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  Topic: Can you do geology and junk the evolution bits ?, Anti science.< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
didymos



Posts: 1828
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,16:16   

Quote (OgreMkV @ Oct. 17 2009,12:01)
Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,12:14)
What are you talking about?  Of course the Bible contains metaphorical language.  Because a narrative contains a metaphor does not make the entire narrative a metaphor.

Now, here's the critical question:

How do you tell the difference?

Prayer?

--------------
I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron
Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

  
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,16:44   

Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,12:14)
There is no doubt of water covering the earth--even mountains (e.g. shells on Everest as mentioned earlier)--but you guys choose to interpret it as tectonic uplift or receding oceans. How you betray your arguments by not allowing the same latitude for the flood.  You need to read Baumgardner

1) Everest wasn't a mountain when it began to rise as a result of the Indian Plate subducting under Eurasia.
2) It's not a mere matter of "interpretation" as uplift when all the scientific data point that way and your view has none.
3) IF you HAVE studied both Baumgardner's claims and those of your opposition, why weren't you critical of Baumgardner's obvious errors?

Based on your previous blatherings, my informed guess is that you really don't know shit about Baumgardner's crap or the actual views of real scientists today.

So, how old are you, kid?

--------------
AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
Reed



Posts: 274
Joined: Feb. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,17:26   

Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,10:14)
There is no doubt of water covering the earth--even mountains (e.g. shells on Everest as mentioned earlier)--but you guys choose to interpret it as tectonic uplift or receding oceans. How you betray your arguments by not allowing the same latitude for the flood.

You are bullshitting again. Doesn't your religion tell you something about lying ? We don't just arbitrarily choose a particular explanation. We follow the evidence.

You previously said
   
Quote
Third, in reference to other comments--no one here can do any math without variables--and no one has them--because it is in the past.

Yet now, you are claiming the evidence supports your theory again. Why is it, that when you think evidence supports your theory, that's all good, but when some well supported evidence contradicts your theory, you retreat to "well anything could have happened, we just don't know!!!!111".

If you want to discard the utility of evidence, that's OK. There's nothing left to discuss, because you have abandoned reason as a valid path to understanding. Have fun in fantasy land, but please don't try to argue that your fantasy is supported by evidence!

If on the other hand you do accept the utility of evidence, you have a big problem. We have many, many lines of evidence that absolutely contradict a global flood in the last few hundred million years. For example, we have ice core records that have annual layers going back many thousands of years. There are lakes with sedimentary records going back tens of thousands of years. Heck, there are living trees that are older than your flood. Have a look at http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-noahs-ark.html.

  
Scienthuse



Posts: 43
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,18:35   

Quote (deadman_932 @ Oct. 17 2009,16:44)
Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,12:14)
There is no doubt of water covering the earth--even mountains (e.g. shells on Everest as mentioned earlier)--but you guys choose to interpret it as tectonic uplift or receding oceans. How you betray your arguments by not allowing the same latitude for the flood.  You need to read Baumgardner

1) Everest wasn't a mountain when it began to rise as a result of the Indian Plate subducting under Eurasia.
2) It's not a mere matter of "interpretation" as uplift when all the scientific data point that way and your view has none.
3) IF you HAVE studied both Baumgardner's claims and those of your opposition, why weren't you critical of Baumgardner's obvious errors?

Based on your previous blatherings, my informed guess is that you really don't know shit about Baumgardner's crap or the actual views of real scientists today.

So, how old are you, kid?

Your quite a lippy guy.    

Your so smart and intelligent and all--why don't you give me a lesson as to why this happened?

Clock in a rock


Keys in rock


Fossil hat


Petrified flour

"A small sample of petrified flour was chipped from one of the bags for analysis. It was like hammering hard rock. Microscopic examination revealed that the flour was still present, but all the air space had been filled with tiny calcium carbonate crystals. There was no burlap bag remaining—it must have rotted away."

doorknobs in coal


Why is this evidence not being presented in scientific conventions.  Is it because it is "religious?"

  
khan



Posts: 1554
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,18:44   

We're definitely into guano territory.

--------------
"It's as if all those words, in their hurry to escape from the loony, have fallen over each other, forming scrambled heaps of meaninglessness." -damitall

That's so fucking stupid it merits a wing in the museum of stupid. -midwifetoad

Frequency is just the plural of wavelength...
-JoeG

  
Dr.GH



Posts: 2333
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,18:49   

I think we have a loki troll.

