Antievolution.org - Antievolution.org Discussion Board -Topic::Telic Thoughts Thread

Posted: April 03 2010,13:46

Quote (Zachriel @ April 01 2010,20:14)

Quote

Zachriel: Nor do we have to have knowledge of molecular genetics to know about inheritance or show that certain traits are heritable.

ID guy: You can't show something is heritable without that knowledge.

So much for Mendelian Inheritance.

It's hard to believe, but ID guy doesn't even know about the birds and the bees. Yes, ID guy, when birds reproduce they make little baby birds, not bees. When sunflowers reproduce, they make more sunflowers.

{Instructions: Take 4" needle. Jab (you are going through bone) firmly in the upper left corner of right eye socket or upper right corner of left eye socket until you push passed bone. Mix vigorously}

Oh yeah Mr. Evilutionist? That's what ID says all along. Kinds only give birth to kinds! It is Evilution that says dogs give birth to cats or liberals give birth to human babies!

{Warning: Once contents inside brain case are stirred, the process is irreversible}

Crap.

--------------
Marriage is not a lifetime commitment, it's a life sentence!

Zachriel

Posts: 2723
Joined: Sep. 2006

Posted: April 05 2010,18:25

Chunkdz has a well-documented history of trolling. The latest case:

Quote

chunkdz: One of the following utterly incorrect statements was generated by a random sentence generator I found on the web.

The other utterly incorrect statement was generated by Zachriel.

Which one is which?

Quote

A) "Fascism is a right wing philosophy."

Quote

B) "Abiogenesis is a testable hypothesis".

Of course, chunkdz's purpose is to divert Thought Provoker's topic. There's no way to respond without contributing to that diversion. So, like with most trolls, it's best left unfed.

--------------

You never step on the same tard twice—for it's not the same tard and you're not the same person.

Zachriel

Posts: 2723
Joined: Sep. 2006

Posted: April 09 2010,09:31

It's been two Earth years since first posting the story of William and his new Victorian home. Yet, no one has bothered to try to calculate the CSI of a few simple examples.

Quote

Zachriel: The question on the table is whether Dembski's specified complexity is a valid, objective measure. After many attempts, no one has ever taken the time to work through a few examples.

Dembski: Can objects, even if nothing is known about how they arose, exhibit features that reliably signal the action of an intelligent cause?

Quote

Today, William got an incredible deal on an old Victorian house. Highly satisfied with his business acumen, William settled in for a blissful night of sleep in his new home.

SLAM!

William woke with a start. He listened intently. But he didn't hear anything, so he settled back to sleep.

Cree..eak

William listened even more closely this time until, after a bit, the creaking noise died away. For some reason, he recalled the seller's maniacal laughter just after William signed the papers to buy the house.

SLAM!

William was trembling and his teeth were rattling. He thought about getting out of bed to investigate. Instead, he pulled the covers over his head.

Cree..eak

Hmm, William thought. Being a famous design theoretician, I can use the patented (not really) Dembski Inference to determine if the pattern is being caused by a ghost, er, some unspecified intelligent cause.

SLAM!
Cree..eak
SLAM!
Cree..eak
SLAM!
Cree..eak
SLAM!
Cree..eak

For our first calculation. Let's assume the pattern is 01010101010101 �

Using Dembski's Inference, what can we infer about the pattern without risking a venture about the house? Assume the pattern is regular for now. Be sure to show your math (e.g. Chance Hypothesis).

And remember! No peeking from beneath the covers!

Well, after all that time, William's home needs some repairs. There is a leak that drips into a pan and keeps William up at night. As he listens, he notices that the pattern is not regular, but sporadic. He wonders if it is sending a message of some kind. Being scared of the dark, and still spooked by being unable to determine the CSI of the Cree..eaks and SLAM!s, he pulls the covers up over his head, and listens intently.

Will William be able to calculate the CSI of the drips? Or will the sound of his chattering teeth overwhelm the ~~ghostly message~~, er, communication from an unspecified Intelligent Designer?

