Reciprocating Bill
Posts: 4265 Joined: Oct. 2006
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Quote (Thought Provoker @ Sep. 30 2007,11:16) | Hi Reciprocating Bill,
You wrote... Quote | Before you go, I'd appreciate your thoughts on the quoted post, above. Including my request vis the fastball. |
I'm sorry, I usually try to address comments in the order they were received. In my confusion, I skipped over yours. Again, sorry.
I'm not going anywhere. I was just giving Creek Belly a heads up that I thought we were getting to a point where the arguments are becoming forced.
As for fastballs and Libet. I just did a google search on "fastball Libet" and got a lot of good looking hits. Try it.
I think our differences are becoming forced too. BTW, calling me "TP" for short is fine. I think Libet threw scientists a curve ball (pardon the pun) thirty years ago. Think about it. The first reaction was to deny and challenge the reality of experimental data. Experiments were run to challenge Libet, not to support an explanation of it. Libet's results survived the challenge. Then there was the scramble to come up with good-sounding explanations for the data that couldn't be refuted. They come up with some. Life is good again, books have been updated to reassure psychology students their teachers might know something.
Conservative answers are generally easier to support. That doesn’t mean they are correct. |
TP -
Your take on Libet describes ordinary self-correction in science. Everything you describe went right, so far as I can tell. Of course individual scientists often overvalue their own ideas, and upon finding themselves corrected thusly aren't happy. So the world goes 'round. But your response doesn't go to my observation that new theory needs to demonstrate added value vis empirical work, which these quantum notions have not (yet) vis cognitive processing, a sense of volition, etc., before the models with which they compete can be be declared obsolete. Declaring victory out of hand in the absence of any constructive research is one of ID's worst (and most obnoxious) habits.
Baseball is full of "ballistic" behaviors (literally and figuratively); it provides a good illustration of the issues involved. Not surprising that it arises in many similar discussions. I've read some of Wegner's and Bargh's work, and it likely came up there, and lodged in my brain pan. (And, 'tis the season, as October approaches and my boys are in.)
-------------- Myth: Something that never was true, and always will be.
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace
"Here’s a clue. Snarky banalities are not a substitute for saying something intelligent. Write that down." - Barry Arrington
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