? I think it is fairly obvious that the East Africans have all the inherent traits of all the races in their genomes! Whereas it is also obvious that Europeans are much more deficient of the raw material to “make” other color races. To me it is clear that more information for skin color resides in the East Africans! It is commonly known that the black color is really a mixture of all the other colors when referring to materials, whereas white contains all the other colors when referring to light! As to how to extrapolate this basic fact for color information to the genome I do not know right now. As well you can clearly see genetic entropy in the wild with the sub-species of “horses” such as donkey and zebra. It is very easy to see which is closer to the parent species that was originally created by God and to see which has been “naturally selected” for to produce the “very limited variability” we can easily see in the sub-species! As far as front loading goes, I believe that “beneficial adaptations” will occur from preexisting information such as what we see in the polar bear from the grizzly bear but that the adaptation , though beneficial, will result in the loss of information from the original parent species. Such as the loss of information for hair color. Wow. Added: Link -------------- "I am not currently proving that objective morality is true. I did that a long time ago and you missed it." -- StephenB http://paralepsis.blogspot.com/....pot.com

Arden Chatfield Posts: 6657 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,19:58    Holee shit: Quote I think it is fairly obvious that the East Africans have all the inherent traits of all the races in their genomes! Whereas it is also obvious that Europeans are much more deficient of the raw material to “make” other color races. To me it is clear that more information for skin color resides in the East Africans! It is commonly known that the black color is really a mixture of all the other colors when referring to materials, whereas white contains all the other colors when referring to light! As to how to extrapolate this basic fact for color information to the genome I do not know right now. As well you can clearly see genetic entropy in the wild with the sub-species of “horses” such as donkey and zebra. It is very easy to see which is closer to the parent species that was originally created by God and to see which has been “naturally selected” for to produce the “very limited variability” we can easily see in the sub-species! Um, am I right that he's saying that White people were 'originally created by God' and that Black people are a result of natural selection? -------------- "Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

Hermagoras Posts: 1260 Joined: June 2007 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,20:05    Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Sep. 10 2007,19:58) Holee shit:     Quote I think it is fairly obvious that the East Africans have all the inherent traits of all the races in their genomes! Whereas it is also obvious that Europeans are much more deficient of the raw material to “make” other color races. To me it is clear that more information for skin color resides in the East Africans! It is commonly known that the black color is really a mixture of all the other colors when referring to materials, whereas white contains all the other colors when referring to light! As to how to extrapolate this basic fact for color information to the genome I do not know right now. As well you can clearly see genetic entropy in the wild with the sub-species of “horses” such as donkey and zebra. It is very easy to see which is closer to the parent species that was originally created by God and to see which has been “naturally selected” for to produce the “very limited variability” we can easily see in the sub-species! Um, am I right that he's saying that White people were 'originally created by God' and that Black people are a result of natural selection? It's hard to see through the Tard-fog, but I think he's saying exactly the opposite.  Creationism is the anti-racism!  Evolution leads to Nazism!  Etc. (insert creationist canards freely).   It's really odd, for sure.  He's forgotten that real people aren't actually white or black.   Cue up a little Bruce Cockburn:   Quote Who needs supremacy of pink people? There's no such thing as a pure racial strain Takes all colors to make a rainbow Takes every part to making a working brain -------------- "I am not currently proving that objective morality is true. I did that a long time ago and you missed it." -- StephenB http://paralepsis.blogspot.com/....pot.com

Arden Chatfield Posts: 6657 Joined: Jan. 2006 (Permalink) Posted: Sep. 10 2007,20:43    I note a certain deafening silence has descended on that thread, like BA77 just loudly farted in church. Part of it may be the extreme difficulty of figuring out which of two completely retarded ideas he's advocating. Sentences like the following sure don't help:   Quote Do you think the younger races have more information for skin color than the younger races? No, I think the younger races have more information, not the younger ones. -------------- "Rich is just mad because he thought all titties had fur on them until last week when a shorn transvestite ruined his childhood dreams by jumping out of a spider man cake and man boobing him in the face lips." - Erasmus

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