--------------

You never step on the same tard twice—for it's not the same tard and you're not the same person.

Henry J

Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

Posted: April 09 2010,12:36

Maybe he should call the Ghostbusters?

Aardvark

Posts: 134
Joined: Feb. 2006

Posted: April 18 2010,15:01

Slaying not harmful if the Bible defines it that way, or something, according to DL:

Quote

I guess you want to define slaying as "harmful" by definition, but apparently the Bible doesn't go by that definition.

oldmanintheskydidntdoit

Posts: 4999
Joined: July 2006

Posted: April 21 2010,06:20

dim-wit Guts believes that children should be murdered for their parents sins

Quote

And if Grandpa ignored the warning, the kid deserves to die. Perfectly patient, perfectly just, perfectly merciful. Praise the Lord.

Yes, especially if the kid keeps acting like the kids before him did.

What a nice person.

--------------
I also mentioned that He'd have to give me a thorough explanation as to *why* I must "eat human babies".
FTK

if there are even critical flaws in Gauger�s work, the evo mat narrative cannot stand
Gordon Mullings

Gunthernacus

Posts: 235
Joined: April 2007

Posted: April 21 2010,12:43

Bradford is lonely:

Quote

Do human females have a protein factor whose expression or lack thereof affects their mating drives?

--------------
Given that we are all descended from Adam and Eve...genetic defects as a result of intra-family marriage would not begin to crop up until after the first few dozen generations. - Dr. Hugh Ross

fnxtr

Posts: 3504
Joined: June 2006

Posted: April 21 2010,20:28

Quote (Gunthernacus @ April 21 2010,10:43)

Bradford is lonely:

Quote

Do human females have a protein factor whose expression or lack thereof affects their mating drives?

bwa ha ha ha!

--------------
"[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory

"Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night." Joe G

keiths

Posts: 2195
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: April 24 2010,10:36

A goofy comment from MikeGene:

Quote

Whether or not free will is supernatural is not important to me and I agree with you about that conclusion. But I do know that free will is not an illusion anymore more than my thoughts are illusions. I know from a lifetime of experience that I have the ability to choose against my biological urges and against my environmental pressures and conditioning. In fact, my life and identity are defined by those choices and nature and nurture together are insufficient to explain my life.

--------------
And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number. -- Joe G

Please stop putting words into my mouth that don't belong there and thoughts into my mind that don't belong there. -- KF

Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: April 24 2010,11:45

Quote (keiths @ April 24 2010,10:36)

A goofy comment from MikeGene:

Quote

Whether or not free will is supernatural is not important to me and I agree with you about that conclusion. But I do know that free will is not an illusion anymore more than my thoughts are illusions. I know from a lifetime of experience that I have the ability to choose against my biological urges and against my environmental pressures and conditioning. In fact, my life and identity are defined by those choices and nature and nurture together are insufficient to explain my life.

No, Mike, Godmeme made you do it.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Posts: 1556
Joined: Aug. 2005

Posted: May 02 2010,12:10

Quote

Zachriel Says:
May 2nd, 2010 at 10:37 am

zykander: The SETI project are looking for anomalous radio sources.

The SETI radio hypothesis is based on the theory that evolution of biology and technology might occur on other planets suitable for carbon-based life, much as it did on Earth. Narrow-band signals are a solution based in the physics of transmission energy and communications, something humans are known to use. Radio signals pass easily through interstellar space. The test will set a bound on the frequency of such an occurrence by sampling the local galactic sector. Other tests are determining the number of planets, and the number of planets with suitable environments. Future tests may be able to detect the presence of life (such as free oxygen in the atmosphere).

Presumably, non-technological life is much more common than technological life. If someone were to have sampled Earth at various points in its history, there is only a very small likelihood, about 0.0000025%, of having detected narrow-band radio signals. SETI would not detect the world of Thales, Confucius or Descartes.

