The Ghost of Paley
Posts: 1703
Joined: Oct. 2005
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| Quote | 1) Here is the original claim YOU made:
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For example, I claim that Muslims, as a group, do not assimilate as well as other groups, and in fact their culture often damages civil liberties. Is this bigotry or simply stating an unpleasant truth? You obviously think the former, but if you're right you should point to evidence (not isolated examples) that Muslims do in fact assimilate, or that we are more free to speak our minds than previously. |
Bolding mine.
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You know Louis, I'm reading that statement over and over, and yet I don't see where "other groups" translates into "all other groups". Since I've never claimed that Muslims are the only group that doesn't assimilate (quite the contrary), then why would I make an unnecessarily strong claim? In fact, the fuller definition you just gave shows that the "groups" I was referring to were Jews, N.E. Asians, and Indians. Here, let's look again:
| Quote | By "integration", I mean:
1) No more likely to commit violent crimes as a group than the population as a whole (15 % pts above national violent crime rates at maximum) ;
2) No cries for "affirmative action";
3) Roughly proportionate representation in the intellectual occupations (doctors, lawyers, and/or scientists) without relying on 2). Yes, this implies good scores on standardised scholastic tests;
4) A culture that tolerates Western norms.
Groups that satisfy all the above conditions:
Jews, N.E. Asians, S.E. Asians (I think), Indians.
Notice that it's OK if an immigrant group beats the native population in these areas -- I'm not afraid of hypercompetitive groups. Please notice the word "tolerates" in point 4). |
Also notice 1) which explicitly compares Muslims "as a group" to "the population as a whole". This was an attempt to give you a break, so you wouldn't have to compare the three hypercompetitive groups against Muslims -- only with the general population. And the Muslims fail even that test, because they are overrepresented in the criminal prison population, which means that the rest of the population is underrepresented!!! So your very nitpicking works agin you.
| Quote | | 3) Reading the stats from my previous post we see that muslims are more represented in the prison population than in the general population. As I explained before this isn't a problem for me bevause I'm not claiming differently. However it is a problem for Gippy IF another group is even more represented in the prison population than muslims when it relates back to the presence in the general population. Non religious people are more represented by far in the prison population than are muslims, and vastly more than present in the general population. |
As I've noted, not only is this claim false, it doesn't even make sense, as I've always argued that several different groups don't assimilate well. By the way, you never proved that the nonreligious are overrepresented in prison, so your other point fails as well.
| Quote | As for violent crime, look at how under-represented asians/muslims are in violent crimes, much less than the white/christian majority even taking into account proportion of general population.
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Like I said, Louis, if you want to shift the claim to, "Asian Muslims assimilate well", that's OK. I was told to focus on religion, not race, so why are you bitching because I followed directions? Geez, make up your mind, dude: I can't be a racist and race-blind at the same time.
| Quote | | The point is Gippy you made a big claim which you had every chance to redefine, take back, or modify and yet you ploughed ahead regardless. You have been hoist by your own bigotry, so eager are you to promote your pre-existing racist fantasies. |
OK, earlier you were complaining that I was ignoring racial subcategories (a terrible thing, apparently), now you're claiming I was promoting my "pre-existing racist fantasies" during the debate. This makes no sense.
| Quote | This is why I keep telling you Gippy, you're fucking transparent sonny. Not only is the claim AS STATED AND DEFINED BY YOU false, but you are now resorting to equivocation to back away from it. I said right at the outset this was not a thread about the benefits/flaws of immigration,it was merely a thread about you demonstrating your claim to be true. You have not done that with all your news stories, bigotry and obfuscation because one simple set of stats show that you claim is false.
Keep whining dumbass. As I have said many many times, you fool no one. What a laughable, contemptable little clown you are.
Louis |
Wow, Louis, you must be kicking my tail, because you're behaving in such a calm, rational, self-confident manner. Too bad you can't be such a tuffy when it really counts.
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Dey can't 'andle my riddim.
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