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  Topic: Intellectually Honest Christians?, Is it possible?< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Mike PSS

Posts: 428
Joined: Sep. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: Jan. 10 2007,09:34   

Quote (skeptic @ Jan. 10 2007,09:58)
Quote (Mike PSS @ Jan. 10 2007,08:42)
You give up too easily skeptic.  From an independent observer I can make the following summary by analogy.  This is only my words and my view at present.

 This poorly put together analogy is (I think) what Lenny is alluding to when he states your perception is locked into authority.  You "need" to have something spelled out as omnipotent/all-powerful or over-arching to make sense of everything else.

Two quick ones:

I'm not giving up, I just don't want to sidetrack Scary's discussion any further.

And the idea of an omnipotent/all-powerful authority is not a requirement and that is why Lenny's authority concept doesn't apply.  The Cause could be any number (or infinite) of things that resulted in existence as opposed to oblivion.  It need not be active, aware, unnatural or even still in around.  At the fundamental level it might just be more important to recognize that there is a cause than what the nature of the that cause is.

Anyway, I'll do some reading on my own and try to get a glimpse from the other side.

First off, I included the science statement in my analogy because this addresses the subject of the thread.  I can explain this if you need.

You contradict yourself immediately by attributing "The Cause" to (what I think is) our creation.  This is your authority statement.  Yes, our creation "happened" but so did everything else.
What is the reason you attribute "The Cause" as an over-arching event?

The first bolded part of your statement is your own perception (in this case a duality) of choice.  Either we exist or there is oblivion.  Well, we exist so what now brown cow.  Your duality is meaningless in my perception of your words.  And I can project "value" on my perception by saying:
"Look into a mirror and describe the oblivion, or lack thereof, that you perceive."
Anyone reading this, including Intellectually Honest Christians, can duplicate this action and begin to form their own word jumble to describe this experience.

The second bolded part reinforces your own perception of a duality in your universe.  All of us are part of the same reality, the same existence.  There are no opposites sides, only interpretations.

As an aside, I came into this world view by reading about everything else (religion, history, science, etc.) and trying to encapsulate ALL of what I read into a coherent perception that INCLUDES everything.  I haven't spent time or effort reading specifically about eastern Tao, or Zen.  What is interesting is that a lot of my conclusions about life in general are paralleled by authors thousands of years ago.  So even though my sources of information are different, and probably more detailed, the general perceptions I have are nothing new to the human condition.

  335 replies since Jan. 03 2007,21:39 < Next Oldest | Next Newest >  

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