Comment by Zachriel � May 2, 2010 @ 10:37 am

Zachriel talks to an empty chair.

olegt

Posts: 1405
Joined: Dec. 2006

Posted: May 09 2010,21:30

Daniel Smith (remember him?) tells it like it is. �

Quote

My thoughts are that ID is wasting time by concentrating on the whole "detecting design" gimmick. It's basically a ruse to get God back in science. We all know that. (In spite of the odd "non-believing IDer" and the so-called "Big Tent".)

So I say � drop the ruse � admit that you're coming from the "I believe God did all this" perspective and start doing real science from that perspective.

Let's see what ID fans say to that.

--------------
If you are not:
Galapagos Finch
please Logout �

Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: May 10 2010,08:54

Using my patented "typo's per word and curses per paragraph" stress analysis algorithm, Joe is flustered and not enjoying the current exchange.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Posts: 1556
Joined: Aug. 2005

Posted: May 10 2010,13:27

Quote (olegt @ May 09 2010,16:30)

Daniel Smith (remember him?) tells it like it is. �
�

Quote

My thoughts are that ID is wasting time by concentrating on the whole "detecting design" gimmick. It's basically a ruse to get God back in science. We all know that. (In spite of the odd "non-believing IDer" and the so-called "Big Tent".)

So I say � drop the ruse � admit that you're coming from the "I believe God did all this" perspective and start doing real science from that perspective.

Let's see what ID fans say to that.

Nothing will be my guess, unless he repeats it a few times, in which case he may find difficulty posting comments. �I am pleased Dan now sees the �ID movement for what it is. If I could post at TT I would suggest he is ready to move on to the Biologos blog. I think he deserves credit for his honesty and for admitting to his earlier motives.

Quack

Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

Posted: May 10 2010,16:45

Quote

admit that you're coming from the "I believe God did all this" perspective and start doing real science from that perspective.

As always, I may be wrong, seeing things that are not there - but doing real science from what perspective?

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
Robert Byers.

Posts: 1556
Joined: Aug. 2005

Posted: May 12 2010,07:42

Quack,May 10 2010,11:45

�

Quote

...from what perspective?

I guess from the perspective that everything was ultimately created by the god of your choice. Catholics, TEs and so on don't seem to have a problem with religious belief and observed reality.

Quack

Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

Posted: May 12 2010,08:40

I have a problem with "I believe God did all this" - isn't that just what Dembski and Behe says, the 'designer did it', wholesale, including bacterial flagellum, cytochrome C and the blood clotting chain? What's left to do science about - emergence, random mutations, natural selection, chaos, chance, autocatalysis?

I admit I don't know anything about TE, but if it encompasses the belief that God manipulate molecules - either by magic or by growing pseudopods, �what's left for science?

OTOH; I find it all right if people adopt a belief in a divine spirit pervading the universe; the universe is awesome!

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
Robert Byers.

dogdidit

Posts: 315
Joined: Mar. 2008

Posted: May 13 2010,11:36

Richardthughes sighting at TT.

Congratulations RtH on resisting the urge to shout
"OWN GOOOOOOOOAAAAAALLLLLLL!!!!!!!

edited to remove superfluous O's

--------------
"Humans carry plants and animals all over the globe, thus introducing them to places they could never have reached on their own. That certainly increases biodiversity." - D'OL

Henry J

Posts: 5786
Joined: Mar. 2005

Posted: May 13 2010,16:24

So how many "O"'s were there before the editing to remove superfluous ones?

Badger3k

Posts: 861
Joined: Mar. 2008

Posted: May 13 2010,20:36

Quote (Quack @ May 12 2010,08:40)

I have a problem with "I believe God did all this" - isn't that just what Dembski and Behe says, the 'designer did it', wholesale, including bacterial flagellum, cytochrome C and the blood clotting chain? What's left to do science about - emergence, random mutations, natural selection, chaos, chance, autocatalysis?

I admit I don't know anything about TE, but if it encompasses the belief that God manipulate molecules - either by magic or by growing pseudopods, �what's left for science?

OTOH; I find it all right if people adopt a belief in a divine spirit pervading the universe; the universe is awesome!