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
someotherguy



Posts: 398
Joined: Aug. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,18:49   

This is about to get very entertaining very fast.

--------------
Evolander in training

  
didymos



Posts: 1828
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,18:54   

Quote (Dr.GH @ Oct. 17 2009,16:49)
I think we have a loki troll.

Hadn't occurred to me, but now that you mention it...

--------------
I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron
Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5455
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,18:56   

Quote (didymos @ Oct. 17 2009,19:54)
Quote (Dr.GH @ Oct. 17 2009,16:49)
I think we have a loki troll.

Hadn't occurred to me, but now that you mention it...

It's so hard to tell anymore, though, because no matter how fucking insane you make the parody, it's still not as insane as the real deal.

--------------
“Why do creationists have such a hard time with commas?

Linky“. ~ Steve Story, Legend

   
didymos



Posts: 1828
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,18:59   

Quote (Lou FCD @ Oct. 17 2009,16:56)
Quote (didymos @ Oct. 17 2009,19:54)
Quote (Dr.GH @ Oct. 17 2009,16:49)
I think we have a loki troll.

Hadn't occurred to me, but now that you mention it...

It's so hard to tell anymore, though, because no matter how fucking insane you make the parody, it's still not as insane as the real deal.

Oddly, this applies to metal bands as well as creationists.

--------------
I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron
Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,19:12   

Quote
Why is this evidence not being presented in scientific conventions.  Is it because it is "religious?"


that's probably not why.

lolololololololol

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3668
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,19:14   

I would like to point out that I am incredibly offended that you hotlinked to a site that requires cookies to be implanted on my PC.  Try doing things respectfully.

Furthermore, if you believe that any of that is a problem for science, then you really are incredibly confused.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
Texas Teach



Posts: 2084
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,19:54   

Quote (Lou FCD @ Oct. 17 2009,18:56)
Quote (didymos @ Oct. 17 2009,19:54)
Quote (Dr.GH @ Oct. 17 2009,16:49)
I think we have a loki troll.

Hadn't occurred to me, but now that you mention it...

It's so hard to tell anymore, though, because no matter how fucking insane you make the parody, it's still not as insane as the real deal.

I don't know.  GoP's use of sweaty wrestlers to prove geocentrism might have exceeded that upper bound.

--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5455
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,19:57   

Quote (Texas Teach @ Oct. 17 2009,20:54)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Oct. 17 2009,18:56)
Quote (didymos @ Oct. 17 2009,19:54)
 
Quote (Dr.GH @ Oct. 17 2009,16:49)
I think we have a loki troll.

Hadn't occurred to me, but now that you mention it...

It's so hard to tell anymore, though, because no matter how fucking insane you make the parody, it's still not as insane as the real deal.

I don't know.  GoP's use of sweaty wrestlers to prove geocentrism might have exceeded that upper bound.

You're not a regular at FSTDT then, I take it?

--------------
“Why do creationists have such a hard time with commas?

Linky“. ~ Steve Story, Legend

   
Dr.GH



Posts: 2333
Joined: May 2002

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:09   

Is that pronounced "fisted?"

I am doing two lectures next week at Cal State Fullerton. I think I'll add those photos of creato frauds to my slides of Carl Baugh's fake foot prints.

Edited by Dr.GH on Oct. 17 2009,18:13

--------------
"Science is the horse that pulls the cart of philosophy."

L. Susskind, 2004 "SMOLIN VS. SUSSKIND: THE ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE"

   
Texas Teach



Posts: 2084
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:12   

Quote (Lou FCD @ Oct. 17 2009,19:57)
Quote (Texas Teach @ Oct. 17 2009,20:54)
 
Quote (Lou FCD @ Oct. 17 2009,18:56)
 
Quote (didymos @ Oct. 17 2009,19:54)
   
Quote (Dr.GH @ Oct. 17 2009,16:49)
I think we have a loki troll.

Hadn't occurred to me, but now that you mention it...

It's so hard to tell anymore, though, because no matter how fucking insane you make the parody, it's still not as insane as the real deal.

I don't know.  GoP's use of sweaty wrestlers to prove geocentrism might have exceeded that upper bound.

You're not a regular at FSTDT then, I take it?

After reading the quote about NASA finding a missing day (WTF? How would that even work?), I retract my previous post.  I'm going to go stare at Lou's picture of heaven until my mind is cleansed.

