Thought Provoker
Posts: 530
Joined: April 2007
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Hi Louis,
| Quote (Louis @ Feb. 13 2010,08:59) | | I find the whole notroversy over evolutionary biology to be hilarious. The contortions that IDCists et al will go to to avoid something they don't like are genuinely funny. Please don't disappoint me and retort that "well the scientists do just the same" because to be blunt, they don't. I disagree with Joy that this is a mere matter of duelling metaphysics for both "sides" (yuk, hack, ptui) in this "debate" (cough, spit, bleaurgh), in fact I'd go further, this is Joy projecting her attitudes onto others. An all too common affliction. |
Hopefully, I won't disappoint you. The reason I tended to post at Telic Thought is that I like to argue. It is less interesting to argue with people you agree with.
I disagree with Joy concerning her presumed attitudes of scientists and she knows it. I think religious organizations and movements (e.g. ID Movement) are far more dangerous than people focused on obtaining scientific knowledge.
I do think there is a culture war going on, i.e. "dueling metaphysics". Especially in the United States (yes, I'm an American).
I see this as more than a "notroversy" over evolutionary biology. It is apparent to just about everybody the Discovery Institute also sees it as something bigger. Just read the wedge document.
| Quote (Louis @ Feb. 13 2010,08:59) | | Despite being an atheist, i.e. I lack a belief in any form of deity, and a professional scientist (not just someone who plays one on the internet) I actually have no dog in the hunt so to speak. If it turns out that the course of evolution really is teleological and there is a god then, regardless of any further implications, we will have discovered something new and wonderful about the universe. I know there are other people who don't understand that attitude. Science doesn't care what you claim is true, it cares how you claim it to be true. It's about what you can establish to be the best, most coherent, parsimonious, evidence based explanation for a series of phenomena. IDC and sundry creationisms simply don't manage to do this in any sense. Despite all the handwaving and special pleading. |
It is nice to hear a kindred spirit. I honestly think it would be neat if it turned out there was a God. The universe might be a supernatural science fair project. If it is, I hope we get first place.
| Quote (Louis @ Feb. 13 2010,08:59) | | I don't remember if you are an American or not, but from outside the USA this "debate" is largely seen for what it actually is: a faux controversy manufactured by a specific series of religious sects. Of course, as usual huge public apathy and a natural human tendancy to (often falsely) attribute the "truth" to the mid point between two opposed camps covers a mutitude of sins, but the claimed controversy simply doesn't exist in anything like the same way outside the USA. |
That's as I understood it. Glad to hear more confirmation.
| Quote (Louis @ Feb. 13 2010,08:59) | | As for the title and thus topic of the thread, I think it's a false dichotomy, a complete category error. It's the wrong question to be asking. |
I was wondering when this would come up. It is also my presumption this is a false dichotomy and neither exists.
While unsubstantiated presumptions are all but worthless to scientists, they end up effecting voters and , therefore, public policy in the United States.
Besides that, I feel better if I have an internally consistant worldview I feel comfortable enough to expose to criticism.
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I like it.