All it is is setting the boundaries of where the magic starts at different places. TE puts it further back than where the IDiots put it. And both of them usually put it further back than your basic literal (YE) creationist - although there are those in the ID camp, as we all know.

--------------
"Just think if every species had a different genetic code We would have to eat other humans to survive.." : Joe G

Quack

Posts: 1961
Joined: May 2007

Posted: May 14 2010,03:04

Shouldn't it rather be where the magic ends?

The way I look at it, isn't it about where or when the creator was done with his job and left the world free to develop on its own although restrained by the rules he'd laid down?

--------------
Rocks have no biology.
Robert Byers.

Posts: 1556
Joined: Aug. 2005

Posted: May 14 2010,14:52

Quote (Richardthughes @ May 10 2010,03:54)

Using my patented "typo's per word and curses per paragraph" stress analysis algorithm, Joe is flustered and not enjoying the current exchange.

You might find some material for stick-poking here, Rich.

Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: May 14 2010,15:13

Quote (Alan Fox @ May 14 2010,14:52)

Quote (Richardthughes @ May 10 2010,03:54)

Using my patented "typo's per word and curses per paragraph" stress analysis algorithm, Joe is flustered and not enjoying the current exchange.

You might find some material for stick-poking here, Rich.

Cheers Alan.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

fnxtr

Posts: 3504
Joined: June 2006

Posted: May 14 2010,19:01

Quote (Alan Fox @ May 14 2010,12:52)

Quote (Richardthughes @ May 10 2010,03:54)

Using my patented "typo's per word and curses per paragraph" stress analysis algorithm, Joe is flustered and not enjoying the current exchange.

You might find some material for stick-poking here, Rich.

Quote

Also the eye of today is not the designed eye. Meaning �bad design� could have crept in over the generations.

What with, you know, genetic entropy after Teh Fall, and everything.

--------------
"[A] book said there were 5 trillion witnesses. Who am I supposed to believe, 5 trillion witnesses or you? That shit's, like, ironclad. " -- stevestory

"Wow, you must be retarded. I said that CO2 does not trap heat. If it did then it would not cool down at night." Joe G

KCdgw

Posts: 376
Joined: Sep. 2002

Posted: May 16 2010,09:39

Joe/ID Guy, the gift that just keeps on giving:

olegt:

Quote

ID guy wrote:

Quote

Dr Jones is a professional biologist.

I don't think so, Joe. Jones has a B. Sc. in biology and was studying to become a biology teacher in 2009. Link.

Joe:

Quote

He says he is a biologist�

--------------
Those who know the truth are not equal to those who love it-- Confucius

Posts: 1556
Joined: Aug. 2005

Posted: May 17 2010,15:55

Banned at TT, but who cares! I got guts, chunkdz and JoeG all at Design Matrix

Zachriel

Posts: 2723
Joined: Sep. 2006

Posted: May 17 2010,16:43

Quote (Alan Fox @ May 17 2010,15:55)

Banned at TT, but who cares! I got guts, chunkdz and JoeG all at Design Matrix

When were you banned?

--------------

You never step on the same tard twice—for it's not the same tard and you're not the same person.

keiths

Posts: 2195
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: May 17 2010,17:08

Quote (Zachriel @ May 17 2010,14:43)

Quote (Alan Fox @ May 17 2010,15:55)

Banned at TT, but who cares! I got guts, chunkdz and JoeG all at Design Matrix

When were you banned?

He was zykander.

--------------
And the set of natural numbers is also the set that starts at 0 and goes to the largest number. -- Joe G

Please stop putting words into my mouth that don't belong there and thoughts into my mind that don't belong there. -- KF

Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006

Posted: May 18 2010,12:34

Tardic Tards is turning out to be moar_fun that I thought it would.

--------------
"Richardthughes, you magnificent bastard, I stand in awe of you..." : Arden Chatfield
"You magnificent bastard! " : Louis
"ATBC poster child", "I have to agree with Rich.." : DaveTard
"I bow to your superior skills" : deadman_932
"...it was Richardthughes making me lie in bed.." : Kristine

Posts: 11178
Joined: Jan. 2006