ETA: lol at Dr. GH

--------------
"Creationists think everything Genesis says is true. I don't even think Phil Collins is a good drummer." --J. Carr

"I suspect that the English grammar books where you live are outdated" --G. Gaulin

  
Scienthuse



Posts: 43
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:26   

I thought you guys were going to let me know why this happened.  No matter how "crazy" I am you still have rocks with modern artifacts in them.  This would have profound implications on your teaching about lithification.  Can anyone answer this?  If you can, besides claiming fraud, I would be very interested in knowing how these rocks lithified so fast but the rest of the lithosphere hardened slowly several small  layers at a time.

As I said, I have touched hardened boulders that have fallen from the cliff/ banks they came from.  Yet the boulders stacked up above them are still soft, and the cliff is soft.

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5455
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:30   

Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,21:26)
I thought you guys were going to let me know why this happened.  No matter how "crazy" I am you still have rocks with modern artifacts in them.  This would have profound implications on your teaching about lithification.  Can anyone answer this?  If you can, besides claiming fraud, I would be very interested in knowing how these rocks lithified so fast but the rest of the lithosphere hardened slowly several small  layers at a time.

As I said, I have touched hardened boulders that have fallen from the cliff/ banks they came from.  Yet the boulders stacked up above them are still soft, and the cliff is soft.

Here's an idea: I'll do my own homework instead, and you do yours for a change.

Lazy fucker.

--------------
“Why do creationists have such a hard time with commas?

Linky“. ~ Steve Story, Legend

   
didymos



Posts: 1828
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:37   

Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,18:26)
As I said, I have touched hardened boulders that have fallen from the cliff/ banks they came from.  Yet the boulders stacked up above them are still soft, and the cliff is soft.

Dude!  You should go back there with a sledgehammer and/or explosives and do some field research.

--------------
I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron
Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:53   

Quote (didymos @ Oct. 17 2009,21:37)
Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,18:26)
As I said, I have touched hardened boulders that have fallen from the cliff/ banks they came from.  Yet the boulders stacked up above them are still soft, and the cliff is soft.

Dude!  You should go back there with a sledgehammer and/or explosives and do some field research.

yeah, no shit!  

wait, YOU HAVE THESE ARTIFACTS?????//??/???

you might try dialing up Science or Nature, i'm sure they'd love to hear your expert analysis!

pssst if you do that lock your doors at night and don't answer the phone.  the EAC will be after you.

MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

tard

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:54   

Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,18:35)
Your quite a lippy guy.    

Your so smart and intelligent and all--why don't you give me a lesson as to why this happened?
[snip AIG and Creation magazine pics]

Why is this evidence not being presented in scientific conventions.  Is it because it is "religious?"

I may be lippy, but I know the difference between a possessive and a contraction. This also seems to have eluded you. 

I also know that it's unlikely to have your "pictures" presented in a "scientific convention" -- not because they're "religious," but because the con artists trying to sell them to sheep like you never presented any scientific papers analyzing the materials.

You sure haven't done that either.  How about you try giving me something to analyze other than photos that can be easily faked? I'd like to see hard-copy studies, with chemical analyses, dating methods, chain-of-evidence data, and so forth. Got any?

I also notice that in your Gish-Galloping hurry to move on,  that you never acknowledged the obvious errors in Baumgardner's claims -- although you were bubbling over just a while ago about how good his work was.

Oh, and how old are you?

--------------
AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
Reed



Posts: 274
Joined: Feb. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:56   

Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,18:26)
I thought you guys were going to let me know why this happened. No matter how "crazy" I am you still have rocks with modern artifacts in them.  This would have profound implications on your teaching about lithification.

No, the only thing it implies that you are either a troll, or profoundly gullible and ignorant. I lean toward the former, but as a great man once said* "Sufficiently advanced idiocy is indistinguishable from trolling"

On the off chance you are actually serious, you had an opportunity here to have an honest, serious discussion with people who know a lot about geology, paleontology and related topics. By ignoring or failing to comprehend their responses, and instead just pasting obvious creationist bullshit, you've lost that chance. Your loss.

* paraphrased loosely.

  
Doc Bill



Posts: 1039
Joined: April 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:56   

Hey, I just got a call from a guy named Noah.

Says he left his hat on Mt. Ararat.

Anybody seen it?

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,20:59   

Quote (Doc Bill @ Oct. 17 2009,21:56)
Hey, I just got a call from a guy named Noah.

Says he left his hat on Mt. Ararat.

Anybody seen it?

he dropped it when Ham was giving him the old amurrikan style butt sex.

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
OgreMkV



Posts: 3668
Joined: Oct. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,21:03   

Quote (didymos @ Oct. 17 2009,16:16)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Oct. 17 2009,12:01)
Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,12:14)
What are you talking about?  Of course the Bible contains metaphorical language.  Because a narrative contains a metaphor does not make the entire narrative a metaphor.

Now, here's the critical question:

How do you tell the difference?

In case you missed it...  

I really, really want this one answered.

--------------
Ignored by those who can't provide evidence for their claims.

http://skepticink.com/smilodo....retreat

   
deadman_932



Posts: 3094
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,21:04   

Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Oct. 17 2009,20:53)
Quote (didymos @ Oct. 17 2009,21:37)
 
Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,18:26)
As I said, I have touched hardened boulders that have fallen from the cliff/ banks they came from.  Yet the boulders stacked up above them are still soft, and the cliff is soft.

Dude!  You should go back there with a sledgehammer and/or explosives and do some field research.

yeah, no shit!  

wait, YOU HAVE THESE ARTIFACTS?????//??/???

you might try dialing up Science or Nature, i'm sure they'd love to hear your expert analysis!

pssst if you do that lock your doors at night and don't answer the phone.  the EAC will be after you.

MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

tard

Maybe he just likes touching "hardened" boulders and stuff with his soft, uncalloused, trembling-with-sweaty-anticipation hands.

--------------
AtBC Award for Thoroughness in the Face of Creationism

  
Henry J



Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,21:31   

Quote
(Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,12:14)
What are you talking about?  Of course the Bible contains metaphorical language.  Because a narrative contains a metaphor does not make the entire narrative a metaphor.


Therefore, even if the narrative as a whole is non-metaphor, there's no reason to assume that any one particular part of it isn't such?

Quote
Fossil hat

Indian Jones meets Doctor Who.

Henry

  
Scienthuse



Posts: 43
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 17 2009,23:52   

Quote (deadman_932 @ Oct. 17 2009,20:54)
Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,18:35)
Your quite a lippy guy.    

Your so smart and intelligent and all--why don't you give me a lesson as to why this happened?
[snip AIG and Creation magazine pics]

Why is this evidence not being presented in scientific conventions.  Is it because it is "religious?"

I may be lippy, but I know the difference between a possessive and a contraction. This also seems to have eluded you. 

I also know that it's unlikely to have your "pictures" presented in a "scientific convention" -- not because they're "religious," but because the con artists trying to sell them to sheep like you never presented any scientific papers analyzing the materials.

You sure haven't done that either.  How about you try giving me something to analyze other than photos that can be easily faked? I'd like to see hard-copy studies, with chemical analyses, dating methods, chain-of-evidence data, and so forth. Got any?

I also notice that in your Gish-Galloping hurry to move on,  that you never acknowledged the obvious errors in Baumgardner's claims -- although you were bubbling over just a while ago about how good his work was.

Oh, and how old are you?

Where are his errors--the age of the earth? Or the age of the coastal crust?  I must have missed it.  Obviously--he's a PhD and he must have missed it too.

  
Scienthuse



Posts: 43
Joined: Sep. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 18 2009,00:01   

Deadman--good one--"you're."  Is that better?  You didn't catch the fact that sometimes I put a period on the end of a question.  I bet you never have to edit your papers.  Technically, there is no compound word for "deadman."  It's "dead man."  Now you're going to explain that since it's a proper noun it is justified.  How petty!

  
didymos



Posts: 1828
Joined: Mar. 2008

(Permalink) Posted: Oct. 18 2009,00:02   

Quote (Scienthuse @ Oct. 17 2009,21:52)
Where are his errors--


In his writing.

Quote

the age of the earth?


Yes.

Quote
Or the age of the coastal crust?


Roger that.

Quote

 I must have missed it.


Sure did.

Quote

 Obviously--he's a PhD and he must have missed it too.


Damn straight.

--------------
I wouldn't be bothered reading about the selfish gene because it has never been identified. -- Denyse O'Leary, professional moron
Again "how much". I don't think that's a good way to be quantitative.-- gpuccio

  
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